What is pulling this trend? I know I'm a fan of the new model, and I do plan on getting one, hopefully going to race plastics and competing with it in CMRA. Just curious why people are wanting to get rid of theirs?

If it were later this year, I'd most likely pick one up off of one of you, or try to find a new one on the showroom.

I guess I could not go and see myself ditching a nice new ride (which the new 250's are) so soon.

So why are several of you selling your bike?

most are afflicted with the "bigger is better" syndrome. :rolleyes:

I'm not selling mine - just passing my pre-gen down to my younger brother as his first bike. I will be getting something like an older cbr.

most are afflicted with the "bigger is better" syndrome. :rolleyes:

That's exactly it. I must admit, I started thinking the same way after about 500 miles... But the 'jette is just so damn fun (not to mention paid off), that I realized that I was being an idiot and that I should keep on with the 250 for at least a few years and outfit it for track days when I buy a new one.

My decision was 100% cemented when I dropped her and paid $45 to repair the damage instead of the couple thousand an RR would have cost.

^ 45$ damage?? fairings are fairings.. it would still cost the same.. you have to shift less with a 600cc bike, better for highways...250 is more fun on curves n stuff i guess though...gr8 bike but most people want "real" sportbikes as in super sport bikes.. im gunna sell myn for a 07 or 05 cbr 600rr hopefully..

you have to shift less with a 600cc bike,.

You still have 6 gears to go thru......... just not as quick thru them :)

^ 45$ damage?? fairings are fairings.. it would still cost the same.. you have to shift less with a 600cc bike, better for highways...250 is more fun on curves n stuff i guess though...gr8 bike but most people want "real" sportbikes as in super sport bikes.. im gunna sell myn for a 07 or 05 cbr 600rr hopefully..

Yeah, I realize that I overstated a little because I didn't actually replace the fairing or the pipe.

I have some rash on my right fairing and pipe, but that doesn't bother me. The $45 was for the turn signal.

The repair cost of the 250R is indeed about 1/3 that of a larger bike - $250 vs $750+ for fairings, for instance.

The Ninja 250 is the classic bike to learn on. People buy them, learn to ride, feel inadequate when they see someone on a faster bike, and then sell them to 'move up'. Nothing wrong with that.

My second motorcycle was a Ninja 250. My 4th (and current) is also a Ninja 250. I'm a practical person, and I don't have anything to prove. I don't want to go 160 mph. I'm quite content cruising at the posted speed limit (well usually), and keeping all the extra money in my pocket.

:thumbup:

:outlaw4:

No motorcycle is forever, and upgrading is just part of this hobby. But the reasons that some folks state as why they are upgrading from the Ninja 250 sometimes do grate on me, as I know they are factually incorrect, whether the rider knows it yet or not.

For example, "I bought this bike to learn on and become more confident, and now after 1,500 miles I've learned everything I can with it and it's time to move up".

Without reading another word I know the writer, whoever he/she is, is full of crap. There is no way, no how that they have learned everything they can on that bike. If there's some continuum between utter newbie with zero experience and grizzled veteran with 30 years of riding and 500,000 miles under their belts, at 1500 miles someone will be hard pressed to tell the difference between them and utter newbie. At that point you don't even know what you don't know yet. The reason that I think it would be beneficial for people to keep the ninjette longer, is that those skills that they don't yet have (or don't even know they need to have) are better learned on the ninjette. You can start moving up to the bike's limits, moving closer to the traction limits, braking harder, swerving with more authority, losing traction on loose surfaces and recovering, all of those things. Without worrying about excess power futzing up the whole works. Those that learn on underpowered machines become better riders faster than those that learn on overpowered machines. :2cents:

No motorcycle is forever, and upgrading is just part of this hobby. But the reasons that some folks state as why they are upgrading from the Ninja 250 sometimes do grate on me, as I know they are factually incorrect, whether the rider knows it yet or not.

For example, "I bought this bike to learn on and become more confident, and now after 1,500 miles I've learned everything I can with it and it's time to move up".

Without reading another word I know the writer, whoever he/she is, is full of crap. There is no way, no how that they have learned everything they can on that bike. If there's some continuum between utter newbie with zero experience and grizzled veteran with 30 years of riding and 500,000 miles under their belts, at 1500 miles someone will be hard pressed to tell the difference between them and utter newbie. At that point you don't even know what you don't know yet. The reason that I think it would be beneficial for people to keep the ninjette longer, is that those skills that they don't yet have (or don't even know they need to have) are better learned on the ninjette. You can start moving up to the bike's limits, moving closer to the traction limits, braking harder, swerving with more authority, losing traction on loose surfaces and recovering, all of those things. Without worrying about excess power futzing up the whole works. Those that learn on underpowered machines become better riders faster than those that learn on overpowered machines. :2cents:


Oh yeah??? but it's only a 250... it's not cool, ya know??? :cool:

besides, I'm so ashamed of that small rear tire Kawasaki put on the bike!!! What were they thinking!!! People can tell right away it's nothing more than a scooter!! :mad:

I know someone who has been riding for 6 years and rides all over the country and he says that he is still learning things most times he goes out.

Alex, you are absolutely correct, often a person does not know something they need to know till they experience it and if they are on a bike that is over powered, can lead to bad events...

Kelly, even given the small size of the rear, people I meet still think it is a 600 :eek: :D

I am never selling my 06! NEVAR!
I am determined to travel 49 states within 5 years.
And after reading this thread, Korean guy named Wan travels all over U.S. in a 49cc Honda Ruckus (http://totalruckus.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=12143&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=15) I might try to do that with a Ruckus in 10 years. It is my life goal! Wan is my hero!

I'm keeping my ninjette for quite a while too. A couple things people didn't mention above on the upsides list: gas mileage and comfort. My seat is nowhere near as hard as any 600cc bike I've ever sat on. I know it's not the same for those of you that don't have a pregen, but there's also the fact that there's less damage to your wrists from leaning forward thanks to the upright or partial upright posture of either bike. They're also safer overall. If you can't go as fast, you can't get into as much trouble. Granted, we can still pull 100mph and that's plenty dangerous, but you've still got more reaction time and better survival chances than if you were going 160. Another note on speed: a stock ninjette can still go as fast as most stock cars out there. Who actually NEEDS to go 160mph? Or even 100mph for that matter? Most of the upgrades are for street riding, not track riding. Also, with 50mpg how can you go wrong? :D

in all honesty, i was looking for a larger bike when i had enuff saved up. nothing new for the amount i set aside to spend. having a 700cc previously, i was hoping to stay near that size or larger, if a deal came along.
well a deal DID come, and i am SO glad i didn't let ego win-out over the pure rush of riding something this manuverable.
friends who know my riding history aren't suprised that i'm on a 250 cuz they know for me, its all about the handling when tipping into the twisties.
newer, and especially younger riders who have started their motorcycle experiences onboard a 600 plus cc bike seem to always ask when am i gonna upgrade? and i'm more than happy to explain that 1- i just got this one 2- am having just TOO much fun riding my 250 and 3 - wife is going to use this bike when she is ready to begin her riding experience...and she can have the bike...when she pry's it outta my cold, dead hands!

what we ride doesn't make us the riders we are.
how we ride does, or at least, thats the way i've come to see it.

aloha

My second motorcycle was a Ninja 250. My 4th (and current) is also a Ninja 250. I'm a practical person, and I don't have anything to prove. I don't want to go 160 mph. I'm quite content cruising at the posted speed limit (well usually), and keeping all the extra money in my pocket.

:thumbup:

:outlaw4:

My thoughts exactly. At my age, I don't care if people ask why I'm not on an 1100. I've got others saying that I have the coolest bike around! Everyone has their opinions, but I'm just having a great time riding again.

besides, I'm so ashamed of that small rear tire Kawasaki put on the bike!!! What were they thinking!!! People can tell right away it's nothing more than a scooter!! :mad:

Hahaha, this is the best one. The funny thing is that the only people who really think this are 250 owners living in regret. All the riders I've talked to see it and still know it's fast, and all the non-riders I talk to just tell me it's a beautiful bike. ;)

Hahaha, this is the best one. The funny thing is that the only people who really think this are 250 owners living in regret. All the riders I've talked to see it and still know it's fast, and all the non-riders I talk to just tell me it's a beautiful bike. ;)

I'm sure Kelly's tongue was firmly planted in his cheek when he bemoaned the small rear tire.

Tim

+1000 Yes, I hear/read about this quite often. The now that I've got 1500 miles on it, I'm ready for a bigger bike...Sigh..
Shrug and slowly shakes head...

No motorcycle is forever, and upgrading is just part of this hobby. But the reasons that some folks state as why they are upgrading from the Ninja 250 sometimes do grate on me, as I know they are factually incorrect, whether the rider knows it yet or not.

For example, "I bought this bike to learn on and become more confident, and now after 1,500 miles I've learned everything I can with it and it's time to move up".

Without reading another word I know the writer, whoever he/she is, is full of crap. There is no way, no how that they have learned everything they can on that bike. If there's some continuum between utter newbie with zero experience and grizzled veteran with 30 years of riding and 500,000 miles under their belts, at 1500 miles someone will be hard pressed to tell the difference between them and utter newbie. At that point you don't even know what you don't know yet. The reason that I think it would be beneficial for people to keep the ninjette longer, is that those skills that they don't yet have (or don't even know they need to have) are better learned on the ninjette. You can start moving up to the bike's limits, moving closer to the traction limits, braking harder, swerving with more authority, losing traction on loose surfaces and recovering, all of those things. Without worrying about excess power futzing up the whole works. Those that learn on underpowered machines become better riders faster than those that learn on overpowered machines. :2cents:

Im thinking that people that want to upgrade are just so excited about just being able to ride a motorcycle they want to get a bigger motor. It probably just depends on what type of riding they plan on doing. Definitely would not suggest someone to upgrade to soon if they really enjoy twisty rides as apposed to long distance/touring rides.

Hey look at this way you can probably get a good deal on a salvage 600 shortly after they "upgrade."

I think that it's a pride issue. Younger riders are more self-conscious and tend to undervalue the importance of skill and overvalue the importance of appearance.

Was I any different?

More and more I ride it, more and more I appreciate it.
Riding position, gas mileage, utility, etc.

Oh, I was talking to my friend yesterday about tires and he's spending $350 for the rear.:eek:
I just bought a cheap touring tire but even if I were to buy a high performance tire, it would be less than half that much.
Plus, I don't take corners as seriously as he does.
I guess it really depends on your preference.

I think that it's a pride issue. Most younger riders are more self-conscious and tend to undervalue the importance of skill and overvalue the importance of appearance.

Was I any different?

fixed it for ya.:D

I'm sure Kelly's tongue was firmly planted in his cheek when he bemoaned the small rear tire.

Tim

Heh, yeah Kelly knows what's up. ;)

I think these guys just haven't gotten out into the twisties enough to appreciate how crazy-maneuverable the 250 is.

I'm hoping to get a good deal on a 2008+ when they upgrade and want to sell their 250s so they can buy a bigger bike. Not really in the market for a newer one though just yet.
Tony

I'm gonna be looking for something a little nicer later in the year. I'm leaning toward the CBR or R6. We'll see...


When the time comes, I don't think it would be premature and it's definitely not because I feel I've done all I can on this bike. I have tons of fun tracking this thing. The steering and handling is so quick and nice. And I do take some pride in keeping up and making passes on guys with bigger bikes. :)

But by that time I'm in a position to make the switch, I'll have done 7-8 trackdays and around 10,000 miles. I'm confident in my ability to ride well and would like to try the challenge of riding a bigger and more aggressive bike on the track and the mountains. If I could keep two bikes, I would do it. But that's not really in the cards at the moment.

Oh, I was talking to my friend yesterday about tires and he's spending $350 for the rear.:eek:

Did he mention which specific tire he's getting? I can't think of a single rear tire from any manufacturer that costs that much, whether street or track. (at least the track ones that are readily available to non-factory racers).

shipped, installed, balanced, mounted price.

Still seems high, installed/mounted/balanced is $20, right?. :idunno:

Still seems high, installed/mounted/balanced is $20, right?. :idunno:

:rotflmao: do you live at Disneyland? I don't know about where you live, but to have those things done on kauai you would either need to buy the tires from the dealer at an outrageously inflated price or pay at least $50 to have those services done if you brought the wheel and tire in already dismounted from the bike.

seriously, Alex, are things that cheap there? if so, that's a great deal. :thumbup:

It's $20 here too if you bring in the wheel/tire. $40 if you take the bike in.

I don't doubt that I'd be perfectly comfortable on a bigger bike now, and there are bigger bikes I'd love to have (mmm, Street Triple, yum), but...

I don't really want to spend $9k and pay the significant extra for insurance on my meager one year of experiece.
I don't have room to store a second bike, and...
...there is no way I'm selling the 250.

The 250 does what I want, it is 100% joy. It doesn't leave me wanting.

:rotflmao: do you live at Disneyland? I don't know about where you live, but to have those things done on kauai you would either need to buy the tires from the dealer at an outrageously inflated price or pay at least $50 to have those services done if you brought the wheel and tire in already dismounted from the bike.

seriously, Alex, are things that cheap there? if so, that's a great deal. :thumbup:

Wheels off bike, bring in your own tires, then yup, the going rate is $20/wheel for mount and balance. There are plenty of dealers here that would be happy to take $50 front / $75 rear to mount/balance your new tires if you just ride the bike in and say do it, but I'd rather save the cash and bring in the wheels off the bike. Even my BMW dealership will mount/balance wheels off bike for $25 or so. It's why I can't justify a grand for the no-mar tire changer, as it's only costing me $20/tire right now; thats a whole lot of tires I need to change before I'd break even...

crap, I wish it were that way here. :mad:

I guess a lot of competition helps.

I'm upgrading mainly for the highway commuting I will be doing this year. Now I know you can do it on the Ninjette with the sprocket swap etc to lower rpm but having done a small trip on a friends CBR F3 it felt a lot more stable and solidly planted on the road. Road snakes, cracks and other crap on the road didnt phase it like it normal does with the ninja.

I've also heard people who've said that the fuel mileage of the ninjette drops heavily once you start going 75+ which you kinda have to on SoCal freeways unless you want to dwell in the slow lane which is as you know not safe.

Still keeping the ninja as my experimental bike and possible track bike - oh yeah and for my younger bro :D

my 250 is my daily and I ride on freeways daily at those speeds...with stock sprockets.

Same here. It's a lot of sustained 9-10k rpms for me but I just tell myself "hey, it's designed to do that and we're not at redline." And yes my mpg can get as low as 40 but that's still like driving a Prius.

hm, my combined mileage never dropped below 60.
I am a happy man...

My main concern with moving up from a 250 is safety.. I know im prone to mistakes.. and to make a mistake on a bigger bike would be.. well a really bad mistake. To believe that I've honed my skills to the point where mistakes don't happen would be a lie.

I can hardly imagine having more fun on a bigger bikes than on my 250, it sure would hauls more ass, but gone would be the constant WOT and shifting without breaking the laws, lol !!!

It's $20 here too if you bring in the wheel/tire. $40 if you take the bike in.

:eek::eek::eek:

Just priced 2 Pirelli MT75's w/ mount and balance having the shop do it all cause I don't have any tools right now. $330+TAX......

I asked if I could trade one of my kids for partial payment, the guy didn't think that was funny. Washington is SO EXPENSIVE......:(

I estimate that over the years, I have logged about 350,000 miles. It is a conservative estimate having ridden since age 18. I am still learning and am also making a lot of mistakes. A 750 Norton handles a lot differently than a Ninjette. If you put the effort it takes to run a Norton through some twisties into a Ninjette, you would in all certainty crash. For a while I had thought of getting a touring bike like a Honda NT700. I would be looking at a 10K price tag. I quickly dismissed that idea, and I can afford the bike, on the other hand10K would pay for a lot of motel rooms and I could travel lighter. I would still have kept the Ninja. It is paid for and set up the way I like it. Back in the 60s we built cafe racers with 500 to 750cc bikes. You were hot s$$$ if your bike could do "The Ton". The Ninja does the ton out of the box--and it is only a 250! We have come a long way. As for feeling inadequate and all that stuff; The only person I need to impress is me. Have you seen the report on the Royal Enfield Bullet 500? It has 19HP at the wheel. That`s the sort of bike we rode in the 60s.:D:D:D

One of my professors wanted to see my bike the other day and when she was asking me about it, I told her that average sportbike or "biker" folks wouldn't consider it a "real" motorcycle because of the small engine. That being said, one of the things that I love about the bike is that it really is the perfect street sportbike. Sure a 600 or liter bike would have more power and better components but on the street no one needs a 100+ hp motorcycle. I mean really, it's almost a crime that bikes like that are sold for the street in the first place because they'll never be ridden to their full potential. That requires a track and a world class rider.

I'd much rather take a smaller bike and ride the wheels off it than tool around on a big bike, barely flexing its muscles and hoping the extra power doesn't kill me one day. You learn more and have more fun that way. Any wanker can twist a throttle. I take the same approach to cars. My favorite car was the '91 civic SI hatchback I used to own because it was just sporty enough that I could drive the s#!* out of it without ending up in jail or in the morgue. I think that people confuse owning a better machine with being a better rider/driver.

Ill never sell my 250r...even if I do add more bikes to my growing collection. This one is staying in the hanger until the day I die. I finally got one of these little ninja bikes, and Im not giving it up.

Amen to that Bryan. I've been lusting after the newgen since the pics first game out in 2007. Now that I've got one I'm never letting it go (barring a catastrophe)

Im still holding out for KTM to produce the RC4 or Aprilia to produce their secret RSV 550. Till either of those happen I don't see the need to get a 600, I rode an R6 for a while and to be honest I had more fun on the 250 as far as street use goes. For my personal taste and style I just don't see the point in getting a motorcycle that legally can cruise in 3rd gear, that's just boring. Plus I love me a light weight corner killer, and yes I mean lighter than the CBR I'm talking RS125 territory. That being said the 250 really is all I would ever need for the street.

http://www.blogsmithmedia.com/www.autoblog.com/media/2007/12/ktm690.jpg

http://motohol.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/11/aprilia_rs_125_02.jpg

She wanted a bigger bike. I bought the ninjette for her to learn on and she wanted a 600R that my friend was selling, so I passed the 250 onto another newbie and hopefuly he'll do the same if he decides to move up.

Her reasoning was keeping up with the bigger bikes. We ride tons of rural roads around since we're in Maine. The speed limitsare mostly 45+ and the 250 took a lot to pull out and pass with the bigger bikes. I loved it and miss it. I'll most likely buy one for me when I get out of college.

I really want them to bring out the 400's again. Those are the perfect bikes for street use.

Or make a ninja 350. :D

I'm a practical person, and I don't have anything to prove. I don't want to go 160 mph. I'm quite content cruising at the posted speed limit (well usually), and keeping all the extra money in my pocket.

:thumbup:

:outlaw4:

X2, I'm the same way as you are, I don't feel the need to have a bigger bike. This is plenty for me and I don't want to kill my self, I have a family to support.

I'd be with you guys but I got the second 600R for almost half the price of the ninjette and I know it's an extremely mechanically sound bike. The insurance for her is $2 a month more and she's happier so I'll let her have at it.

Last weekend a fellow pulled up next to me at a red light on a beautiful looking R6. He made a little gesture and I nodded. He opened his throttle maybee 1/4 and shifted not even once. He is halfway down the block before I even clear the intersection.

Next stoplight, same thing, except rather than nod, I shrug.

Sour grapes is annoying.

most are afflicted with the "bigger is better" syndrome. :rolleyes:
Some guys are eager to move to a bigger engine to, you know, compensate.

I constantly think about getting a bigger bike when I'm not riding (they just look so awesome) but the minute I hop on my 250 and fire it up, all those thoughts go away. I've had experience riding a R6 but in the end I think the lower displacement bikes are more fun.

Every stop light is a drag race to the next light. You get to rev the crap out of your engine, shift gears and do all that within reasonable speeds. No way you can have that much fun on the streets with a 600. Overall you can afford to be more crass with the 250s and I love that.

While the 250 is CAPABLE of riding highways, it certainly leaves quite a bit to be desired at high speeds. It's not the most stable bike in the world for one, and over-taking cars can be dangerous. I try to avoid major interstates with the 250.

So overall, for 95% of the riding that I do, the 250r is PERFECT. I just learn to live with the other 5% because no bike is perfect.

She wanted a bigger bike. I bought the ninjette for her to learn on and she wanted a 600R that my friend was selling, so I passed the 250 onto another newbie and hopefuly he'll do the same if he decides to move up.

Her reasoning was keeping up with the bigger bikes. We ride tons of rural roads around since we're in Maine. The speed limitsare mostly 45+ and the 250 took a lot to pull out and pass with the bigger bikes. I loved it and miss it. I'll most likely buy one for me when I get out of college.

I regularly ride with a couple of 1200 BMWs, a Honda 600 sport bike, and a Suzuki 650. I have no trouble keeping up. I may shift a little more, but my left toes are up to the task. Looking forward to meeting you guys. Give me a call when you are in Belfast.

Last weekend a fellow pulled up next to me at a red light on a beautiful looking R6. He made a little gesture and I nodded. He opened his throttle maybee 1/4 and shifted not even once. He is halfway down the block before I even clear the intersection.

Next stoplight, same thing, except rather than nod, I shrug.

lmao, eh, you cant win them all... next time pull up next to the honda accord

I too am guilty of desiring other bikes, lust in the mind I guess, haha. Just today I went and hung at my dealer's warehouse where a buddy of mine since elementary school (1974, but whose counting) was assembling a zx6r monster energy (which means putting on the windscreen and seat cowl). Anyway I hang there and drool over all the bikes (more there than in the showroom). But the other day when I was riding some curvy backroads I thought to myself (would I be going any faster on a bigger bike in these corners). Then when I hit the main routes I thought how much faster would I be doing on this straight on a bigger bike, and how much would the ticket cost.
Anyway on the straight backroads I do sometimes wish for about another 100 or 150cc as I scream through the gears, look down, and see I am going 40.

I definitely see a 600 in my future, zx6r or cbr, but i've got plenty of time and learning to be done before i see that day.. and money to save up..

I tell people I ride a small bike because I have big BALLS.....

I rode a few 600s in my time and in the end the 250 is just so much fun.....when I get on a Kawa 600R I just think ---this bike owns me--I don't own it.....

I ride twisties all the time and that moped we ride fellas sure can fly.....the joke I always say is my bike is a moped with fairings on it but like I said--in the end the 250R suits me and makes me happy...perspective is everything.....

I rode into work today and parked in the spot designated for motorcycles that I always do, but today I took a moment to look at all the bikes parked there just to see how mine compared (Although, I admittedly can't ever stop near a bike without having to stare at it for a few moments, but today there was a beautiful blue and white GSXR 600 with powder coated wheels that I hadn't seen before, so it brought on a different level of curiosity. Not sure who owns it yet).

Anyways, after ogling the GSXR 600, the GSXR 750, the SV650, the Triumph 675, the ninja 650, Some manner of Harley, and a bright yellow Ducati monster for a few moments, I actually realized I preferred my little ninja's super sharp, tight and compact lines to the generally rounder, meatier bigger bikes. The current gens are really beautifully designed, I think (No offense to the old gens- I used to have one and loved it- but the 08+ makes me purr). I honestly don't know how anyone could ever ditch the ninja because it's not pretty enough. Besides, I've even had other bikers ask me "Is that a 600?" so I know I'm not the only one who thinks it looks fast and awesome :D

That said, when I first got my '09, I told myself I'd get that cbr I've been infatuated with for forever as soon as I put 15,000 miles on it. The more I ride it though, the less I want to ever get rid of it. I'm definitely getting a honda someday, but I think it'll be an "in addition to" rather than "in place of". I was told I'd get bored of the 250 in a few months but I think if any motorcycle is boring you, then you're clearly doing it wrong :p

On a side note, I never realized how many other bikers I work with until today. It's a shame I only personally know two of them. Gonna have to work on that......

Last weekend a fellow pulled up next to me at a red light on a beautiful looking R6. He made a little gesture and I nodded. He opened his throttle maybee 1/4 and shifted not even once. He is halfway down the block before I even clear the intersection.

Next stoplight, same thing, except rather than nod, I shrug.

A state of the art sportbike can easily beat an entry level 250cc street bike that hasn't changed since Thundercats was on TV? :eek:

I rode into work today and parked in the spot designated for motorcycles that I always do, but today I took a moment to look at all the bikes parked there just to see how mine compared (Although, I admittedly can't ever stop near a bike without having to stare at it for a few moments, but today there was a beautiful blue and white GSXR 600 with powder coated wheels that I hadn't seen before, so it brought on a different level of curiosity. Not sure who owns it yet).

Anyways, after ogling the GSXR 600, the GSXR 750, the SV650, the Triumph 675, the ninja 650, Some manner of Harley, and a bright yellow Ducati monster for a few moments, I actually realized I preferred my little ninja's super sharp, tight and compact lines to the generally rounder, meatier bigger bikes. The current gens are really beautifully designed, I think (No offense to the old gens- I used to have one and loved it- but the 08+ makes me purr). I honestly don't know how anyone could ever ditch the ninja because it's not pretty enough. Besides, I've even had other bikers ask me "Is that a 600?" so I know I'm not the only one who thinks it looks fast and awesome :D

That said, when I first got my '09, I told myself I'd get that cbr I've been infatuated with for forever as soon as I put 15,000 miles on it. The more I ride it though, the less I want to ever get rid of it. I'm definitely getting a honda someday, but I think it'll be an "in addition to" rather than "in place of". I was told I'd get bored of the 250 in a few months but I think if any motorcycle is boring you, then you're clearly doing it wrong :p

On a side note, I never realized how many other bikers I work with until today. It's a shame I only personally know two of them. Gonna have to work on that......

I have the same feeling and I am fast approaching 15,000 (crossed 12K today). Every time I catch myself drooling over a Triumph Daytona 675 or a Ducati 749-1098, I think about how I still want to keep my '08 250R... she's a beaut.

I bought my ninja to learn the basics ect... still learning- will always be open minded on the bike ect... that being said I will be moving up I thought i wanted the CBR atleast a 600 but then i saw the Buell Firebolt 2006 XB9r something or other...( I think ) -Lol... And its as small as a ninja and doesn't have the riding profile of the bigger sport bikes more ninja 250ish... i also hear it carves in the turns... I'ts also loud!!!!

Safety is a concern to me and the riding postion of the buell would be great next step IMO and the crome looks killer- I will be handing off the ninjette to the wife but not after I look into getting a Firebolt.

I too am guilty of desiring others , lust I guess, haha. Just today I went and hung at elementary school assembling energy. Anyway I hang there and drool over all the... But the other day I thought to myself how much would the ticket cost.
Anyway I do sometimes wish for ... as I scream , look down, and see I am 40.

Hang in there Greg. Don't do it!

I edited out the useless words in your post.

HAHA - well most of my words are useless anyway. Think you added a few also!

Ive ridden all sorts of bikes...anything from literbikes, cruisers, scooters, etc..there just is no bike more fun to ride than the 250r. There just isnt. I cant explain it, the 250r is just the quintessential rider's ride.

Ive always been a fan of the smaller displacement bikes, and I think a big part of it is that its so much fun to totally thrash a small bike.

The easiest way to describe it is to compare them to a horse. The ninja 250r is like a trusty horse that obeys you and does what you tell it to, and when you are ready it doesnt mind getting into a gallop. Literbikes are like a unbroken stallion. If you can manage to get on the onery SOB, and stay on, then you are constantly tugging on the reins to keep him under control.

Say you are leaving your neighborhood and entering a highway with a 45mph limit. On a 250r, as soon as its clear you twist that sucker, release the clutch, and hammer that throttle up to 10g as you go shifting up through the gears as it screams in delight. The front wheel never leaves the ground, and the rear wheel doesnt go spinning out to one side. You take a 10min ride through the city, and you've been through every gear, and even bounced the needle near the redline.

On a literbike you are leaving your neighborhood, and entering a highway with a 45mph limit. As soon as its clear, you barely touch the throttle, release the clutch, and turn out onto the road, being careful not to accidentally twist too much and sling the rear end out. Finally, you open the throttle just a touch, and before you know it your doing 60mph and havent even left 1st gear...so you back it off. After a 10min ride through the city, you havent even gotten out of 3rd gear, and you've broken the speed limit 25 times.

Im sticking with my 250r...its more fun.

I am never selling my 06! NEVAR!
I am determined to travel 49 states within 5 years.
And after reading this thread, Korean guy named Wan travels all over U.S. in a 49cc Honda Ruckus (http://totalruckus.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=12143&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=15) I might try to do that with a Ruckus in 10 years. It is my life goal! Wan is my hero!
Dang you. I just read this and I am GLUED to it. Wan sounds like he is an awesome guy. It is a great read!

I love this quote...



4w3s0m3!!!!!!!!

?? English please. or Korean


:lol:

I too am guilty of desiring other bikes, lust in the mind I guess, haha. Just today I went and hung at my dealer's warehouse where a buddy of mine since elementary school (1974, but whose counting) was assembling a zx6r monster energy (which means putting on the windscreen and seat cowl). Anyway I hang there and drool over all the bikes (more there than in the showroom). But the other day when I was riding some curvy backroads I thought to myself (would I be going any faster on a bigger bike in these corners). Then when I hit the main routes I thought how much faster would I be doing on this straight on a bigger bike, and how much would the ticket cost.
Anyway on the straight backroads I do sometimes wish for about another 100 or 150cc as I scream through the gears, look down, and see I am going 40.

Lust sucks like that. :D

To be honest, my move to a 750 was more about seat space than anything else. A Ninja 500 probably would've been the smarter choice, but the deal on my 92 gixxer was both more convenient and better than the other options I had at the time. That and the sportbike riding position is easier on my back given how heavy I'm getting.

Do I regret upgrading to a sportbike? A little bit actually...the costs of running the bike are double. Not including insurance, gas mileage is HALF that of the ninjette, tire costs are triple...not to mention the fact that the damn bike overheats in traffic. Oh well...at least my cousin can inherit the little 250 for free as her starter bike, and I'm a lot more comfortable on rides now...especially when I have a tail/tank bag.

The move from a 250 up to an SS of any kind involves a hell of a lot more than people sometimes realize. Especially if you're dealing with a new SS. Those things just aren't good at commutes, are boring as hell on straight roads (unless you're doing high speed fly-bys), can be tempermental in turns, and they're a lot harder to ride overall. Composure is the name of the game...and when you're itching for some stupidity, having to remain composed to stay alive kinda sucks. There's no forgiveness on these bikes. One of the things I had to do to adjust to the new bike was clean up my riding habits....in fact this is one of the things i still have to work on. It's a lot of the little things, like keeping my arms calm and relaxed while sneezing; squeezing the tank and taking the weight off my arms while going over bumps, through turns, etc; not allowing the bike to wobble when I do shoulder checks (which is harder in the leaned over position, mind you). The tolerances are much tigher than on the 250, and any small movement from you or your body translates into some kind of response from the bike. You have to be a lot more precise as a rider. When you're fatigued...this is brutal!

So basically upgrading to a supersport..old or new...isn't necessarily better. It's different. Some days it's better...some days its a hell of a lot worse....but I have to admit that when it's good, it's really good! Just some things to keep in mind based on my personal experience so far. :thumbup:

When I get the money I am going to get a Repsol CBR1000rr, but I will be keeping my ninjette because it is an awesome bike. I will be still riding it, but it's going to be given to my fiance after we get married because she wants a bike.

The move from a 250 up to an SS of any kind involves a hell of a lot more than people sometimes realize. Especially if you're dealing with a new SS. Those things just aren't good at commutes, are boring as hell on straight roads (unless you're doing high speed fly-bys), can be tempermental in turns, and they're a lot harder to ride overall. Composure is the name of the game...and when you're itching for some stupidity, having to remain composed to stay alive kinda sucks. There's no forgiveness on these bikes. One of the things I had to do to adjust to the new bike was clean up my riding habits....in fact this is one of the things i still have to work on. It's a lot of the little things, like keeping my arms calm and relaxed while sneezing; squeezing the tank and taking the weight off my arms while going over bumps, through turns, etc; not allowing the bike to wobble when I do shoulder checks (which is harder in the leaned over position, mind you). The tolerances are much tigher than on the 250, and any small movement from you or your body translates into some kind of response from the bike. You have to be a lot more precise as a rider. When you're fatigued...this is brutal!


Perfectly well said.

I always laugh when people say they need more power. No, you don't. You think you need more power. 250 is plenty for all kinds of commuting. Long haul, etc.

Me personally, I want to get another bike with a bit more weight and more comfort. So I am still looking at maybe a KLR or GS model. I also like the FZ1. I really do love the looks of the CBR600 and all those nice crotch rockets, but in reality, I would rarely use the power it had. As I think more and more about what type of riding I want to do (commuting and long distance), a SS bike goes lower and lower on my list. I still want one, but I feel that the type of riding I encounter on a daily basis requires a different bike. I'm not sure if I'll ever own a cruiser, but maybe a Honda NT700? Maybe a dual sport? Not sure yet. Plan on renting a KLR when it warms up and giving it a try.

I saw a cr500 super moto yesterday at the bike show. I have to admit it looked like fun.

I always laugh when people say they need more power. No, you don't. You think you need more power. 250 is plenty for all kinds of commuting. Long haul, etc.

Me personally, I want to get another bike with a bit more weight and more comfort. So I am still looking at maybe a KLR or GS model. I also like the FZ1. I really do love the looks of the CBR600 and all those nice crotch rockets, but in reality, I would rarely use the power it had. As I think more and more about what type of riding I want to do (commuting and long distance), a SS bike goes lower and lower on my list. I still want one, but I feel that the type of riding I encounter on a daily basis requires a different bike. I'm not sure if I'll ever own a cruiser, but maybe a Honda NT700? Maybe a dual sport? Not sure yet. Plan on renting a KLR when it warms up and giving it a try.

The KLR is an Awesome DS. Spent alot of time on the 650. HEAVY when your really offroading it, but comfy otherwise, as long as your over 5'6" tall!

Anyone ever think of Bigger Bike without it having to be a Race Replica? I mean, I wouldn't mind a little more usable power at TIMES without HAVING to rev to 12,000 rpm to get there, but I wouldn't want a CBR, GSX-R, or the like... The Ninja 650 or the newer ER-6N (Naked Ninja 650, awesome looking, I think) have also been basically deemed "Beginner Bikes" in this day of 170hp Liter bikes. And this is due to the fact that they have more power, BUT the power delivery is such from the bike that it is Controlable if the Rider does there part. I REALLY have been thinking about the ER-6N. I think it is dead Sexy for some reason. I have never been a naked Bike fan, till this one.

AND.....I WON'T ditch my Little Red 250 either. Especailly having a Wife that wants to learn and RIDE...:)

Yeah, if it was street only, I'd consider the same Jeff.

a 650 is plenty of bike. And it retains that lovely parallel-twin sound. :)

Oh and let me add this:

I have a friend that has a ZX-10. He loves the bike and thinks it is very comfortable. I asked him if he had ever taken it to WOT. He said no. He said it has too much power and will lift the front wheel at WOT. He said WOT scares him. I asked him, so why did you get the 10? He said because his last bike was a ZX-9R, and he wanted to upgrade. I don't view it as an upgrade if you never use the additional power.

He should honestly be on a 600...at least it wouldn't scare him as the 10 does.

Buddy of mine rides a honda 919. Just a basic standard bike, steel frame, only suspension adjustment is shock preload, and they stopped making it 2 years ago. Says its the most fun bike he has owned. And he owned a few. Good power off the bottom, comfortable, more speed than he needs. To me its todays CB750Four. Too bad US buyers didn't appreciate it, but bypassed it for flashier bikes.
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I regularly ride with a couple of 1200 BMWs, a Honda 600 sport bike, and a Suzuki 650. I have no trouble keeping up. I may shift a little more, but my left toes are up to the task. Looking forward to meeting you guys. Give me a call when you are in Belfast.

I loved riding the little bike. It was quick, very agile and did everything I wanted it to, including a few parking lot wheelies when I got it. I'll have another someday. Those were her reasons and I won't ocmplain too much since a second 600R is actually saving me money. I do miss it though, it was a blast as soon as I put the stock exhaust on and sold the cf 2-bros...that thing was obnoxious

ever think of Bigger Bike without it having to be a Race Replica? I mean, I wouldn't mind a little more usable power at TIMES without HAVING to rev to 12,000 rpm to get there, but I wouldn't want a CBR, GSX-R, or the like... The Ninja 650 or the newer ER-6N (Naked Ninja 650, awesome looking, I think) have also been basically deemed "Beginner Bikes" in this day of 170hp Liter bikes. And this is due to the fact that they have more power, BUT the power delivery is such from the bike that it is Controlable if the Rider does there part. I REALLY have been thinking about the ER-6N. I think it is dead Sexy for some reason. I have never been a naked Bike fan, till this one.

I'm pretty much set on getting a Versys as my next bike. I say pretty much because I've also considered an SV650 or Gladius, or possibly the ER-6N. I just think the Versys will be better suited to the kind of riding I do.

I'm probably waiting until next spring, or this fall, but if they drop below $5K as dealers try to clear them out I will be very tempted. I actually like the '08-'09 Versys better than the '10, so that would be an added benefit for me.

I am a beginning rider and I definitely feel the need to open it up and "give her hell" sometime, but I definitely understand where the 250 is a lot smarter of a riding choice. I do believe, though, that there should be something between the 250 and the 600. I know the 500 is out there, but until they restyle it like they did the 250 i wont buy it.

I don't know how popular or easy this would be, but what about some sort of bore or stroke kit that would give the 250 that little boost. Maybe bump it to a 300 or 350 size. I don't know if they ever did this for the old 250s, but it seems like an option aftermarket companies could look into. How about upgraded cams? My main experience is automobiles and I love to build engines. I know what the regular upgrades on any engine are, and after intake and exhaust, cams and carbs are usually the next upgrade to increase the breath-ability of the engine. Maybe this stuff is out there and I don't know, just wondering.

I'm pretty much set on getting a Versys as my next bike. I say pretty much because I've also considered an SV650 or Gladius, or possibly the ER-6N. I just think the Versys will be better suited to the kind of riding I do.

I'm probably waiting until next spring, or this fall, but if they drop below $5K as dealers try to clear them out I will be very tempted. I actually like the '08-'09 Versys better than the '10, so that would be an added benefit for me.

I REALLY like the look of the Versys too! Thought for sure that would be my next bike until I sat on it and WOW......:( 33.1" seat height on the Versys vs. 29.7" on the ER-6N..... I have the shortest freeking Mr. Frodo, Hobbit A@#, inseam of anyone ever!! So, the 1" + makes a difference for me. Don't want to feel like I am riding a KLR when I am on a Sportier Steed...:thumbup:

I REALLY like the look of the Versys too! Thought for sure that would be my next bike until I sat on it and WOW......:( 33.1" seat height on the Versys vs. 29.7" on the ER-6N..... I have the shortest freeking Mr. Frodo, Hobbit A@#, inseam of anyone ever!! So, the 1" + makes a difference for me. Don't want to feel like I am riding a KLR when I am on a Sportier Steed...:thumbup:

I'm sure there is an easy mod to drop the seat height a little.

Here are my 600's...no supersports juts 600's with a usable powerband
http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e207/Babyviper95/0901091644b.jpg

Those YZF600's are super comfortable. I wanted the one at the dealer. Selling for a decent price. But the dual sports are sooo tempting...

I'd love one but can't see spending the kind of money they want for a brand new one. I kinda like having two YZF's in the stable. The blue one is getting lowered and inch front and back for her though.

Here are my 600's...no supersports juts 600's with a usable powerband



Are there 600's with non-usable power bands?

Have you ridden the supersports? No the most practical powerband for the commuter. Besides, the Thundercat makes more HP and torque up to 10,500 rpm's than an R6. I still ride by those big black and white signs on the side of the road and they don't change if you're on a scooter, 250 or zx-14. I love the ergonomics of my Thundercat and she fell in love with it too. I'd rather she picked a Cat than a R6

Have you ridden the supersports? No the most practical powerband for the commuter. Besides, the Thundercat makes more HP and torque up to 10,500 rpm's than an R6. I still ride by those big black and white signs on the side of the road and they don't change if you're on a scooter, 250 or zx-14. I love the ergonomics of my Thundercat and she fell in love with it too. I'd rather she picked a Cat than a R6

Other than the little ninja I haven't been on a bike as small as an R6 in some time. I have, however, been riding liter bikes for the last 17 years and I find their power bands quite practical and useful... maybe even fun :thumbup:

I'd love an R1 someday but the practicality and insurance price of it for me right now suck. I've found the powerband to be defferent on my friends R1vs another friends R6. The torque feels a lot more smooth on the 1000cc than the 600's. The closest comparison that I can think of is a Honda's VTEC. nothing, nothing nothing, POWER

:D I'd absolutely kill for a Thunderace if I could find a good one. I'd suck up the insurance for one of those. :thumbup:

I love my lil Ninja. Totally practical for the riding I do, twisty backroads. I have no need or lust for anything bigger. On the other hand, being vertically challenged, there aren't too many choices for me anyways :p If anything else, I'd probably go for a thumper (DRZ).

The closest comparison that I can think of is a Honda's VTEC. nothing, nothing nothing, POWER

I always thought the VTEC, it was nothing, nothing, nothing, nothing, ohh...there is something, a little more something, nothing. :lol:

:)

http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a79/wonderwes/vtec_yo.jpg

I figured I'd be nice since I make my money from American Honda Motors

I mainly sold my 250 because my knees would cramp up pretty badly after 100-150km's of riding. Bike was physically too small for me.
I'm not super tall or anything, but tall enough. Combined with my bad knees, it just doesn't work out.
It's low power didn't help much when it came time to decide either, to be honest.

Ended up upgrading to a DR650 dual sport, which I was much happier with in every single regard except for fuel mileage (comfort... power... handling... highway capability and just pure fun).

Now I have a 600 and I find the power to be useless. Not just because 100+ hp is useless on the street..... but more because of where that power is.
By the time the power kicks in fully in first gear, 10,000 rpm, you are already breaking the speed limit on any road that you would find here.

I'll probably be selling the 600 to go back to a dual sport soon.
Really wish I had enough room for two full sized bikes.... only reason I have room for my Honda is because it's so small.

Mista Bob: A guy at my father-in-laws oil shop talked to me today about getting a GSXR600. I told him not to. He asked why, and I gave him the same reason you just did. The fact that you have to rev it to the sky to get any power out of it.

I told him if he wanted a sporty ride that has usable power, look to rides like z1000, FZ1, Ninja 650, etc (even though the 1000's tend to be overkill).

He then mentioned that he wanted to ride all over the place, doing lots of traveling. I told him to 100% stay away from sportbikes. I even mentioned a KLR650 for him. I reminded him on long trips you carry a lot of gear, so the sportbike would be weighted down anyway. Need something with more utility. He agreed. He said he would think about it more and consider what I told him.

The more I think about it the less I want a supersport for my next ride. Where I live around Texas, there are no curves. If I ride to get to them, then it will be a 2hr ride, and that is too far. I'm better off with a dualsport, a sport-tourer, or something like that. I am going to save up some cash and try to talk my wife into my getting a 2nd bike. That will be fun conversation!!!

I'm sure there is an easy mod to drop the seat height a little.

There are mods to drop the ride height, but USUALLY in turn for some sort of handling issue, IMO....

I have ridden a couple KLR and DR 650's that had lowering links. I know they are a different type of bike, but even with the seat height at a more respectable level for me, they were like trying to lean a Truck into a turn. Really hard to use. This might be all in my head to, but I would rather buy something more manageable for me height wise from the get go...:thumbup:

Makes sense! :D

There are mods to drop the ride height, but USUALLY in turn for some sort of handling issue, IMO....

I have ridden a couple KLR and DR 650's that had lowering links. I know they are a different type of bike, but even with the seat height at a more respectable level for me, they were like trying to lean a Truck into a turn. Really hard to use. This might be all in my head to, but I would rather buy something more manageable for me height wise from the get go...:thumbup:

It's all in your head. ;)

A dual sport will turn in much easier than any sport bike ever will.
And the nice and wide handle bars + the sitting position lets you easily control the bike in any situation.
They are just all around extremely agile bikes.
:D

I always thought the VTEC, it was nothing, nothing, nothing, nothing, ohh...there is something, a little more something, nothing. :lol:

:)

http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a79/wonderwes/vtec_yo.jpg

Depends on which Honda you are talking about. The newer Hondas/Acuras with the iVTEC is like you said... you can't feel much.

Back to motorcycles... I wish Honda would revive the 250RR.

It's all in your head. ;)

A dual sport will turn in much easier than any sport bike ever will.
And the nice and wide handle bars + the sitting position lets you easily control the bike in any situation.
They are just all around extremely agile bikes.
:D

I agree!:) BUT, throw some lowering links on a KLR 650 and compare it with a stock height... Which one is easier to turn?:thumbup:

He then mentioned that he wanted to ride all over the place, doing lots of traveling. I told him to 100% stay away from sportbikes. I even mentioned a KLR650 for him. I reminded him on long trips you carry a lot of gear, so the sportbike would be weighted down anyway. Need something with more utility. He agreed. He said he would think about it more and consider what I told him.


Actually certain sportbikes make fantastic sport tourers. The yzf thundercats/thunderaces as mentioned a few posts above are great at it, as are the fireblades (929/954 bikes in particular). Apparently the sportbike riding position is more comfortable for the...err..."fatter" rider because it takes the weight off of the lower back....and allows them to straddle their gut. :D

Luggage room is always going to be a premium on a sportbike, but the same is true for any bike short of a Goldwing.

lol true about the luggage.

Too bad they don't make those bikes anymore...

The reason why I directed him towards more non SS bikes is because he was talking the GSXR600 and R6. He is about 5'10" and maybe weighs in at 150. He also wasn't pricing insurance either. Told him to do that as well so he gets a better overall picture.

I agree!:) BUT, throw some lowering links on a KLR 650 and compare it with a stock height... Which one is easier to turn?:thumbup:

Shouldn't affect it too much so long as it was lowered within the manufacturers recommended specs in regards to lowering.
Not sure on the KLR 650, but with the DR650 the lowering was done via a lowering link along with lowering the front end by moving up the forks.
I'm almost 6'2 so I of course didn't lower mine. ;)
so I don't actually have any experience with lowering links.

If only the rear was lowered (or lowered further then recommended) it could negatively affect the handling.
As I believe it would change up the steering angle on the front end. Increasing the rake, resulting in worse turn in.

Another thing that would add to it I'd imagine is, the higher up perspective you have due to the higher seat height and upright sitting position.
Which can take a lot of getting used to in the corners.
I know it took me a week or two to get back up to speed fully on the DR650 after coming off of the 250.

Shouldn't affect it too much so long as it was lowered within the manufacturers recommended specs in regards to lowering.
Not sure on the KLR 650, but with the DR650 the lowering was done via a lowering link along with lowering the front end by moving up the forks.
I'm almost 6'2 so I of course didn't lower mine. ;)
so I don't actually have any experience with lowering links.

If only the rear was lowered (or lowered further then recommended) it could negatively affect the handling.
As I believe it would change up the steering angle on the front end. Increasing the rake, resulting in worse turn in.

Another thing that would add to it I'd imagine is, the higher up perspective you have due to the higher seat height and upright sitting position.
Which can take a lot of getting used to in the corners.
I know it took me a week or two to get back up to speed fully on the DR650 after coming off of the 250.

You know, I'll bet that is what my experience has been. The couple that I have ridden with the lowering links in the rear had not been lowered at the fork. Good Point!!! Makes more sense.:thumbup:

lol true about the luggage.

Too bad they don't make those bikes anymore...

The reason why I directed him towards more non SS bikes is because he was talking the GSXR600 and R6. He is about 5'10" and maybe weighs in at 150. He also wasn't pricing insurance either. Told him to do that as well so he gets a better overall picture.

It really is. The new(last year) Yamaha FZ6R is a great bike though. Extremely comfortable. There are many more but I'm a Yamaha guy sooooo :thumbup:

The reason why I directed him towards more non SS bikes is because he was talking the GSXR600 and R6. He is about 5'10" and maybe weighs in at 150. He also wasn't pricing insurance either. Told him to do that as well so he gets a better overall picture.

Wow that dood's skinny LOL. He'd definitely fit better on a fizzer or something. Those shiney racing plastics are quite tempting, though, but a lot of the newer offerings are very attractive. I saw a brand new FZ6R at Taco Bell with dual scorpion cans on it. Very sweet! :thumbup:

Test rode an '09 Versys Saturday. Don't know why I tempt myself. I don't know if I will be able to wait until next year, or even until the summer. Working on some numbers now, and checking with another dealer.

Wow that dood's skinny LOL. He'd definitely fit better on a fizzer or something. Those shiney racing plastics are quite tempting, though, but a lot of the newer offerings are very attractive. I saw a brand new FZ6R at Taco Bell with dual scorpion cans on it. Very sweet! :thumbup:

Oh man, now I am hungry for a gordita. Sat on a couple FZ6R, definitely lower spec than an R6 or even FZ6 from past years, but supposedly a very good bike, comfortable, and great rework of motor for everyday use.

Test rode an '09 Versys Saturday. Don't know why I tempt myself. I don't know if I will be able to wait until next year, or even until the summer. Working on some numbers now, and checking with another dealer.

Nevermind. I'll be waiting until the summer at least.

I just got off the phone with my insurance agent. I pay $380 a year for full coverage on my ninjette. A Versys with the same coverage would be $990!!!! When I turn 25 in July it will go down to $280 for the Versys.

Hopefully there will still be some left over '09s then.

Nevermind. I'll be waiting until the summer at least.

I just got off the phone with my insurance agent. I pay $380 a year for full coverage on my ninjette. A Versys with the same coverage would be $990!!!! When I turn 25 in July it will go down to $280 for the Versys.

Hopefully there will still be some left over '09s then.

LOL I wish i was getting $990/year. :D

Wow I am surprised at jump from 250R to versys. Now I am older (45) but pay $330 for full coverage with $1K deductible. A new ZX6R brings me to $900, a versys only raises a couple hundred.

For the price difference I will wait 4 months.

I hear that as I think they only adjust the policy once per year (at its renewal). Just like I had a ticket come off in september, but rate didn't reduce until october (renewal).

This whole insurance scam is a mystery to me. For the Ninjette the premium is $285 a year. If I went to a Honda NT700 Deauville, it would be $190. This is with a 50 year totally clean record for both cage and bike. Makes no sense to me. I guess in insurance parlance, Ninja means wanton speed crazed misfit. Who knows? At my age, I am not going to fight them for a "few" dollars--life is too short, and I plan to enjoy what I have left.

Unforunatly insurance cost is often dictated by arbitrary distictions. Our little ninjette is a "sportbike" so actuarily it commands a higher insurance premium where the NT700 as a "sport touring" bike is less risky according to the magical actuarial data. This data is the result of aggregated data over time. So really, if you want to blame anyone for the high cost of sport bike insurance, you can blame all the squids who have come before that wadded their bikes more fruequently than their non-sportbike riding peers.

I hear ya though about doin' what you gotta do though. Heck I have our two scooters insured, not so much to cover the hardware but the liability should someone get hurt or property damaged.
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How about I can get an FZ1 and insurance goes from $330 (ninjette) to $600. FZ1 is a literbike, with engine from previous gen R1, and a half fairing. However crash experience is low. Price out R1 from 2 years ago, power is relatively the same as FZ1 and its $1,300.

I already have near 2k miles and I know I am still learning.

I think the one thing I like about a bigger bike is not having to shift through all the gears.
Love the bike going through corners and really hope that when I do get to buying a bigger bike that I can still keep my ninja.

Though I think I may sell my ninja in a heart beat when this one comes out :p.

Yamahaette.org anyone ??:runaway2:

http://img.thesun.co.uk/multimedia/archive/00366/Yamaha_YZF250R_366970a.jpg

I already have near 2k miles and I know I am still learning.

I think the one thing I like about a bigger bike is not having to shift through all the gears.
Love the bike going through corners and really hope that when I do get to buying a bigger bike that I can still keep my ninja.

Though I think I may sell my ninja in a heart beat when this one comes out :p.

Yamahaette.org anyone ??:runaway2:

http://img.thesun.co.uk/multimedia/archive/00366/Yamaha_YZF250R_366970a.jpg


I wish this was out when I was looking for a bike. Is it coming out in the US?

I was looking at those when it was time for the gf to get a bike, but in the end after importing it would have been about the same as the ninjette. I'd love to get one though! I don't think it'll come to the U.S since we're all size queens here.

Found a differnt insurance company. $100K/300K, $250 deductible, full coverage on the ninjette is $185/yr, on the Versys is $391/yr. I'm going to the dealer tonight. If I can't get the price I want, I'll just wait. Its nice having a bike already and not "needing" one. Don't get me wrong I really want it, but I will make sure I get the deal I want.

This time next week I could be riding a Versys!! Don't worry I'm not leaving though (not that any of you were :D)

After wading through over a years worth of posted opinions and false hoods, I'm going ring in with my feelings here. I personally feel that 1000cc sport bikes are over kill. 90MPH in first gear? That's idiotic. 600 isn't really a happy medium, as they're fast too, albeit it slightly more sane. Here's what I think of some of the previous comments:


[list=1]
I don't really want to spend $9k and pay the significant extra for insurance on my meager one year of experiece.
Did you even research insurance quotes while considering new bikes? I switched insurance companies and pay LESS with MORE COVERAGE for my newer 2006 CBR600RR ($180/year) than I did for my 1995 Ninjette ($220/year). I am a 27 year old male, licensed for 11 years ("3" years on a motorcycle) with a perfect driving record: No moving violations, no accidents, felonies, arrests, etc...

My main concern with moving up from a 250 is safety..

Talk to Becky from Custom Seat Creations about the accident she had on her Ninjette.

As far as being "prone to accidents," you honestly probably shouldn't even be on a motorcycle in the first place. A common saying amongst my friends is that your "idiot check" is connected to the bottom of your right wrist.

Mista Bob: A guy at my father-in-laws oil shop talked to me today about getting a GSXR600. I told him not to. He asked why, and I gave him the same reason you just did. The fact that you have to rev it to the sky to get any power out of it.


This made me laugh. If you have to rev a 600cc bike to the sky to get any power out of it, then by your standards the Ninjette is just a glorified moped, that couldn't rev its way out of a wet paper bag. As that thing makes no power untill about 9k, and tops out at a WHOPPING 29 WHP at what 15K RPM? A stock CBR puts out ~30 WHP at about 3400 RPM, and peaks at about 100HP @ a little over 13K RPM. With exhaust, air filter, velocity stacks, PCIII you can get into the upper 110s easy. A dyno run with custom fuel mapping will put you over 120HP at 13.6k RPM. This is all from a machine that weighs less than 100 pounds more than an EX250, yet puts out 4x the horsepower. "Rev it to the sky to get any power out of it." You're clueless.

But this is beside the point. Like typical testosterone driven meat heads, all you guys talk about is SPEED and POWER. There was one mention about "canyon carving" and while the Ninjette was a hoot to carve with, I feel much more comfortable leaning my CBR over in turns than I did towards the end of my career on my Ninjette. I'd attribute it to the reduced rake on the CBR, and of course better tires, but this thing feels like its on an absolute RAIL, and I still have a ****** Dunlop endurance tire on the rear. Turning IS different. It feels like you're making a commitment rather than just a simple change of direction, but once you get used to that, you're golden.

But let's get back to the speed and power nonsense. That's barely the half of it. Let's start with the brake systems on sport bikes. Dual 4 piston calipers up front clamping down on dual 3**mm rotors (versus the dual piston single calipers on the ninjettes). It's like dropping a smooth controlled anchor, even under aggressive braking. Brakes were a HUGE reason I wanted to step up. Suspension was an other reason. My Ninjette came with the EX500 rear shock on it, but I did have the disfortune of riding an EX250 with the stock suspension. It felt like an overly plush worn out cadillac. It was horrible. When dialed in correctly, the suspension on sport bikes bikes is nothing short of astounding, which will be reflected in the handling. Is a 600 fast? Yes. But so are Corvettes, Camaros, Mustangs and a lot of other cars that a lot of people on this forum probably have in their garage.

While cliche and corny, I find the line from the Spider-Man movie appropriate here: With great power comes great responsibility. To me it all comes down to your idiot check connected to the bottom of your right wrist.

After wading through over a years worth of posted opinions and false hoods, I'm going ring in with my feelings here. I personally feel that 1000cc sport bikes are over kill. 90MPH in first gear? That's idiotic. 600 isn't really a happy medium, as they're fast too, albeit it slightly more sane. Here's what I think of some of the previous comments:

Did you even research insurance quotes while considering new bikes? I switched insurance companies and pay LESS with MORE COVERAGE for my newer 2006 CBR600RR ($180/year) than I did for my 1995 Ninjette ($220/year). I am a 27 year old male, licensed for 11 years ("3" years on a motorcycle) with a perfect driving record: No moving violations, no accidents, felonies, arrests, etc...



Talk to Becky from Custom Seat Creations about the accident she had on her Ninjette.

As far as being "prone to accidents," you honestly probably shouldn't even be on a motorcycle in the first place. A common saying amongst my friends is that your "idiot check" is connected to the bottom of your right wrist.



This made me laugh. If you have to rev a 600cc bike to the sky to get any power out of it, then by your standards the Ninjette is just a glorified moped, that couldn't rev its way out of a wet paper bag. As that thing makes no power untill about 9k, and tops out at a WHOPPING 29 WHP at what 15K RPM? A stock CBR puts out ~30 WHP at about 3400 RPM, and peaks at about 100HP @ a little over 13K RPM. With exhaust, air filter, velocity stacks, PCIII you can get into the upper 110s easy. A dyno run with custom fuel mapping will put you over 120HP at 13.6k RPM. This is all from a machine that weighs less than 100 pounds more than an EX250, yet puts out 4x the horsepower. "Rev it to the sky to get any power out of it." You're clueless.

But this is beside the point. Like typical testosterone driven meat heads, all you guys talk about is SPEED and POWER. There was one mention about "canyon carving" and while the Ninjette was a hoot to carve with, I feel much more comfortable leaning my CBR over in turns than I did towards the end of my career on my Ninjette. I'd attribute it to the reduced rake on the CBR, and of course better tires, but this thing feels like its on an absolute RAIL, and I still have a ****** Dunlop endurance tire on the rear. Turning IS different. It feels like you're making a commitment rather than just a simple change of direction, but once you get used to that, you're golden.

But let's get back to the speed and power nonsense. That's barely the half of it. Let's start with the brake systems on sport bikes. Dual 4 piston calipers up front clamping down on dual 3**mm rotors (versus the dual piston single calipers on the ninjettes). It's like dropping a smooth controlled anchor, even under aggressive braking. Brakes were a HUGE reason I wanted to step up. Suspension was an other reason. My Ninjette came with the EX500 rear shock on it, but I did have the disfortune of riding an EX250 with the stock suspension. It felt like an overly plush worn out cadillac. It was horrible. When dialed in correctly, the suspension on sport bikes bikes is nothing short of astounding, which will be reflected in the handling. Is a 600 fast? Yes. But so are Corvettes, Camaros, Mustangs and a lot of other cars that a lot of people on this forum probably have in their garage.

While cliche and corny, I find the line from the Spider-Man movie appropriate here: With great power comes great responsibility. To me it all comes down to your idiot check connected to the bottom of your right wrist.

:whathesaid: Very well put.

I was missing our occasional dose of "angry-man". :)

I find literbikes much easier to ride on the street than 600's, and have owned a few of both. Yes, a 600 has tons more power than our 250's at any measure on the dial. But the problem I have with the SS 600's is that their power is so non-linear. Turn the throttle a certain amount when it is at 3K, you get nothing. At 5K, you get something. At 8k, you get a bit more, and at 12k, you get 100+ hp. For me, the bikes become tiring on the street because if you leave it in the upper gears the bike feels weaker than you're used to, but if you're keeping it in the power range, suddenly it does feel much more like a racebike and you're well into the triple-digits by the time the bike is feeling as it should. It's just non-linear. The ninjette, bless it's heart, just doesn't behave that way.

I've found literbikes to be much more entertaining than 600's on the street, with plenty of power from idle to redline, they feel much more responsive, aren't significantly heavier than the 600 class, and are just easier to live with when you're not in a ricky racer mood. Once wound out though, they become just as silly on the street as any other supersport.

All that said, I tend to have as much fun on the ninjette as I ever do on our other bikes, as long as the ride is within the ninjette's sweet spot. For me that means twisty roads, good weather, and less than 8 hours. For what it's worth, I much prefer it on the street than any of the 600's I've owned or ridden. On track it's a different story; a SS 600 can be a dream to ride. :thumbup:

I was missing our occasional dose of "angry-man". :)



lol.. :lol:

Still seems high, installed/mounted/balanced is $20, right?. :idunno:
Where are you getting tires mounted and balanced for $20. I haven't found a place that will do it for under $40. I'm in over the bridge in Marin.

Where are you getting tires mounted and balanced for $20.

Road Rider (http://www.roadridermca.com/) in San Jose. $20 per tire (off the bike), not $20 for both tires.

If you're closer to SF, this guy (http://www.supertireguy.com/) does it for $18 per tire.

My local dealer does it for $20 (tire off the bike) too.

I pulled the trigger and bought a leftover 09 Versys. Pick it up on Thursday.

http://i254.photobucket.com/albums/hh87/camaroz1985/Ninja/Versys/P3110623.jpg

Bought an '09 GSX-R 750, pick it up on Friday week.

Great bike Mark - best of luck.

There are still a lot of rumors floating around right now about Kawasaki bringing back the 500 as a new version like the 250r in 2011. Ive even heard some dealers talking about it.

Im not holding my breath. I just dont see it happening. Mainly because a revamped 500 would still have that ancient engine, and a update to the design would put it right in the same price point as a 650r....but we can hope.

Bought an '09 GSX-R 750, pick it up on Friday week.

Great bike, you will absolutely love it.

Ohhhh time for fun!! :D



This made me laugh. If you have to rev a 600cc bike to the sky to get any power out of it, then by your standards the Ninjette is just a glorified moped, that couldn't rev its way out of a wet paper bag. As that thing makes no power untill about 9k, and tops out at a WHOPPING 29 WHP at what 15K RPM? A stock CBR puts out ~30 WHP at about 3400 RPM, and peaks at about 100HP @ a little over 13K RPM. With exhaust, air filter, velocity stacks, PCIII you can get into the upper 110s easy. A dyno run with custom fuel mapping will put you over 120HP at 13.6k RPM. This is all from a machine that weighs less than 100 pounds more than an EX250, yet puts out 4x the horsepower. "Rev it to the sky to get any power out of it." You're clueless.

I am clueless of one thing, why you compared a 600 to a 250 since it never even made it into that particular discussion. :D :p

My discussion with him he seemed he was leaning more towards a sporty bike. I know good and well what power a 600 makes, but do you know how much torque it makes? There is more to going fast than just HP. I've rebuilt and modified several engines, worked with nitrous and superchargers, did some drag racing and several auto-x races, trust me, I know my numbers and do my research.

Granted, yes, it makes low end power compared to a 250. Hell anything makes low end power compared to a 250 it seems. I actually don't even recall saying for him to get a 250, nor did it ever come up in my posts when I discussed my friend.

Let us stick with the 600 vs 1000 debate that the original post (regarding my friend) was about. He mentioned not wanting to rev it to get a lot of power, he wanted low grunt, etc. A 1000 excels at low end grunt. A Z1000 is more of the "type" of bike he was looking for. Line a 600 next to a 1000, roll it to 20-25mph, click up 2 gears and hit the throttle, and tell me who out accelerates who. That is the low end grunt he wants. :D

Heck, I'd love to have that grunt, but I live with a 250, so I don't expect anything spectacular out of a bike with 25 year old technology. :D This thread makes me want to get a bigger bike. Dang you all!


Like typical testosterone driven meat heads, all you guys talk about is SPEED and POWER.
.... I feel much more comfortable leaning my CBR over in turns than I did towards the end of my career on my Ninjette. I'd attribute it to the reduced rake on the CBR, and of course better tires, but this thing feels like its on an absolute RAIL, and I still have a ****** Dunlop endurance tire on the rear. Turning IS different. It feels like you're making a commitment rather than just a simple change of direction, but once you get used to that, you're golden.

I think a lot of us take about speed and power mainly because many of us don't live near canyons. :( Out here in Texas, there is nothing but long straight roads (at least where I am at). I'd have to travel over 2 hours to get to slightly interesting roads. So power and speed is all we have in order to have some fun (unfortunately I am not part of that group since I don't have power or speed or handling lol).

I agree though, the suspension setup on the newer 600's is far superior to the 250's ancient suspension, which is why it feels better.


But let's get back to the speed and power nonsense. That's barely the half of it. Let's start with the brake systems on sport bikes. Dual 4 piston calipers up front clamping down on dual 3**mm rotors (versus the dual piston single calipers on the ninjettes). It's like dropping a smooth controlled anchor, even under aggressive braking. Brakes were a HUGE reason I wanted to step up. Suspension was an other reason. My Ninjette came with the EX500 rear shock on it, but I did have the disfortune of riding an EX250 with the stock suspension. It felt like an overly plush worn out cadillac. It was horrible. When dialed in correctly, the suspension on sport bikes bikes is nothing short of astounding, which will be reflected in the handling. Is a 600 fast? Yes. But so are Corvettes, Camaros, Mustangs and a lot of other cars that a lot of people on this forum probably have in their garage.

While cliche and corny, I find the line from the Spider-Man movie appropriate here: With great power comes great responsibility. To me it all comes down to your idiot check connected to the bottom of your right wrist.

Agreed. The 250 sucks compared to any "late model" 600-1000 sportbike. 250's run with 1980's technology. To imagine it to be anything close to what a newer SS bike is would be unwise. My bike does what its intended to do. Slightly sporty styling tossed in with a small, cheap package. It was never designed to be anything else than that. Technically the Ninja 250 isn't a sportbike. It is a small econo-bike in a sportbike halloween costume.

Technically the Ninja 250 isn't a sportbike. It is a small econo-bike in a sportbike halloween costume.

The Ninjette is a great bike, especially the 08+, but this made me spray soda all over my monitor! :p:thumbup:

Oh, and I'm still NOT regretting stepping up to the 09 ZX6R! :D It has it's down sides (slightly heavier, bigger monthly $, more $ for insurance, takes huge amounts of impulse control, less overall long haul comfort), but it is precisely the bike I wanted. I enjoyed all 6K+ miles on my Ninjette, but it was, for me, always intended to be a cool looking re-starter bike with weekend bolt on hobby potential. It succeeded brilliantly and was worth every penny and mile I spent on it.

And to think, I actually almost purchased a nice used Buell Blast!!!!!!

For pure street pleasure, there's really nothing that compares to the 650 twins, IMHO. All the torque you want, and many of the benefits of the smaller bikes and larger bikes in one package (1 generation old tech vs. 1980s tech). If Kawi ever brings back the 500, lets hope they've learned all the lessons from updating the 250 08+ and apply them to the 500. Otherwise, they're going to seriously miss the price point and utility compared to the 650s.

If you want sexy, nothing beats the 600s. Pure balls, liter bikes. Crazy sh1t, 'busa class. It's not all about the corners or the stoplight to stoplight, which is more dictated by geography than anything else.

Buy what you want, ride your own ride. There's no such thing as the "Ultimate" bike for everyone.

Thank GOD I live in America, where we don't all have to (yet) want the same things. If we did, the lines would (will) be long and life would (will) be boring!

The Ninjette is a great bike, especially the 08+, but this made me spray soda all over my monitor! :p:thumbup:

Oh, and I'm still NOT regretting stepping up to the 09 ZX6R! :D It has it's down sides (slightly heavier, bigger monthly $, more $ for insurance, takes huge amounts of impulse control, less overall long haul comfort), but it is precisely the bike I wanted. I enjoyed all 6K+ miles on my Ninjette, but it was, for me, always intended to be a cool looking re-starter bike with weekend bolt on hobby potential. It succeeded brilliantly and was worth every penny and mile I spent on it.

And to think, I actually almost purchased a nice used Buell Blast!!!!!!

For pure street pleasure, there's really nothing that compares to the 650 twins, IMHO. All the torque you want, and many of the benefits of the smaller bikes and larger bikes in one package (1 generation old tech vs. 1980s tech). If Kawi ever brings back the 500, lets hope they've learned all the lessons from updating the 250 08+ and apply them to the 500. Otherwise, they're going to seriously miss the price point and utility compared to the 650s.

If you want sexy, nothing beats the 600s. Pure balls, liter bikes. Crazy sh1t, 'busa class. It's not all about the corners or the stoplight to stoplight, which is more dictated by geography than anything else.

Buy what you want, ride your own ride. There's no such thing as the "Ultimate" bike for everyone.

Thank GOD I live in America, where we don't all have to (yet) want the same things. If we did, the lines would (will) be long and life would (will) be boring!

6R is a great bike. The important thing is that you like it. :D

I have to admit, I have a weakness for the new CBR600RR. Awww dang, that thing is sooo sexy.

Everyone has different taste to be honest, and I am gonna try to keep mine as long as I live and probably even get another ninja if I have enough money. It's a really great bike and almost got 3k in mileages on it. I'm still learning, and I have been riding for two months.. almost 3 now. Sorry for the ranting.. jus want to express myself :D

2nd on the ride what you like. Last bike I had before I was off for 10 years was an Gixxer1100. Originally wanted an SV650 but price and it apparently being discon swayed me to look at the Ninjette.

Sat on one in the dealership and I was sold. Actually considering an 2010 650 to upgrade and keeping the 250 to teach the kids to ride on after they get competent on minibikes. :thumbup:

There are still a lot of rumors floating around right now about Kawasaki bringing back the 500 as a new version like the 250r in 2011. Ive even heard some dealers talking about it.

Im not holding my breath. I just dont see it happening. Mainly because a revamped 500 would still have that ancient engine, and a update to the design would put it right in the same price point as a 650r....but we can hope.

The main reason they won't be bringing back the 500 in '11 is because of the economy. Dealer's in my area are selling the '09 ZX-6R for $7199. According to a guy I know that's a salesman at a Kawi dealer, the dealer invoice is around ~$7000. They want that inventory gone so they don't stuck with the financing charges. All of the Big Four got caught with their pants around their ankles in 08 and 09. For the next few years expect less colors, prices to go back up due to lower production levels and less features or model updates.

Its insane the number of 600 sportbikes sitting in the dealers right now from 2009. I guess the 2008 I'll take that bike, oh sorry it sold 5 minutes ago, caused dealers to over order in 2009, then the economy spanked them. Imagine the ZX6R with all the accolades it got, sitting on the floor at $7,200. Yam is down a bit in price, but honda is holding its price here (so far) on the 600RR. A couple months ago you could get a 2008 CBR1000RR for less than a 600RR as Honda firesaled them.

Its insane the number of 600 sportbikes sitting in the dealers right now from 2009. I guess the 2008 I'll take that bike, oh sorry it sold 5 minutes ago, caused dealers to over order in 2009, then the economy spanked them. Imagine the ZX6R with all the accolades it got, sitting on the floor at $7,200. Yam is down a bit in price, but honda is holding its price here (so far) on the 600RR. A couple months ago you could get a 2008 CBR1000RR for less than a 600RR as Honda firesaled them.

As much of a bad year for 600's it might have been, the 1000's suffered even worse up here. I've spoken with a few dealers (normally high volume) who've sold exactly 2 or 3 litre bikes for the entire season. I'm sure it's even worse down there, and explains why Honda dumped the fireblades for so little.

Good point Pat. I forgot about all those R1 sitting on the floor. Rumor has it that the blade burns oil like crazy and perpetuated the stock sitting on the dealer floors. Half say its true, other half say that some folks don't know how to read their dipsticks.

Good point Pat. I forgot about all those R1 sitting on the floor. Rumor has it that the blade burns oil like crazy and perpetuated the stock sitting on the dealer floors. Half say its true, other half say that some folks don't know how to read their dipsticks.


It's true, I did the research (eating oil)... it's the reason why I don't have a brand new CBR1000RR right now.

I was missing our occasional dose of "angry-man". :)

I find literbikes much easier to ride on the street than 600's, and have owned a few of both. Yes, a 600 has tons more power than our 250's at any measure on the dial. But the problem I have with the SS 600's is that their power is so non-linear. Turn the throttle a certain amount when it is at 3K, you get nothing. At 5K, you get something. At 8k, you get a bit more, and at 12k, you get 100+ hp. For me, the bikes become tiring on the street because if you leave it in the upper gears the bike feels weaker than you're used to, but if you're keeping it in the power range, suddenly it does feel much more like a racebike and you're well into the triple-digits by the time the bike is feeling as it should. It's just non-linear. The ninjette, bless it's heart, just doesn't behave that way.

I've found literbikes to be much more entertaining than 600's on the street, with plenty of power from idle to redline, they feel much more responsive, aren't significantly heavier than the 600 class, and are just easier to live with when you're not in a ricky racer mood. Once wound out though, they become just as silly on the street as any other supersport.

All that said, I tend to have as much fun on the ninjette as I ever do on our other bikes, as long as the ride is within the ninjette's sweet spot. For me that means twisty roads, good weather, and less than 8 hours. For what it's worth, I much prefer it on the street than any of the 600's I've owned or ridden. On track it's a different story; a SS 600 can be a dream to ride. :thumbup:

I agree with the liter bike usable power. I find it better on the street and best on the track. I know many will say 600's are better on the track but it's usually the liter bike that has the track record. If you can handle a liter you will have the most "piss your pants" fun.

It's not a beginner's bike but once you have the proper experience it is the bike to have.

I agree with the liter bike usable power. I find it better on the street and best on the track. I know many will say 600's are better on the track but it's usually the liter bike that has the track record. If you can handle a liter you will have the most "piss your pants" fun.

It's not a beginner's bike but once you have the proper experience it is the bike to have.

CC - how about the GSXR 750 - how does that fit in the middle? A bit more linear, like a 1000, but more 600 like handling wise?

Maybe the Duc 848 is a good balance as well?

I agree with the liter bike usable power. I find it better on the street and best on the track. I know many will say 600's are better on the track but it's usually the liter bike that has the track record. If you can handle a liter you will have the most "piss your pants" fun.

It's not a beginner's bike but once you have the proper experience it is the bike to have.

No argument here, I have plenty of fun with a literbike on track. It's just that I'm still so much slower (by lap times) on that bike than I ever was on a 600; modulating 160+ hp just isn't easy when things start approaching at racetrack speed. I'm slower getting on the power coming out of a corner, I'm letting off miles earlier coming into corners, and I'm able to use the full power of the bike only after I'm almost completely straight up and down on the first half a straight. Don't get me wrong, it can be terrific fun. With a 600 I find I'm entering corners faster, I'm more comfortable rolling on sooner, and I don't need to be quite as precise with the throttle. On the other hand, I need to be more precise to be in the right gear at every moment, where a 1000 does leave a rider a little more freedom for that type of error. I'm intrigued by the S1000RR with such advanced TC, I'm not sure if it will make racer-level riders significantly faster, but I'd imagine it would shave huge amounts of time off for riders like myself that are erring way on the side of caution during corner exits.

One quick example of the difference for me... On the front straight at Thunderhill, entering it on a 600 I pin the throttle while still coming out of the last corner, shift at redline 3 times, and am at 150 mph (indicated) by the time I pass start/finish, where I rolloff and prepare for T1. That same straight on the 10R, I'm not at full throttle until I'm straight up and down, I hit 150 mph indicated less than halfway down the straight, and I'm already rolling off a bit because I can't convince my brain to want to pass that stripe at 160+. So I cross the start/finish going actually slower than I would have on the 600, as I've had to modulate the power down to something my brain can comprehend, where on the 600 it was a piece of cake to just hold full throttle and shift at redline without worry.

Hey yall
I've been having such a fun time reading this thread that i figured i would throw my 2 cents ou there. Little back ground i work for a Harley/Ducati dealer in a job that allows me (and forces me some times) to ride any bike we have on the floor. I have spent time on everything from a 883 sportster to an 1198 duc. 2 days ago I was tinkering on the wifes bike and riding it out in the parking lot, I will have to say I am strongly thinking about getting another 250 for me these things are that much fun. There is something about being able to go 10 mph and still drag a knee , or be able to hit 3 gears and still be in a parking lot. The age old argument "there is no replacement for displacement" only works if you want to go fast and straight. As far as a 600 or a liter bike goes if you know how to ride it either one are fun. I have seen a awfull lot of liter bikes over the years that were wreck simply because the retard riding it should have stayed on a 250 untill they learned how to ride instead of getting a bigger bike to make up for there lack of riding skill. Remember the rider that is fast in the corners wins the race so untill you can ride your scoot well enough to catch the guys on a bigger bike don't try and ride a bigger bike. All of this rant is just my opinion so feal free to disagree or flame me for it. ( i love a good debate).

CC - how about the GSXR 750 - how does that fit in the middle? A bit more linear, like a 1000, but more 600 like handling wise?

Maybe the Duc 848 is a good balance as well?

I haven't had a 848. I had a 900ss back in RI, and I have ridden Eddy's 916. I love Ducati but I'm a better rider on the Rice. I think the price of the bike makes me go slower. I've had a few 750s and they are a great all around bike. I'd take one over a 600 anyday. As far as handling the 1000 I don't have any problems. If you have the experience it's just fun, if you don't it's intiminating. If you do have the experience and it's intiminating then it's only in your mind.

No argument here, I have plenty of fun with a literbike on track. It's just that I'm still so much slower (by lap times) on that bike than I ever was on a 600; modulating 160+ hp just isn't easy when things start approaching at racetrack speed. I'm slower getting on the power coming out of a corner, I'm letting off miles earlier coming into corners, and I'm able to use the full power of the bike only after I'm almost completely straight up and down on the first half a straight. Don't get me wrong, it can be terrific fun. With a 600 I find I'm entering corners faster, I'm more comfortable rolling on sooner, and I don't need to be quite as precise with the throttle. On the other hand, I need to be more precise to be in the right gear at every moment, where a 1000 does leave a rider a little more freedom for that type of error. I'm intrigued by the S1000RR with such advanced TC, I'm not sure if it will make racer-level riders significantly faster, but I'd imagine it would shave huge amounts of time off for riders like myself that are erring way on the side of caution during corner exits.

One quick example of the difference for me... On the front straight at Thunderhill, entering it on a 600 I pin the throttle while still coming out of the last corner, shift at redline 3 times, and am at 150 mph (indicated) by the time I pass start/finish, where I rolloff and prepare for T1. That same straight on the 10R, I'm not at full throttle until I'm straight up and down, I hit 150 mph indicated less than halfway down the straight, and I'm already rolling off a bit because I can't convince my brain to want to pass that stripe at 160+. So I cross the start/finish going actually slower than I would have on the 600, as I've had to modulate the power down to something my brain can comprehend, where on the 600 it was a piece of cake to just hold full throttle and shift at redline without worry.

The weight of the 600s and the liters are so close nowadays that handling should be the same. I don't have any problem coming into corners. I come in at a greater speed but if you set up and hit your marks you should be fine. I only use one finger for the front brake, this helps me with throttle control (blipping). There is only one way through the apex so that shouldn't make a difference. Now coming out of the corner and getting on the gas is where most riders freakout. No one wants to high side. You have to learn to slide the bike. This is why you wait until you are upright to get on the 160+HP. If you are carrying enough speed coming into the corner both front and rear tires will slide in the turn. Use this to your advantage and you can get on the gas sooner and keep that rear wheel sliding all the way through being upright and rocketing down the straight (if you get off the gas you will high side). It sounds scary but once you get the hang of it you will be so much faster and much more confident. This is why riding dirt bikes help you learn to ride on asphalt so much better. You are always sliding.

You are riding your 600 like a sports car and your 1000 like a Mack truck. Once you ride them both the same you will have a sports car and a rocket.

Hey yall
I've been having such a fun time reading this thread that i figured i would throw my 2 cents ou there. Little back ground i work for a Harley/Ducati dealer in a job that allows me (and forces me some times) to ride any bike we have on the floor. I have spent time on everything from a 883 sportster to an 1198 duc. 2 days ago I was tinkering on the wifes bike and riding it out in the parking lot, I will have to say I am strongly thinking about getting another 250 for me these things are that much fun. There is something about being able to go 10 mph and still drag a knee , or be able to hit 3 gears and still be in a parking lot. The age old argument "there is no replacement for displacement" only works if you want to go fast and straight. As far as a 600 or a liter bike goes if you know how to ride it either one are fun. I have seen a awfull lot of liter bikes over the years that were wreck simply because the retard riding it should have stayed on a 250 untill they learned how to ride instead of getting a bigger bike to make up for there lack of riding skill. Remember the rider that is fast in the corners wins the race so untill you can ride your scoot well enough to catch the guys on a bigger bike don't try and ride a bigger bike. All of this rant is just my opinion so feal free to disagree or flame me for it. ( i love a good debate).

"there is no replacement for displacement" only works if you want to go fast and straight I would say there are hundreds of roadracers in Clubs, and that are professional, all over the world that would disagree with you. I do agree with the second statement I put in bold.

Balls, brains, experience, and confidence equals fast times and safe fun.

If you are carrying enough speed coming into the corner both front and rear tires will slide in the turn.

You're right of course, but that translates into sliding front and rear at quite high speeds, triple-digits+ in several cases on the tracks I enjoy, and my cojones just aren't quite massive enough. :p I don't mind the rear stepping out, and I spin it up reasonably often even when I'm being careful, but losing the front and managing that slide is above my pay grade at the moment. :thumbup:

I know I want a CBR600RR and a Triumph 675, but I think I will be getting a 09 or 10 Ninja 650R because I don't need or really want a supersport or the power they have. I will change the handlebars to lower sportier bars and change the exhaust to something louder just because I like loud exhaust but other than that the 650R is all I'll ever want for a few years. I just want something that is comfortable have decent power and isn't going to cost an arm and a leg for insurance for a 23 year old. I probably won't get one for a year or 2 so I'm going to keep enjoying my ninjette until then.

You're right of course, but that translates into sliding front and rear at quite high speeds, triple-digits+ in several cases on the tracks I enjoy, and my cojones just aren't quite massive enough. :p I don't mind the rear stepping out, and I spin it up reasonably often even when I'm being careful, but losing the front and managing that slide is above my pay grade at the moment. :thumbup:

Alex, you're really not losing the front end, it's more like drifting. The good thing is the rear end doesn't step out because the whole bike is sliding. If you do it right you won't even feel it, it just becomes natural.

If you have a dirt bike ( put on/off road tires on it) or an on/off road bike, find a spot that is comparable to a road track turn. Keep taking that turn faster and faster letting the bike slide until you finally lose it in the corner, then just take it a little slower. You will be drifting, sliding the front and back tires. Hang off the bike like you would on a street bike instead of riding it like a dirt bike. After a while you will have that turn down and be able to come in hot, hit the brakes, drift the bike, and accelerate out while still drifting. This will be an exaggeration of the street since you will drift more on dirt but you will get the feeling and experience of the drift. Then work on small wheelies coming out of the turn. This will hook up the back tire and send you on your way.

Riding dirt bikes has made me MUCH faster at the track. I used a KX250 motorcross bike as a woods bike and you really had to learn to control the power. I'm not taking open spaces, I'm talking woods and tight paths. It was a blast though.

Its insane the number of 600 sportbikes sitting in the dealers right now from 2009. I guess the 2008 I'll take that bike, oh sorry it sold 5 minutes ago, caused dealers to over order in 2009, then the economy spanked them. Imagine the ZX6R with all the accolades it got, sitting on the floor at $7,200. Yam is down a bit in price, but honda is holding its price here (so far) on the 600RR. A couple months ago you could get a 2008 CBR1000RR for less than a 600RR as Honda firesaled them.

the recession is hitting just about everybody...

reminds me of the guy who helps out at a strip joint dressing the girls...he was asked

so how is the money?

$50/wk

isn't that kind of low?

well, that's all i can afford...

the recession is hitting just about everybody...

reminds me of the guy who helps out at a strip joint dressing the girls...he was asked

so how is the money?

$50/wk

isn't that kind of low?

well, that's all i can afford...

That is funny.

I chuckled too.

Technically the Ninja 250 isn't a sportbike. It is a small econo-bike in a sportbike halloween costume.


The 250r can be anything you like. Which is one reason why it's such a great bike. A lot of people convert the bike to a full race/track bike and some even prefer it at the track over a 600.

The 250r can be anything you like. Which is one reason why it's such a great bike. A lot of people convert the bike to a full race/track bike and some even prefer it at the track over a 600.

Would those riders be from the 250 forums?

It's true, I did the research (eating oil)... it's the reason why I don't have a brand new CBR1000RR right now.
That's odd. I've met 5 different people that went out and got 08 CBR1000's. Price was in the ~9400 range OTD. One guy blew his engine but got it replaced at no charge by Honda.

I was surrounded by them on one ride this year.

http://www.bayarearidersforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=323203&highlight=%2Fdev%2Fnull

I was told by my friend "Oh, you'll want to move up soon..." but after 9000 miles this season, I can safely say I have no desire to get another bike. I had an incredibly awesome day of riding the other weekend--6 hours of twisty roads--I actually took the same stretch four times (out and back twice on Hwy 121 between Napa and 'the junction'), I would have done it again if it wasn't getting dark! I love looking at the bigger more expensive bikes, they're like works of art. But if people look down on me, I guess I sort of feel sorry for them, they don't get what's it's like to ride, it's not about being looked at. Honestly more worried I'm going to cook the engine before I want to give it up.

What is pulling this trend? I know I'm a fan of the new model, and I do plan on getting one, hopefully going to race plastics and competing with it in CMRA. Just curious why people are wanting to get rid of theirs?

If it were later this year, I'd most likely pick one up off of one of you, or try to find a new one on the showroom.

I guess I could not go and see myself ditching a nice new ride (which the new 250's are) so soon.

So why are several of you selling your bike?


If you're going to compete go with a pre-gen for costs and better race bike to work with, especially with all the cake you save on sales prices.

That wasn't true in the other thread, and it isn't true here either. If you want to play on track, anything will work. If you want to be competitive, the pre-gens simply aren't any more.

250 is great...learned on one and still ride one.
Problem is most of you have issues when 600+ is mentioned
:thumbup: