This will be a sloooow thread.

I got my hands on a set of mint Honda 2000-01 929 inverted forks. The Tokico 4 piston caliper I already have mounted on my stock forks should be a direct bolt on. I plan to make a new axle and use the 300 front wheel/rotor with a set of bushings in the fork stubs.

I need to find a top clamp, a set of clip ons or a way to mount regular bars.

All Balls has tapered roller bearings to swap it over. I'll need the top one IIRC. One size was the same as what I already have on my stem, pretty sure it was the lower that was a match.

So, the ball is rolling. Good deal popped up so I jumped on it. If anyone knows of any other top clamps or bars that would work, please advise me. I registered on Fireblade.org to pick a few brains over there already.

I can't wait to be rid of the spaghetti fork tubes on this bike! :dancecool:

Thanks for any help.

The 929 normally has a brake caliper on both sides of the front wheel, correct? Since you'll be using the stock 300 front wheel and one caliper, what do you plan to do with the mounts on the left fork that would normally be used for the second caliper?

Grind them off? Leave them?

What's your plan for a fender?



I'm sure you've already got this thought of, but you'll want to keep the geometry with the new forks the same as the stock geometry. If I were doing it, I'd measure the distance from the triple to the axle with the stock setup, then install the new forks at the needed height to keep that consistent. What's your plan?

I plan to just leave them swingin in the breeze for now. It is just two little tabs with a hole in each, not very obtrusive. I'll try to reuse the stock fender, a few brackets at most to get it on.

I don't think I need the twin calipers, the stock 13mm master and the single 4 piston is really very good.

https://scontent-b-lga.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/q71/s720x720/1486887_469919883127607_1432932591_n.jpg

I'm sure you've already got this thought of, but you'll want to keep the geometry with the new forks the same as the stock geometry. If I were doing it, I'd measure the distance from the triple to the axle with the stock setup, then install the new forks at the needed height to keep that consistent. What's your plan?

I don't worry about it too much, the stocker is so relaxed already. These are a little shorter, by 1/2" or so. Worst case I quicken the steering, which I might do anyway with a longer rear GSXR shock. I can raise the rear 1-1/8" with a different year shock. I may even try to bush a set of KTM clamps I have to fit the tubes, then run a regular handlebar. Rake/trail/height I'll deal with as I test it.

I'll juggle it as I need to ***when*** it is together.

A bit of digging and my plan to use the stock front wheel rotor is out the window. The 929 uses a 330mm rotor! Good times!!!

I need to find a 929/954 2000-2007 or CBR1000 04-07 wheel and rotor. I've got a line on some already.

A single 330mm rotor with my current 4 piston caliper and the stock master should be excellent. It is already really good on the 300mm N300 rotor.

:popcorn:

those forks are adorable. are you going to have them anodized orange too? i'm wondering what it might look like. i like your front wheel. do you have your own PC oven or do you outsource the coats? maybe it's not even pc? also... is that ball bearings i see? do you think you'll have excessive rebound with those balls instead of the tapered bearings? :)

Fwiw, I am a fan of the orange. I wish my bikes lent themselves better to being orange.

Fwiw, I am a fan of the orange. I wish my bikes lent themselves better to being orange.

Get a painter or some paint and hook it up!!!

alex.s:whip:

wat

:pound: he is changing bearings yo

As he knows, I hope anyway, caged ball bearings are far superior to loose ball bearings. I'll use the tapered rollers as All Balls has them ready to drop in my 300 frame. If not, the caged ball bearings would be just dandy. Too bad the bike didn't have them in the first place, think Kawi saved a dime on each bike?

The orange paint is there cause the cheapo Kawi paint must have been water based and FDA approved for small children to ingest. It was leaving the wheels at a rather hurried pace. What a hulking POS the components and materials are. If the 300cc engine wasn't so decent I'd have sold this off by now.

I got the 929 upper clamp and clip ons yesterday. Looks like the lower clamp may have a tweak in it. The tubes aren't dropping in the upper clamp, they miss by a few mm. The clip ons are looking good, they have a nice rise in them so I expect no fairing clearance issues.

Hope to get this together before the 390 replaces the 300. At the pace KTM is holding it shouldn't be a problem!

Sort of jealous, a 929/954 front end swap was one of the mods I wanted to do on my F4i. Direct bolt on and inverted forks just look so much nicer IMO.

I'd have done conventionals forks too, if the fell in my lap as these did. Older GSXR or ZX6 forks would have been great also. Too bad they didn't use the EN6n/f forks if just for the bigger tubes and having the parts already there, wheel, one rotor, one caliper or use duals, the bike sure could use them anyway.

Mmmmm Kawi paint... Doesn't sound tasty to me

Dry and flakey, yuk. Maybe with melamine rich Chinese milk, cereal style?

Never heard of it, but I will try most things

I have wondered what a WP Suspension 4357
would cost. As used on KTM duke 200 or even on their
small 85 SX dirt bike

Seems like a popular fork & not too heavy looking yet 43mm
Have looked but never found prices on them.

Good luck on your project !
Will be fun to watch/read about

A bit of digging and my plan to use the stock front wheel rotor is out the window. The 929 uses a 330mm rotor! Good times!!!


Although too much work for my taste, it is an interesting modification. :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:

How much is the difference in diameter with the rotor of the Ninja 300?
If I remember correctly, rojoracing53 created a support for adapting a caliper to his Ninja 250.
I hope he posts a link as a reference for you, in case you cannot find a Honda disc.

Do you have a link to a pic of the caliper you have installed now?

The stocker is 290mm as I understand. The GSXR caliper thread I started was here,

http://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=123397

but the pic has disappeared. I think you can see it in this pic though.

.https://scontent-a-lga.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/p480x480/1468511_464303337022595_1965617549_n.jpg

I'm great as conceiving ideas and getting them going but not so much with following through. My front end mod is 100% complete but my thread could use a few updates but I wouldn't hold your breath or you'll end up asphyxiation like all those poor fools waiting for me to upload group ride videos :lol:

take and look here for ideas http://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=120310

I don't know or care about anything bearing related so for everyone peace of mind leave me out of it :)

:dancecool: I think my orange wheels are the bigger issue now.

I read your thread, nice work. I'll suggest trying the stock 250 master. I'm running a GSXR Tokico 4 piston caliper (non radial) and the stock master really give great feedback thru the lever with great power too. I think you might be giving up some feel with the bigger R6 master. Stock Ninja master is 13mm IIRC. Not fancy, but far better matched to the 4 pistons that the stock caliper's two. Way oversized for that.

I'm probably going up to the 330mm rotor if I can get this all together.

Like I said that thread is lacking an end result. I've since moved on to another brembo master with a smaller piston made for single 4 pot calipers on supermoto style bikes. The stock Ninjette master piston would be so small the throw would be way to much to realistically usable. It's all a matter of balance and preference but with no one liking the exact same setup and no one able to give an exact answer you'll end up having to try a few setups to get a baseline and then you know exactly which way you want to go from there.

I can't ride other peoples ninjette's, their brakes just suck so bad in stock for :(

I agree about stock brakes, and I come from dirt/supermoto back ground so the whole feel/power balance is big for me. I have yet to ride a brake as nice as my 06 Husky 450SMR. Like a brake for a friggin train, and single finger control that was unreal.

What piston is on the master you use now. I only mentioned to try the stocker as it really surprised me on mine. I'm sure I'd go to a better one at some point so please spill the info!!! Radial master?

...........take and look here for ideas http://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=120310


Thanks, Jason :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:

I have progressed to the point where I feel my front suspension is squishy and could use some modding, hopefully emulators an such will get me where I need and want to be!
Some new balls as well... Getting a little slop in the front an some clanking

I have progressed to the point where I feel my front suspension is squishy and could use some modding, hopefully emulators an such will get me where I need and want to be!
Some new balls as well... Getting a little slop in the front an some clanking

Don't let that front end slop go on for long. Safety first and that is an accident waiting to happen.

I won't old3 it doesn't help the confidence at all

Don't let that front end slop go on for long. Safety first and that is an accident waiting to happen.

..........it doesn't help the confidence at all

Yes, it is a quick way to fillet-weld break-test any frame. :)

Yes, it is a quick way to fillet-weld break-test any frame. :)

It will get that hot? I know a guy with over 12k miles(4months ago) on a 300... He still thinks it runs fine, but the more I ride the less I like bits and pieces of it! Mostly suspension at this point. Most folks aren't quite as picky an persnickety as I though!

Yes, it is a quick way to fillet-weld break-test any frame. :)

Especially the recycled tuna can steel of the 300s!

"Yes, it is a quick way to fillet-weld break-test any frame." I think he means the clunking will transmit enough force to stress the weaker parts of the frame.

Honestly I'd be more worried about a bad wobble in a fast corner first causing an off, but the very mild and cheap steel frame isn't going to hold up to really severe stress. The scarred races that have been posted must have had the stem moving pretty far in the frame. That is a lot of force slamming the frame under braking or steering, pot holes, etc. Picture a hammer smacking the head tube ever bump. .

do you really need that tone, and condescension? I may not love everything about my bike, but don't get me wrong... I DO LOVE IT!!!
old3:whip:

P.S.
I'm glad I saw more to that post after I posted, but my thoughts are the same. I do appreciate the info though.
Off to search for postings you speak of

Without tone and condensation? Dude, is been raining here all day! :eek:

I guess I should try to be more sensitive to the Ninja 300's feelings? LOL! I love mine too, but it just is what it is. I love the lightness in how it handles, the steering and flickability. The small bore feel is there, it just is one of the budget bikes and that brings the stuff I hate.

I'd buy another, unless KTM brings a better package to work with.

It will get that hot?.....

.........."Yes, it is a quick way to fillet-weld break-test any frame." I think he means the clunking will transmit enough force to stress the weaker parts of the frame..........

Precisely !!!

Thanks old3 and sorry JohnnyBravo for my poor English. :o :bow: :o

Yes, any sustained persistent hammering, especially the one coming from a loose head column-stem, leads to cracks in the welded joints of any frame, which are the weakest links (more fragile molecular structure than the steel of the frame).

"Metal fatigue is the progressive and localized structural damage that occurs when a material is subjected to cyclic loadings."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metal_fatigue

That is one of the the reasons for panels of airplanes's skin to be joined by rivets and for our bikes to have suspension and pneumatic tires.

Leave alone the torture for those tracks and little balls in the bearings.

If you want to keep the ball bearings, you must maintain the play of the head column-stem well and frequently adjusted.

:thumbup: thanks
It stopped raining here today yay... Sorry bout your weather old

It's all good, tomorrow mid 40s and dry! Ride tomorrow for sure! Salt will be mostly washed away too. Might even hose the thing off too.

When you get the bearing out, inspect the races closely. I'd bet they have irregular groves worn in them that the balls hammered in. One pic I saw looked like a dremel had been used to file in a long scar.

I ride about everyday, waiting till I get a call that most of the black ice is gone... We have two or more places where water always runs across the road, it never used to happen

A set of conventional forks/triples off a 98 GSXR600 just fell in my lap. He may have the whole front wheel and complete brake set up too, all in like new condition.

Looks like the CBR forks might be up for sale cheap!

Flat top clamp so bar mounts will be an easy fit...

Fully adjustable and ready to go. Dual disc front brakes are back on my mind too. The single 330mm CBR rotor would have been fine, but if it is all there anyway, why not? :thumbup:

Sweet :thumbup:

Bugger.

I just tore the front end off to mess around with it and scope things out. I will need to either adapt the 300's steel stem to the GSXR parts which will involve boring bigger holes in the triples, or I can have the GSXR aluminum stem lengthened about an inch.

Second issue, the body parts surrounding the forks will likely be too close to stay intact. Cutting or gutting the fairing will be necessary to my eye here. I'm not oppose to a naked or 1/4 faired design, but I don't think I want to chop it up. The GSXR/CBR triples are almost 2" wider.

Third, not as big a deal, the steering stop on the frame will need to be cut a lot to allow the new triples to have full steering range. It might even need to be reinforced as it will be so small and is pretty chinzy already.

The bearings on the GSXR triples are close but do not match the ones in the bike, so the hope of it just slipping on has been erased! :(

I threw it together again with the stock forks. I might be looking for a Ninjette stem/lower triple to use as a template if anyone has one laying around. They welded it to the triple? :eek:

Forgive my density, but is the stem not always physically stuck to the bottom triple? That's how it is on mtb's and this is the only motorcycle I've owned...

On most it is a press fit. On the 300/250 it is pressed and the welded at the bottom edge. To remove it will require grinding off the weld and it should pop right out, might need a press to push it out.

I wasn't ready to destroy my lower triple just yet and be 100% committed to this if it means the fairings are going to have to go. I'll find another stem and convert the new fork's triples and go from there.

Interesting. I never would have thought of press fitting the stem to the triples. I'm betting that's how MTB forks are too. Thanks for that! Always learning.

Slight progress!

I grabbed a used 2012 Ninja 250 lower triple and stem off ebay at a great price. When it arrives, I plan to eyeball the possibility of boring it out to fit the GSXR 41mm forks in the 37mm holes. I'm doubting that is an option and fully expect to be grinding the weld off the stem and pressing it out to fit it on the CBR or GSXR triples.

Hey, I said it was only slight progress! :thumbup:

I am starting to think that Equinox USD forks with the type of bar you liked (Z style )
was a good deal at 300 bucks :)
Even if the internals needed upgrading which I am not sure they did.
But I know it would be a risk to try :)
https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn2/t1/1378190_724783470869150_1131656401_n.jpg

I'm tending to agree with you now! If I could go back it probably would have been money better spent. Live and learn I guess. If this is too much I may just revisit that option. For now I'm in this far, can't hurt to play with it a lil more.

If nothing else, the CBR legs have an incredible range of adjustment just by compressing them in my garage against the floor. Supple and soft to full comp that is hard for me to even move. Dramatic differences from each extreme. The GSXR forks are less range but still should be excellent to work with.

Who knows, maybe after I get the stem it will just fall together? :rotflmao:

Seriously, if I can bolt in the triples, the rest is easy.

Where does one aquire those Equinox forks? I tried searching the company on the sticker but no response as of yet.

I'm working on getting a set myself. I'll post up when I hear back about shipping to the USA. I decided to bail on the conversion nightmare and if the guts on these suck, I'll have my suspension guy convert them to another batch of parts from a WP or Japanese fork next winter.

Dude. Why not just buy a middleweight bike and neuter the throttle map so it puts out 70 hp and has a nice fat torque curve? It would be cheaper, would blow away this 300, and get you the suspension and frame you actually want.

Rotational mass.

Race a 125cc MX bike then race a 450.

It is all about the ride dynamics. These 250s and 300s handle well despite their crappy running gear because of their inherent strengths, a major one is low rotational mass in the engines.

...okkaaayy

But you're riding street at a non-race pace.

...okkaaayy

But you're riding street at a non-race pace.

And off road in gymkhana drills. Still, even on the street I'm turning it left/right/left. It is the same sensations as when you turn it anywhere else. Same feedback, feel, experience basically. I love riding my competition sumoto on the street too.

Difference is, I can push the tires to a safe and controlled point on the street, on a ZX10 I can't push anything safely on the street. Heavy and cumbersome to steer at street speeds.

Yeah I see how angular momentum plays a part here, but I feel like all your issues with things like frame and suspension would be gone if you took a 600 and neutered it. Idk. I guess I would have to weigh the parts in a brand new I4 600 engine and compare to the 250/300 to really know how much of a difference there is in rotating weight...

Rotational weight of the bigger motor makes a huge difference.

Yeah I see how angular momentum plays a part here, but I feel like all your issues with things like frame and suspension would be gone if you took a 600 and neutered it. Idk. I guess I would have to weigh the parts in a brand new I4 600 engine and compare to the 250/300 to really know how much of a difference there is in rotating weight...

I can/have neutered all my bikes with my wrist. Not the same thing, believe me. I jump on my KTM 530/610cc EXC dressed as a supermoto and the Ninja feels like a clumsy fat pig with flat tires.

I'd solo ride a 125 if there were any available here in the states. I recently wrote both Aprilia and Derbi about importing a 125cc 4t SS bike, 15 HP I think? I don't care as long as it can be ridden and experienced. They have no plans to bring these lil beauties over though. Shame, probably around 20 HP with basic stuff to open them up.

http://www.derbi.com/uk/images/stories/motos/street/gpr_125/1GPR125_03H_WH.jpg

264 pounds ready to ride with a tank of gas! Over 100 lbs. lighter than a 300!!!

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/01/Paris_-_Salon_de_la_moto_2011_-_Aprilia_-_RS4_125_-_001.jpg/800px-Paris_-_Salon_de_la_moto_2011_-_Aprilia_-_RS4_125_-_001.jpg

264 pounds ready to ride with a tank of gas! Over 100 lbs. lighter than a 300!!!


I would so love to own that

Now why cant we have more sport bikes like this available?
Power to weight ( lightweight ) is where my grin is & this would be a big grin I'm sure

+ look at the build quality it oozes :bow:

You've got a better chance that here in the USA. I'm a guy who still likes to scream around on a 50, and I had my worst racing injury on a KLX140 supermoto! I love the tiny bikes, but the level of sophistication on these must be so high. I'm sure it is a jewel of a bike.

The Derbi looks to be slightly nicer but I'd take either for back road scratching!

Neither company has any plans (or interest I guess), in bringing them here. Too bad.

Well I've got a hold of the company, and they told me these would be 870 shipped to Canada, Shipping is 200 dollars more than the actual cost of the forks itself, ouch. I'll have to pass on these.

I'm trying another place too. I was right around $900 which would be OK if I knew they were awesome, like if they were Ohlins or KYB or a major brand fork. Gambling that much to end up with a moped fork is my big fear.

I'll post up if I find a decent shipping price from another company.

How is it N. America/Europe doesn't have a single vendor for these parts, and everything else they sell over there for the lil bikes???

From what I've heard, the tax on larger bikes is outrageous, so they are forced into buying these little bikes. So vendors capitalize on that and make lots of parts for the bikes. Shame is that they're made in the farthest countries.

264 pounds ready to ride with a tank of gas! Over 100 lbs. lighter than a 300!!!

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/01/Paris_-_Salon_de_la_moto_2011_-_Aprilia_-_RS4_125_-_001.jpg/800px-Paris_-_Salon_de_la_moto_2011_-_Aprilia_-_RS4_125_-_001.jpg

^^ you don't want this guy, you want the older 125, the new one is a four stroke 125, the old a two stroke

http://images.motorcycle-usa.com/PhotoGallerys/Aprilia-RS125-2.jpg

Its simple people all I want is a 400cc V4 with 16k redline, alloy chassis and supersport grade components for 8k.

Lol, I'd probably pay like 10-12k for something like that. Basically just a ninjette-sized Aprillia RSV, right?!?! :D

Lol, I'd probably pay like 10-12k for something like that. Basically just a ninjette-sized Aprillia RSV, right?!?! :D

Basically yeah.

I don't think I've ever heard a V4 that small. I bet it's wonderful. :love:

I'll take the thumper. I've been thru the 2t thing, fun back then, now not so much. The 4t would be fine with me. The SM wheelies at will. I just want a planted, quality mini SS.

From what I've heard, the tax on larger bikes is outrageous, so they are forced into buying these little bikes. So vendors capitalize on that and make lots of parts for the bikes. Shame is that they're made in the farthest countries.

That is true about the tax & big bikes. The RR types from 600cc & up are priced at about double US retail. Add to that the fact that most here make small incomes ( min wage is about $9 a day ) & there it is. :)

Also with millions of scooters here a CBR150/250 or the ninja250/300 does seem like a big bike to many. But still many do pay the high prices & buy Ducatis, R1's & a few others that are imported here. Given the roads etc I am perfectly happy with the 250/300 size here. Sometimes I want to tell the folks here dying for bigger/higher priced how good they have it & to not fall for marketing hype.

You've got a better chance that here in the USA. I'm a guy who still likes to scream around on a 50, and I had my worst racing injury on a KLX140 supermoto! I love the tiny bikes, but the level of sophistication on these must be so high. I'm sure it is a jewel of a bike.

The Derbi looks to be slightly nicer but I'd take either for back road scratching!

Neither company has any plans (or interest I guess), in bringing them here. Too bad.

Maybe you will get a chance soon with the new YZF's?
Looks like Yamaha is really upping their game on the small bikes.
This 125 has USD, Radial mount front caliper, weight 309lbs full
Hope this carries over to their new 250 too.
Actually hope this thinking spreads to all of the big four & we see more good
small bikes.
http://blog.motorcycle.com/2014/02/14/manufacturers/yamaha/2014-yamaha-yzf-r125-announced-europe/
http://blog.motorcycle.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/021414-2014-Yamaha-YZF-R125-EU-Race-Blu-Detail-005-633x356.jpg