So I just finished installing my GSXR rear shock and promised I'd do a write up. Here it goes.

Things you'll need:
06-09 GSXR 600 Rear shock
New dogbones ( http://burkhartcycle.com/store/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=7_34 )

A drill press with vice and 31/64th bit.
2x M12x120-130mm bolts with matching nuts.
4x M14 Nuts (perfect spacers)
1x M10 bolt with nut (length rougly the same as the top shock bolt)

Something to grind with, preferably a bench grinder. I only had a dremel and it SUCKED.

Let's begin:
Put the bike on stands and remove the fairings to include the tail section. Then remove the black plastic dirt guard. To remove that plastic piece the battery is going to have to come out and so is the battery box. Then just disconnect all the wiring from it and it should pull out the back when you unscrew it.

Now you need to find a way to suspend the bike without a rear stand that uses spools. Since you're going to be taking the suspension out you can't use the swing arm. I used jack stands under my rear sets. If you still have the stock folding style foot rests you're going to have to use a jack under the motor.

Then shove something under the tire to support it. The rear seat works perfect for this as you can see.

http://i.imgur.com/3uEXOVF.jpg


Now you can start removing the shock. Start at the bottom and remove the three bolts on the V shaped piece that attaches the shock, dog bones and frame. Then remove the single top bolt and it pulls right out.

This is the V shaped mount I talk about.
http://i.imgur.com/kYFbDcW.jpg


The next part is where it gets tricky for us normal folks. I'm sure this was nothing to people like alex.s and Rexbo but I don't have a machine shop on hand. I actually bought a drill press and vice for this occasion.

The bottom part of the shock where the dog bones will attach is for an M10 bolt. Our V shaped metal piece I talked about earlier is sleeved for M12. So we need to drill out the holes on each side to 31/64th. The best way to do this was on a drill press with an attached vice. You could probably get away with a drill and a vice though.

The top mount for the GSXR shock is an M10 also. The metal sleeve in the bushing is not very thick in the first place and I really didn't feel comfortable drilling all the way through it with a 31/64th bit so that's where the M10 bolt comes into play.

After we've drilled the holes on the bottom mount of the shock to the correct size, it's still too narrow on the inside to fit our stock mount in. This is where we have to grind until it fits together. I ground down some of the steel sleeve, some of the stock mount and some of the inside of the GSXR shock mount until it all fit together. There's really no easy way to get this done, it just took a lot of grinding and trial and error until it fit in there.

That's really the hardest part and once you have them fitting together you can go ahead and re-install in reverse. The dog bones will not clear the GSXR spring without some sort of spacer though. The M14 nuts work perfect for this and they're cheap.

So when you put the bottom back together 2 of the three holes in the V mount will have the stock hardware. The one hole where the dog bones hook up will have to look like this.

Bolt-Dogbone-M14nut-mount-M14nut-dogbone-M12nut
http://i.imgur.com/k695s3V.jpg

You're going to do this on both ends of the dog bones and it should clear perfectly. You'll see my bolts are slightly long but 130mm was the closest I could find that would work. 120-125 would probably be fine as well. If you notice you can't get the shock to line up for the dog bone holes, remove the seat from under the rear tire. This will drop the swing arm all the way down and then you can use your foot under the tire to adjust while you line up that hole.

Since the top mount on the frame is drilled for M12 but the GSXR shock is an M10 and we're using an M10 bolt, there's going to be a little play at the mounting holes when you put it in. I'm not concerned about it because the metal sleeve in the bushing of the shock is the correct size and we are going to tighten down the top bolt with the suspension LOADED. That way any play in the frame holes has been pushed up to the top of the hole and rebound alone while riding won't move it.

http://i.imgur.com/cHE8UJg.jpg


All bolted up.
http://i.imgur.com/aG9cL98.jpghttp://i.imgur.com/s9Z2VU8.jpg

I'm sure I'll think of some other stuff and add to this later to clean it up.

Good work :thumbup:

Question: is that a Shroeder valve on the canister at the top of the shock? What does adding air pressure do?

How come you need new dogbones to do this swap on the new gen 250? I replaced the rear shock on my 300 with a gsxr shock, and used the stock dogbones with no change in ride height.

Anyway, good work. It it a nice improvement over stock IMO.

I think the valve is for when you re do the internals and stuff.

The stock dog bones for the 250 will end up lowering it an inch or so.

Good work :thumbup:

Question: is that a Shroeder valve on the canister at the top of the shock? What does adding air pressure do?

That's where you fill in the nitrogen...

what length dog bones did you end up going with, how does the height compare to stock?

what length dog bones did you end up going with, how does the height compare to stock?

Its coming lol. I put the 1.25" on but as you can see the bike is still apart. I'm doing the front also. When I get the front done and put together I'll report back with the specs lol.

Nice! /linked

Great so far but I am trying to see where you had to grind?

You have to grind the inside of the mounts on the shock. You don't need to grind much, an angle grinder worked for me.

^ this

The y shaped metal piece on the bottom end of the shock. You need to take a little off the inside so it will fit around the stock knuckle

So i finished this up today. No huge surprises, i definitely ended up doing things a little different to say the least.

I couldn't find any 12mm bolts long enough anywhere, was thinking about using thread all but changed my mind. Stepped up to 1/2 inch. Drilled out the 2 steel spacers for the dog bones to 1/2", the steel spacer in the knuckle for the bottom of the shock. All the gsxr shock holes out to 1/2" and the stock top shock/frame bracket holes to 1/2"

Everything fits tight like a tiger with little play and that makes me happy, but i must say with that large diameter spring there is little to no clearance in a few places between spring and swing arm :eek:

kinda has me nervous.

had to trim up the bottom of the mud flap/battery box piece as well to clear top of shock :thumbup:

Ya sorry forgot to say you have to trim the black plastic guard to about the first well nut set to get it to clear the reservoir.

I had to go to an Ace to find the M12 bolts.

All put back together now. I got the bolts from a local source (cost almost as much as the shock which was $23.11 shipped). I only had to cut back the flap to the point shown in your photo. No other mods were required to the airbox/battery box.

Rather than put new dogbones in I lowered the front by 1" (putting on vortex clip ons next week), and measured the drop on the rear which came out to 12mm. The slightly increased rake makes turning easier and did not detract from the high speed stability.

I spent the last couple of days dialing it in and it is AWESOME. The rear feels planted and exhibits no bad habits in turns. I get great feedback in the pegs as to what the rear is doing now. I had already put Sonic Springs in the front and changed to a heavier oil so the suspension feels much better balanced now.

All put back together now. I got the bolts from a local source (cost almost as much as the shock which was $23.11 shipped). I only had to cut back the flap to the point shown in your photo. No other mods were required to the airbox/battery box.

Rather than put new dogbones in I lowered the front by 1" (putting on vortex clip ons next week), and measured the drop on the rear which came out to 12mm. The slightly increased rake makes turning easier and did not detract from the high speed stability.

I spent the last couple of days dialing it in and it is AWESOME. The rear feels planted and exhibits no bad habits in turns. I get great feedback in the pegs as to what the rear is doing now. I had already put Sonic Springs in the front and changed to a heavier oil so the suspension feels much better balanced now.

Awesome! Good to hear more people knocking it out and enjoying all the benefits. :dancecool:

so...I just finished this mod....I ordered the raising dogbones and they didn't show up. I emailed the guy and he didn't respond, so I ended up putting it all back together with the stock dogbones.

I did the goldvalve and new springs in the forks at the same time.

In order to compensate for the geometry change, I left the forks sticking out of the top triple 20mm....is this too much?

^I ended up just making my own dog bones.

I think stock spec for the forks sticking out of the triple is around 12mm so you are only 8mm higher, should not be a big deal but is probably not ideal solution. I don't know a whole lot about rake ect...

so...I just finished this mod....I ordered the raising dogbones and they didn't show up. I emailed the guy and he didn't respond, so I ended up putting it all back together with the stock dogbones.

I did the goldvalve and new springs in the forks at the same time.

In order to compensate for the geometry change, I left the forks sticking out of the top triple 20mm....is this too much?

8mm is not a lot. People lower the front more than that. Give the dog bones some time. Not the best communication but they show up.

8mm is not a lot. People lower the front more than that. Give the dog bones some time. Not the best communication but they show up.

lmao....my son just picked up the package at the post office....I knew I shoulda waited :bounce:

okay so my other question to you Tom....is the top bolt....The holes in the stock bracket was 12mm the gsxr shock could only take a 10mm bolt....is there any concern about play?

I didn't drill it out since that collar is so thin already, so I used a 10mm bolt. If you put the bolt in and then tighten it with the suspension loaded it shouldn't have any play. The rebound alone shouldn't be enough to pull it down. Its not a lot of play to begin with either.

I didn't drill it out since that collar is so thin already, so I used a 10mm bolt. If you put the bolt in and then tighten it with the suspension loaded it shouldn't have any play. The rebound alone shouldn't be enough to pull it down. Its not a lot of play to begin with either.


I did the same....tightened the **** out of it

Here's the Factory setting for the GSXR shock. Remember to adjust accordingly to your bike and weight. The reservoir is filled with nitrogen. Do not fill it with compressed air! Pressure should be about 180 PSI although I have seen somewhere ranges from 150 to 200 psi.

Honestly I fail to see why nitrogen is so important? MTB shocks do just fine at 150-200psi filled with air and they hold pressure for a long time.

I guess I'm just curious why nitrogen? Why not just get a small shock pump and adjust the pressure as needed.

Here's the Factory setting for the GSXR shock. Remember to adjust accordingly to your bike and weight. The reservoir is filled with nitrogen. Do not fill it with compressed air! Pressure should be about 180 PSI although I have seen somewhere ranges from 150 to 200 psi.

Even though nitrogen is recommended, even dry air can be used as an alternative. According to race tech it's 175psi nitrogen or 125psi air... Said air must be free of any kind of moisture...


Honestly I fail to see why nitrogen is so important? MTB shocks do just fine at 150-200psi filled with air and they hold pressure for a long time.

I guess I'm just curious why nitrogen? Why not just get a small shock pump and adjust the pressure as needed.

I would think it's because nitrogen is more stable at different temperatures? You're the science kid, you should know :p

Even though nitrogen is recommended, even dry air can be used as an alternative. According to race tech it's 175psi nitrogen or 125psi air... Said air must be free of any kind of moisture...




I would think it's because nitrogen is more stable at different temperatures? You're the science kid, you should know :p

Good info Hans!

With this mod has anyone noticed a difference while riding with a passenger on the bike?

i don't ride 2 up but i can't imagine how you could not.

Stiffer spring and the ability to make adjustments with a twist of a screw driver.

I was thinking of doing this mod but was not sure if I should stick with the stock dog bones or not as I would be 190lbs with gear on my bike and looking at 320lbs with a passenger. I can get a 07 gsxr 750 shock for around $50 so i am tempted to try this mod.

I was thinking of doing this mod but was not sure if I should stick with the stock dog bones or not as I would be 190lbs with gear on my bike and looking at 320lbs with a passenger. I can get a 07 gsxr 750 shock for around $50 so i am tempted to try this mod.

Pass on the $50 dollar shock, that is robbery. You can get one off ebay for $20-$30 I got an 08 or 09 750 shock for $23 and it was fairly mint.

I don't think you would hurt anything by using stock dog bones lots of people do it, but if that Burkhart guy is still making the riser ones I would just buy a set to get the bike back close to stock, but that is my preference. He sells them at a reasonable price like $20 if I remember right.

This is a pretty solid swap mode, just don't rush things, collect all the pieces and you should be able to knock it out quick. Don't substitute things from the original DIY IMO stick with what works particularly using the 31/64 bit to drill out the holes, and using 12mm bolts. You might have to hunt for a while until you find these pieces but it's the way to go. :thumbup:

If you have a drill press drilling out the top shock hole is non issue and I would rather do it than not do it. :thumbup:

When i first started off with the GSXR shock mod, i was concerned with the material taken off when drilling the eyelet in order to to fit the mounting bolt. (just another avenue of thought)

So I pressed out the eyelet off the OEM ninja 250 shock and pressed it in the GSXR shock. I think i should put up my GSXR setup for sale.

I'm selling a gsxr ohlins shock if anyone is interested :p 1000$ "only"

I did the same....tightened the **** out of it

not to say this is wrong or will fail or any particular assurance like that, but my little brother, MKlein3004 on here, had to undo the 10mm bolt in the 12mm mount holes method as it was moving around in the rear at race pace on bumpy TX tracks with 200 lb rider regardless of how tight you made it.

Modified by welding 10 mm washers on to the mount.

Would you guys say $40 cdn on a used 07 750 shock with 1000km on it is a fair price? For I can't seem to find anything lower then that locally. I have seen a few on ebay for less but with shipping it gets close to the same amount.

not to say this is wrong or will fail or any particular assurance like that, but my little brother, MKlein3004 on here, had to undo the 10mm bolt in the 12mm mount holes method as it was moving around in the rear at race pace on bumpy TX tracks with 200 lb rider regardless of how tight you made it.

Modified by welding 10 mm washers on to the mount.

Different bike, but the EX500 is known for keyholing the top shock mount holes if they're not completely tight, even with the stock parts.

I bought a 12mm reamer bit and used a drill press to enlarge the mounting holes in my SV shock. The metal bushing in the top mount had enough spare material that this was doable. The 12mm reamer actually resulted in tighter holes than the stock shock had.

Gonna buy one of these and cut segments off.

http://www.amazon.com/Carbon-Spanner-Bushing-Spacer-Reducer/dp/B00JMVDB3G

Well I picked up the shock and was I wondering if anyone attempted or was thinking of painting their spring.

Well I picked up the shock and was I wondering if anyone attempted or was thinking of painting their spring.

i was thinking the same thing. i used the search to see if anyone else did or even suggested that as well. no such luck tho.

i removed sanded and painted the gsxr spring that came with the shock i bought. Luckily the gsxr spring is easily removed and put back on unlike some other types of shocks

don't have a picture of gsxr shock but here is a picture of an R1 shock with a spring i painted. This spring was PITA to get on and off, needed spring compressor.

Good job on the spring :thumbup: I was thinking to paint mine red to match the red cap on the top reservoir.

i removed sanded and painted the gsxr spring that came with the shock i bought. Luckily the gsxr spring is easily removed and put back on unlike some other types of shocks

don't have a picture of gsxr shock but here is a picture of an R1 shock with a spring i painted. This spring was PITA to get on and off, needed spring compressor.

For the gsxr shock, just loosen up both ramp adjusters on the spring to remove the tension, then you can disassemble the lower end of the shock to remove the spring easily.

^ yep

i did this mod a while ago on my 08 ninja. Then i remember that it was way too stiff and went back to the old shock. about 50k miles later my original shock went bad and im not using the gsxr shock. My question to you is dont you find it very VERY stiff? mine is. Im trying to adjust it, how do you make the thing a little softer?

i did this mod a while ago on my 08 ninja. Then i remember that it was way too stiff and went back to the old shock. about 50k miles later my original shock went bad and im not using the gsxr shock. My question to you is dont you find it very VERY stiff? mine is. Im trying to adjust it, how do you make the thing a little softer?

Some people use a gsxr1000 spring from the 01 model... Others buy a custom spring...

wouldnt the gsxr1000 shock spring be even stiffer?

my fork seals are busted too, so it looks like my suspension is all over the place.

wouldnt the gsxr1000 shock spring be even stiffer?

my fork seals are busted too, so it looks like my suspension is all over the place.

Nope... The older gsxr 1000 uses an 8.1 spring while your 600 spring is 9.4

i did this mod a while ago on my 08 ninja. Then i remember that it was way too stiff and went back to the old shock. about 50k miles later my original shock went bad and im not using the gsxr shock. My question to you is dont you find it very VERY stiff? mine is. Im trying to adjust it, how do you make the thing a little softer?

When you read in the german Gixxer-Forum then you'll see that at least all of the Gixxer-Rider, except the real heavy ones, have the problems about a too stiff suspension and there especially it's the rear shock and so they change the spring of it (many use the spring from the 03/04 GSX-R 1000 whats a 8.3 N/mm).

Here's a quick chart of stock spring rates on the little Ninjas and GSXR shocks, taken from RaceTech's calculators (http://racetech.com/VehicleSearch#genre=2&brand=Suzuki). This is just to make it easier to see which bikes have which spring rates. I don't know if all of these shocks can be easily DIYed or if the springs will swap between all the different GSXR shocks.

I've also included the ideal rider weights for race and street from RT's NewGen calculator (http://racetech.com/ProductSearch/2/Kawasaki/EX250%20Ninja%20250R/2008-2012). These are just numbers based on RT's formula, not race-proven experience. They're not gospel, but they should give you an idea what spring rate you should be looking for and/or how far off your current spring is. Note that in his suspension thread (https://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=136453) a while back, rojoracing53 said that RT's calculator gave results that didn't match his real-world testing, and that the stock rear spring still seemed to be too soft for his (unspecified) 160lb weight.

BIKE MODEL RATE (kg/mm) RATE (lb/in) RIDER (lb)
EX500 OEM 5.4 300 <30
PreGen OEM 7.9 440 136-144
NewGen OEM 9.3 520 209-218

98-00 GSXR600 6.4 360 58-64
01-03 GSXR600 8.0 450 141-149
04-05 GSXR600 7.6 425 120-128
06-09 GSXR600 9.4 525 214-224
11-13 GSXR600 10.1 565 250-261

00-03 GSXR750 7.2 400 99-107
04-05 GSXR750 7.3 410 105-112
06-07 GSXR750 9.5 530 219-229
08-10 GSXR750 9.5 530 219-229
11-13 GSXR750 10.5 590 271-282

01-02 GSXR1000 7.7 430 125-133
03-04 GSXR1000 8.6 480 172-181
05-06 GSXR1000 8.1 455 146-155
07-08 GSXR1000 10.1 565 250-261
09-11 GSXR1000 11.6 650 329-341

InvisiBill, thanks for that work :thumbup:
From what I think maybe it would be a good idea to have all your information in one thread - rear and front end. What do you think about?

9.3 kg/mm? is that really the new gen spring? I would have never guess it was that high

From what I think maybe it would be a good idea to have all your information in one thread - rear and front end. What do you think about?

A lot of my info is just based on RT's calculators. They generally seem to be at least decent, but we know they've had different data in there for the NewGen, and actual racers here have said that the numbers were quite a bit off (at least in the past). I don't want my (copies of RT's) data to be seen as 100% always the perfect number, so I'm hesitant to include that in any sort of "official" copy, but at the same time I think it helps give people an idea of how different rates and weights match up across the board.

Maybe I'll add something to https://www.ninjette.org/wiki/ with all this data...

9.3 kg/mm? is that really the new gen spring? I would have never guess it was that high

Rojo clarified that he's 160lb and it still felt soft to him, so there's a chance that RT's NewGen data or formula needs some correction. Their rates match up pretty well with the 500's chart, and the rear suspensions are pretty similar, so it could be that they have the wrong spring rate. I don't have the tools to do it myself, but it shouldn't be extremely difficult for someone to measure the spring rate to verify (if you put 93kg/205lb on the spring, it should compress 10mm).

The NewGen shock/spring is a huge improvement on my 500 with my fat butt. I had an SV shock (its rate is similar to the PreGen's) installed before, but there was a bit of binding on the clevis, so it wasn't actually operating properly, so I don't have a good direct comparison between the two rates. I have a Penske with a 525# spring waiting to go on, so that should be a good indicator if the NewGen is actually 520#. Between all the different shocks/springs I have, I can probably figure out which it's closest to at least (assuming I'm able to sufficiently notice the different spring rates while riding).

Honestly, it surprised me that nobody mentioned the rear being too stiff for many Ninjette riders' weights, especially with the fork springs being so soft (https://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=231172). Rojo's statement that it was actually too soft for him goes even further beyond that. Even if it's about the same as the PreGen, that's still almost 50% stiffer than my stock 500 spring, so it would still be a huge improvement even if wasn't the full 9.3kg/mm listed.

Yes... but consider where that statement is coming from. It's someone with a medalled racing pedigree in AMA Superbike. Of course it's too soft for him.

This is not a cookie cutter comparison you're making here, Bill. Average Joe like you and me has problems with the front loooooong before the rear, likely would appreciate damping adjustment on the rear rather than spring rate change.

Yes... but consider where that statement is coming from. It's someone with a medalled racing pedigree in AMA Superbike. Of course it's too soft for him.

Based on RT's numbers (once again, for whatever that's worth), it still seems really stiff to me. They suggest 8.364kg/mm for 160lb with their race setting. 9.3kg/mm is over 11% higher than that, good for 209lb. For comparison, their street settings say 8.2kg/mm for 160lb and 9.121kg/mm for 209lb, or making the race specs 1.5-1.8% higher than street. Even if he is a top-notch racer who likes the very firm end of the suspension range, it still doesn't seem right to me that he'd use a spring meant for someone 40% heavier.

With that much difference, I'm inclined to believe there's a problem with RT's data or formula. I know that small suspension measurement differences can result in large changes in the final numbers, but all these little Ninjas have pretty similar suspensions (as indicated by the ease of swapping their parts around), and the NewGen calculator seems to match up pretty well to the race-accepted numbers for the 500. That makes me think their formula isn't insanely wrong. Based on the Ninjas' history of soft springs, it wouldn't surprise me if the NewGen rear is actually softer than the listed 9.3kg/mm.

https://www.ninjette.org/forums/images/smilies/custom_smilies/idunno.gif Maybe real racers really do just use springs that much stiffer. He did say that their fork spring calculations (a while back, before changes of some sort were made to the NewGen calc) were low too. Or maybe he's just a fatty in denial about his actual weight. https://www.ninjette.org/forums/images/smilies/biggrin.gif


This is not a cookie cutter comparison you're making here, Bill. Average Joe like you and me has problems with the front loooooong before the rear, likely would appreciate damping adjustment on the rear rather than spring rate change.

Speaking from experience with a binding rear shock mod, I can say that a too-stiff rear will make even a bike with a really good front feel bad (someone with more experience might be able to more easily tell where the problem is, but the bike as a whole felt "bad", worse than with the way-too-soft spring). And if the front is also too soft, the stiff rear will exacerbate the rocking horse effect. If the rear spring really is quite a bit too stiff, getting a softer spring might actually make the front seem less bad because the front isn't being forced to absorb all the force that the rear won't (though you should still install springs of the right rate if you need to).

I've installed a couple springs on one street bike, so obviously I'm an expert now. =) But I tend to agree with the general idea that getting the proper spring rate should be the first step. That'll get it bouncing in the right range, allowing the damping to be most efficient. If the spring is too soft, it'll be moving too much and the damping system will be straining to control the excess movement. But if the spring is too stiff, then it's already not moving enough, so restraining the already-lacking movement isn't going to help any.

Luckily, the GSXR shock can take care of both spring rate and damping settings (assuming you choose one with a spring matching your weight) so you don't have to choose one or the other.

The 600 shocks that most people seem to be using have spring rates in the same range as the PreGen and NewGen OEM springs, so most people probably ended up ok (e.g. the '06-'09 is pretty much the same as the stocker (based on RT's listed data)). It just seemed to me that a lot of people didn't know/care what they needed for their weight or what they were installing - they just heard that a GSXR shock was an upgrade so they bought the cheapest one off eBay. A different year 600 or a 750/1000 might have a spring that better matches the person's weight, rather than just duplicating the stock numbers. Maybe I'm just reading too much into it, but I got the impression that people weren't necessarily informed enough to make the best decision. If you can just make a slightly different model choice when buying your GSXR shock and get one with a spring better suited to your weight, it makes the DIY that much better.

Average Joe like you and me has problems with the front loooooong before the rear, likely would appreciate damping adjustment on the rear rather than spring rate change.

Alot of what you say is valid but I would disagree with this statement. The right rate spring is a required foundation for proper suspension action. It is the primary source of taking your KE (mass of you and the bike moving in relationship to the mass of the earth); storing it as PE and releasing some of it as your KE state changes.

A damper transforms the unwanted KE/PE into thermal energy and spreads it to another media (air). A damper being adjusted up and down to transform more or less of that energy cannot correct a spring that does not have the capability of handling the energy input needed to be stored sufficiently. In the same token but on the opposite side, a spring that does not deflect because it stores and returns KE far to quickly will not allow the tire to track the surface of the road/track and no amount of increase/decrease in damper function is going to change that.

Spring first -> Dampen second

Speaking from experience with a binding rear shock mod, I can say that a too-stiff rear will make even a bike with a really good front feel bad

Luckily, the GSXR shock can take care of both spring rate and damping settings (assuming you choose one with a spring matching your weight) so you don't have to choose one or the other.


:werd: Can show up like this;

Rear chatter while hard on the front brake (harder than your average track rider)
Front pushing because rear will not give up enough travel/speed of travel so the tires, forks and frame must absorb the force
Numb feeling of traction from the rear - too much preload or wrong spring
Too much track feedback from the rear - too much preload or wrong spring


The 600 shocks that most people seem to be using have spring rates in the same range as the PreGen and NewGen OEM springs, so most people probably ended up ok (e.g. the '06-'09 is pretty much the same as the stocker (based on RT's listed data)). It just seemed to me that a lot of people didn't know/care what they needed for their weight or what they were installing - they just heard that a GSXR shock was an upgrade so they bought the cheapest one off eBay. A different year 600 or a 750/1000 might have a spring that better matches the person's weight, rather than just duplicating the stock numbers. Maybe I'm just reading too much into it, but I got the impression that people weren't necessarily informed enough to make the best decision. If you can just make a slightly different model choice when buying your GSXR shock and get one with a spring better suited to your weight, it makes the DIY that much better.

I think you're pretty much spot on.

The 600 shocks that most people seem to be using have spring rates in the same range as the PreGen and NewGen OEM springs, so most people probably ended up ok (e.g. the '06-'09 is pretty much the same as the stocker (based on RT's listed data)). It just seemed to me that a lot of people didn't know/care what they needed for their weight or what they were installing - they just heard that a GSXR shock was an upgrade so they bought the cheapest one off eBay. A different year 600 or a 750/1000 might have a spring that better matches the person's weight, rather than just duplicating the stock numbers. Maybe I'm just reading too much into it, but I got the impression that people weren't necessarily informed enough to make the best decision. If you can just make a slightly different model choice when buying your GSXR shock and get one with a spring better suited to your weight, it makes the DIY that much better.

You are probably right about this but some people my self in particular put a lot of time and effort into trying to track down a rear spring that would be better for my weight for the gsxr shock. It was difficult and a waste of money. It is hard to find much info let alone accurate info on rear springs. I figured I could find a used shock from some bike that had the rate I wanted and the correct size but it never worked out. Most of the springs were never the right size despite doing research and looking like the numbers added up and I ended up just wasting money trying different shock springs. I should have just bought a new racetech spring from the get go and saved myself the time and money.

But we all know shocks are more than just springs, there are valves, if you are going to go through the trouble of getting the correct spring, that still doesn't mean it is going to work any better on that actual shock as the valving can be way off. Might be a step in the right direction but with a new spring you are still only addressing some of the potential problems and I don't think the gsxr shocks can be rebuilt/revalved very easily or cheaply for that matter.

In short, sticking with the stock spring on the gsxr shock isn't all that bad or big of a deal. If you are going to drop $70 or so to make the conversion work then another $110 for a new spring you are $180 into it, that is a good chunk towards an aftermarket shock built specifically for you and the ninja that keeps the stock geometry. If I could go back and do it again I would probably have went aftermarket

In short, sticking with the stock spring on the gsxr shock isn't all that bad or big of a deal. If you are going to drop $70 or so to make the conversion work then another $110 for a new spring you are $180 into it, that is a good chunk towards an aftermarket shock built specifically for you and the ninja that keeps the stock geometry. If I could go back and do it again I would probably have went aftermarket

That is a fair and accurate point. The GSXR shock works as a budget replacement situation, mostly if your in the range of the stock spring, or you can get an appropriate rate spring off another model for really cheap and swap it yourself. A respring and revalve by a suspension tuner on a GSXR shock is not the best cost effective solution.

That is a fair and accurate point. The GSXR shock works as a budget replacement situation, mostly if your in the range of the stock spring, or you can get an appropriate rate spring off another model for really cheap and swap it yourself. A respring and revalve by a suspension tuner on a GSXR shock is not the best cost effective solution.

exactly, guess that is what I was trying to say but never got to it. :p

budget replacement that works and gives you lots of adjustment vs stock shock that works and gives you no adjustment :thumbup:

You are probably right about this but some people my self in particular put a lot of time and effort into trying to track down a rear spring that would be better for my weight for the gsxr shock. It was difficult and a waste of money. It is hard to find much info let alone accurate info on rear springs. I figured I could find a used shock from some bike that had the rate I wanted and the correct size but it never worked out. Most of the springs were never the right size despite doing research and looking like the numbers added up and I ended up just wasting money trying different shock springs. I should have just bought a new racetech spring from the get go and saved myself the time and money.

But we all know shocks are more than just springs, there are valves, if you are going to go through the trouble of getting the correct spring, that still doesn't mean it is going to work any better on that actual shock as the valving can be way off. Might be a step in the right direction but with a new spring you are still only addressing some of the potential problems and I don't think the gsxr shocks can be rebuilt/revalved very easily or cheaply for that matter.

In short, sticking with the stock spring on the gsxr shock isn't all that bad or big of a deal. If you are going to drop $70 or so to make the conversion work then another $110 for a new spring you are $180 into it, that is a good chunk towards an aftermarket shock built specifically for you and the ninja that keeps the stock geometry. If I could go back and do it again I would probably have went aftermarket

Absolutely. http://www.nestreetriders.com/forum/44588-shock-swap-myth.html

The 500 guys are lucky in that the PreGen spring (or SV650 shock) is good for a ~180lb rider and the NewGen/300 shock/spring is good for bigger guys. We have a few drop-in options that cover a pretty good range of common adult sizes. They're all cheap, non-adjustable shocks, but the horrible stock spring rate means that getting the right rate is a huge upgrade, even if you can't tweak the shock.

But if you can buy a slightly different $25 GSXR shock that will fit the Ninja the same, or buy a second $25 GSXR shock and swap the springs, you might get much better results than just accepting the default one mentioned in the DIY. I'm not sure about the origins of the GSXR shock swap - the fact that it matches the stock spring rate might be carefully researched or pure coincidence. And there seems to be some question about the applicability of the stock rate too.

I found a deal on a used Penske and jumped on it. However, I've been happy enough with the NewGen shock that I haven't bothered to install it yet (the Penske really is overkill for me). The Penske also uses standard(ish?) 6"x2" springs, so it's fairly easy to find replacements pretty cheap (though maybe not in the exact rate you want).

...

Or maybe he's just a fatty in denial about his actual weight. https://www.ninjette.org/forums/images/smilies/biggrin.gif

lol, not a fatty.

also, dude. you've had a lot of time to think about the RT calculator... :rotflmao: Don't take that the wrong way. just... wow.

Spring first -> Dampen second

^^ werd. You're totally right.


but hear me out.

average joe or average sally rides their ninja. They've been riding 3 years, no track time. Comfortable and safe in twisties, able to ride spirited but not dragging knee. Comfortable enough to have some fun, but smart enough to be cautious still.

Where do these riders notice the front end? Bumps. brake dive, corner vagueness. They want that fixed soon.

Where do they feel the rear end? It pogo's over bumps. Maybe they play with the preload a little to stop it from squatting a ton when they just sit on it. But realistically the rear end for an average rider on street is low on rebound damping more than it is undersprung. What I'm saying is that an average rider is going to want a damping change in the rear before they'll really want spring changes.

the PreGen spring is good for a ~180lb rider

Just putting this out there... no it's not.

If it is, then the 500's suspension geometry is different enough from the pregen that you're not comparing apples to apples with all your spring rate thoughts.


EDIT: wait... pregen spring or pregen shock? I've never seen someone change the spring rate on the stock pregen shock. Just not worth it.

also, dude. you've had a lot of time to think about the RT calculator... :rotflmao: Don't take that the wrong way. just... wow.

I'm currently not working, so I've got all sorts of time to think way too much about all kinds of stupid things. You wouldn't believe how much useless crap I've accomplished!


Just putting this out there... no it's not.

If it is, then the 500's suspension geometry is different enough from the pregen that you're not comparing apples to apples with all your spring rate thoughts.


EDIT: wait... pregen spring or pregen shock? I've never seen someone change the spring rate on the stock pregen shock. Just not worth it.

PreGen spring transplanted to the 500 shock (which is pretty similar, but has a preload adjuster), or with the SV650 shock/spring swapped in. The 500 chart compiled from veterans' info states that a 450# spring is good for a geared-up rider at 200lb. These springs are ~45% stiffer than the 300# stocker.

I haven't done any extensive testing on it, I'm just accepting the word of guys who've been racing these for a long time. So far, their numbers have given me good results. Like I said, the NewGen shock/spring has been such an improvement that I've had a used Penske sitting here in the box for a year because it's just sooooo much work to bolt it in and strap the reservoir to the frame.

InvisiBill I agree with all you said about the rear shock.
After I bought a new shock from YSS for my bike I'd order it with a 85 N/mm spring (the standard is 80 N/mm) and from what I feel and think now with riding my Ninja I'd better took the standard spring, since my bike still feels really stiff (at the lowest point of pre-load).
And let me say one word about the GSX-R shock, when one reads in the German gixxer forums one can read that around 50% of all 600/750 Gixxer-rider (not the 1000 cc) change the spring of the rear shock to a softer one and this also means nearly no rider is happy with the rear spring, but some guys just take it like it is.
And this I think can be transfered to Ninja-riders also, even when the spring is to stiff nobody will talk about this, because that means confirming a wrong decision was made.
Also since humans are some kind of herd they always follow what others did or say :bow:

InvisiBill I agree with all you said about the rear shock.
After I bought a new shock from YSS for my bike I'd order it with a 85 N/mm spring (the standard is 80 N/mm) and from what I feel and think now with riding my Ninja I'd better took the standard spring, since my bike still feels really stiff (at the lowest point of pre-load).
And let me say one word about the GSX-R shock, when one reads in the German gixxer forums one can read that around 50% of all 600/750 Gixxer-rider (not the 1000 cc) change the spring of the rear shock to a softer one and this also means nearly no rider is happy with the rear spring, but some guys just take it like it is.
And this I think can be transfered to Ninja-riders also, even when the spring is to stiff nobody will talk about this, because that means confirming a wrong decision was made.
Also since humans are some kind of herd they always follow what others did or say :bow:


It's stiff for sure. I'm able to be backed out on pre-load and just hit ~30ish sag. If you're ~180lbs I still think it's a bang for your buck thing using the shock as is.

It's stiff for sure. I'm able to be backed out on pre-load and just hit ~30ish sag. If you're ~180lbs I still think it's a bang for your buck thing using the shock as is.

Tom I don't have any problems with what you're doing since its all your way.
But please remember what you are doing:
- with a shorter shock (which from the low sales price could be understood at the end of its life-cycle already) made for a complete different bike (and not only from progression) you are changing the progression of the Ninja's suspension in one way
- just to then use different dog bones to change the progression more backwards in the opposite way :confused:
and this only to talk about height and not about the internal components of the gixxer-shock.
But like I said, you must feel and be happy with this mod :)

9.3 kg/mm? is that really the new gen spring? I would have never guess it was that high

When I calculate the spring rate by the given parameters of the spring the result is: 9.4955 kg/mm.
Here please note that my number of free coils might not be exactly correct so I think the given 9.3 kg/mm spring rate should be the real number.

I got looking at the old Intiminator thread on the SV forum, and ended up browsing some of their shock upgrade stuff. It seems they're using ZX-10/14 shocks for budget upgrades.

BIKE MODEL RATE (kg/mm) RATE (lb/in) RIDER (lb)
06-07 ZX-10R 8.3 465 157-166
06-11 ZX-14R 9.7 543 230-240

These two particular models have the reservoir coming straight off. Other years have angled reservoirs, which makes mounting them harder/impossible on the SV.

I was hoping to find a comparable Kawasaki shock that wouldn't require messing with the mounting stuff. Unfortunately, these both use 10mm mounting bolts, so they'll still require the same mods as the GSXR shock there. The width may or may not fit our little Ninjas better. RT does list the same replacement spring part numbers for these and the GSXRs, so they might serve as cheap spring donors if nothing else. They talked about getting these dirt cheap (under $30), but they seem to be closer to $100 on eBay now. If these manage to be less work to get installed and/or you do find one cheap, they might still be a good budget upgrade.

Hopefully someone here has access to one of these shocks (or is willing to buy one as a guinea pig) and can see how applicable it is.

New dogbones ( http://burkhartcycle.com/store/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=7_34 )

There are a fair number of posts on these forums about long wait times and a complete lack of communication for Burkhart. I thought I'd offer my experience simply because it's recent (unless you're read this months from now).

My links were ordered on 7 December 2015
$17.00 for the links, $6.35 for shipping
Arrived at my doorstep on 14 December 2015

Seems like I got the best case scenario, compared to what others have experienced.

Maybe real racers really do just use springs that much stiffer. He did say that their fork spring calculations (a while back, before changes of some sort were made to the NewGen calc) were low too. Or maybe he's just a fatty in denial about his actual weight. https://www.ninjette.org/forums/images/smilies/biggrin.gif


:rotflmao:
Just noticed this thread come across the portal page and since I have still yet to install the GSXR shock I bought like two years ago I figured I'd glance at what you guys have figured out. It would seem you've done quite a bit of homework since last I checked.

Couple quick notes. Yes very fast racers use stiff springs then most and the calculators can't compensate for this because there's like only 2% of racers that fall into that scenario. My forks noticeably stiff on the street but at least when I have to jam on the brakes they are there to hold me up. Because my fork are so stiff my stock shock feels even softer then before but I can deal with that because it's not dangerous. The rear shock is only an issue at this point while on the track which hasn't happened for a while and won't be happening again any time soon. It's also too soft when I'm bike camping with all my gear and the MTB on the rear, it actually bottoms out with a noticeable bump over big dips and such. Sadly my laziness dictates It'll still be quite awhile longer before I get to installing that GSXR shock.

Do it already, you bum.

bump ......
This topic has me getting ready to hit up my boxed oem stuff. (I did swap them all out for tunability reasons.) The sec gen 10r shock mentioned above got my attention since I know that one of those sits in a box that an SV 1000 owner wanted. I am still new to the 250, but keep up on the good reads.

Updating this DIY guide to simplify and make it even easier to do. For those wishing to install GSX-R shocks on Ninjette, there is no need to drill out upper shock bushing or your frame mounts. The 10mm bolt used for GSX-R shock is fine because it generates sufficient friction to hold bushing in between ears.

To use factory unmolested 12mm mounting ears and 10mm shock eyelet, you just need two sleeves like this. Might need to remove 1mm from width to not extend beyond width of mounting ears on frame. These fill up larger hole in frame mounting ears and allows simple bolt-on use of GSX-R 10mm bolt.

Polaris # 5135275 - https://www.ebay.com/itm/302898035590

https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/vZMAAOSw7VVZ5M5E/s-l1600.jpg

Updating this DIY guide to simplify and make it even easier to do. For those wishing to install GSX-R shocks on Ninjette, there is no need to drill out upper shock bushing or your frame mounts. The 10mm bolt used for GSX-R shock is fine because it generates sufficient friction to hold bushing in between ears.

To use factory unmolested 12mm mounting ears and 10mm shock eyelet, you just need two sleeves like this. Might need to remove 1mm from width to not extend beyond width of mounting ears on frame. These fill up larger hole in frame mounting ears and allows simple bolt-on use of GSX-R 10mm bolt.

Polaris # 5135275 - https://www.ebay.com/itm/302898035590

https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/vZMAAOSw7VVZ5M5E/s-l1600.jpg

Awesome man, good info I've been searching around for something like this. Been considering the GSXR shock upgrade for a while.

Btw does anyone have any pics of the cutout they had to do to the rear underplastic to get this to fit? I'm trying to picture what it will look like after cutting plastics, and how to mitigate any issues with the cutout and riding in wet weather

Awesome man, good info I've been searching around for something like this. Been considering the GSXR shock upgrade for a while.

Btw does anyone have any pics of the cutout they had to do to the rear underplastic to get this to fit? I'm trying to picture what it will look like after cutting plastics, and how to mitigate any issues with the cutout and riding in wet weather

I'll run to the garage and take a pic.

Here's how mine looks. Luckily the carbs are out with Gordon so pics were easy lol.

Here's how mine looks. Luckily the carbs are out with Gordon so pics were easy lol.

Thanks for that! Hmm seems I need to cut a big portion of the plastics to get the shock to fit. Worried about rain getting in, as I ride this rain or shine.

Maybe I could use a small lithium ion battery instead to make space and add some kind of block off rubber mat/plastic/metal where the cut above the shock.

Thanks for that! Hmm seems I need to cut a big portion of the plastics to get the shock to fit. Worried about rain getting in, as I ride this rain or shine.

Maybe I could use a small lithium ion battery instead to make space and add some kind of block off rubber mat/plastic/metal where the cut above the shock.

I switched to pod filter when I did this. Mainly to give me more room there than any HP gains but even with the open pod there I've had no issues in the rain.

Depending upon specific GSX-R shock you get, amount to cut from fender-liner will vary. Get shock first, then see where it interferes and cut minimum amount needed.

Depending upon specific GSX-R shock you get, amount to cut from fender-liner will vary. Get shock first, then see where it interferes and cut minimum amount needed.


I'm thinking about grabbing an 03-04 GSXR 1000 shock. I'm 176lbs without gear and I've got a SW Motech rack in the back that adds some weight. I just added 0.75kg racetech springs w/ 15w fork oil.

I left the oil height stock for now, Ill probably start adjusting it this coming week as I don't think I'm using all of my fork travel. I actually forgot to mark where the fork bottoms out so I gotta go back in anyway, and I figure I'll pull out some oil and try 120mm oil height and see how that plays out

I ran the 600 with a 1000 spring with minimal cutting. I cannot remember the specs or year shock I used.

Hi All. I realize that this is an old thread, but I'm hoping you all can help. I bought a get 2 ninjette race bike. It has the GSXR shock installed. I spent the summer dragging rears pegs, burning through boots and generally looking like a fool who doesn't know how to set up a bike. I need to raise the rear over the winter. Ordered raising links from Burkahrt a month and a half ago. No confirmation outside of the website account showing the order pending. No responses. Not sure they will ever come seeing as how it is now 11 years later than this thread started.

So, can anyone help me with dog bone measurements. I have access to a CNC router and am capable of making my own if I have a staring point on measurements. Looking to raise the rear 1.25". Any help is much appreciated.

Thanks.