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Old June 16th, 2016, 08:23 PM   #84
Misti
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Name: Misti
Location: Vancouver, BC
Join Date: Oct 2010

Motorcycle(s): currently: Yamaha YZF 250 dirt/motard

Posts: 787
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ducati999 View Post
Misti,
I believe you are right that I did not state what I was feeling correctly. Towards the beginning of this thread I was asking what the feeling I was getting thru the front end was. When I began to corner harder at the track, I was feeling something new thru the bars and did not know/understand what the feedback from the tire was telling me. I have just returned from Riding School with Mr CSMITH12 and I now have a much better understanding of what the bike it communicating to me while leaned over at speed. I will PM you with some of what I have learned and explain further. Thank you so much for taking time to assess and improve my riding!

The answer the your first question above: "What do you do immediately after you press on the bar?" (Answer) Stop once the lean angle is correct for the turn.

Answer to the second question above: "What do you do to stop the bike from turning?" (Answer) Push/pull bars in the opposite direction.

Let me know if I got these answers correct or if I am missing what you are trying to communicate to me
Got your PM! I read it carefully and agree that you picked up a lot of understanding of what was going on in terms of "feel" from your bike but I still think there is something to be dissected here a little bit more that may give an alternative possibility to some of the things you are feeling with your bike. One of my questions to you was what do you do immediately after you press on the bar, and you said, stop pressing which is correct.

Then I asked, how do you stop the bike from turning and you said, push/pull the bars in the opposite direction- now, this may simply be semantics at play here BUT, there is no need to actually do anything when you want the bike to stop turning, you simply stop pressing on the bar. When you enter a turn you press on the inside bar to initiate the turn, when you get to the lean angle you want you stop pressing, now here is where it gets interesting, a lot of people believe that you need to push/pull the bar in the opposite direction (as you mentioned) in order to ensure that the bike doesn't lean over any further.

It is that SMALL/SLIGHT motion of trying to stop the bike from leaning over that CAN create a small pushing feeling in the front tire. It may feel like the bike is hitching, or a bit jerky or even that it is sliding a little bit or pushing the front. As coaches we see it manifest in a little jerk or wiggle (very slight) immediately after turn in. This is what I was thinking was a possibility of what you may be feeling.

Sometimes it isn't even a conscious effort to stop the bike from leaning over by pressing on the opposite bar, but even a tightening on both bars can have the same effect.

Give some thought to that and next time you ride see if pressing on the bar and then RELEASING all pressure (both ways) removes that pushing feeling, or makes the turning a bit smoother. It may not be the solution at all but it could have something to do with what you were experiencing.

And thanks for being so open to my advice and keeping this thread active and interesting!

Quote:
Originally Posted by adouglas View Post
Ant, I think you missed slightly on the second one, only because of terminology. "Turning the bike" means causing a change of direction from the path it would take anyway. A bike that's leaned over with no pressure on the bars is carving a circle but it's not "being turned" because it's at steady state.

(Try it with your bicycle... hold the saddle, tilt it over and push forward... it'll go in a circle without you pressing the bar at all.)

Consider that we're told to "finish turning the bike" as fast as possible, and before the apex. That's consistent with the idea that simply releasing bar pressure stops the bike from turning further.

I'd say the answer to both is the same... release bar pressure. You initiate the turn by pressing on the bar. You maintain turning (meaning the bike continues to lean over) as long as the bar is pressed. Once you release pressure, the bike STOPS turning and is now tracking in an arc because it's leaned over.

Countersteering the other way gets the bike stood up.
Yes, this is another way of explaining it
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