New member - Semi-big plans - help?

[cydisc]

I'm a newb, taking my motorcycle rider safety class in a few weeks. I'm planning to do a longish ride next summer and would like some feedback, ideas, tips etc... I've yet to choose a first bike, but the Ninjette is on the list, obviously. Realistically, my future riding would be close to 80/20 street to dirt (read: gravel).

Here is my narrowed list of potential bikes:
- Used 250/300 Ninja (any year)
- Used Honda CB300F
- CSC (Zongshen) Cyclone RX3

Here is my semi-epic ride:

Start: Ames, IA to Lake Michigan via Lake Geneva, WI (childhood memories to revisit), down through Chicago and around the lake up through Mackinac, west and south through the UP, up the Door Peninsula and back down through Green Bay, west towards Faribault, MN and back south to Ames. 1600+ miles in 9 days.

I'll have places to stay at friends and relatives on Mackinac Island, MI, Shawano, WI (west of Green Bay) and Faribault, MN. The rest will be camping. I plan to ride no more than 300 miles in a day and mostly in the 200 mile range.

That's it so far. I'm looking for advice on all fronts... bike choice, gear needed, places to see, things to do, where to eat, where to stay, etc...

And, go!

[VaFish]

Well a ninjette is certainly capable of doing that trip, and this being a ninjette forum of course I say get the Ninjette.

However, your future use of 80/20 street dirt makes me think a dual sport or adventure bike might be a better choice if you only want to buy 1 bike.

As for gear, I just posted some pictures of a couple of large tail bags I recently purchased in the cargo space forum , for other gear think backpacking, small light 1 man tent, light weight backpacking stove, minimal clothing and do laundry often ect...

[adouglas]

Random tips in no particular order. These are from first-hand experience on a 2,500 mile tour on my Ninjette:

- Do a trial run that simulates one full day's ride before your trip. You'll learn a lot... in particular, exactly what riding 300-400 miles in one day feels like.

- Stop and get off the bike every hour, even if you don't think you need to. Just walk around for a minute or two and stretch. Does wonders for your endurance and it really doesn't slow you down that much.

- GOOD for you on keeping the days short! This should be fun, not drudgery.

- Stay off the Interstates whenever you can. The very best way to NOT see America is ride the Interstates. Back roads are the best roads. (Bonus tip: Get paper maps covering your whole route and look for the squiggliest lines. That's what I did and I discovered By God West Virginia, which is an amazing riding destination.)

- If you see something interesting, stop and check it out. Ditto if there's a place you've wanted to visit along the way. You're not going to have another chance this trip, and may never get there again.

- Try to build flexibility into your schedule so you don't encounter "get-home-itis"... the need to press on even though you're exhausted. You should be riding when you want to ride, not because you have to ride. It's good to have a break in the middle of the trip to reset and recreate. On my own trip, I rode from CT to Indianapolis for the MotoGP race, then took a long and winding route home. The break for the races was great.

- Eat at local joints, not chains. Every McDonald's is the same. Local businesses are one-of-a-kind. (Exception: Coffee, unless you find a real coffee shop.)

- Move around on the bike a lot. Like, all the time. Keeps you from getting monkey butt.

- Put your weight on your thighs, not your a$$. Like you're perching on the edge of a kitchen chair. Like a jockey on a race horse. Since discovering this on my own epic Ninjette tour, I have never, ever had a sore butt.

- Rest your chest on the tank bag from time to time. This is all about staying comfortable hour after hour.

- I've not done this personally, but consider getting a cramp buster or some other cruise control (cramp buster looks best to me because it doesn't actually lock the throttle open). I had to get pretty creative with ways to keep my right hand from cramping.

- Dress for the ride. I went with base layers under riding clothes... no street clothes for the ride. More comfortable that way.

- You're going to spend 99.9 percent of your time in riding clothes. It's a waste to bring more than one or two shirts and one pair of pants because some days, you won't even wear them. Use the space for underwear and socks instead.

- Speaking of riding clothes, now is the time to invest in proper gear if you haven't already. Dedicated motorcycle pants with armor (overpants work well for touring because they're flexible), back protector upgrade for your jacket, gauntlet gloves and riding boots.

- Frog Toggs are less expensive than motorcycle rain suits and they work well. They also pack small. They make a bib overall that goes well with a jacket.

- I went with a good-sized tank bag (Axio) and a SW-Motech (Bags Connection) Cargobag from Twisted Throttle. Worked well and I'd buy it again. There are many luggage solutions, though, so find one that's right for you. Figure out what you'll be carrying before you buy luggage, so you don't come up short.

- One word: Earplugs. Personally I like to listen to audiobooks/podcasts etc. to help pass the time, so for me it's earbuds. I HIGHLY recommend the Plug-Up S-plugs, which are worth every penny and more. They disappear into your ear so there are no pressure points from your helmet, are utterly comfortable and provide superb isolation so you can keep the volume down. No kidding, this is a mission-critical item for me. http://www.plugup.com/the_S_plug_ste...rbuds_s/67.htm

- Take pictures.

- Talk to people.

- Make memories. They're going to last the rest of your life, long after the bike is gone.

You're gonna have a GREAT time!

[InvisiBill]

Originally Posted by http://www.revzilla.com/common-tread/wrenching-your-own-ride-a-look-at-the-new-csc-rx-3-cyclone

To cut down on costs to the consumer, CSC has no plans to use a traditional dealer network. Instead, you purchase directly from the warehouse and have it delivered to your home or you can swing on in and ride on out on your new bike. Instead of dealer support, what you get with the purchase of a Cyclone is a full factory service manual and a detailed maintenance tutorial page on their website that walks you through valve adjustments, fork rebuilds, replacing the clutch and everything in between. There are detailed pictures and specific instructions to help you complete each job on your own.

Now, some will argue that they are doing this because their 250cc Chinese engine probably requires more service than other bikes and there is no large dealer network to supply the needed support for the Cyclone.

This may be a concern on a long distance trip like that. While I generally like the idea of saving money by doing things myself, I'm not sure I'd want to be several states away with nobody to service or provide parts for my bike. If you've had it a year by the time of the trip, I'd hope you'd have a decent idea of what to expect out of the bike. However, it's the surprises that get you. For comparison, I guarantee there's at least one Kawasaki/Honda dealer in every state you'll be passing through.

Like VaFish said, something less sportbike-y might be better for you. Maybe a CB500X? https://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=264443 There seemed to be internet rumors of a CB300X a while back, but I'm not seeing that they've actually released one.

While I understand people wanting a smaller bike and encourage anyone to not buy too big a bike, I find my EX500 to be a great blend of a small bike and a decent amount of power. The Ninja 300 is about 35hp, the CB500 45hp, and the EX500 55hp. It's a step up, but it's not an insane jump in power where you'll accidentally be doing 150mph wheelies. The extra power might be nice on a longer trip like this, especially if you do end up on some expressways. My 500's peak power is at 9500rpm and can cruise 80mph at only 6500rpm (compared to 11000rpm/8600rpm on the Ninja 300 and 11000rpm/9800rpm on a NewGen 250) so it should be less buzzy, which can help on long rides.


By the way, I'm a little ways east of Grand Rapids if you're swinging inland on your way up. There's a 4500 acre state park with a lake and camping nearby. This area's not the greatest for exciting riding, but there are some hills and winding rivers. Lots of nature at least.

[CaliGrrl]

I hope you have a great trip! That's quite a road trip but I'm sure you'll see some great things.

Husband and I did a short motorcycle trip up to Death Valley recently, and we packed way too much stuff. We need to sort through what we did and didn't use and pack better next time. Layers will be your friend, though, and clothes that you can wash out in the sink and which will dry by the next morning.

As far as tailbags go, we've been using Kriega bags and they are great. Closes up so it's waterproof, and you can stack 'em. They come in 5liter, 10liter, 20liter, and 30liter sizes and even the 10L holds quite a bit of stuff. Plan for what you can reasonably carry to a hotel room. How many bags will you have, and will anything have carrying straps? That kind of thing.

[Ghostt]

For comfort on the Ninjette look into better grips,(heated grips) Heavy bar ends, touring windscreen, a better seat, gear it down if you plan on interstate speeds, I run +1/-2 set up @ 75mph it's about 8k or so

I weigh about 225 lbs with full gear.

Luggage wise I have Rapid Transit Recon 19 tank bag, saddle and tail bag. Plenty of room for everything I need.

If you check out my blog below you'll find some more information on the items I mentioned above.

Good luck, and ride safe.

[Motofool]

Originally Posted by cydisc

I'm a newb, taking my motorcycle rider safety class in a few weeks. ........... I'm looking for advice on all fronts... bike choice, gear needed, places to see, things to do, where to eat, where to stay, etc...

And, go!

Welcome to the world of motorcycling !!!

For your specific case, a pre-2008 Ninja 250 is your best option among the ones above.

The specs of the Chinese bike show 24.8 HP @ 9000 rpm / 16.6 lb-ft of torque @ 7000 rpm / 386 lbs curb weight.

The specs of the pre-gen Ninja show 37.4 hp @ 12500 rpm / 18 lb-ft of torque @ 10,000 rpm / 355 lbs wet weight.

http://www.motorcycle.com/manufactur...-3-review.html

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kawasaki_Ninja_250R

You can find a good pre-gen Ninja for less than $1,500.
Being your first bike, the probability of getting cosmetically and/or mechanically damaged is high.

The new-gen is as good as the pre-gen, but the price remains higher.

The Ninja 300 is more expensive, obviously.

If you have to use the super-slabs, the 72 mph tested for the CSC Cyclone RX-3 will not do much to keep you safe from aggressive traffic.

For gear and tips:
http://faq.ninja250.org/wiki/Protective_Gear

http://www.roadrunner.travel/

http://faq.ninja250.org/wiki/New_Riders

[SLOWn60]

Welcome Steve!My suggestion is a Honda CRF250L or a Suzuki DRZ400 either S or SM

I clocked over 40,000 miles on my Honda (1976) XL250 and 2 years ago I toured Kenya 6,000 kms on a Honda XL250 Baja. They are excellent bikes, comfortable to ride, cheap to operate, work on and insure. Lots of luggage options and have enough get up & go for the roads you should be on (not droning for hours on super slab!) though they can do slab but that's a waste of travel time! I will be selling my BMW800GS and buying a CRF250L this summer!

Though I've never owned a DRZ400 I have enough friends that do or have. They are a fantastic bike but higher price point & costs.

Either one will give you that dirt component you seek which is not what a Ninja 250R is about!

I should add: there is an ongoing thread right now on ADVenture rider, of a 70 year old woman traveling down the length of South America. Great read and illustrates the durability of the Honda 250 dual sport.

[cydisc]

Originally Posted by adouglas

Random tips in no particular order. These are from first-hand experience on a 2,500 mile tour on my Ninjette:....

This is all great information and exactly what I was looking for. Thank you for your thoroughness.

[toEleven]

Paging @NevadaWolf. He gives me the impression he'd have useful advice for long rides. I also didn't see any mention of the KLX250 in any of it's variants. I'm an admirer rather than an owner, so I can't attest to it's long range manner, but it ticks the dualsport and smaller displacement boxes.

Edit: my pronouns are wrong, but left as is so the clarification below continues to make sense. Sorry NevadaWolf!

[NevadaWolf]

Simply for clarity, I'm a she.

Actually on rides like this, the advice adouglas gave is better than what I'd provide. 200-300 miles days are weekend back country goat road 10-12 hour adventures for me. My normal trips are much longer and further.


So, that said, generic stuff..

First off, sounds like you are way over thinking this. Eyeballing the map (which why I hadn't responded yet, hadn't mapped out your trip to see where you were) looks like towns and civilization are within easy reach anywhere and anywhen. So you only need to pack the minimal amount needed to get you through the day. Realistically I would think all you need is to pick up a roadside assistance plan or carry tools to fix a flat, anything else should be managable with a cell phone and a credit card. Still, I've not been in your corner of the country, so if you know areas of little traffic or weak cell signal, think how long you'll have to wait for help and plan accordingly.

Carry layers, cool air in the morning gives ways to warm afternoons and as night falls it's amazing how cold things get. I wear a heated jacket to help with the chill and LDComfort base layers to combat the heat (desert southwest if not guessed from my name).

If you plan on having dinner/breakfast at camp, grab something to go when you gas up for the night and take it with you. No sense carrying food all day when it's all around you.

Lock your bike up with at least a lock on the rear brake disc. Keeps bad guys from rolling the bike away.


Bike wise, I have the newgen and it's not really soft luggage friendly. It'll do hard pack dirt roads and mild rough terrain, but that front cowl hangs down way low so you really need to pick your line carefully. I'd say go pregen if you can, better tail for gear and Skippii has done some wild off roading with his. But if you are planning to add consistant dirt into the mix, then maybe a small dual sport would work (Thanks, Bill, for the link to my new bike thread).

The important thing is to have fun and enjoy your trip the way you want. If meeting folks is your thing, then get out there and meet them. If watching the landscape roll by and marveling at nature is more your speed, then keep on cruising. It's all good.

[JohnnyBravo]

Sounds like a sweet ride

[FrugalNinja250]

My long distance riding is on a 2006 that's mostly stock other than a taller windscreen and different sprocket ratios. Oh, and a Corbin. Gotta get a Corbin if you can. Rear at the time was a 43, front was (and is) a 15. That's gotta be the very first change if you get a pregen.

My longest ride is 850 miles from Chattanooga, TN to Houston, TX via New Orleans. Took me 14 hours and 20 minutes. My setup is full saddle and tail bags, and a tank bag. I put two rigid water bottles and a folded towel in the tank bag and lay on it so that the only muscles I actually am using are the ones operating the two shortest fingers on my throttle hand. Everything else is relaxed. With this technique I can essentially ride continuously without being significantly tired at the end of a ride. I only stop for gas.

[Mechanikrazy]

Originally Posted by cydisc

I'm a newb, taking my motorcycle rider safety class in a few weeks. I'm planning to do a longish ride next summer and would like some feedback, ideas, tips etc... I've yet to choose a first bike, but the Ninjette is on the list, obviously. Realistically, my future riding would be close to 80/20 street to dirt (read: gravel).

Here is my narrowed list of potential bikes:
- Used 250/300 Ninja (any year)
- Used Honda CB300F
- CSC (Zongshen) Cyclone RX3

Here is my semi-epic ride:

Start: Ames, IA to Lake Michigan via Lake Geneva, WI (childhood memories to revisit), down through Chicago and around the lake up through Mackinac, west and south through the UP, up the Door Peninsula and back down through Green Bay, west towards Faribault, MN and back south to Ames. 1600+ miles in 9 days.

I'll have places to stay at friends and relatives on Mackinac Island, MI, Shawano, WI (west of Green Bay) and Faribault, MN. The rest will be camping. I plan to ride no more than 300 miles in a day and mostly in the 200 mile range.

That's it so far. I'm looking for advice on all fronts... bike choice, gear needed, places to see, things to do, where to eat, where to stay, etc...

And, go!

Congrats and welcome to riding! Prepare to open your wallet on things you never thought you'd need or want.

Being that this is your first bike, I would recommend going with a used bike by a mainstream manufacturer. If you plan to get another motorcycle for dirt riding, then I would recommend getting a 250 or 300. Depending on your budget, the 300 is a nice upgrade from the 250. The extra power will make a long distance trip a bit nicer.

If you plan to ride a single bike, consider a dual sport like a DRZ400.

I say get a mainstream manufacturer because it is more likely that dealers will have knowledge and spare parts for your bike if anything happens. Even if you plan to do all the work yourself, this is a good safety net. When you're first learning to ride, that is just one less thing to be concerned about.

I would also say, do not dump money into your first bike. Ride it as is for at least 1000 miles and figure out what is really important to you before pouring money into it. Of course, if you have a extra cash laying around, it's your call.

[Ghostt]

If it hasn't been already mentioned, upgrade the headlight bulb, there are a lot of choices. Like the Sylvania Silver Stars, HID, LED, etc. Also reaim the headlight, as it's usually set too low.

Personally I run 55w/6k HID which has an output of 5,000 lumens. I live in the middle of nowhere, and there are critters that come out at night, everything from possums, to deer. Being able to see more/further increases one's reaction time.

[VaFish]

There is a lot to be said for picking up an older pregen Ninja 250 and riding it for your first year, then upgrading to a little bigger and newer bike for you trip next year.

That's what I did to start my daughter riding last August. Found a poorly running pregen for $400 with some busted up plastic. Replaced the levers and one bar, took the plastic off, mounted a set of temporary front turn signals and she had a bike she wasn't afraid to drop. (which she did a couple of times in real slow stuff) Now we are fixing up the plastic and she has a couple thousand miles on the bike. She'll ride the rest of this summer on it and then probably upgrade for next year.

[snot]

Welcome

[verboten1]

I'm a big guy, we did 2500 miles in 8 days. '08 Ninja was a good bike.

Wife rode hers on a single track trail, it was ok.

I rode both hers and mine on forest service roads and dirt roads no issue.

[adouglas]

Originally Posted by Ghostt

If it hasn't been already mentioned, upgrade the headlight bulb, there are a lot of choices. Like the Sylvania Silver Stars, HID, LED, etc. Also reaim the headlight, as it's usually set too low.

Personally I run 55w/6k HID which has an output of 5,000 lumens. I live in the middle of nowhere, and there are critters that come out at night, everything from possums, to deer. Being able to see more/further increases one's reaction time.

FWIW:

You may not get the results you seek.

I tried Silverstars in my car and while they are much whiter than OEM they both burned out within months, vs. years for the OEM halogens. Doesn't mean all aftermarket bulbs are crap, but these did not impress me based on short lifespan. I've also used the Philips Motovision bulb with satisfactory results. FWIW my current bike has the OEM bulbs in it (meaning the Motovision didn't offer enough of an improvement to make me rush out and buy another one).

A friend of mind had an HID rig on his SV650 and it absolutely sucked. Far worse than OEM... doesn't mean all HIDs are crap, but it is possible.

Never seen the aftermarket LED retrofit bulbs in the flesh but am interested. The idea of a "bulb" that won't burn out at an inopportune time appeals to me... but there are other considerations there such as heat and additional electronics (meaning more points of potential failure).

Check the headlight aim before diving in. It may be set low... or not. (Same advice for any guidance to go change something immediately without verifying that it's wrong first... ain't broke, don't fix IMHO.) Bear in mind that blinding oncoming drivers is not a good thing to do.

[InvisiBill]

Originally Posted by adouglas

FWIW:

You may not get the results you seek.

I tried Silverstars in my car and while they are much whiter than OEM they both burned out within months, vs. years for the OEM halogens. Doesn't mean all aftermarket bulbs are crap, but these did not impress me based on short lifespan. I've also used the Philips Motovision bulb with satisfactory results. FWIW my current bike has the OEM bulbs in it (meaning the Motovision didn't offer enough of an improvement to make me rush out and buy another one).

SilverStars and similar are designed in a way that puts out more light, at the cost of longevity. For the 9012 HIR2 bulbs used in my car, the long-life versions have the coils wound about 15% larger than the high-output "+30" versions. The tighter winding results in more focused light output, but also more heat in the filament.

The +30 refers to 30% increased output within the main beam. This is achieved by a tighter, more precisely placed filament, such that it's closer to the focal point of the lamp's optics. It's this same tighter hotspot that contributes to the bulb's shorter life. Overall, the same amount of light is available in either bulb; it's more-readily translated into useful beam in the +30 bulb.

The DOT specs have a range, and different types of bulbs can give you different amounts of light output within that range. Usually there's some form of tradeoff, like output vs. life in this case.

Originally Posted by adouglas

A friend of mind had an HID rig on his SV650 and it absolutely sucked. Far worse than OEM... doesn't mean all HIDs are crap, but it is possible.

Never seen the aftermarket LED retrofit bulbs in the flesh but am interested. The idea of a "bulb" that won't burn out at an inopportune time appeals to me... but there are other considerations there such as heat and additional electronics (meaning more points of potential failure).

Putting any other kind of light source inside a headlight is going to be a crapshoot. The housing is designed with the expectation that the light will be coming from the specified bulb. Using a different light source is going to give you different output. Exactly how much and in what way the light source is different will determine exactly how much the output varies.

A number of people have had good luck putting LED 9012s into the Volt. In general, a projector tends to do a better job than an old-fashioned reflector at aiming the light from a different source, since it has a parabolic reflector behind it focusing it through a lens. A simple reflector is a lot more dependent upon the light being in the focal point.

The new European Prius uses a bi-LED projector. It functions like a bi-xenon HID setup, except that it's powered by a single LED. I'd like to use one to retrofit the 500, but they're still rare and expensive here. However, with LED you lose the extra electronics needed for the HID as well as the warmup time and fragility of bulbs.

Keep in mind that the PreGen uses an H4 bulb and switches back and forth between the low and high filaments depending on the dimmer switch. The NewGen uses an always-on low bulb and turns the high bulb on and off with the dimmer switch. HIDs need to warm up a bit and don't like to be switched on and off rapidly, so take that into consideration if you're retrofitting something.

Originally Posted by adouglas

Check the headlight aim before diving in. It may be set low... or not. (Same advice for any guidance to go change something immediately without verifying that it's wrong first... ain't broke, don't fix IMHO.) Bear in mind that blinding oncoming drivers is not a good thing to do.

This. I'm not sure about the 250, but a lot of 500s seem to have been shipped with the headlight aimed at the front axle. Take a few minutes to check your aim and make sure it's right. It varies by model, but generally the light should be aimed ~2" down at 25' to give you the proper angle. If yours is aimed incorrectly, just correcting that with no actual changes to the hardware could help your night vision a lot.

And you should obviously check the aim again after any modifications. I've mentioned it before, but you can actually doubly hurt your night vision by taking a poor light pattern and aiming it too low. You obviously get less light in the distance where you want it, but you also get too much light up close, causing your pupils to close down and making you less able to see in the darkness. If you can't aim your headlight properly due to blinding other drivers, it's a bad setup.

[cydisc]

Originally Posted by VaFish

There is a lot to be said for picking up an older pregen Ninja 250 and riding it for your first year...

I'm currently in the market for this every thing. There are a couple pregens on the local Craigslist for <$2000. Need to make room in the garage and get educated before I pull the trigger on one.

[VaFish]

Originally Posted by cydisc

I'm currently in the market for this every thing. There are a couple pregens on the local Craigslist for <$2000. Need to make room in the garage and get educated before I pull the trigger on one.

Your local prices may vary, but around here a Pregen in running condition is around $1,500 or less depending upon condition. Non running are usually $400-$500.

[cydisc]

Originally Posted by VaFish

Your local prices may vary, but around here a Pregen in running condition is around $1,500 or less depending upon condition. Non running are usually $400-$500.

There are currently two listed at $2000 and $1350.

[allanoue]

Originally Posted by cydisc

There are currently two listed at $2000 and $1350.

Bet they take $1500 and $950

[VaFish]

Originally Posted by allanoue

Bet they take $1500 and $950

Cash talks, and the worst they can say is "No" (well actually they can say worse but I don't really care)