February 17th, 2012, 10:32 AM | #1 |
ninjette.org member
Name: Zander the Expander
Location: Houston, Texas
Join Date: Nov 2011 Motorcycle(s): 2010 Kawasaki 250 (Track scooter) 2012 Triumph Daytona 675 Posts: 153
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415 chain conversion question
What is the best rear sprocket size? Kit comes with 57 but im hearing 59 would be better. Anyone have experience with this mod?
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February 17th, 2012, 02:07 PM | #2 |
CVMA / AFM / M1GP #250
Name: Steve
Location: Los Angeles
Join Date: Sep 2009 Motorcycle(s): 2009 Ninja 250r, 2011 Zero S, 2009 KLR 650 Posts: A lot.
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I've got the 57 and am happy with it, but I may go down a tooth or two, but thats just because my bike is track only and I'm topping out against the rev limiter at the end of straights.
For daily riding, who cares hahah |
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February 17th, 2012, 02:58 PM | #3 |
ninjette.org member
Name: Zander the Expander
Location: Houston, Texas
Join Date: Nov 2011 Motorcycle(s): 2010 Kawasaki 250 (Track scooter) 2012 Triumph Daytona 675 Posts: 153
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yea man this is track only ... and i ride smaller technical tracks that dont have super long straightaways ... i get to 95mph and im already engine braking into corner ... so drive out of turn is more important. ... my friend is telling me 59 would be better than 57 for that ... not sure tho
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February 17th, 2012, 03:12 PM | #4 |
CVMA / AFM / M1GP #250
Name: Steve
Location: Los Angeles
Join Date: Sep 2009 Motorcycle(s): 2009 Ninja 250r, 2011 Zero S, 2009 KLR 650 Posts: A lot.
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yeah for a smaller track a larger rear sprocket will give you shorter gearing, but you will be shifting more often. Best way to judge gearing is to have the engine top out right at the end of the fastest straight in the lowest useable gear.
So for example at chuckwalla I'm bouncing off the rev limiter in 5th about 10 yards from the braking zone, so if I go up teeth i'm pretty much guaranteeing that i'll have to shift and waste time. If I go down a tooth I may just touch the limiter at the braking zone which is ideal, minimizing shifts. |
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February 17th, 2012, 03:57 PM | #5 |
CVMA #74 WSMC #750
Name: Nemesis
Location: On the track
Join Date: Oct 2009 Motorcycle(s): All of them Posts: A lot.
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I found website that had an excel spreadsheet that calculated the speed/rpm, up & downshift speeds, gear ratio each gearing, etc. for whatever sprocket you desire; and when I compared the 3 sprocket a few weeks ago I noticed very slight differences. It even graphed the differences.
Unfortunately I don't have the link to the site anymore or am just too lazy to go look for it. LOL
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February 18th, 2012, 02:10 AM | #7 | |
ninjette.org member
Name: Tiane
Location: Virginia Beach
Join Date: Sep 2011 Motorcycle(s): NINJA300 Posts: 46
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Quote:
We've been doing some research and if I get the 415 kit, I'll get the 59 rear to try to match the stock gearing. According to gearingcommander . com that's the closes to stock. Stock with the 130 tire: Custom with the 140 tire: |
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February 18th, 2012, 11:19 PM | #8 |
ninjette.org member
Name: Sean
Location: Seattle
Join Date: Aug 2010 Motorcycle(s): 250 Ninjette Posts: 94
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For what it's worth, I ran this setup last season and used an 18/57. It was nice for technical tracks and still topped out at 102-104, but my rev limiter is at 14,500. I've only run Pacific near Seattle, Portland, and Streets of Willow with this gearing, but it has been good for all those tracks.
The 18/57 is a gnat's ass taller than stock, but not much, (although my bike had a 14/45 stock, I think some came with a 47 on the back). When I moved from the 140/70 rear tire to the 120/70, I rode for one session and came in and put on my 55 in the rear. This puts my gearing back to whre it was with the 57 and the larger tire. I would be pretty hesitant to run much larger than the 57 on the back, but I guess it would depend on the track and whether there were any corners that made for really awkward shift points. -Sean |
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February 23rd, 2012, 09:53 AM | #9 |
ninjette.org newbie
Name: Jesse
Location: asheville nc
Join Date: Feb 2012 Motorcycle(s): 2010 ninja 250, 09 R1 Posts: 8
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Help please
Did anyone have front sprocket trouble? I got the 415 kit and when I put the front sprocket on the nut tightens all the way up but the sprocket is still loose on the shaft kind of like I need to use a couple washers or something.
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February 23rd, 2012, 09:58 AM | #10 |
CVMA / AFM / M1GP #250
Name: Steve
Location: Los Angeles
Join Date: Sep 2009 Motorcycle(s): 2009 Ninja 250r, 2011 Zero S, 2009 KLR 650 Posts: A lot.
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There is a washer that is supposed to be in there... also make sure that your sprocket is on correctly, its not symmetric so make sure thats correct as well.
ALSO both Nemesis and I had our front sprocket nuts unwind themselves and come off on the track (after torquing to 65 lb-ft!) so be sure to have some kind of physical lock, safety wire or silicone to ensure the nut doesn't come loose. |
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February 23rd, 2012, 10:03 AM | #11 |
ninjette.org newbie
Name: Jesse
Location: asheville nc
Join Date: Feb 2012 Motorcycle(s): 2010 ninja 250, 09 R1 Posts: 8
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Thanks, I didn't see a washer in my kit so guess I'll have to come up with something. I'm guessing it goes on the transmission side of the sprocket
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February 23rd, 2012, 01:42 PM | #12 |
CVMA / AFM / M1GP #250
Name: Steve
Location: Los Angeles
Join Date: Sep 2009 Motorcycle(s): 2009 Ninja 250r, 2011 Zero S, 2009 KLR 650 Posts: A lot.
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Its a keyed washer that sits right behind the nut, you had to pull it off when you took off the stock sprocket. Re-use that one
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February 23rd, 2012, 03:42 PM | #13 |
ninjette.org newbie
Name: Jesse
Location: asheville nc
Join Date: Feb 2012 Motorcycle(s): 2010 ninja 250, 09 R1 Posts: 8
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O yea I know about that one, I am saying with all that there is still free play with the sprocket like its just a touch too narrow
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February 23rd, 2012, 03:44 PM | #14 |
CVMA / AFM / M1GP #250
Name: Steve
Location: Los Angeles
Join Date: Sep 2009 Motorcycle(s): 2009 Ninja 250r, 2011 Zero S, 2009 KLR 650 Posts: A lot.
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huh. get in touch with the dude selling them. The machinist might have messed up, a friend of mine just called me with the exact same problem. Sounds like a batch of sprockets got machined wrong.
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February 23rd, 2012, 04:57 PM | #15 |
R&T Suspension
Name: K Hertell
Location: San Antonio, TEXAS
Join Date: Jun 2009 Motorcycle(s): Too many to list Posts: 175
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A little slop is no problem.
FYI on choosing sprockets. Buy several and ride w/ them. That is the only way to choose the correct one for the day. When the wind changes the sprox will need to change if you want the best laptimes. |
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February 23rd, 2012, 05:21 PM | #16 |
ninjette.org newbie
Name: Jesse
Location: asheville nc
Join Date: Feb 2012 Motorcycle(s): 2010 ninja 250, 09 R1 Posts: 8
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Yea I ordered a couple different rear sprockets assuming i would have to make some changes.. On the 520 setup 15/45 seemed to be a good base for most tracks.. I know some dirt bikes have a little slop in the front sprocket it just worried me a tad on this thing
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February 23rd, 2012, 10:14 PM | #17 |
CVMA / AFM / M1GP #250
Name: Steve
Location: Los Angeles
Join Date: Sep 2009 Motorcycle(s): 2009 Ninja 250r, 2011 Zero S, 2009 KLR 650 Posts: A lot.
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So i measured the stock sprocket and its 0.258" thick, and cheeks measured his (has slop) and its the same! It must have something to do with how the splines were cut on the sprocket, or maybe certain bikes have different spline lengths??! Definitely strange...
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February 24th, 2012, 06:35 AM | #18 |
ninjette.org newbie
Name: Jesse
Location: asheville nc
Join Date: Feb 2012 Motorcycle(s): 2010 ninja 250, 09 R1 Posts: 8
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I would be willing to bet your right about the different spline lengths.. The cut to go on the splines seems dead on . Definitely appreciate the help I'm gonna try it with an without some homemade spacers on some side roads here before I use it at the next race round and I will post up what I figure out
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February 27th, 2012, 04:08 PM | #19 | |
L8APEX
Name: CRA#33 EXPERT
Location: Mankato, MN
Join Date: Nov 2011 Motorcycle(s): 07 KTM 950SMR, 06 KTM 450SMR, 99 KTM 300MXC, 00 Derbi GPR 50, 09 Ninja 250 racebike, race with www.cra-mn.org! Posts: 233
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Quote:
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www.joemillersmoderngarage.com www.starr-cycle.com ***The most important concept of science isn't memorizing facts, it's observation of phenomena.*** Last futzed with by smokinsingle; March 1st, 2012 at 06:50 PM. |
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February 27th, 2012, 04:09 PM | #20 |
CVMA / AFM / M1GP #250
Name: Steve
Location: Los Angeles
Join Date: Sep 2009 Motorcycle(s): 2009 Ninja 250r, 2011 Zero S, 2009 KLR 650 Posts: A lot.
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March 3rd, 2012, 09:37 AM | #21 |
ninjette.org newbie
Name: Jesse
Location: asheville nc
Join Date: Feb 2012 Motorcycle(s): 2010 ninja 250, 09 R1 Posts: 8
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Ok so just an update, I put a spacer on the transmission side of the sprocket about 3 or 4mm thick and took it down the road near the house. So far so good, I'll put it thru the paces at Roebling Road in 2 weeks and we will see how she holds up
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March 3rd, 2012, 10:25 AM | #22 |
CVMA / AFM / M1GP #250
Name: Steve
Location: Los Angeles
Join Date: Sep 2009 Motorcycle(s): 2009 Ninja 250r, 2011 Zero S, 2009 KLR 650 Posts: A lot.
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yeah Cheeks did the same thing, seems to be workin out for him. Not sure what happened there....
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March 8th, 2012, 08:19 AM | #23 |
CVMA #74 WSMC #750
Name: Nemesis
Location: On the track
Join Date: Oct 2009 Motorcycle(s): All of them Posts: A lot.
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What? I never said it was 64 lbs. I said the front axle nut is around 65. I believe it was Dino who gave us the torque spec. Dammit, Dean!
I need to re-torque my shiet but bike's all loaded up. Dammit!
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March 10th, 2012, 10:46 AM | #24 |
ninjette.org member
Name: Jason
Location: Austin TX
Join Date: Dec 2011 Motorcycle(s): 09Ninja250, Ducati Monster 800ie, Harley FXSTS,Rebel 250,CR144,KX85,RM85L Posts: 142
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I'm in favor of no slop. behind the spacer that is behind the sprocket is an o-ring. no pressure on the o-ring you can get a leak of oil very slight through the spacer and output shaft gap. needs to be tight. I took a 2mm body washer, dremeled out the inside until it fit and then that was it. torqued, red loctite.
We also run the Dunlop and I really see the need for a 53 at TWS with the 1mile straight. Will need to get one made.
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Thanks to: , DUNLOP, WHOOPIE RACING, 995 PAINTWORKS, South Austin Motorcycles |
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March 13th, 2012, 06:55 AM | #25 | |
ninjette.org certified postwhore
Name: dino
Location: Oceanside, Ca
Join Date: Nov 2010 Motorcycle(s): '09 250 Street, '09 250 Race, '13 300 Race Posts: A lot.
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Quote:
Sheesh! Now I know how Cowboy feels!
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CVMA #55 |
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March 14th, 2012, 11:19 AM | #26 |
ninjette.org member
Name: Zander the Expander
Location: Houston, Texas
Join Date: Nov 2011 Motorcycle(s): 2010 Kawasaki 250 (Track scooter) 2012 Triumph Daytona 675 Posts: 153
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here it is ... put it on last weekend with some help from a friend ... wasnt too bad at all ... front sprocket bolt was a bitch
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March 14th, 2012, 01:48 PM | #27 |
#squid
Name: nickypoo
Location: Five Guys
Join Date: Jul 2011 Motorcycle(s): Track dedicated 2008 ZX6R Posts: A lot.
MOTM - Jul '16
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What's the advantage of converting it?
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March 14th, 2012, 02:24 PM | #28 |
ninjette.org certified postwhore
Name: dino
Location: Oceanside, Ca
Join Date: Nov 2010 Motorcycle(s): '09 250 Street, '09 250 Race, '13 300 Race Posts: A lot.
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Lighter weight and less chain resistance.
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CVMA #55 |
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March 15th, 2012, 06:27 AM | #29 |
ninjette.org member
Name: Zander the Expander
Location: Houston, Texas
Join Date: Nov 2011 Motorcycle(s): 2010 Kawasaki 250 (Track scooter) 2012 Triumph Daytona 675 Posts: 153
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March 17th, 2012, 04:27 PM | #30 |
CVMA/AFM #72
Name: Tiffani
Location: Los Angeles, Ca
Join Date: Oct 2009 Motorcycle(s): 2009 Ninja 250r (Racebike), 2015 FZ-07(Tourer), 2001 KX65(LOL bike) Posts: A lot.
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March 17th, 2012, 07:32 PM | #31 |
ninjette.org member
Name: Zander the Expander
Location: Houston, Texas
Join Date: Nov 2011 Motorcycle(s): 2010 Kawasaki 250 (Track scooter) 2012 Triumph Daytona 675 Posts: 153
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Ok so just did a full trackday with my new 415... thing def improves acceleration response as soon as you hit the throttle but I cant really tell the difference much after that ... still feels a lot more responsive at corner exit which is where the 250s need it,,,, especially after all the mistakes i make... I did lose some track time bc I was working on tightening/losening the chain throughout the day but its pretty well settled in and this is expected ... I would def buy this product again and its right up there with clip ons and rear sets on my list of best track day mods
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March 17th, 2012, 07:40 PM | #32 |
ninjette.org member
Name: Jason
Location: Austin TX
Join Date: Dec 2011 Motorcycle(s): 09Ninja250, Ducati Monster 800ie, Harley FXSTS,Rebel 250,CR144,KX85,RM85L Posts: 142
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Damn, was hoping to be the only ninjette in CMRA with the 415 setup...what track? what gearing? I'm thinking the 16/55 still too low for TWS with the dunlop rear. need a 53 i think.
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Thanks to: , DUNLOP, WHOOPIE RACING, 995 PAINTWORKS, South Austin Motorcycles |
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March 17th, 2012, 07:45 PM | #33 |
ninjette.org member
Name: Zander the Expander
Location: Houston, Texas
Join Date: Nov 2011 Motorcycle(s): 2010 Kawasaki 250 (Track scooter) 2012 Triumph Daytona 675 Posts: 153
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im not in cmra ... yet ... i was running at Grandsport speedway 16/57... havent been to tws yet .. not really looking forward to the wear and tear on the poor ninja... why kind of dunlops are you running?
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March 17th, 2012, 07:51 PM | #34 |
ninjette.org member
Name: Jason
Location: Austin TX
Join Date: Dec 2011 Motorcycle(s): 09Ninja250, Ducati Monster 800ie, Harley FXSTS,Rebel 250,CR144,KX85,RM85L Posts: 142
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sportmax gp 120/70/17 front 160/50/17 rear. they work really good.
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Thanks to: , DUNLOP, WHOOPIE RACING, 995 PAINTWORKS, South Austin Motorcycles |
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March 18th, 2012, 05:42 AM | #35 |
ninjette.org member
Name: Zander the Expander
Location: Houston, Texas
Join Date: Nov 2011 Motorcycle(s): 2010 Kawasaki 250 (Track scooter) 2012 Triumph Daytona 675 Posts: 153
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March 18th, 2012, 09:20 AM | #36 |
ninjette.org member
Name: Jason
Location: Austin TX
Join Date: Dec 2011 Motorcycle(s): 09Ninja250, Ducati Monster 800ie, Harley FXSTS,Rebel 250,CR144,KX85,RM85L Posts: 142
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well, I reversed some numbers. got confused with the SV. 150/60/17
about 8mm shorter than the stock 140/70. substantially lighter than stock. VERY sticky. We ran them in the rain race that we won at MSRH. I let my son put a lot of laps on the sockers and he did well but crashed twice. My two boys had a MX ride with Dunlop so we called and asked and were able to convert that over to Road Racing. Allan Campbell from Whoopies Racing has been very helpful as he is the South Central Dunlop distributor.
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Thanks to: , DUNLOP, WHOOPIE RACING, 995 PAINTWORKS, South Austin Motorcycles |
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March 19th, 2012, 07:01 AM | #37 |
ninjette.org newbie
Name: Jesse
Location: asheville nc
Join Date: Feb 2012 Motorcycle(s): 2010 ninja 250, 09 R1 Posts: 8
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Made it thru my first race weekend with the 415 setup, worked excellent and didn't even need to adjust it. Can't say I can really tell much of a difference in performance but it sure can't hurt shedding 2lbs off the bike. As far as tires, it seems like if I use a good soft 120 front I can pretty much use whatever on the rear and the bike sticks but I always run 150's on the rear
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March 25th, 2012, 09:40 AM | #38 | |
ninjette.org member
Name: Sam
Location: Ohio
Join Date: Nov 2011 Motorcycle(s): 2005 HON CBR1000RR Repsol, 2012 KAW Ninja 250R Posts: 131
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Quote:
How is everyone mounting the rear sprocket? Flat side in or out? On my rear sprocket, "57" is stamped on the raised side, which I faced in to push the teeth away from the wheel. I guess I was trying to mimic the stock alignment (since my 7/8" spacer puts the front sprocket in about the stock position). |
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March 25th, 2012, 11:20 AM | #39 |
CVMA / AFM / M1GP #250
Name: Steve
Location: Los Angeles
Join Date: Sep 2009 Motorcycle(s): 2009 Ninja 250r, 2011 Zero S, 2009 KLR 650 Posts: A lot.
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I put the numbers on the outside as well. Made sense to read that way and it seems to work!
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March 25th, 2012, 12:17 PM | #40 | |
ninjette.org member
Name: Zander the Expander
Location: Houston, Texas
Join Date: Nov 2011 Motorcycle(s): 2010 Kawasaki 250 (Track scooter) 2012 Triumph Daytona 675 Posts: 153
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Quote:
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