August 4th, 2012, 04:03 PM | #1 |
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Compression numbers.
Picked up a 03 250 with 2100 on the clock. Had been sitting for 5 years, needs gas tank cleaned, carbs cleaned, chain, tires, and fluids flushed as well as some much needed tlc.
Carb is cleaned, Oil an coolant changed, Used "the works" in the tank and it looks great, Hooked up compression test and added a little oil to each cylinder. Got 155 dead on each cylinder before the battery started reducing output. What's ideal compression numbers? I've heard 130's, I've also heard 139-219. Pistons look like they're in good shape and OEM spark plugs look like they've had little use. |
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August 4th, 2012, 04:14 PM | #2 |
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155 is good . The engine will not even fire with numbers below 125.
Stock 11.6 to 1 is about 140 ~180. I think .On one engine I run. I run 13.5 to 1 and get close to 200 psi . |
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August 4th, 2012, 05:12 PM | #3 |
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That's good, I bought the bike non running and started to resuscitate it back to life slowly. Paid $700 so the fact that it only said 2100 on the odometer had me questioning it. If those number are good, then tonight I should turn it on for the first time in 5 years supposedly, fingers crossed.
Since the previous owner had the tank off as well as the petcock I'm trying to find a fuel line diagram to the carb and vaccum to the tank any idea on a possible link/or direction to something similar? |
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August 4th, 2012, 05:20 PM | #4 |
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Also, I did the compression check while it was cold, I've always done them on cars while hot, so I'm assumin the number will go up some more when hot. Is it preferred to check compression while cold on bikes?
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August 4th, 2012, 06:17 PM | #5 |
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I always check mine cold. But I think they will go up when hot. I can only recommend you get a service manual . Everything is in there.
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August 4th, 2012, 06:57 PM | #6 |
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Manual is on the way, thanks!
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August 5th, 2012, 10:54 AM | #7 |
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Got it up and running last night, the motor of kinda loud compared to what I'm used to (forced induction 4 cylinders). Are these motors on the loud side? It idles great, if valve adjustment was needed it would show up via compression check correct?
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August 5th, 2012, 11:59 AM | #8 |
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Congratulations!!
Yes they are mechanically loud, not so much for intake and exhaust flows. Regarding valves, a positive cold compression test only indicates that the valves are properly closing. If out of recommended clearance, one or more valves could remain partially open after the engine heats up (due to dilatation). If the 2,100 miles are real, valves should have been adjusted at the first 500 miles.
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August 6th, 2012, 10:06 PM | #9 |
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Thanks! I'll be checking the valve clearances tomorrow and syncing the carbs and finally putting everything back together, new tires in Friday and I can actually ride it.
I have the tank off cleaning it but I noticed while the bikes running I get a nasty rev hang. I haven't quite been able to let it hit operating temp as I temporarily have a gas line hung up and have to fill it with gas. Could the rev hang be because it's coldish still? Valve adjustment,carbs, or the fact that the fuel tank isn't full and hooked up? I get the rev hang with and without choke, thanks in advance! |
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August 7th, 2012, 03:55 AM | #10 |
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The hanging idle may be restricted pilot jets. Definitely check the valves. Loud sounds could be the valves.
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August 7th, 2012, 06:30 AM | #11 |
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Revs that 'hang' typically indicate the engine running in a lean condition, which would support Racer X's blocked jets theory. It could also be the pilot micture settings. Basically, not enough fuel for the air it's getting....
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August 7th, 2012, 06:40 AM | #12 |
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Well I did clean the hell out of the jets, sat em in carb cleaner. Brushed them and used guitar string to make sure it was clear, shop car cleaner in the jets and verified they all were working correctly.
Gonna hook the tank up tonight after the asjustments and let it get actually up to running tell and see. If not I'll be pulling the carb again, Thanks for all the help! |
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August 7th, 2012, 07:00 AM | #13 |
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The lean condition is maybe one pilot jet restricted . As you close the throttle the slides drop down. With one carb lean in the lower midrange the engine speeds up a little before going down to the idle circuit. Pilots are very small orifice. If you can't get it . Replace the jets with new ones . But try to synchronize the carbs first. Don't forget to uncover the idle screws if it has not been done already
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August 7th, 2012, 08:43 AM | #14 |
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Going to uncover the screws today. Also there's no other vac lines than the 2 on the carb an one to the petcock correct? Airbox is seated perfect on the carb a well.
When I say they hang, they'll sit at whatever rpm I revv'd it to for about 30 seconds Give or take, like I said though I had not really gotten it warm though. When I pull the carb for the mixture screws I'll also measure the floats. Carburation is new to me, not by any means incapable of working on them just learning. |
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August 7th, 2012, 08:56 AM | #15 |
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These are simple to deal with. Pulling the air box is the biggest thing. Wright down the jet numbers while you are in there and check the diaphragm on top of the slide. Also be careful when uncovering the screws. Put tape or something on the drill bit so it won't hit the idle screw
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August 7th, 2012, 09:12 AM | #16 |
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Roger, checked the diaphragm and it was great looking. No rips,tears, any oddities at all. Will report back later with findings after valve adjustments and more thorough cleaning of jets.
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August 8th, 2012, 09:24 AM | #17 |
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This may be a silly question....but your throtlle cable is lubed and moves freely. i.e. the slides on the carb snap back when you release the throttle..??
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August 8th, 2012, 11:47 AM | #18 |
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No silly questions, I'd rather you ask as maybe I overlooked something. But yes I lived all cables before I started it for the first time, from the bottom and top. Did verify that it snaps back.
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August 8th, 2012, 01:00 PM | #20 |
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Been digging through a bunch of old threads on here and I stumbled across someone saying each carb has a different needle? Is this true does each carb have a specific size needle? I don't think I mixed them up but any things possible. Didn't get a chance to work on it yet, I'm going home today to reclean and drill out mixture screws.
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August 8th, 2012, 02:56 PM | #21 |
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I have seen different jets from side to side and the mixture screws a not going to be more than a half turn from each other. But I never even looked at the needles.
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August 8th, 2012, 07:37 PM | #22 |
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Well, valves were slightly too tight for my liking. Adjusted them right in the middle of spec, they weren't crazy tight though. Pulled the carb again and went ahead pulled the jets, girlfriend bought me a 5 gallon drum of brake clean so their sitting over night and in a jar of brake clean. Pilot jets I couldn't see through so if I had to guess that's the issue. Thought I cleaned it well but I did rip the carb at 3 am after driving 5 hours to pick up the bike.
Will continue with updates tomorrow as the mosquitos in the garage aren't being too friendly. Will update tomorrow, one of the tires came in today as well do I'm gonna be quite busy! |
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August 8th, 2012, 11:00 PM | #23 |
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So, here's the rundown and where I'm at. I have adjuste the vales to dead within spec, I have cleaned the bajesus out of every hole and orifice in the carb. Put everything back together and started it up, barely idled. Slowly adjusting mixture screws to try and get it to idle but called it a night, I'm thinking the seafoam I had dumped in the tank to help stabilize it for the week it's been in there may of been a bit too much of seafoam mixture. Going to get new gas tomorrow and play with the screws had to grind down a small Allen key to fit in there properly.
When I did get it to idle for a few if I turned the throttle it would immediately die, spike up then fall down. Which would say its rich, correct? |
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August 9th, 2012, 03:44 AM | #24 |
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I guess start with the idle screws out 1.5. The pilot jets are funny. They have two holes. One at each end so make sure that a wire or micro drill wil go all the way through. It is hard to tell rich or lean off idle. My guess is lean because rich will just bog alittle.
What screw are you turning with an allen? |
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August 9th, 2012, 09:25 AM | #25 |
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The mixture screws I'm turning with the Allen, I'm going to grab some new gas as well before I attempt anymore
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August 9th, 2012, 10:11 AM | #26 |
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I think the mixture screws are stumpy flat blade screwdriver. Or an angle drive .
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August 9th, 2012, 10:29 AM | #27 |
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Idle mix screws can be turned with a stumpy flat bladed screw driver. I took apart a bicycle tool and that flat blade works well
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August 9th, 2012, 11:29 AM | #28 |
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I grinded down a old Allen into a flat blade on one end. Bike is running now no stumbling or missing. Smoking a bit but I'm gonna run it for a while and continue adjusting slightly. Revs hang every one and a while around 2k for a few seconds. But it's much much better. I can continue putting it back together now and mount the tires.
There's a subtle bit of smoke coming from the pipes, not blue. I'm chalking this up to probably the bugs an dust that been in there a it at for 5 years. I'm really grateful for all the help, I'll report back when she's fine tuned later today! |
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August 9th, 2012, 02:44 PM | #30 |
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To add insult to injury, I let the bike cool off and put in some more gas, Bike didn't want to start. Pulled plugs and they were wet and black. These are brand new plugs mind you. Cleaned em off and it started back up and I went back to adjusting. Slowly, well now the bike is back to hanging idle and it's revving on its own. I'm so sick of carburators I'm ready to sell the bike and buy fuel injected.
Would the carbs being out of sync cause this? I'm going to pick up rubber stoppers to finish my carb syncer. Should I sync them first and then adjust mixtures after? /banghead |
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August 10th, 2012, 05:53 AM | #31 |
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When you get it running, does it run well enough to take it for a ride? that will get it warmed up fully
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August 10th, 2012, 08:00 AM | #32 |
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Don't give up. Sounds like a sync problem. Try to adjust it again with it warm. It takes forever to warm up these bikes. Will it hold 2000 rpm with the choke?
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August 10th, 2012, 03:15 PM | #33 |
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Well I got it nice and hot synced it and adjusted good enough for now. Took the bike out for the first time and my first time too. Rode it around the neighborhood about 5 or 6 times. It seems to be doing great doesn't stutter or anything. Bike seemed to pull pretty well for what it is. My first time riding so I didn't rip on it too hard.
Changing the tires tonight and hopefully new turns will be here Monday so I can take it through inspection and get a tag and actually drive it! |
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August 10th, 2012, 07:47 PM | #35 |
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Now to just find a way to set the bead on this front tire. Got the new one on, was a learning process no major damage though!
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August 10th, 2012, 07:52 PM | #36 |
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Old school. Spray starting fluid inside and light a match . BANG its on!! Or remove the valve stem core and use a compressor.
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August 10th, 2012, 07:57 PM | #37 |
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Yeah looms like starting fluid is in my future for tomorrow.
Just wanted to say thanks again for all the help. It's nice to have a little reassurance in tough times. |
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