November 15th, 2015, 06:48 AM | #241 |
ninjette.org member
Name: Scott
Location: Syracuse
Join Date: May 2011 Motorcycle(s): 09 Ninja 250, 2011 Honda CBR250R, 07 Ninja 650 Posts: 212
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I don't know what it would take to get it registered in the USA but a Canadian CBR125R would be an unbeatable fuel economy competition machine for the Vetter Challanges.
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http://www.fuelly.com/driver/sendler/cbr250r |
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November 15th, 2015, 09:59 AM | #242 |
Motorcycle Hypermiler
Name: Vic
Location: Livermore CA
Join Date: Jan 2012 Motorcycle(s): 1999 & 2005 Kawasaki Ninja 250R's Posts: A lot.
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Scott, Interesting about the CBR125R,a concern would be if it had enough power to keep up the pace at the more demanding Vetter Challenges( Bonneville and to a lesser extent Hollister ). Around 20 horsepower seems to be about the lower limit to what is needed. I'll have to check out the specsbut that may be worthy of serious consideration. Thanks!
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235 MPG Hypermotorcycling to a better tomorrow |
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November 15th, 2015, 10:33 AM | #243 |
ninjette.org member
Name: Scott
Location: Syracuse
Join Date: May 2011 Motorcycle(s): 09 Ninja 250, 2011 Honda CBR250R, 07 Ninja 650 Posts: 212
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A fully streamlined CBR125R with longer gearing would keep up. Barely if it is not too hilly. Even though it has only 14hp. But wouldn't be as fast when loaded down for a cross country trip.
. Yours and Alan's pregen Ninjas are doing astonishing numbers so I don't know if a CBR250R would ever do much better even if the low revving, fuel injected, single, should be better on paper.
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http://www.fuelly.com/driver/sendler/cbr250r |
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November 16th, 2015, 11:41 AM | #244 |
Motorcycle Hypermiler
Name: Vic
Location: Livermore CA
Join Date: Jan 2012 Motorcycle(s): 1999 & 2005 Kawasaki Ninja 250R's Posts: A lot.
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It looks like the CBR125 tops out at about 92 mph so in theory it should fast enough. It would be somewhat of a challenge to get my hands so one. So, if I can find an acceptable CBR250R I may jump ship to the Honda camp. 200 mpg is calling....
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235 MPG Hypermotorcycling to a better tomorrow |
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November 16th, 2015, 11:52 AM | #245 |
ninjette.org member
Name: Scott
Location: Syracuse
Join Date: May 2011 Motorcycle(s): 09 Ninja 250, 2011 Honda CBR250R, 07 Ninja 650 Posts: 212
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A stock CBR125R is 14 hp and is lucky to hit 70 mph but would be better with longer gearing and streamlining. As long as you are not fully loaded up hill. A streamlined CBR250R should theoretically be much more fuel efficient than a Ninja250 but 150 mpgUS is hard to beat.
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http://www.fuelly.com/driver/sendler/cbr250r |
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November 17th, 2015, 02:50 AM | #246 |
Freedom for Germany
Location: This World
Join Date: May 2011 Motorcycle(s): Ninja 250R-FI Posts: A lot.
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Hey Vic and Scott,
I know it's a different story, but did you ever think about hybrid? |
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November 17th, 2015, 04:21 AM | #247 |
ninjette.org member
Name: Scott
Location: Syracuse
Join Date: May 2011 Motorcycle(s): 09 Ninja 250, 2011 Honda CBR250R, 07 Ninja 650 Posts: 212
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It would be possible I suppose. But as Craig says " Don't make it more trouble than it is worth". Hybrids only really help in stop and go scenarios. Though it would tend to make a CBR125R more comfortable at holding speed up some of the shorter hills.
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http://www.fuelly.com/driver/sendler/cbr250r |
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February 12th, 2016, 10:09 AM | #248 |
Motorcycle Hypermiler
Name: Vic
Location: Livermore CA
Join Date: Jan 2012 Motorcycle(s): 1999 & 2005 Kawasaki Ninja 250R's Posts: A lot.
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@Somchai, I haven't considered hybrids but have thought about an electric moto. They are still pretty expensive and I try to limit my budget so that my hypermiling actually saves money. Terry Hershner has won a Vetter Challenge ( Bonneville 2014) on his streamlined Zero. But I was still able to beat him when I won at the 2014 San Luis Obispo Challenge. Looking at what Terry has done with his Zero I see the potential to do better but it would take a lot of $$$ and a steep learning curve for me to be competitive with an electric moto.
At this point I am still inclined to keep working on getting a gasoline powered moto into the winner's circle. Also since the Challenges are won by lowest cost of fuel to go the distance, the current low cost of gasoline favors conventional ICE powered motos. My latest mods have been trying to design some additional panels to smooth the air flow past my helmet and shoulders. I made some folding flaps on the windscreen but had problems with them lifting as I hit freeway speeds. Also they it hard to check my mirrors and gauges. Back to the drawing board. I had to work on the tail bodywork as it was sagging down and causing some drag on the rear tire. I removed it and made some different mounting struts so that the top the front bulkhead of the tailsection is better supported by the rear of the frame. I tested it briefly yesterday and it seems to be big improvement.
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235 MPG Hypermotorcycling to a better tomorrow |
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August 13th, 2017, 08:27 AM | #249 |
Motorcycle Hypermiler
Name: Vic
Location: Livermore CA
Join Date: Jan 2012 Motorcycle(s): 1999 & 2005 Kawasaki Ninja 250R's Posts: A lot.
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After some reflection I've decided it's time to move on to a new moto for next year's competitions. My '99 Ninjette has done some incredible things( 3 Overall Vetter Fuel Economy Challenge wins, 5 conventional fuel class wins, a best performance of 235 mpg/0.9 cents per mile) during the past 6 years but standing still is falling behind in competition. When I first started competing I thought winning was improbable with my low budget effort but through hard work and perserverence I broke through the barriers.
I have removed all the bodywork and returned the moto to its stock gearing. It's a shame there is not a market yet for streamlined motos. It will be bittersweet to sell it. But I will continue on with the Vetter fiberglass nose on my next streamliner. I won't be leaving the Ninjette fold totally as I will continue on with my 2005 partially streamlined Ninjette with the aerotrunk.
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235 MPG Hypermotorcycling to a better tomorrow |
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August 13th, 2017, 09:04 AM | #250 |
ninjette.org certified postwhore
Name: AKA JacRyann
Location: Mesa, AZ
Join Date: Dec 2011 Motorcycle(s): CB125T CBR250R-MC19 CBR250RR-MC22 NSR350R-MC21 VF500F CBR600RR SFV650 VFR750F R1M ST1300PA Valkyrie-F6C Posts: A lot.
MOTY - 2018, MOTM - Nov '17
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Nice work! Your mods gave some ideas for my race-bike. More aero is also faster for same power!
My wife's CB125T gets 100mpg and it's not even faired! I think converting to EFI will give you big improvements. You can do lean-burn at cruising 16:1 AFR or so. |
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August 14th, 2017, 05:11 AM | #251 |
vampire
Name: A
Location: IT
Join Date: Feb 2011 Motorcycle(s): 2 many 2 list Posts: A lot.
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So solar electric assist bicycle next?
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August 14th, 2017, 08:28 AM | #252 |
Motorcycle Hypermiler
Name: Vic
Location: Livermore CA
Join Date: Jan 2012 Motorcycle(s): 1999 & 2005 Kawasaki Ninja 250R's Posts: A lot.
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Actually I'm very interested in electric assisted bikes. Unfortunately they currently wouldn't work for the Vetter Challenge ( not fast enough; ability to go 70 mph into a 30 mph headwind). I do think they have awesome potential for urban/suburban transportation.
thanks! I'm glad you found the incredible advantage of reducing aerodynamic drag on your moto. I had thought about streamlining a 125cc moto but they are just short of the power needed for Vetter Challenges with sustained high speed sections. I am very excited about working with EFI to get better fuel economy.
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235 MPG Hypermotorcycling to a better tomorrow |
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August 15th, 2017, 01:44 PM | #253 |
ninjette.org certified postwhore
Name: AKA JacRyann
Location: Mesa, AZ
Join Date: Dec 2011 Motorcycle(s): CB125T CBR250R-MC19 CBR250RR-MC22 NSR350R-MC21 VF500F CBR600RR SFV650 VFR750F R1M ST1300PA Valkyrie-F6C Posts: A lot.
MOTY - 2018, MOTM - Nov '17
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One thing that really helps MPGs on autos is EGR. With many under cruising, up to 40-50% of intake is exhaust. This reduces pumping-losses due to intake-manifold vacuum (less difference between pre-throttle vs. post-throttle pressures). Pistons don't have to fight mostly-closed throttle on their intake-stroke. Power to generate this vacuum comes from other pistons on power-stroke.
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August 24th, 2017, 09:13 AM | #254 |
Motorcycle Hypermiler
Name: Vic
Location: Livermore CA
Join Date: Jan 2012 Motorcycle(s): 1999 & 2005 Kawasaki Ninja 250R's Posts: A lot.
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I sold the 1999 Ninjette last Sunday to a young woman who will be starting motorcycling. She was from Sacramento so we decided to meet halfway so I got to ride it for about 40 miles the final time on a beautiful day here in NorCal. Since I restored the gearing to the stock 14/45 configuration, I enjoyed the brisk acceleration but was dismayed by the screaming amount of rpms needed to cruise the collider zones of Hwys 580, 280, and 5. Still it ran beautifully as it always has over my last 6 years of ownership. I wish I was rich enough to put it in a museum but I need the funds to move on to my next project. This was a great moto and I will always have fond memories of it.
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235 MPG Hypermotorcycling to a better tomorrow |
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August 24th, 2017, 05:14 PM | #255 |
ninjette.org certified postwhore
Name: Kerry
Location: Ventura, CA
Join Date: Jan 2016 Motorcycle(s): Ninja650 Posts: A lot.
MOTM - Apr '18, Apr '17, Apr '16
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Nice to know it's going to a good home and someone who will appreciate her!
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August 25th, 2017, 04:56 AM | #256 | |
vampire
Name: A
Location: IT
Join Date: Feb 2011 Motorcycle(s): 2 many 2 list Posts: A lot.
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Quote:
If you want an engine for low fuel consumption with high output at low rpm.. Ninja 250 engine probably was not he ideal one to start with. I'd think something like a 250 single engine with good amount of lowend torque and CVT trans. |
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August 25th, 2017, 06:16 AM | #257 |
Rev Limiter
Name: Jay
Location: WI
Join Date: Jul 2013 Motorcycle(s): '06 SV650n, '00 Derbi GPR, '64 CA77 Dream 305, '70 CL450 Scrambler, numerous dirt bikes Posts: A lot.
MOTM - Jun '18, Oct '16
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What's the next project Vic?
CBR250R based? |
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August 25th, 2017, 05:20 PM | #258 | ||
Motorcycle Hypermiler
Name: Vic
Location: Livermore CA
Join Date: Jan 2012 Motorcycle(s): 1999 & 2005 Kawasaki Ninja 250R's Posts: A lot.
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Quote:
Quote:
Hi Jay, Yes, I'll be looking at some CBR250Rs tomorrow. I also found a CBR150R but it is carbureted so I will pass on it.
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235 MPG Hypermotorcycling to a better tomorrow |
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August 26th, 2017, 02:34 PM | #259 | |
vampire
Name: A
Location: IT
Join Date: Feb 2011 Motorcycle(s): 2 many 2 list Posts: A lot.
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Quote:
Belt-drive CVT is lighter, depending on the optimal speed you need during the competition, you can likely built your own CVT drum top accommodate the optimal speed and have the single engine reving at 3-4k rpm or whereever the torque peak is. Likely even use an air/oil-cooled engine to lighter your vehicle even more. |
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September 13th, 2017, 08:17 AM | #260 |
vampire
Name: A
Location: IT
Join Date: Feb 2011 Motorcycle(s): 2 many 2 list Posts: A lot.
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September 15th, 2017, 09:21 AM | #261 | |
Motorcycle Hypermiler
Name: Vic
Location: Livermore CA
Join Date: Jan 2012 Motorcycle(s): 1999 & 2005 Kawasaki Ninja 250R's Posts: A lot.
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Quote:
Now that I'm without a fully streamlined moto, I have started the baseline testing for my next project. Alan Smith and I rode our test loop yesterday ( Livermore CA to Patterson ), he on his modified KLR650 and me on my stock 2011 Honda CBR250R. He got 80mpg for a best on this moto and I got 88mpg.
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235 MPG Hypermotorcycling to a better tomorrow |
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