shifting problem/question

Sound Wave · February 15th, 2009, 07:27 PM

when i shift up, first and second gear is fine. it positively clicks into gear. the problem i have is that sometimes 4th and 5th gear doesn't shift into gear. i lift my toe to shift, it feels like it shifted, although i don't get that notchy click, but it didn't shift gears. then i gotta try again and it usually works the second try.

when i rode ninjabrewers bike the other day, each shift had a firm click as i upshifted through the gears. i only rode it about a mile or so, but i didn't miss a gear change once.

does anyone know what could be causing the problem? my bike has been this way since day 1. this is my first bike so i thought it was supposed to be that way.

thanks for any help.

Alex · February 15th, 2009, 07:42 PM

First thing I'd check (because it's the easiest) is the clutch freeplay. There should be a small knob on your clutch lever. Make sure that there is a little (1 or 2 mm) of freeplay in the lever. There shouldn't be any more, and there shouldn't be much less. A misadjusted clutch can cause a bunch of different shifting issues.

If that turns out not to be the case, I'd then check technique. Make sure that after you upshift from 2nd to 3rd, you are not putting any pressure on the shift lever, and you've allowed it to come all the way back to center position. Sometime when people keep their toes underneath while shifting up through several gears, they don't let the shift lever return all the way, and that can cause the issue your describing.

Then, I'd work on adjusting the shift lever itself. There are two locknuts on the bar that connects from the lever to the shifter itself. If you loosen the locknuts, you can see how turning them lengthens and shortens that rod. You want it so when it is in the center position, it is as perpendicular as possible to the shifting rod itself. If it isn't perpendicular, the effort to upshift and downshift can be different than you'd expect, and cause some strange shifting behavior.

Finally, if it's still giving you fits, just take it to a dealer and explain the problem. It's still under warranty. Let them tell you if there's something wrong with it, and if there is they're on the hook to fix it. Good luck!

ninjabrewer · February 15th, 2009, 07:51 PM

I don't believe that it is his shifting method, his bike shifted much different than mine. I can't explain it, shifted softer, didn't take as much effort, something like that. mine "click""click""click". And his clutch engages earlier than mine, (hell, I choked it down expecting it to be like mine) but I know all clutches are different, like cars.

nb

Sound Wave · February 15th, 2009, 08:09 PM

thanks for the tips. i will go and check those two things out.

yeah, i rode chris' bike the exact same way as i do mine.

Alex · February 15th, 2009, 08:35 PM

Here's a great link that shows what I was trying to say about the shift rod adjustment.

Not my original pic, but whoever put it together had the right idea:

kkim · February 15th, 2009, 08:37 PM

cool drawing.

Sound Wave · February 15th, 2009, 09:08 PM

thanks for that pic. i just finished working on my bike. i tried not to have to take off the fairing, but couldn't get around it.

my clutch play was 5 mm, so i adjusted it to about 2mm rode around on my parking level. not a good idea trying to shift with slippers on. seems better, but hard to tell because i couldn't go very fast.

gotta go back down to take another look at the rod itself, then i will go for a quick test ride on the street.

thanks again!!!

Sound Wave · February 15th, 2009, 10:46 PM

ok, well i got back from my test ride and some other errands...

it still isn't as "snik snik" as chris' but it does feel better. i only went for a 2 mile ride, but i think there is an improvement. 4th and 5th gear change still seem a bit soft but i didn't miss any gear changes. my 2nd gear shift is kind of loud now though... but that i don't mind.

also, i did adjust the shift rod. i got it as parallel to the ground as possible. still couldn't get it like the pic though. it pivots the shift lever up (further from the ground).

anyways, thanks for the help alex. i am pretty happy with the way it is now.

HKr1 · February 16th, 2009, 05:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kkim

cool drawing.

Dont know how people shift with there lever flat like that. My foot doesnt move that far up

Alex · February 16th, 2009, 05:37 PM

I think the trick is to get the lever exactly how you want, while still making sure that the shift arm isn't completely out of whack. (but you probably knew that

)

HKr1 · February 16th, 2009, 05:46 PM

^ Yeah

Some pics I see of peoples bikes, there shift lever is level with the peg...... Guess they lift there whole foot to shift?

Sound Wave · February 16th, 2009, 06:23 PM

while i did have to raise my foot higher to shift with the new position, it wasn't anything that felt awkward.

i didn't do a before and after rod-adjustment ride. so i don't know if raising the height of the shift lever helped. still, i think i will leave it like this and see how it goes.

i rode over 200 miles this weekend and i am a bit sore. not planning on riding again for a couple days.

Alex · February 16th, 2009, 06:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sound Wave

i rode over 200 miles this weekend and i am a bit sore.

komohana · February 16th, 2009, 09:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alex

...but 200 HAWAIIAN miles takes more outta someone...its...different.....like...doggie years vs human years cept in miles

kkim · February 16th, 2009, 09:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by komohana

...but 200 HAWAIIAN miles takes more outta someone...its...different.....like...doggie years vs human years cept in miles

I have a Hawaiian miles credit card.

jpnfrk · February 16th, 2009, 09:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kkim

I have a Hawaiian miles credit card.

Quote:

Originally Posted by komohana

...but 200 HAWAIIAN miles takes more outta someone...its...different.....like...doggie years vs human years cept in miles

I couldn't stop laughing when I read those comments... you guys are too funny!!

Sound Wave · February 16th, 2009, 10:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alex

hey alex, better watch it man. as you can see, if you pick on one hawaiian, you pick on all of us! all ummm...... all 4 of us. hey, somebody go find ninjabrewer.
don't make us throw a pineapple at your or something. those things hurt you know. really prickly.

TrueFaith · February 17th, 2009, 09:01 AM

I notice you have a new 09 Ninja. A lot of people who bought 08 Ninjas last year were complaining about the same "false neutral" in the upper gears. I had the same problem on my 08. No "solution" was ever found and I really think this is a transmission "break-in" thing. Once I had a few thousand miles on the bike the incidence of false neutrals became less and less and I'm hoping switching to full synthetic Rotella T this spring will eliminate them entirely.

Sound Wave · February 17th, 2009, 09:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TrueFaith

I notice you have a new 09 Ninja. A lot of people who bought 08 Ninjas last year were complaining about the same "false neutral" in the upper gears. I had the same problem on my 08. No "solution" was ever found and I really think this is a transmission "break-in" thing. Once I had a few thousand miles on the bike the incidence of false neutrals became less and less and I'm hoping switching to full synthetic Rotella T this spring will eliminate them entirely.

thanks. hopefully it will get better. although, at least from my short test ride, i didn't miss any gear changes. gonna try and take it for a longer ride later this week. i plan on eventually changing to synthetics too. maybe at 2000 miles.

ninjabrewer · February 17th, 2009, 08:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sound Wave

hey alex, better watch it man. as you can see, if you pick on one hawaiian, you pick on all of us! all ummm...... all 4 of us. hey, somebody go find ninjabrewer.
don't make us throw a pineapple at your or something. those things hurt you know. really prickly.

huh??

February 15th, 2009, 07:27 PM	#1
Sound Wave Ramen Rider Name: Gary Location: Honolulu, Hawaii Join Date: Jan 2009 Motorcycle(s): 2015 BMW R1200R, 08 Honda VFR800A (sold), 09 Ninja 250R (sold) Posts: A lot.	shifting problem/question when i shift up, first and second gear is fine. it positively clicks into gear. the problem i have is that sometimes 4th and 5th gear doesn't shift into gear. i lift my toe to shift, it feels like it shifted, although i don't get that notchy click, but it didn't shift gears. then i gotta try again and it usually works the second try. when i rode ninjabrewers bike the other day, each shift had a firm click as i upshifted through the gears. i only rode it about a mile or so, but i didn't miss a gear change once. does anyone know what could be causing the problem? my bike has been this way since day 1. this is my first bike so i thought it was supposed to be that way. thanks for any help.

February 15th, 2009, 07:42 PM	#2
Alex ninjette.org dude Name: 1 guess :-) Location: SF Bay Area Join Date: Jun 2008 Motorcycle(s): '13 Ninja 300 (white, the fastest color!), '13 R1200RT, '14 CRF250L, '12 TT-R125LE Posts: Too much. Blog Entries: 7	First thing I'd check (because it's the easiest) is the clutch freeplay. There should be a small knob on your clutch lever. Make sure that there is a little (1 or 2 mm) of freeplay in the lever. There shouldn't be any more, and there shouldn't be much less. A misadjusted clutch can cause a bunch of different shifting issues. If that turns out not to be the case, I'd then check technique. Make sure that after you upshift from 2nd to 3rd, you are not putting any pressure on the shift lever, and you've allowed it to come all the way back to center position. Sometime when people keep their toes underneath while shifting up through several gears, they don't let the shift lever return all the way, and that can cause the issue your describing. Then, I'd work on adjusting the shift lever itself. There are two locknuts on the bar that connects from the lever to the shifter itself. If you loosen the locknuts, you can see how turning them lengthens and shortens that rod. You want it so when it is in the center position, it is as perpendicular as possible to the shifting rod itself. If it isn't perpendicular, the effort to upshift and downshift can be different than you'd expect, and cause some strange shifting behavior. Finally, if it's still giving you fits, just take it to a dealer and explain the problem. It's still under warranty. Let them tell you if there's something wrong with it, and if there is they're on the hook to fix it. Good luck! __________________________________________________ Montgomery Street Motorcycle Club / cal24.com / crf250l.org / ninjette.org ninjette.org Terms of Service Shopping for motorcycle parts or equipment? Come here first. The friendliest Ninja 250R/300/400 forum on the internet! (especially Unregistered)

February 15th, 2009, 07:51 PM	#3
ninjabrewer dirty old man Name: Chris Location: Hazel Green, AL Join Date: Nov 2008 Motorcycle(s): Blue '08 Ninja 250 Posts: A lot. Blog Entries: 1	I don't believe that it is his shifting method, his bike shifted much different than mine. I can't explain it, shifted softer, didn't take as much effort, something like that. mine "click""click""click". And his clutch engages earlier than mine, (hell, I choked it down expecting it to be like mine) but I know all clutches are different, like cars. nb __________________________________________________ Death tugs at my ear and says, "Live, I am coming." -Oliver Wendell Holmes, Sr., poet, novelist, essayist, and physician (1809-1894) www.friendsofsanonofre.org

February 15th, 2009, 08:35 PM	#5
Alex ninjette.org dude Name: 1 guess :-) Location: SF Bay Area Join Date: Jun 2008 Motorcycle(s): '13 Ninja 300 (white, the fastest color!), '13 R1200RT, '14 CRF250L, '12 TT-R125LE Posts: Too much. Blog Entries: 7	Here's a great link that shows what I was trying to say about the shift rod adjustment. Not my original pic, but whoever put it together had the right idea: __________________________________________________ Montgomery Street Motorcycle Club / cal24.com / crf250l.org / ninjette.org ninjette.org Terms of Service Shopping for motorcycle parts or equipment? Come here first. The friendliest Ninja 250R/300/400 forum on the internet! (especially Unregistered)

February 16th, 2009, 05:37 PM	#10
Alex ninjette.org dude Name: 1 guess :-) Location: SF Bay Area Join Date: Jun 2008 Motorcycle(s): '13 Ninja 300 (white, the fastest color!), '13 R1200RT, '14 CRF250L, '12 TT-R125LE Posts: Too much. Blog Entries: 7	I think the trick is to get the lever exactly how you want, while still making sure that the shift arm isn't completely out of whack. (but you probably knew that ) __________________________________________________ Montgomery Street Motorcycle Club / cal24.com / crf250l.org / ninjette.org ninjette.org Terms of Service Shopping for motorcycle parts or equipment? Come here first. The friendliest Ninja 250R/300/400 forum on the internet! (especially Unregistered)

February 15th, 2009, 08:09 PM	#4
Sound Wave Ramen Rider Name: Gary Location: Honolulu, Hawaii Join Date: Jan 2009 Motorcycle(s): 2015 BMW R1200R, 08 Honda VFR800A (sold), 09 Ninja 250R (sold) Posts: A lot.	thanks for the tips. i will go and check those two things out. yeah, i rode chris' bike the exact same way as i do mine.

February 15th, 2009, 08:37 PM	#6
kkim Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: Too much.	cool drawing.

February 15th, 2009, 09:08 PM	#7
Sound Wave Ramen Rider Name: Gary Location: Honolulu, Hawaii Join Date: Jan 2009 Motorcycle(s): 2015 BMW R1200R, 08 Honda VFR800A (sold), 09 Ninja 250R (sold) Posts: A lot.	thanks for that pic. i just finished working on my bike. i tried not to have to take off the fairing, but couldn't get around it. my clutch play was 5 mm, so i adjusted it to about 2mm rode around on my parking level. not a good idea trying to shift with slippers on. seems better, but hard to tell because i couldn't go very fast. gotta go back down to take another look at the rod itself, then i will go for a quick test ride on the street. thanks again!!!

February 15th, 2009, 10:46 PM	#8
Sound Wave Ramen Rider Name: Gary Location: Honolulu, Hawaii Join Date: Jan 2009 Motorcycle(s): 2015 BMW R1200R, 08 Honda VFR800A (sold), 09 Ninja 250R (sold) Posts: A lot.	ok, well i got back from my test ride and some other errands... it still isn't as "snik snik" as chris' but it does feel better. i only went for a 2 mile ride, but i think there is an improvement. 4th and 5th gear change still seem a bit soft but i didn't miss any gear changes. my 2nd gear shift is kind of loud now though... but that i don't mind. also, i did adjust the shift rod. i got it as parallel to the ground as possible. still couldn't get it like the pic though. it pivots the shift lever up (further from the ground). anyways, thanks for the help alex. i am pretty happy with the way it is now.

February 16th, 2009, 05:46 PM	#11
HKr1 IC2(SW) Name: Kerry Location: Pensacola Join Date: Nov 2008 Motorcycle(s): . Posts: A lot.	^ Yeah Some pics I see of peoples bikes, there shift lever is level with the peg...... Guess they lift there whole foot to shift?

February 16th, 2009, 06:23 PM	#12
Sound Wave Ramen Rider Name: Gary Location: Honolulu, Hawaii Join Date: Jan 2009 Motorcycle(s): 2015 BMW R1200R, 08 Honda VFR800A (sold), 09 Ninja 250R (sold) Posts: A lot.	while i did have to raise my foot higher to shift with the new position, it wasn't anything that felt awkward. i didn't do a before and after rod-adjustment ride. so i don't know if raising the height of the shift lever helped. still, i think i will leave it like this and see how it goes. i rode over 200 miles this weekend and i am a bit sore. not planning on riding again for a couple days.

February 17th, 2009, 09:01 AM	#18
TrueFaith ninjette.org sage Name: Wayne Location: Brookfield, MA Join Date: Nov 2008 Motorcycle(s): 2011 Honda CBR250R Posts: 585	I notice you have a new 09 Ninja. A lot of people who bought 08 Ninjas last year were complaining about the same "false neutral" in the upper gears. I had the same problem on my 08. No "solution" was ever found and I really think this is a transmission "break-in" thing. Once I had a few thousand miles on the bike the incidence of false neutrals became less and less and I'm hoping switching to full synthetic Rotella T this spring will eliminate them entirely.

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