Still Idles high :(

[M-Oorb]

So just got back from a short vacation and I have over 2000 unread posts!! Its gunna be a long night...but anywayss

So I have posted this probelm in another thread and I thought the problem was fixed but with a little more ridding..the problem is still there.
The Problem is...When I start the bike it idles fine at 1500 rpm.Once I start to ride and stop at a light it idles at 1500 but then it slowly rises sometimes reaching and settling at 2500. Now when I first posted this problem Kkim asked me if I revved it if it dropped back down and I said no it didnt...guess Im incompetent at revving cause now when I do rev it drops back down...sometimes back to 1500 sometimes only to 2000...Yet it slowly makes its rise back up(Most of the time). I dont know much about engines in general but it sounds to me like something is sticking?

Just some background on the bike...I have the snorkel removed...cant really remember if the problem started before or after I did this. Also have one washer on but the problem was def. there before I shimmed. Any help would be great...I hate having to rev my bike at every light to have a normal idle and this probably is not good for the bike...Any help would be much appreciated!!

[kkim]

The idle needs to be set to 1500 rpm after it has been fully warmed up. Is that how you set the idle? You can't set the idle when it's cold.

[M-Oorb]

What do you mean "set the idle"? Ive never messed around with the idle screws if thats what you mean? The only time I touched my engine since I've had the bike is when I shimmed my needles and the problem was occurring before I did this.

[kkim]

sets the idle speed... the little black knob on the side of the bike, right below the left side panel. You've never adjusted that?

[M-Oorb]

Just went out real quick to look at what your talking about but I couldnt find it...but no I dont think I have if I dont even know where or what it is . About 500 miles ago the bike fell on the left side...minor cosmetic damage and I replaced the fairing and turn signal but the bike went in for the 600 miles maintenance after the fact...not saying that dealerships are smart...in fact most arent which is why I wanna figure this out and fix it myself. Would a fall do anything to this knob. Can you tell me where exactly I should be looking?

[kkim]

Take a look at the picture I added. It's directly above the date stamp in the picture... the thing that looks like, well... a knurled knob.

[M-Oorb]

Okkk I see it now...looks silver to me haha. Ok so yeaa I've never touched that...would messing around with that somehow help to alleviate me idle problem?

[kkim]

Would be a good place to start sorting it out. You need to run the bike a good 10 minutes to be sure it's fully warmed up, then set the idle speed by turning that knob.

[M-Oorb]

Thanks a bunch...as always a big help...hopefully haha. Ill hit that up tomorrow when I do the sprocket install...but of course the idle problem will come first

[HKr1]

Check the choke cable, make sure it's loose down there on the carb when fully off.

Might need to look into this thread:

http://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=10246

[M-Oorb]

Loose down where(Dont take the wrong way you pervs)? And I was thinking about doing that but because the problem didn't come about from me messing with them I didn't want to mess with them to fix the problem ya know? Maybe I'm wrong but I don"t think anything I did caused this problem so I didn't think I would have to resort to those screws...hopefully

[kkim]

Like I said, start with that idle knob as a start to isolate the problem. If you have never adjusted it, that may well be your problem.

[M-Oorb]

Well thank you kind sir...I will attempt this tomorrow and hopefully the problem is gone...will praise you tomorrow if this works...if it doesnt...well I'll just bitch to you some more until you figure out whats wrong with my bike

[kkim]

Originally Posted by M-Oorb

...if it doesnt...well I'll just bitch to you some more until you figure out whats wrong with my bike

sure... why not??? That's what everyone else does anyway.

[HKr1]

Originally Posted by M-Oorb

Loose down where(Dont take the wrong way you pervs)? And I was thinking about doing that but because the problem didn't come about from me messing with them I didn't want to mess with them to fix the problem ya know?:

Down between the carbs, you can move the choke lever and see the cable move(at the carbs). It's harder to see than the idle knob

Was kinda funny the other day, we pulled up to stop lite. Wife was on the 250r & it was idling high 3000rpm. I was thinking oh crap here we go
Then I noticed the choke lever was just barley on

And yes....... I gave her a slap up side the helmet

[Sound Wave]

oh, m-oorb just in case... i tried adjusting my idle for the first time a couple nights ago and the knob wouldn't turn.

apparently (nobody tease me please, it is my first bike hehe) you gotta pull the knob towards you first to unlock it. then you can twist it. i think to the left was less rpms and to the right was more. when you are done, push it back in.

if you already knew that, sorry. i couldn't figure it out at first and the manual was no help. i couldn't figure out why it wouldn't turn.

anyone correct me if i am wrong, but that is what i had to do.

[M-Oorb]

HKr1...so I gotta tear the whole bike down . Ill check it out

And soundwave...thanks I'm a noob with bikes too and I woulda been sitting in my garage trying everything to turn that little knob and wouldnt have figured it out haha

[Guinss]

my FI bike was idling at 2500rpm when i got it from the dealer. They didnt do anything about it at the "delivery check" right before i got the bike, and not at 1000km service either. Found it a little annoying and they didnt seem to bother at the shop so i figured i'd had to do it myself, checked the owners manual, found the idle-adjuster on the bike, like on the picture kkim posted, turned it a little anti-clockwise, and problem solved. Always idles steadily at 1500 now, except when choke is on of course.

M-Oorb: Did you find out why your bike is idling so high?

[kkim]

Matt,

have you tried adjusting it?

[HKr1]

Originally Posted by M-Oorb

HKr1...so I gotta tear the whole bike down . Ill check it out

No!

Check the knob first like Kelly mentioned

[kkim]

Originally Posted by Sound Wave

apparently you gotta pull the knob towards you first to unlock it. then you can twist it.

mine has no such "lock"??? does anyone else?

[Viper-Byte]

Originally Posted by M-Oorb

HKr1...so I gotta tear the whole bike down . Ill check it out

To adjust the idle, no. The knob in Kelly's picture is acessible with the fairings on. I have even adjusted mine sitting on the bike fully geared sitting at traffic lights.

Originally Posted by kkim

mine has no such "lock"??? does anyone else?

As far as I know, mie didn't... Though the dealer did adjust it before I did at the first service.

[Sound Wave]

Originally Posted by kkim

mine has no such "lock"??? does anyone else?

i don't know... it would grudgingly turn about half way and when i let go, the knob would "bounce" (for lack of a better word) right back to the original position.

i accidentally, pulled on it a bit and the knob moved outwards. i pulled it a bit more until it stopped. then i tried twisting it again and it moved clockwise and counter-clockwise easily. after that i just pushed it back in.

maybe it is an 09 thing? then again, maybe they just put that there specially for me to mess with my head.

[Guinss]

no such lock on my 08, could be only on 09 version as you suggest

[M-Oorb]

I hate being home from school...I seem to never do the things I plan on doing...other things keep popping up . Tomorrow morning first thing I'm adjusting the idle...didnt even get a chance to ride today .

[archetype]

I change the idle two or three times whenever I ride one of the 250s (07,09).
My son keeps the 09 set at 2500 (warm) it seems to work well.
It idles at about 1500 cold then doesn't exceed 2500 as it warms up.
The way I see it, 2500 shouldn't be a problem as F1 engines that peak at 19000 idle at 6000.
Kelly, do you see any problem with 2500, we have a lot of temp. and humidity changes here ?

[kkim]

At 2500, I would think he is bypassing the idle circuit. I don't thinik there is anything wrong, but why not use the choke when cold to start and set the idle at 1500 when fully warmed? Does he have problems with it like that?

[archetype]

We do use the choke on start-up, let it run about a minute or two while backing off the choke.
It generally takes about five minutes or so to reach full temp. and a stable idle speed.
I usually wait about two minutes before I take off.
He can't wait more than one minute max.
Once he can get 1500 without the choke he is gone.
We have had three of these 250s, they all seem to be the same cold-natured beasts. (The main reason I really want the FI version.)

[archetype]

Oh, if I set the idle at 1500 warm it takes about five minutes before I can back off the choke completely.

[kkim]

Like I said, I don't see a problem with having a warm 2500 idle, but personally, I would just set it at 1500 warm and use the choke to ride off when cold during stat up. Turn the choke off once you get on the road.

You do know shimming the needles would cure your problems of a cold beast, right?

[archetype]

I was afraid you were going to tell me to work on the carbs.
At this point in my life, anything more than changing oil, I'd rather just buy a new one.
I have only worn out one set of car tires in last 15 years.

[kkim]

have the boy do the work with you as supervisor. he rides, he should learn how to wrench. great bonding tool... or motive for murder.

[archetype]

Ok, I trust you, buddy.
Should I shim or just run richer.
Counter-clockwise is rich, clockwise is lean, right?

[kkim]

It's the idle circuit that is lean. The real solution is to adjust the mixture screws which are a PITA to get to as they have anti tampering plugs on them so you don't screw with them.

The raising of the carb needles allows the idle circuit to get the extra fuel it needs so warm ups are quicker and the power between idle to about 7k rpm is improved.

the stock main jets are a great choice and I wouldn't change them unless you remove the airbox, which I don't recommend at this point.

CW/CCW??? you talking about the idle speed control on the left side of the bike? that's only used to set the idle speed and does not change any jetting (air/fuel mixture ratios) Use that to set the idle speed at 1500 when the bike is fully warm.

[archetype]

Idle speed, just using the idle adjuster.
I was thinking the mixtures screws were little needle jets with a slot head and a tiny shaft through them.
My only carb experience in the last twenty years was jet ski carbs.
Jet ski carbs were butterfly and these bikes are slide.
I guess I need to read the DIY threads.
Thanks for your help.

[kkim]

http://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=10287

[Guinss]

2500 idle is sure fine for the engine, but it sounds funny, and its a bigger clonk when you put it into first. Thats why i changed it to 1500

[M-Oorb]

So i adjusted the idle yesterday...easiest fix on this bike yet haha. Its a tick under 1500,id say 1400. Nice and steady and now it doesnt sound like I'm being obnoxious and am at the throttle at traffic lights anymore

[g21-30]

Congratulations! You're now on the road to becoming a mechanic!

[kkim]

Originally Posted by M-Oorb

So i adjusted the idle yesterday...easiest fix on this bike yet haha. Its a tick under 1500,id say 1400. Nice and steady and now it doesnt sound like I'm being obnoxious and am at the throttle at traffic lights anymore

You may need to readjust every now and then. I usually check the idle when I get home after a ride before I shut it down. If it's high or low by a hundred rpm or so, I touch it up with that adjustment knob, then shut the bike down. You'll find after you do this a few times, you won't have to readjust it after awhile as the idle speed will always settle at your desired idle speed.