Squids

[Alex]

We've had the rear-braking discussion a number of times here on the site, and here are two threads where it might be more appropriate to continue if need be:

"Front Brake? Rear brake? Both?" Thread 1 Thread 2

These are linked from the sticky thread at the top of the Riding Skills area.

[Jinx250]

Originally Posted by Kevin2109

So yesterday I decided to give up on squids. I used to always talk **** on people that arnt wearing gear or try and get them to change there mind about gear or whatever. But at this point Ive come to realize there's so reason to try and get people to change there ways because you or I think they are wrong. Just enjoy riding with them or hanging with them, if they crash and get hurt there's nothing you could have done about it, let them deal with it

/end rant

I don't preach to anyone who wants to NOT wear gear - it's their lives and their choice. But I will NOT ride with them. Period.

Originally Posted by Kevin2109

Have you ever been on a sport bike? And a cruiser? The front brake barely works on a cruiser

Have you? I'd say no, since you said what you said. The front bakes on cruisers stop pretty damn good. Add in some SS lines and they stop better. Add in HH pads and you could probably lift the rear wheel. And YES, I've been on a cruiser. Several actually. Anyone who says fronts don't work on a cruiser are sadly misinformed and obviously inexperienced.

[Kevin2109]

Originally Posted by Jinx250

I don't preach to anyone who wants to NOT wear gear - it's their lives and their choice. But I will NOT ride with them. Period.



Have you? I'd say no, since you said what you said. The front bakes on cruisers stop pretty damn good. Add in some SS lines and they stop better. Add in HH pads and you could probably lift the rear wheel. And YES, I've been on a cruiser. Several actually. Anyone who says fronts don't work on a cruiser are sadly misinformed and obviously inexperienced.

again your wrong. If you think that the stopping performance from the front brake is the same on a cruiser as on your 250, then you clearly have a broken 250

[nit8690]

I can say one thing that really sucks...seeing your sister with a squid riding down the road...both wearing a harely t shirt jeans and no helmet, just a bandana. I love her dearly and she is smart I dont know what possesed her to do that. I mean I plane to have at least helmet jacket and gloves. maybe pants but I mean no gear at all...if they had wrecked...yeah

[rusninja]

I think if people do not wear gear its not critical to yourself for the fact that it comes to skill. Point being you may think the under dressed person doesnt care for his life but the person fully geared can be the one to take you out. So really when you ride with someone what really matters is if they know what their doing.

[adri99an]

Art Vanda I <3 you
Posted via Mobile Device

[Art Vandelay]

Originally Posted by adri99an

Art Vanda-moron is WRONG!!!
Posted via Mobile Device

So far in this thread, you've called me stupid, an infant, and now a moron. All I've done is call you a kid (which I still believe you are) and noted what the best practices are for quick stops on the street, according to the experts.

This forum has a reputation for immaturity...I wonder why?

[Kevin2109]

[Alex]

Adrian and Kevin -

Your recent posts are clear T.O.S. violations. If you want to stay here, edit them promptly.

[Kevin2109]

What one besides the demotivational poster?

[Alex]

Post #113, and anywhere else where you felt a personal attack was warranted.

[Trailerboy531]

I don't see how Adrian and Kevin calling someone a novice and arguing their points is any different from Alex doing next to the same thing at the beginning of this thread?
Posted via Mobile Device

[Kevin2109]

Originally Posted by Alex

Post #113, and anywhere else where you felt a personal attack was warranted.

Ive edited what was wrong, I will edit no more

[Alex]

Originally Posted by Trailerboy531

I don't see how Adrian and Kevin calling someone a novice and arguing their points is any different from Alex doing next to the same thing at the beginning of this thread?
Posted via Mobile Device

Personal attacks are against the T.O.S. Period. Calling someone a moron is never OK. Disagreements are fine, debate is fine, childish namecalling is not. Stop trying to stir the pot.

[Trailerboy531]

Im not trying to stir any pots im just trying to understand. I can see how calling someone a "moron" would be unacceptable.
Posted via Mobile Device

[alex.s]

play nice kids

[adri99an]

I felt a personal attack when I was called a kid-where's my redemption. Double edge sword here folks....
I love everyone and turtles.
Posted via Mobile Device

[gfloyd2002]

Originally Posted by Trailerboy531

Im not trying to stir any pots im just trying to understand. I can see how calling someone a "moron" would be unacceptable.
Posted via Mobile Device

It is good policy. The purpose of this forum is to promote the exchange of information and the enjoyment of our shared hobby. Personal attacks aren't helpful to that, and create an environment that discourages sharing and one that focuses discussion on non-informational, unhelpful posts that frankly the rest of us don't want to read. Some of the best information comes when members disagree and post differing viewpoints, but it really should be done respectfully to focus on the issues and not personal attacks.

And while it isn't in the terms of service, it would also be tremendously helpful if people weren't so aggressively one-sided about things. There is right and wrong, of course, but a lot of room for common ground and respectful differences of opinion. That someone has a different opinion from us should be welcome, and not at all threatening. Particularly on something as legitimately debatable as braking technique on short wheelbase sportbikes, it is pretty ridiculous that the debate devolved into name calling.

Relevant terms of service follow:

2.1. Members will conduct themselves in a respectful manner. This is not to say that arguments and disagreements between Members are not permitted, simply that a level of respect is to be maintained in doing so. Members' posts should not contain malicious personal attacks, flaming, baiting, trolling, e-sniping, e-stalking, indirect attacks, and other such activities that are not conducive to a positive and productive environment. Personal threats will not be tolerated, and may result in a suspension, if not a perma-ban. Such posts will be acted on by interpretation of admins and/or moderators.

2.2. When personal disputes arise between Members they will take their squabble to Private Message (PM) when requested by Staff to do so. This does not apply to differences of opinion from which others will benefit (arguments pertaining to motorcycling technique, style, history, etc.); it is specifically targeted at those who actively engage in violation of Section 2.1. Such PM's are not to be posted publicly, nor will they be moderated.

[Trailerboy531]

I prefer tortoises
Posted via Mobile Device

[adri99an]

Floyd...name calling is the ultimate form of flattery.
I just hate when people get on here with their motorcycle thumping idiotic ideas. I've been attacked and ridiculed over the years here yet I'm the one that gets banned.
I still love turtles.
Posted via Mobile Device

[gfloyd2002]

Originally Posted by adri99an

Floyd...name calling is the ultimate form of flattery.
I just hate when people get on here with their ideas with which I feel deeply compelled to respectfully disagree. I've been attacked and ridiculed over the years here yet I still have the grace to overlook their immaturity and use the power of the keyboard to speak truth.
I still love Floyd.
Posted via Mobile Device

Fixed it for you.

[akima]

I like to spread the good word of ATGATT, but if someone doesn't one to listen then I'm not going to keep hammering at them. Adults make up their own minds.

I also believe in lead-by-example. If I ride with someone who lacks all the gear they should use, then they might see me all cosy and protected inside my padded outer shell and think to themselves "oh boy: if she crashed she'd probably be ok... me however, I don't think this t-shirt and swimming shorts would provide the adequate protection I would need."

Personally I love wearing the gear. It makes me feel special... like an astronaut who is going into dangerous territory and needs special training and advanced life-support equipment.

[ninja250]

Gear is fun, I think most of us who spent a couple G's on it can agree to that one
I try to do the robot in my gear but I can't so I just look dumb. =P

I wave to all the little kids who always wave at "the motorcycle man" though. haha

[Alex]

Originally Posted by akima

It makes me feel special... like an astronaut who is going into dangerous territory and needs special training and advanced life-support equipment.

And all of that freeze-dried ice cream!

[ninja250]

How'd we get from Honey Badger's to tortois now?
Where's snake when you need him?

[alex.s]

i'd just like to point out the fact that there is no difference in the technology of brake disks between a sport bike and a cruiser aside from maybe ratios, disk sizes, and count. (of course you can get into fancy radials and carbon disks but i'm not counting those since the topic was VS a 250...) and that the extended rake and trail of a cruiser would actually enable more forceful braking vs. the shorter raked sport bikes which will stoppie before the cruisers. the difference is how much heavier the cruisers are which makes stopping harder. you take a sport bike and give it a 30d rake and a dropped rear and you'll stop on a dime.

[ninja250]

If you use two fingers on my bike you can flip yourself right off it.
Safer to use one.

Takes three fingers to flip the Ninjete lol on my end anyways.
I do still need to do that rebleed though..

[nickjpass]

Originally Posted by Alex

And all of that freeze-dried ice cream!

They get ice cream there?!

[Jono]

Haha we got some cyber-bullying going on!

Anywho, As far as riding with people not wearing gear, well I am no going to try and change their mind. They made their decision and it is their life. If they are to stupid to realize that gear can save their life in some instances well then they should learn their lesson. Too harsh? I don't think so. I don't however associate with really stupid people who pop wheelies down the highway or go 100+mph and not wear gear.

As for me, I wear a helmet gloves and a jacket 98% of the time. I don't have riding pants yet but will soon. I will however only wear them when I hit the backroads. I sacrifice my safety for convenience. I know it is terrible but at least I will have an upperbody when I crash, right? Most people where I live wear only a helmet and possibly gloves, so I am being safer than most motorcyclist around here.

Not riding with someone who doesn't wear gear is like not talking to someone who smokes cigarettes. They know the risks but choose to ignore them or accept them. I hate smokers but I am not going to avoid talking to them.

*And today my jacket's zipper broke so I rode up to cycle gear without my jacket and got a new one for free because it had a warranty. But back to the main point. It felt amazing not wearing a jacket. You feel even more free. Yes it was dangerous but I now see why people do it. Don't worry I am not going start to riding without my jacket but it did feel nice.

Just my 2cents for this thread.

[ninja250]

When I finally went full gear it made me ride crazier.
Since I bought pants with knee sliders instead of regular riding pants it helped me want to go crazy on my knee.

However, I should have had more control. Like I try to do with my wrist.
Just because all that throttle is there doesn't mean I should use it. Same with knee sliders.

If I were you, when you get riding pants, don't get the ones with knee sliders until you're getting ready for the track, and don't use them unless you're on it. Then you won't be tempted.

[akima]

Originally Posted by Jono

Haha we got some cyber-bullying going on!

Anywho, As far as riding with people not wearing gear, well I am no going to try and change their mind. They made their decision and it is their life. If they are to stupid to realize that gear can save their life in some instances well then they should learn their lesson. Too harsh? I don't think so. I don't however associate with really stupid people who pop wheelies down the highway or go 100+mph and not wear gear.

As for me, I wear a helmet gloves and a jacket 98% of the time. I don't have riding pants yet but will soon. I will however only wear them when I hit the backroads. I sacrifice my safety for convenience. I know it is terrible but at least I will have an upperbody when I crash, right? Most people where I live wear only a helmet and possibly gloves, so I am being safer than most motorcyclist around here.

Not riding with someone who doesn't wear gear is like not talking to someone who smokes cigarettes. They know the risks but choose to ignore them or accept them. I hate smokers but I am not going to avoid them.

*And today my jacket's zipper broke so I rode up to cycle gear without my jacket and got a new one for free because it had a warranty. But back to the main point. It felt amazing not wearing a jacket. You feel even more free. Yes it was dangerous but I now see why people do it. Don't worry I am not going start to riding without my jacket but it did feel nice.

Just my 2cents for this thread.

So in one sense ("As far as riding with people not wearing gear, well I am no going to try and change their mind") you are not concerned with what people think, but in another sense ("Most people where I live wear only a helmet and possibly gloves, so I am being safer than most motorcyclist around here. ") you are concerned.

I've ridden without a protective jacket once too. I can totally relate to that nice feeling! I don't plan on doing that again though.

[Jono]

Originally Posted by ninja250

When I finally went full gear it made me ride crazier.
Since I bought pants with knee sliders instead of regular riding pants it helped me want to go crazy on my knee.

However, I should have had more control. Like I try to do with my wrist.
Just because all that throttle is there doesn't mean I should use it. Same with knee sliders.

If I were you, when you get riding pants, don't get the ones with knee sliders until you're getting ready for the track, and don't use them unless you're on it. Then you won't be tempted.

Advice taken. I can see how wearing full gear would make you feel more comfortable to push yourself on the street. Even if it is not really that much safer. I plan to get basic leather Bilt pants without knee sliders from cycle gear that zip to my Bilt jacket.

[ninja250]

Smart move.

I need to invest in some non knee style pants for riding on the street.

Some of them are fairly snazzy.
I like the leather stuff.

[akima]

Originally Posted by ninja250

Smart move.

I need to invest in some non knee style pants for riding on the street.

Some of them are fairly snazzy.

I've got a pair of protective trousers (not pants! pants are what you wear underneath ). Mine are great: I just wear them on top of whatever skirt/trousers/shorts I'm already wearing. Means I'm not stuck wearing heavy motorcycle gear if I decide to stop for longer than intended.

[Jono]

Originally Posted by akima

So in one sense ("As far as riding with people not wearing gear, well I am no going to try and change their mind") you are not concerned with what people think, but in another sense ("Most people where I live wear only a helmet and possibly gloves, so I am being safer than most motorcyclist around here. ") you are concerned.

I've ridden without a protective jacket once too. I can totally relate to that nice feeling! I don't plan on doing that again though.

I am not concerned about the stupid riders in my area. I was concerned about being flamed in this thread by you guys. I was just trying to point out that I am being safer than most riders in my area even though I don't wear ATGATT. I know I am taking a risk.

Yeah I love my jacket and will always wear it, even though it did feel nice without it.

[gfloyd2002]

Originally Posted by akima

protective trousers (not pants! pants are what you wear underneath ).

Oh, you can get protective underwear, too. Great excuse to use the phrase "protective coccyx pad" which is totally underrated as far as phrases go. Though your comment is particularly important as a Yank living in a former British colony at present. Asked for dress pants at the mall, got a confused look and directed to underwear section.

[akima]

Originally Posted by gfloyd2002

Though your comment is particularly important as a Yank living in a former British colony at present. Asked for dress pants at the mall, got a confused look and directed to underwear section.

lol

I've made friends with a number of Americans, and it continues to amaze me how much our languages differ. I'm constantly having to explain the British words I use to them I seem to get on better with the unique American words than they do with the unique British words, but that's probably because I (like many other citizens of the world) get a strong dose pseudo-American culture via hollywood on a regular basis.

[adri99an]

Originally Posted by gfloyd2002

Fixed it for you.

Very nice touch floyd....

[Numbersix]

Everyone on two wheels, four, 18, or just feet on the road takes a risk.

When people buy or don't buy gear, decide when and whether to wear it, get trained or don't, choose when and where and how fast to ride, they're deciding how much risk to take.

We can also choose whether to advise others or not; and if good advice isn't taken, whether to further that advice by our presence and good example or by our absence and good example.

I will say that I've never seen anyone positively motivated by insults; so even if Joe Squid is someone you care for and is being a complete f***ing moron, saying so probably doesn't help. The sole exception might be boot camp, but outside of Uncle Sam most of us don't have the privilege of having the other person's every bodily function under our direct control for several weeks on end to help drive home lessons

[Alex]

Originally Posted by Numbersix

The sole exception might be boot camp, but outside of Uncle Sam most of us don't have the privilege of having the other person's every bodily function under our direct control for several weeks on end to help drive home lessons

Now you're talking. "Coming to a training center near you, ninjette boot camp!"