July 2nd, 2014, 08:37 AM | #1 |
ninjette.org member
Name: John
Location: Milford, CT
Join Date: Mar 2014 Motorcycle(s): 2003 Ninja 250r Posts: 212
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Valve adjust and carb sync...
What are the symptoms of a bike that needs a valve adjustment?
What are the symptoms of a bike that needs a carb sync? |
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July 2nd, 2014, 08:56 AM | #2 |
Wrench wench
Name: The Stigette
Location: DC/MD/VA
Join Date: Jun 2014 Motorcycle(s): TWO HUNDRED FORTY EIGHT CUBIC CENTIMETERS (R.I.P.), SIX HUNDRED FORTY FIVE CUBIC CENTIMETERS Posts: 415
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I had extremely tight (<.002") exhaust valves on mine at one point. The symptoms were: needing full choke to start in the summer, and stalling out while stopping for a light unless the throttle was kept open. This was over a year ago, so there was probably some other small symptoms, but these are the main ones I remember.
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July 2nd, 2014, 03:50 PM | #3 |
CPT Falcon
Name: J.Emmett Turner
Location: Newnan, GA
Join Date: Apr 2009 Motorcycle(s): '08 CP Blue EX250J, '97 unpainted EX250F, 2nd '97 unpainted EX250F (no engine), '07 black EX250F Posts: A lot.
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Well, you technically need the valves serviced before you encounter noticeable symptoms. For the 2008+ model they suggest checking every 7,500 miles and adjusting then if it needs it. They don't always need it at the first 7,500 but, if they do, you risk damaging them by continuing on until the next interval (15,000) so I wouldn't push it much beyond 10 or 12 thousand miles before the first valve check/service. It will almost certainly need adjustment by then but, if not, be smart and do not wait until 20-24,000!
Here's my outline if pushing it to save money: Wait until 10-12,000 miles for the first valve service. If they need adjustment and clearances were not dangerously tight, then adjust all to the loose end of spec and check again at the interval we have established. If they need adjustment and WERE dangerously tight, adjust to the loose end of spec and check again a couple thousand miles sooner next time. On the chance that they DON'T need adjustment (not likely by the time you break 10,000 miles), you will probably need it much sooner rather than later, so I wouldn't break 8,500 miles without an adjustment. I got my first check done before 9K and then stupidly skipped the next one (didn't have the money). By the time I got what should have been my third one, one of my exhaust valves was dangerously tight. I only hope it didn't do any damage! Edit: Oops. My glasses are dirty. "2003" looked like "2008" Ignore my advice! |
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July 2nd, 2014, 03:54 PM | #4 |
ninjette.org dude
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Location: SF Bay Area
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His pregen is a little more aggressive on recommended intervals, with the first at 600 miles, then at every 6k afterwards if I remember correctly. If it's possible that the first owner skipped that first service and the valves have never been looked at, it may be worth it to confirm (by actually checking the valve clearance now).
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July 2nd, 2014, 03:59 PM | #5 | |
wat
Name: wat
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Quote:
2. fluctuating idle
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July 2nd, 2014, 04:07 PM | #6 | |
CPT Falcon
Name: J.Emmett Turner
Location: Newnan, GA
Join Date: Apr 2009 Motorcycle(s): '08 CP Blue EX250J, '97 unpainted EX250F, 2nd '97 unpainted EX250F (no engine), '07 black EX250F Posts: A lot.
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Quote:
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July 3rd, 2014, 01:23 AM | #7 |
Phoenix Salvage
Name: Mac
Location: AR
Join Date: May 2014 Motorcycle(s): 2007 Ninja 250R Posts: 71
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If you don't know when the valves were last adjusted, its time for a check/adjustment.
symptoms for either issue include erratic idle, poor throttle response, engine speed racing or hunting after a quick rev, or stalling at lower rpm. I generally make sure the carbs are synced anytime the tank is off, as once you have a gauge - either purchased or homemade, its a sub 5 minute check and gives the ease of mind of knowing everything is just right.
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July 4th, 2014, 03:05 PM | #8 |
Daily Jap rider
Name: Lance
Location: La Porte
Join Date: Dec 2012 Motorcycle(s): 2012 Ninja 250r Posts: A lot.
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I know I am probably going to get an ear full, but I just hit 14k on my 2012 and still have not taken it in for first adjustment. Would do myself but it is a little past my expertise. I depend on my bike to commute to work, so if I take it apart and screw something up, I no worky. Kawi dealer told me to wait til about 15k till bringing it in for first one, says that it is a waste of money to come in any sooner than that unless it was making bad noise.
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July 7th, 2014, 04:53 AM | #9 | |
Long Time Rider
Name: Blue
Location: Charlotte, NC
Join Date: Sep 2010 Motorcycle(s): 2009 Kawasaki Ninja 250R Posts: A lot.
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Quote:
Poor idle is a give-away of valves being out of adjustment. Poor throttle response is a sign you may need a carb sync. If you don't know when the last valve adjustment was done, you should have one done. |
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July 7th, 2014, 06:27 AM | #10 | |
ninjette.org member
Name: John
Location: Milford, CT
Join Date: Mar 2014 Motorcycle(s): 2003 Ninja 250r Posts: 212
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Quote:
Poor idle is a give-away of valves being out of adjustment. My idle is very steady with no missing or hesitation of any kind. The problem is the idle will sit at 1500, 1800, 2000 rpms and sometimes it just drops below 1000 rpms and stalls. Sometimes it drops to 1000 rpms and doesn't stall and picks itself up to 1800 rpms on its own. If I blip the throttle right before it stalls it will generally sit at around 1800 rpms very steady. Poor throttle response is a sign you may need a carb sync. Throttle response is excellent. Crisp with no issues at all. I checked the carbs yesterday and they were sync'd perfectly. |
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July 13th, 2014, 01:07 AM | #11 |
ninjette.org guru
Name: xorbe
Location: Bay Area, CA
Join Date: Jun 2013 Motorcycle(s): N650 (and others) Posts: 408
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Yeah my used bike needed full choke and idled terrible until I did the valve adjustments at 7K miles.
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July 13th, 2014, 10:32 PM | #12 |
Grouchy Old Squid
Name: Joe
Location: Clinton, Ar.
Join Date: Apr 2014 Motorcycle(s): 2006 Ninja 250, 1993 Yamaha FJ 1200 ABS, 1990 Yamaha FJ 1200, 2014 Can Am Spyder RT-S Posts: 37
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Probably the first time
I just finished adjusting the valves and changed the coolant on my son's 2006 Ninja. We bought it with 18,200 miles, I'm going to go out on a limb and say that they have probably never been checked before. All the clearances were below the minimums. I really hope there are no burnt valves on this bike. I hope to get it fired up tomorrow and see how well it runs.
Joe |
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July 14th, 2014, 11:00 AM | #13 |
ninjette.org member
Name: John
Location: Milford, CT
Join Date: Mar 2014 Motorcycle(s): 2003 Ninja 250r Posts: 212
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Where can I get the feeler gauge to adjust the valves? Do I need any replacement gaskets when doing it? I need to be totally prepared before I tear it apart.
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July 14th, 2014, 11:08 AM | #14 | |
ninjette.org guru
Name: Vlad
Location: Weaverville, NC
Join Date: Jul 2014 Motorcycle(s): 2011 Ninja 250R (Sold), 2015 Rocky Mountain Soul (Runs on fat) Posts: 404
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July 14th, 2014, 11:30 AM | #15 |
Grouchy Old Squid
Name: Joe
Location: Clinton, Ar.
Join Date: Apr 2014 Motorcycle(s): 2006 Ninja 250, 1993 Yamaha FJ 1200 ABS, 1990 Yamaha FJ 1200, 2014 Can Am Spyder RT-S Posts: 37
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If you don't have a service manual, this link will give you all the guidance you will need. http://faq.ninja250.org/wiki/How_do_..._the_valves%3F As far as where to get feeler gauges, any auto parts store will have them as well as Sears, Lowes, Fastenal or your nearest industrial supply house. Don't buy the bent tip feeler gauges that are sold as tappet gauges or some such thing, most of those do not have the thinner sizes you need to adjust the valves on a 250 Ninja. You shouldn't need any gaskets unless your Ninja has a ton of miles. Just be patient and take your time, there is not a lot of room in the top of the head if your hands are large. I say be patient because the adjuster screw will want to tighten down when you tighten up the locknut. just observe what is happening and make a correction, I found that I had to set the clearance looser than I wanted then it would tighten up as the locknut was tightened. I think I will be buying the Kawasaki valve adjustment tool before I do the valves again. I took the radiator entirely out, just because I wanted to wash it out to remove the mud and bugs.
Joe |
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July 14th, 2014, 11:59 AM | #16 |
Daily Jap rider
Name: Lance
Location: La Porte
Join Date: Dec 2012 Motorcycle(s): 2012 Ninja 250r Posts: A lot.
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I am taking my bike in tomorrow morning for its first adjustment at 14k. Going to cost a lot, hopefully I can learn enough to do it my self next time. Will see how she runs when I get her back. I think they might be a little tight due to having to full choke it and hit starter for about 6-10 seconds before she fires up, and thats with it being 95 degrees out.
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July 14th, 2014, 12:03 PM | #17 | |
CPT Falcon
Name: J.Emmett Turner
Location: Newnan, GA
Join Date: Apr 2009 Motorcycle(s): '08 CP Blue EX250J, '97 unpainted EX250F, 2nd '97 unpainted EX250F (no engine), '07 black EX250F Posts: A lot.
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July 14th, 2014, 12:23 PM | #18 |
Grouchy Old Squid
Name: Joe
Location: Clinton, Ar.
Join Date: Apr 2014 Motorcycle(s): 2006 Ninja 250, 1993 Yamaha FJ 1200 ABS, 1990 Yamaha FJ 1200, 2014 Can Am Spyder RT-S Posts: 37
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Ahhh..... I missed that little detail
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July 14th, 2014, 12:49 PM | #19 |
ninjette.org guru
Name: xorbe
Location: Bay Area, CA
Join Date: Jun 2013 Motorcycle(s): N650 (and others) Posts: 408
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July 14th, 2014, 01:55 PM | #20 |
Grouchy Old Squid
Name: Joe
Location: Clinton, Ar.
Join Date: Apr 2014 Motorcycle(s): 2006 Ninja 250, 1993 Yamaha FJ 1200 ABS, 1990 Yamaha FJ 1200, 2014 Can Am Spyder RT-S Posts: 37
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Well, yeah, I was thinking that too.....
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July 14th, 2014, 09:20 PM | #21 |
Grouchy Old Squid
Name: Joe
Location: Clinton, Ar.
Join Date: Apr 2014 Motorcycle(s): 2006 Ninja 250, 1993 Yamaha FJ 1200 ABS, 1990 Yamaha FJ 1200, 2014 Can Am Spyder RT-S Posts: 37
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Got the Ninja fired up tonight, it sounds pretty good with the Muzzy system on it, if not a little loud. Going to sync the carbs in the morning and put the rest of the plastic back on it. I have a feeling that the jetting may need some work, but that remains to be determined.
Joe |
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