August 31st, 2015, 09:14 PM | #1 |
ninjette.org newbie
Name: Johnny
Location: So Dak
Join Date: Aug 2015 Motorcycle(s): 1995 EX250,1978 XS650, 2008 FZ6, 1977 CB550f Posts: 2
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Two Stroke Ninjette!
Ninjette purists be warned!
Hey all, I'm new to this forum and also to ninjette ownership. I registered here so I can get some insight and hopefully give you guys access to any solidworks files I create. To start things off, here's my plan. I recently bought a '95 250f and am planning to put a kx250 two stroke motor in it, along with doing some performance upgrades and modifications to the suspension and brakes. I'm going for an ultra light, high power/weight ratio city ripper that's built for the track and not very street legal. Some things I've started on is removing anything that is not absolutely essential for the build, which basically left me with the frame, suspension, brakes, tank, and wheels. I'm currently working on a CNC top yoke, which looks doooope and should be done this week. Here's some photos of the build thus far! |
2 out of 2 members found this post helpful. |
August 31st, 2015, 09:15 PM | #2 |
The Corner Whisperer
Name: Chris (aka Reactor)
Location: Northern KY
Join Date: May 2011 Motorcycle(s): 2010 250 (track), 1992 250, 2006 R6 (street/track), 2008 R6 (track) Posts: Too much.
MOTY 2015, MOTM - Nov '12, Nov '13
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Welcome Johnny!
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Goal: Shake A Million Hands | Look through the corners | Track Day Prep | Closest track? | The Mid-Ohio School |
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August 31st, 2015, 09:26 PM | #3 |
Participant
Name: Dave
Location: South of Seattle
Join Date: Oct 2012 Motorcycle(s): '94 K75 std Posts: Too much.
MOTM - Aug '15
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Welcome and good luck!
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August 31st, 2015, 11:58 PM | #4 |
ChocolateMilk Addict
Name: Maurice
Location: McDonough
Join Date: Mar 2015 Motorcycle(s): '05 EX-250 "Kallie" 85 KLT 110 ATC "Murdock" Posts: 329
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Sub'd, i need to see this happen for myself, good luck with the build and post alotta pics!!! (i like pics....alot)
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September 1st, 2015, 06:02 AM | #5 |
ninjette.org dude
Name: 1 guess :-)
Location: SF Bay Area
Join Date: Jun 2008 Motorcycle(s): '13 Ninja 300 (white, the fastest color!), '13 R1200RT, '14 CRF250L, '12 TT-R125LE Posts: Too much.
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@TheDuck started to put one of these together awhile back...
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September 1st, 2015, 06:27 AM | #6 |
Fighting Texas Aggie '05
Name: Neil
Location: Hutto, TX
Join Date: Feb 2009 Motorcycle(s): '07 ZX6R, '08 Versys, '09 250R Track, '93 F2/F3 Track Posts: A lot.
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can't wait to see it turn out ..... howdy and welcome!!!!!
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September 1st, 2015, 06:33 AM | #7 |
ninjette.org certified postwhore
Name: Eric
Location: Iowa City
Join Date: May 2009 Motorcycle(s): 2008 Kawmeracchi 350 2010 Project X Posts: A lot.
Blog Entries: 54
MOTM - Sep '18, Feb '16
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As a purest of the 250 ninja. I am so offended by this blasphemy. The ninja is like a vintage Car. They should be restored to factory condition.
I for shame.
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Top speed 123.369mph. Ohio mile Worlds fastest 250 ninja |
1 out of 1 members found this post helpful. |
September 1st, 2015, 06:42 AM | #8 |
dirty boy
Name: Joe
Location: Johnstown, PA
Join Date: Sep 2012 Motorcycle(s): I don't even know anymore?? Posts: A lot.
MOTM - Apr '14
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gearing is going to be tight. Not sure if any of the various kawi trannies would swap into the kx? sprocket changes alone will only get you so far. Would be fun around town at least.
With the narrow engine, how off center will the engine have to be mounted to get sprockets aligned? assume you will fabricate a cradle, well and lots of other things? There was a similar bike posted up a while back, it was a cr250 motor though... I think. I will hunt for it later. Found it. https://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=187632 Well enjoy the build, good luck, look forward to see what you end up doing
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I love the smell of burning pre-mix in the morning I don't think I'm a lot dumber than you thought that I think that I thought I was once. |
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September 1st, 2015, 06:51 AM | #9 |
ninjette.org certified postwhore
Name: Eric
Location: Iowa City
Join Date: May 2009 Motorcycle(s): 2008 Kawmeracchi 350 2010 Project X Posts: A lot.
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I have seen a number of land speed racers try to use dirt bike engines. The gearing is not good for top speed that's for sure. Rebel gears can make any gear you want for sprocket changes so you will be close. It seems like there is little difference between first and third.
Do you have the engine yet?
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Top speed 123.369mph. Ohio mile Worlds fastest 250 ninja |
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September 1st, 2015, 07:06 AM | #10 |
Rev Limiter
Name: Jay
Location: WI
Join Date: Jul 2013 Motorcycle(s): '06 SV650n, '00 Derbi GPR, '64 CA77 Dream 305, '70 CL450 Scrambler, numerous dirt bikes Posts: A lot.
MOTM - Jun '18, Oct '16
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Go for it!
I love the idea of having a street 2-stroke (I've had RDs, RZs, and have a Derbi). My dream bike/ultimate project is a 125 or 250 2-stroke street bike in a trick chassis (aluminum frame, inverted forks etc) The issue that I see is the lack of reasonable engine mounting points availabe with the Ninja's frame. Not saying it can't be done, but there isn't a lot to work with for mounts for the smaller 2-stroke engine. Keep us informed. |
1 out of 1 members found this post helpful. |
September 1st, 2015, 07:39 AM | #11 |
dirty boy
Name: Joe
Location: Johnstown, PA
Join Date: Sep 2012 Motorcycle(s): I don't even know anymore?? Posts: A lot.
MOTM - Apr '14
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If I was to do a project bike with a 2t dirtbike thumper I would go as big of a bore as I could get my hands on. 300 or higher, preferably or maybe a 250 with a BB kit, so 295 or something of the likes. But not for the power, the rebuild intervals for the top end get way longer the larger bore you go.
A 125 mxer top end screaming on the street wouldn't last 20hrs, you could probably get over 50hrs on a 300 if you were screaming on it a good bit. Hard to say.
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I love the smell of burning pre-mix in the morning I don't think I'm a lot dumber than you thought that I think that I thought I was once. |
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September 1st, 2015, 11:31 AM | #12 |
ninjette.org newbie
Name: Johnny
Location: So Dak
Join Date: Aug 2015 Motorcycle(s): 1995 EX250,1978 XS650, 2008 FZ6, 1977 CB550f Posts: 2
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Today I almost finished the top yoke. I have a bit of drilling, tapping and bead blasting to do, but other than that I'm really happy with it! Gotta love engineering schools, CNC = the cats PJ's. Anybody interested in the .SLDPRT files let me know.
As far as engine mounts go... I will probably use the lower part of the frame from my donor MX bike (that I'm about to buy) so that I know the stock exhaust will fit. From there i'll mill out some new mounts, do some welding and eventually I think I'll get a pretty good fit. Gearing- I know I'll be pushing the limits of what rear sprockets are available for ninjas and what front sprockets are available for kx's, but I think I can get pretty close. At least they both run the same chain! Also, I don't plan on taking it above, say, 75 mph so I think shorter gearing will be okay for around town. Tires- What do you track guys run? I'll be sticking with the 110 and 130 16's, I just need sticky tires that don't necessarily have to wear well. I know the Avon scooter tires are cool looking, anybody ever run those? Suspension- Here is where I need plenty of info. What do you guys use? I think I'm going to install valve emulators and new springs, but as far as rear suspension swaps go, whats the inside scoop? Thanks so much for your input! |
1 out of 1 members found this post helpful. |
September 1st, 2015, 07:55 PM | #13 | |
EX500 full of EX250 parts
Name: Bill
Location: Grand Rapids-ish, MI
Join Date: Jul 2012 Motorcycle(s): '18 Ninja 400 • '09 Ninja 500R (selling) • '98 VFR800 (project) • '85 Vulcan VN700 (sold) Posts: A lot.
Blog Entries: 1
MOTM - Aug '15
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Quote:
Check out Ricor Intiminators too. They cost a little more than emulators, but I think they're a much more sophisticated solution. https://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=186192 I haven't seen a whole lot of detail on rear spring rates. With a bit of DIY work, you can swap in a GSX-R shock. https://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=170747 I'm not sure how similar/interchangeable the shocks/springs are, but there are a variety of spring rates available on different years/sizes. The shock itself, while not designed for the Ninja, seems to work well for a lot of people and provides a lot of adjustment options, for quite cheap.
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*** Unregistered, I'm not your mom and I'm not paying for your parts, so do whatever you want with your own bike. *** |
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September 10th, 2015, 11:48 AM | #14 |
Lostcause enthusiast
Name: Graham
Location: Austin, TX
Join Date: Jan 2015 Motorcycle(s): 2000 EX250F Posts: 178
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This is an awesome project, i've had the same thought and might go the same direction if I pop my motor.
The KDX or WR enduro motors have wider ratio transmissions than their motorcross brethren, if you don't already have an engine look for one of them. Also torquier porting and better service interval. The other option for an engine swap would be the banshee motor, the 350cc two stroke twin descended from the RD350, 50-60 hp, that would be a blast, although it might be too much power for the ninja's suspension. |
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September 18th, 2015, 06:33 AM | #15 | |
ninjette.org guru
Name: Jesse
Location: Maryville, TN
Join Date: Nov 2012 Motorcycle(s): Ugly 89 frankenstien special ex250, and the "Zooks" : 1982 GS450 and 1979 GS1000 Posts: 327
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Quote:
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Oh god the bikes are multiplying!!! |
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September 18th, 2015, 07:59 AM | #16 |
Rev Limiter
Name: Jay
Location: WI
Join Date: Jul 2013 Motorcycle(s): '06 SV650n, '00 Derbi GPR, '64 CA77 Dream 305, '70 CL450 Scrambler, numerous dirt bikes Posts: A lot.
MOTM - Jun '18, Oct '16
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September 18th, 2015, 09:03 AM | #17 |
ninjette.org guru
Name: Jesse
Location: Maryville, TN
Join Date: Nov 2012 Motorcycle(s): Ugly 89 frankenstien special ex250, and the "Zooks" : 1982 GS450 and 1979 GS1000 Posts: 327
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Actually we looked into that, at least in the state of MI you have to get lights, horn, etc all working (steal the charging system and harness off a KLX?), then make an appointment to have it inspected to make sure it meets all the requirements to be street legal. My brother was looking at tagging his kx500 to make a trip out of taking trails from lake Huron to lake Michigan a couple years ago. It'd be an undertaking but not too bad.
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Oh god the bikes are multiplying!!! |
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September 21st, 2015, 05:30 PM | #18 |
dirty boy
Name: Joe
Location: Johnstown, PA
Join Date: Sep 2012 Motorcycle(s): I don't even know anymore?? Posts: A lot.
MOTM - Apr '14
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plating custom 2smoke conversion bikes can be pretty easy, it really depends on the state you plan on plating it more than anything. Here in PA i could plate just about any bike with out much fuss, plating a homemade trailer or even a store bought trailer with out proper documentation on the other hand... forget it. lol
@kxpower? I would definitely go the sumo route with any 500cc 2t over throwing the engine in a sport bike frame. It is just so much easier and would be more rewarding fun wise. Those BB 2ts have a great hit with the stock short gearing which is what makes them so much fun doing what they do best and that is being hooligan machines. Put the motor in a much heavier frame it just wouldnt be quite the same and you would have to drop some different gears in the tranny to make it feel right in that kind of setup IMO Plus those motors alone even in not the best shape go for $1k+ all day long and most people think a whole bike is worth a small fortune when it is actually only worth the motor for the most part unless it is mint original. Parts can be tricky to find as well Like someone else mentioned, a banshee motor is a much better option for a sport bike conversions. So much aftermarket stuff available for them and again like someone mentioned they are damn near identical to the rz350's of the mid 80's which means there are lots of parts available to make it comfortable on the street, gearing, tranny, ect... yet still has that 2t hit. Banshee motors can be had for around $1k give or take, even some built ones for a little more, they can be a little costly to build as you are buying double everything, pipes, carbs, reeds ect... ask me how i know i am curious to what a 250 2t would feel like in a ninja?? they are great for dirtbikes, but the entire bike only weighs 210lbs add another 100 easy and i am not sure if it would still be the arm ripper they are in the dirtbike frame. + again the whole gearing thing, you would run through the gears really quick on any road. Even with a wr wide ratio tranny
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I love the smell of burning pre-mix in the morning I don't think I'm a lot dumber than you thought that I think that I thought I was once. |
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September 22nd, 2015, 08:48 AM | #19 | |
ninjette.org certified postwhore
Name: Spooph
Location: Golden, CO
Join Date: Jul 2010 Motorcycle(s): '08 Ninja 250R Posts: A lot.
MOTM - Oct '15
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Quote:
Sub'd for the build!
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April 25th, 2016, 06:04 PM | #20 |
ninjette.org certified postwhore
Name: Ryan
Location: Beaufort SC
Join Date: Aug 2015 Motorcycle(s): 05 Ninja 250, 04 KTM 625 SMC, 01 Xc250 Posts: A lot.
Blog Entries: 3
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So what ever happened to this? @JohnnyH
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Because Unregistered sucks at riding. |
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April 25th, 2016, 07:00 PM | #21 |
ninjette.org certified postwhore
Name: Eric
Location: Iowa City
Join Date: May 2009 Motorcycle(s): 2008 Kawmeracchi 350 2010 Project X Posts: A lot.
Blog Entries: 54
MOTM - Sep '18, Feb '16
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He has not been around since late September. I do hope he is still working on the project. I was hoping to see it.
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Top speed 123.369mph. Ohio mile Worlds fastest 250 ninja |
1 out of 1 members found this post helpful. |
May 23rd, 2016, 05:56 AM | #22 |
ninjette.org dude
Name: 1 guess :-)
Location: SF Bay Area
Join Date: Jun 2008 Motorcycle(s): '13 Ninja 300 (white, the fastest color!), '13 R1200RT, '14 CRF250L, '12 TT-R125LE Posts: Too much.
Blog Entries: 7
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Me as well!
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Montgomery Street Motorcycle Club / cal24.com / crf250l.org / ninjette.org ninjette.org Terms of Service Shopping for motorcycle parts or equipment? Come here first. The friendliest Ninja 250R/300/400 forum on the internet! (especially Unregistered) |
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June 12th, 2016, 09:47 PM | #23 |
ninjette.org member
Name: Scotty
Location: Brantford,ONT,Canada
Join Date: Jun 2010 Motorcycle(s): CBR Fireblade, KTM 950SM, YZF750 (x2), R6, ZZR250, XR200, KTM 50SX Sr.Pro, Honda Spree Posts: 41
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I clicked this thread hoping to see someone try to stuff an RZ 350 motor into a Ninjette
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June 13th, 2016, 04:25 AM | #24 |
ninjette.org certified postwhore
Name: Eric
Location: Iowa City
Join Date: May 2009 Motorcycle(s): 2008 Kawmeracchi 350 2010 Project X Posts: A lot.
Blog Entries: 54
MOTM - Sep '18, Feb '16
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I poked around to see if that would work.
Basicly I found a couple things. First there are a very small number of real RZ or TZ engines around. The Banshee engine is the same but the internal gearing is very different. The exhaust would a big deal to make and fit. At least a proper tune pipe system from a banshee would be. The basic thing is to build a cradle to fit the engine and hold it in place in the ninja frame. Then fit the rest. It is another buy a 600 moment when you add it up. But the bark of the banshee is very cool.
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Top speed 123.369mph. Ohio mile Worlds fastest 250 ninja |
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June 13th, 2016, 02:46 PM | #25 |
Rev Limiter
Name: Jay
Location: WI
Join Date: Jul 2013 Motorcycle(s): '06 SV650n, '00 Derbi GPR, '64 CA77 Dream 305, '70 CL450 Scrambler, numerous dirt bikes Posts: A lot.
MOTM - Jun '18, Oct '16
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June 14th, 2016, 04:16 AM | #26 |
ninjette.org certified postwhore
Name: Eric
Location: Iowa City
Join Date: May 2009 Motorcycle(s): 2008 Kawmeracchi 350 2010 Project X Posts: A lot.
Blog Entries: 54
MOTM - Sep '18, Feb '16
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When I looked into building a race bike. I looked for a ZZR250 frame . I wanted to build a ninja 250 turbo and wanted the aluminum frame. The other day I spotted a Suzuki SV 650 with the tank off.
If you want to build somthing using a twin cylinder engine . I would suggest looking at that frame. Because it's a V twin it is narrow. But if you are tall like 6 foot. It will fit nice. Or if you want to mount a turbo charger with an intercooler or long expansion chambers like a 350 two stroke engine there is plenty of room. I can see a banshee engine with twin chambers under the seat. Vintage road race fairings working out very well.
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Top speed 123.369mph. Ohio mile Worlds fastest 250 ninja |
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June 14th, 2016, 06:37 PM | #27 | |
dirty boy
Name: Joe
Location: Johnstown, PA
Join Date: Sep 2012 Motorcycle(s): I don't even know anymore?? Posts: A lot.
MOTM - Apr '14
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Quote:
Most people wouldn't waste their time putting an rz350 engine in an n250, people do far more interesting things to the stock rz frame for less work and $
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I love the smell of burning pre-mix in the morning I don't think I'm a lot dumber than you thought that I think that I thought I was once. |
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June 14th, 2016, 07:21 PM | #28 | |
ninjette.org certified postwhore
Name: Ryan
Location: Beaufort SC
Join Date: Aug 2015 Motorcycle(s): 05 Ninja 250, 04 KTM 625 SMC, 01 Xc250 Posts: A lot.
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Quote:
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Because Unregistered sucks at riding. |
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June 15th, 2016, 05:04 AM | #29 |
dirty boy
Name: Joe
Location: Johnstown, PA
Join Date: Sep 2012 Motorcycle(s): I don't even know anymore?? Posts: A lot.
MOTM - Apr '14
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^ Just gotta keep an eye out and also know where to look, they are around. If you live close to Canada you could probably get a nice Canadian one for a good price, they are not uncommon up North, some rz hoarders in them there parts as well lol
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I love the smell of burning pre-mix in the morning I don't think I'm a lot dumber than you thought that I think that I thought I was once. |
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