Weird Rattling Noise From Engine At Startup When Cold

[Jamspack]

Hello everyone, I have a 2007 Ninja EX250r with about 1600 miles on it. I have noticed that upon startup when the engine is cold I hear an odd rattling and ticking noise that sounds like its coming from the lower end of the engine (it almost sounds like marbles rattling around) that eventually goes away as the engine warms up. This typically only happens when it is 40 degrees outside or colder. I recently changed the oil and that didn't make the sound change much. Let me know if anyone has experienced anything similar to this, and sorry if it has already been talked about in previous threads, I couldn't seem to find much! Thanks for the help!

[taz]

A video with it running will go a long ways with helping determine the problem/noise.

[Motofool]

Welcome, James !!!

Cold noises like that mainly come from the cam/valves and and cam chain.

Have you serviced those recently?

[Triple Jim]

Does it change when pulling in the clutch lever?

[jkv45]

What oil are you using?

How long does it take to go away?

[Jamspack]

I haven't recently serviced the cam/valves and cam chain. At what mileage marker do those typically need service? Like I mentioned earlier the bike only has just over 1600 miles on it.
The rattling doesn't change at all when pulling in the clutch, and it usually takes 3 or 4 minutes to completely go away. I am running Shell Rotella T6 5W-40.

[Motofool]

Originally Posted by Jamspack

I haven't recently serviced the cam/valves and cam chain. At what mileage marker do those typically need service? Like I mentioned earlier the bike only has just over 1600 miles on it.
.......

Valves should have been adjusted after the first 500 miles, then at 6000.
For a bike that was manufactured 10 years ago, rolling only 160 miles per year, I would suggest a full service:

http://faq.ninja250.org/wiki/Service_Schedule

I would first remove, clean and lubricate the cam tensioner, caring of not rotating the engine.

[Jamspack]

Okay good to know. When I bought the bike from my neighbor back in August of last year had 98 miles on it so it sat for a LONG time. I changed out the spark plugs coolant and have done oil changes at the intervals that were suggested, but no other service has been done. What else is usually involved in a full service, and how much would I usually expect to pay if I just take it to a mechanic somewhere?

[jkv45]

Originally Posted by Jamspack

I haven't recently serviced the cam/valves and cam chain. At what mileage marker do those typically need service? Like I mentioned earlier the bike only has just over 1600 miles on it.
The rattling doesn't change at all when pulling in the clutch, and it usually takes 3 or 4 minutes to completely go away. I am running Shell Rotella T6 5W-40.

OK - then you are good and it's not an oil-related problem.

[Motofool]

Originally Posted by Jamspack

..........What else is usually involved in a full service, and how much would I usually expect to pay if I just take it to a mechanic somewhere?

Click on the links within that link and they will take you through the process step by step.

You must decide whether you have the money to use the expensive and rarely detailed services of a shop or if you have the time, tools and place to do the periodic works yourself.

[Jamspack]

Originally Posted by taz

A video with it running will go a long ways with helping determine the problem/noise.

Here is a video I was able to get this morning. Sorry its kinda hard to hear the ticking. You can hear a ticking from the lower part of the engine, but it's louder in person. I have noticed that when it gets colder the rattling/ticking is more frequent and also louder.

https://youtu.be/1tBv2l9-BKg

[Triple Jim]

"This video is unavailable"

[Jamspack]

Originally Posted by Triple Jim

"This video is unavailable"

Sorry, had it set as private. Should work now.

[Triple Jim]

Yes, I can watch the video now, and I hear the noise. Huh. Mine doesn't do that.

Sorry, I don't have any good ideas, but I bet some of the guys with more years on a 250 do. My only wild guess would be a flapping cam chain, but I don't know why that would go away when the engine is warm.

[jkv45]

Originally Posted by Jamspack

Here is a video I was able to get this morning. Sorry its kinda hard to hear the ticking. You can hear a ticking from the lower part of the engine, but it's louder in person. I have noticed that when it gets colder the rattling/ticking is more frequent and also louder.

https://youtu.be/1tBv2l9-BKg

Why is it running so fast?

I think you need to get it fully warm and set the idle mixture and idle speed to 1300.

Once it starts, keep it about 2000 or 2500 until you can back the choke off and it will idle normally. If the carbs are adjusted (and synced) properly it won't need too much choke for too long when cold.

I didn't hear the noise you were referring to.

[Triple Jim]

He had it idling normally for a short time, but apparently sped it back up to make the noise happen.

[Jamspack]

This was a completely cold start and I had the choke on. The bike idles at about 1300 rpm when it is fully warmed up with the choke off.

[Motofool]

Originally Posted by Jamspack

This was a completely cold start and I had the choke on. The bike idles at about 1300 rpm when it is fully warmed up with the choke off.

Moderate the choke application after the engine starts up: high rpm's when cold are not healthy.

Please, read this:
http://faq.ninja250.org/wiki/What_is..._at_startup%3F

[Jamspack]

I don't normally idle it that high when I start up the bike, I try to keep it under 3000, I was just trying to film the noise and adjust the choke a little with my left hand at the same time.

[taz]

back to the noise subject it does sound like cam chain slap.

[Jamspack]

Originally Posted by taz

back to the noise subject it does sound like cam chain slap.

So would cam chain slap be caused by the cam chain tensioner not doing its job, or would it be caused by damage to the cam chain, or something else?

[taz]

it could be ether, the chain could be bad or the tensioner could be worn or even a combo of both. start with the tensioner and checking that it moves freely and full movement.

[Jamspack]

Originally Posted by taz

it could be ether, the chain could be bad or the tensioner could be worn or even a combo of both. start with the tensioner and checking that it moves freely and full movement.

Alright I think I will start there. Thanks for the advice.

[juliusmichaelhonrada]

try pulling the clutch and see if it goes away

[Triple Jim]

Originally Posted by juliusmichaelhonrada

try pulling the clutch and see if it goes away

In post #6 he said it makes no difference.

[juliusmichaelhonrada]

Ooops . *hides in the corner*

[Triple Jim]

No one is immune to speed reading.

[greg737]

An old standard "do-it-yourself" driveway mechanic diagnostic check:

If the noise you're hearing is matched perfectly to the RPM of the engine, then it's a problem in the crankshaft/connecting rods/pistons area of the engine.

If the noise you're hearing is less than the RPM of the engine, then it's a top-end issue (because the valve train rotates at 1/2 crankshaft speed).

Getting a "Mechanic's Stethoscope" from Harbor Freight (dirt cheap!) will make it much easier to locate the exact source of the noise.

[Alex]

And if you step away from the bike and the noise doesn't get softer, it may not be the bike at all.