Commercial vehicle petition- US129

[TheJimmyEnglish]

Thought I would share this link for a petition against semi-trucks using US129(Deals Gap)


http://www.change.org/petitions/ikes-law-restrict-use-of-us-highway-129-to-non-commercial-vehicles

[caps]

Do you realize how important that road is for truckers?
Have you thought about how much this could impact the prices of several goods that are regularly transported on that road?

[TXJ]

This is like a snowball rolling downhill. It only gets worse. It's horrible that someone lost their life on this road to a semi, but banning them isn't the answer. Not to sound like a a-hole, but that's the name of the game when you're riding roads like this. There are always risks. Motorcycles crash into motorcycles, cars, trucks and vice versa..

I've rode this road before, last I remember the speed limit is 35 for the whole distance. Most riders take corners at 50+, pass on blind corners and treat this road like it's their personal track. Not saying that was the case, but it doesn't weigh very well in the voice of concerned motorcyclists trying to implement a safety precaution...

[bdavison]

Signed.

There are plenty of other routes that the trucks can take which are safer both to themselves, and to other motorists on the roads. If you've never been on the dragon, then you just dont know. Semi trucks have no business on that road, it is almost UNNAVIGATEABLE by semis. There is NO semi that can run that road without crossing into oncoming traffic lanes, taking up runoff shoulders, and endangering others. In many cases the trucks have too come to a complete stop, and back up to shimmy their way through some of the corners.

[TnNinjaGirl]

Signed. Ill pay $.50 extra for my Doritos to help save my life. After all those Doritos are no good if you are dead.

[TheJimmyEnglish]

Originally Posted by caps

Do you realize how important that road is for truckers?
Have you thought about how much this could impact the prices of several goods that are regularly transported on that road?

I'm not the one who started the petition only passing it on. For one most of the businesses through there take their supplies by box truck which is a 6 wheel vehicle. The 18 wheeled vehicles cannot navigate these turns even at 35 mph without cruising lanes which makes them even more dangerous not only for motorcyclist but other vehicles and themselves. My brother drives a commercial vehicle and he signed the petition. As bdavison said their are plenty of routes for them to take without being on this section of road.

[caps]

wont this affect the funding to maintain the road as well?

[TheJimmyEnglish]

Originally Posted by caps

wont this affect the funding to maintain the road as well?

Not likely. The local business there mainly use box trucks for there supplies. Not much of an effect from stopping the commercials. I've almost been hit quite a few times through there by semi's and I can tell you I do not speed through those corners on the stock tires. Not everyone uses the road as a race track. Their are still responsible riders out there.

[caps]

Originally Posted by TheJimmyEnglish

Not likely. The local business there mainly use box trucks for there supplies. Not much of an effect from stopping the commercials. I've almost been hit quite a few times through there by semi's and I can tell you I do not speed through those corners on the stock tires. Not everyone uses the road as a race track. Their are still responsible riders out there.

yea but you are asking for a road the is maintained by the government to limit what can drive on it.

[TheJimmyEnglish]

Their are lots of roads just like US129 that have already restricted use to non commercial vehicles only and they're doing just fine if not better.

[Jinx250]

Originally Posted by caps

wont this affect the funding to maintain the road as well?

Everyone keeps throwing that out there, like all of a sudden some magical chunk of money from the feds is going to disappear. Even if the feds reduced by some small percentage the amount of "highway funds" given to the state for road maintenance, there will be a lot less required maintenance on the road, since the traffic won't be 10K + pound vehicles.

There are any number of simialr roads that have banned semi trucks from using them. Shockingly, they are still open nad well maintained. Any loss of funds from the feds will liekly be negligible, since that partiuclar road is one of many many roads for which the state receives federal money.

[caps]

Originally Posted by Jinx250

Any loss of funds from the feds will likely be negligible, since that particular road is one of many many roads for which the state receives federal money.

This makes a lot of sense.

[Bill N]

Originally Posted by TheJimmyEnglish

Their are lots of roads just like US129 that have already restricted use to non commercial vehicles only and they're doing just fine if not better.

You got that right. Check out I think 221 into Blowing Rock...restrictd to max vehicle length of 28 ft. I've encounterd such road restrictions on several twisty roads. On the Dragon, simi's take up well over half the other lane on some curves. Should have been restricted years ago. Bill

[bettysmith]

Originally Posted by TXJ

This is like a snowball rolling downhill. It only gets worse. It's horrible that someone lost their life on this road to a semi, but banning them isn't the answer. Not to sound like a a-hole, but that's the name of the game when you're riding roads like this. There are always risks. Motorcycles crash into motorcycles, cars, trucks and vice versa..

I've rode this road before, last I remember the speed limit is 35 for the whole distance. Most riders take corners at 50+, pass on blind corners and treat this road like it's their personal track. Not saying that was the case, but it doesn't weigh very well in the voice of concerned motorcyclists trying to implement a safety precaution...

Vehicles that are unable to maintain their lane shouldn't be allowed to use said road. It is not that the drivers aren't capable, it's that their machines aren't.

Motorcyclists aren't the only ones affected by truckers unable to maintain lane position on this road.

[CZroe]

Originally Posted by TheJimmyEnglish

Not likely. The local business there mainly use box trucks for their supplies. Not much of an effect from stopping the commercials. I've almost been hit quite a few times through there by semi's and I can tell you I do not speed through those corners on the stock tires. Not everyone uses the road as a race track. There are still responsible riders out there.

The ol' switcheroo.

Bonus points for using "effect" correctly.

I just wanted to point out that even box trucks are usually commercial. Granted, the ones passing through are usually on a long haul and aren't servicing locally. It wouldn't make sense to split the load up in box trucks and combine it back together to continue the haul. If there truly are decent alternatives then someone needs to update their GPS software!

[bdavison]

There are no less than three alternative routes...

If going south,
I75 South, which is a interstate.
There is also I40, and I26 that go southeast.


If going southeast, Hwy 441, has already banned semi trucks, and it isnt nearly as hazardous for them as the Dragon. They are banned because of the hippie tree huggers as it goes through a National Forest.

There are already signs on the Dragon warning semi trucks about the dangers BEFORE they get on the road. Once they enter the road, there is NO turning back, they have to go all the way down it as there is NO place to turn around. There are many of the curves in which a semi will bottom out the rear fender or pick a wheel off the ground because of the elevation changes in the corner.

I might go run it this weekend, Ill get pics if I do.

[Mountain Dew]

At first I thought this was just a "we want this road for ourselves" kinda deal. Then I read into the petition and clicked on the http://tailofthedragon.com/dragon_trucks.html link. Some of the pictures are absolutely ridiculous. Now, not only did I sign it, but I passed it on to my motorcycle group on Facebook.

[Reddoak]

Originally Posted by caps

Do you realize how important that road is for truckers?
Have you thought about how much this could impact the prices of several goods that are regularly transported on that road?

I've got a CDL, and used to drive 48' and 53' trailers over the road. I've also been through US 129 (not in a truck.) In my opinion, that road is not suitable for navigation by large commercial trucks. The radius on many turns is simply too tight for these vehicles to navigate safely. In addition, the dips and irregularities in the road surface may it possible for the center sections of large trailers to bottom out on the road, which damages the vehicle and the roads. Two and three axle straight trucks and combination vehicles with smaller trailers can navigate this route safely, albeit slowly.

There are plenty of restricted roads in rural areas. There are even more in some urban areas (I recall several low bridges in Chicago, for example.) Trucks simply use alternate routes. Riders and drivers on any road, even the Dragon, should not have to navigate around vehicles that are incapable of navigating a road without staying completely within their lane or damaging the road. It's not safe; even though the bikes are speeding, two wrongs make a dead rider, not a right.

[TheJimmyEnglish]

Originally Posted by Mountain Dew

At first I thought this was just a "we want this road for ourselves" kinda deal. Then I read into the petition and clicked on the http://tailofthedragon.com/dragon_trucks.html link. Some of the pictures are absolutely ridiculous. Now, not only did I sign it, but I passed it on to my motorcycle group on Facebook.

Thank you.

[ally99]

Originally Posted by Mountain Dew

At first I thought this was just a "we want this road for ourselves" kinda deal. Then I read into the petition and clicked on the http://tailofthedragon.com/dragon_trucks.html link. Some of the pictures are absolutely ridiculous. Now, not only did I sign it, but I passed it on to my motorcycle group on Facebook.

Thank you for opening your mind and doing some research before deciding how you felt about the issue. If only all would do the same...
There are MANY roads where 18-wheelers are not allowed, and somehow they make it to their destinations just fine. This stretch of 129 should absolutely be one of those roads. They just can NOT make some of these hairpin turns without blocking both lanes.

[ally99]

Thank GOD! It finally happened!!

[TnNinjaGirl]

[Bosgarage57]

It only happened on the NC side, coming from TN side its still legal........ It'll never truly be blocked from 18 wheelers.

[CC Cowboy]

If you sign this I hope you understand you just gave change.org all your personal information. If you don't know or agree with the politics of change.org you should investigate them before you sign.

[CZroe]

Originally Posted by CC Cowboy

If you sign this I hope you understand you just gave change.org all your personal information. If you don't know or agree with the politics of change.org you should investigate them before you sign.

This. I signed something due to AT&T throttling me with unlimited data and now I'm inundated with solicitations for causes that go against my values and beliefs.

[TnNinjaGirl]

I'm glad I signed it using someone elses info! :-)
Posted via Mobile Device

[alex.s]

i dont know if i can agree with this. i used to agree, but not anymore. public roads are for transportation, not sport. you want to ride fast, go to a track. when people crash because of not riding safely on public roads (by 'not riding safely', i mean riding faster than their vision and brakes allow. as in, if there happens to be a semi around that blind corner in the middle of the road and you cant stop in time, its too fast), the rest of the public shouldn't suffer consequences. yes, the dragon is a great road. there are tons of great roads. but you know what else is a great road? one that has tons of runoff, medical staff waiting to help you, and corner workers sitting waiting to warn anyone approaching if you screw up.

[Bosgarage57]

Alex its not really that we are "speeding," the limit is 35, and even going 35 its dangerous so MOST of us slow down. Unless you have the road memorized. The thing is, the 18 wheelers, or even campers can not travel the road without crossing the double yellow, thus causing injury and death.

[ally99]

Originally Posted by alex.s

i dont know if i can agree with this. i used to agree, but not anymore. public roads are for transportation, not sport. you want to ride fast, go to a track. when people crash because of not riding safely on public roads

Look, trucks are FORCED to break the law on that road. They can NOT make those hairpin turns without taking up BOTH lanes and the opposite pull-offs some times leaving you nowhere to go to get out of the way. Just look at Killboy pics for proof. If you can't take a road legally, you are a danger to all. One does not have to be speeding to get hurt or worse coming across an 18-wheeler in a blind corner. This benefits everyone...moms in minivans, bikers, and even the truckers themselves. I don't know many truckers who would take that road a 2nd time after the incredible difficulties they face on it. By the end, they are sweating like pigs. That is NOT an easy road and certainly not one that should be open to vehicles that can not take it without endangering others. That includes squid bikers who can't stay in their own lane. There are many, many mountain roads where trucks are not allowed because there are safer alternative routes. This is one of them. Have you ever been on this stretch of 129 yourself?

[Sinister]

/signed


After seeing this road in person there is no way a full sized truck and trailer can navigate it and still remain it its own lane.

[alex.s]

Originally Posted by ally99

Look, trucks are FORCED to break the law on that road. They can NOT make those hairpin turns without taking up BOTH lanes and the opposite pull-offs some times leaving you nowhere to go to get out of the way. Just look at Killboy pics for proof. If you can't take a road legally, you are a danger to all. One does not have to be speeding to get hurt or worse coming across an 18-wheeler in a blind corner. This benefits everyone...moms in minivans, bikers, and even the truckers themselves. I don't know many truckers who would take that road a 2nd time after the incredible difficulties they face on it. By the end, they are sweating like pigs. That is NOT an easy road and certainly not one that should be open to vehicles that can not take it without endangering others. That includes squid bikers who can't stay in their own lane. There are many, many mountain roads where trucks are not allowed because there are safer alternative routes. This is one of them. Have you ever been on this stretch of 129 yourself?

i haven't ever been there, no. and i completely agree if you cant stay in your own lane, dont be on the road. and for that i completely agree with the ban on 18wheelers there, if they cant stay in their own lane making the turns. but at the same time, everything i said before still holds true. if its blind, and you are going faster then you can brake, thats too fast for the conditions available. we have similar roads here, and the same should hold true. situations always change. you should ride (or drive) as if there is a brick wall everywhere you cant see. road goes behind a blind corner? assume theres a brick wall behind it. truck blocking part of the road ahead? assume theres a brick wall behind it.

want to go fast? don't go where there are blind corners.

accidents happen when two people make mistakes. one person to drive a semi into the other lane, another person to be going faster than their vision and brakes can account for.

[ally99]

Sounds like we agree about both issues then. The street is not a racetrack and should not be treated like one. The speed limit on parts of the road is 30mph. I got pulled over for going 40mph once (on a straight). 40mph is mild on this road. Many people take it MUCH faster than they should, and I agree, that's not smart riding. However, the laws of physics restrict trucks from being able to stay in their own lane, and as you can see, not just by a sliver either. They sometimes take up both lanes AND both pull-offs leaving cars and bikes nowhere to go. It's dangerous for all involved, including the truck drivers themselves. You can be at a standstill and the danger is still present if you encounter an 18-wheeler on some of these corners.

[TheJimmyEnglish]

Originally Posted by alex.s

i haven't ever been there, no. and i completely agree if you cant stay in your own lane, dont be on the road. and for that i completely agree with the ban on 18wheelers there, if they cant stay in their own lane making the turns. but at the same time, everything i said before still holds true. if its blind, and you are going faster then you can brake, thats too fast for the conditions available. we have similar roads here, and the same should hold true. situations always change. you should ride (or drive) as if there is a brick wall everywhere you cant see. road goes behind a blind corner? assume theres a brick wall behind it. truck blocking part of the road ahead? assume theres a brick wall behind it.

want to go fast? don't go where there are blind corners.

accidents happen when two people make mistakes. one person to drive a semi into the other lane, another person to be going faster than their vision and brakes can account for.

Not everyone who rides US129 is on it to go fast or treat it like a track. Even doing the speed limit or under the limit there is danger with these trucks on this roadway.

[alex.s]

my main point seems to be elusive so ill point it out.


if you are going faster than your vision and brakes allow, ANYWHERE, regardless of what a posted speed limit says, under any condition, you are riding faster than you should be. anything that happens is now your fault. if someone is in your lane and you cant stop, it is your fault. it might also be their fault. but its your fault for not being able to maintain your forward buffer.


now, the exception of course is someone speeding at you or crashing into your lane. you can maintain good buffer and still be caught by someone riding with no buffer. but with a slow moving truck like that, there is no excuse.

[blink]

I don't live i american yet I know how important that road is for truckers.

I'd let them be.

[TnNinjaGirl]

Originally Posted by alex.s

my main point seems to be elusive so ill point it out.


if you are going faster than your vision and brakes allow, ANYWHERE, regardless of what a posted speed limit says, under any condition, you are riding faster than you should be. anything that happens is now your fault. if someone is in your lane and you cant stop, it is your fault. it might also be their fault. but its your fault for not being able to maintain your forward buffer.


now, the exception of course is someone speeding at you or crashing into your lane. you can maintain good buffer and still be caught by someone riding with no buffer. but with a slow moving truck like that, there is no excuse.

The point is that even when you are traveling the speed limit, due to the blinds curves and nature of this road, it is very hard to prevent being run over by a semi. The road simply cannot be navigated by large trucks without endangering other motorists. It doesn't matter if you are on a sportbike or in a minivan, it's difficult to avoid being crushed by a semi coming the opposite direction.

I invite you to visit the road before you speak of it so matter of factly.

[alex.s]

Originally Posted by TnNinjaGirl

The point is that even when you are traveling the speed limit, due to the blinds curves and nature of this road, it is very hard to prevent being run over by a semi. The road simply cannot be navigated by large trucks without endangering other motorists. It doesn't matter if you are on a sportbike or in a minivan, it's difficult to avoid being crushed by a semi coming the opposite direction.

I invite you to visit the road before you speak of it so matter of factly.

again. my point is completely missed.

the speed limit is not the speed you should travel. it is the maximum legal limit. current conditions alone define what speed you should be traveling at. current conditions alone define what is safe. if you don't bring the speed down to match conditions, you are going faster than you should be. blind curves -- like fog, or other conditions -- limit your abilities. they make it harder for you to keep your own personal buffer. they take away, so you should give back by reducing your speed.


let me reiterate;

if you are ever traveling so fast (like around a blind corner), that if there was something in the road and by the time you see it, it will be so close that you cant stop, ur doin it wrong.

**** happens on public roads. people crash. people spin out. animals stop in the road. semis swing it wide. **** happens. if you want to risk it and make an assumption, its your own ass on the line. but do not say that its purely the conditions fault for being there. it takes two to tango. if you dont account for a condition, it is YOUR FAULT if it bites you in the ass.

once more... with feeling!;

blind corners are road hazard conditions just like fog or anything else. failure to recognize that and slow the **** down means you are putting yourself at risk. anyone who crashes into something in the road when going around a blind corner caused it themselves by not slowing to the point where they can stop if something is in the road.

if you feel this logic is at fault somehow; please explain what part of it you disagree with.

TL;DR:
if you out run your brakes and vision, its your own fault.


take it to the track.

[TnNinjaGirl]

You can be still in your lane and still be hit by a semi. I can't explain it any better than this.

[alex.s]

so if you were at a dead stop in your own lane. you would be unable to prevent the semi from running directly into you?


you really expect me to believe these semi trucks are going more than 20mph on these curves? you expect me to believe if yoou were stopped in the road that they would be unable to stop in time?


really?


if you want to let your life depend on an assumption that there won't be something in the road ahead after a blind corner... well... i guess thats your decision.

[Dano]

Originally Posted by alex.s

so if you were at a dead stop in your own lane. you would be unable to prevent the semi from running directly into you?


you really expect me to believe these semi trucks are going more than 20mph on these curves? you expect me to believe if yoou were stopped in the road that they would be unable to stop in time?


really?


if you want to let your life depend on an assumption that there won't be something in the road ahead after a blind corner... well... i guess thats your decision.

Your point is really correct, but hving been to the dragon semi trucks have no business on that road it is not safe for truck drivers or local motorists. The road is entirely not wide enough to safely navigate a truck on it period.