Went down yesterday...

[dowmace]

Was riding with a group of friends through some pretty spirited twisty's. I didn't know the roads that well and was probably already over my limit but I was keeping up very well for riding with liter bikes, anyway I was probably rolling a good 70mph or so around a corner when I found a sand patch.

When I hit the sand for some reason I panicked and grabbed both brakes. So of course the bike stood right up on me and I went careening into the grass, I low sided and head over heels rolled atleast twice that i could count, thankfully i ride atgatt and only got some road rash and a really good bruise on my right hip. The bike has a bent rear brake lever and the right side front turn signal broke off, but i was able to find it so I'll be re-attaching that. I hope I can straighten the brake lever back it's bent way way back.

I know all the variables that contributed to the crash

1. over my limits and i knew it
2. poor road conditions
3 panic if i hadn't panicked I would've been able to ride it out

I know what I should have done, when the tire broke loose I should have rolled off the throttle and then back on and I would've come out of the turn. But being as inexperienced as I am I freaked.

Just thought I'd post this so any of you guys that are going to the twisty's this early in the season know to look for sand and salt and DON'T PANIC!

[alex.s]

It's good to hear you're alright!

excuse me for being new to the sport, but wouldn't the correct thing to do in a situation like this be to not chop the throttle and transfer all your weight to the front wheel while the back is sliding about, but rather to keep the throttle the same, or give it slightly more gas until the rear starts to get traction back?
that way most of your weight stays on the rear tire which not only helps it get traction back, but is where you want to keep it in a turn... 40/60, right?

if you were sliding because you were at your traction limit (not because of sand in the road), chopping the throttle and transfering your weight up front would only make it worse... right?

whats that saying? when in doubt, gas it out?

[dowmace]

Originally Posted by alex.s

Hi, excuse me for being new to the sport, but wouldn't the correct thing to do in a situation like this be to not chop the throttle and transfer all your weight to the front wheel while the back is sliding about, but rather to keep the throttle the same, or give it slightly more gas until the rear starts to get traction back?
that way most of your weight stays on the rear tire which not only helps it get traction back, but is where you want to keep it in a turn... 40/60, right?

if you were sliding because you were at your traction limit (not because of sand in the road), chopping the throttle and transfering your weight up front would only make it worse... right?

whats that saying? when in doubt, gas it out?

I was in a pretty wide band of sand, if i had laid on the gas the rear would've slid out on me. Or atleast I'm pretty sure thats what would happen.

But I could be wrong I haven't been riding on a sport bike for very long.

[cnichols79us]

Well Damn..... Glad to hear your ok. Thanks for telling us so we can learn from it. Hope the bike is good too. Sounds like minamal damage for as fast as you were going.

[tjkamper]

glad you're okay. please post some pics of the damage. Hope you can get it back together soon.

[dowmace]

Originally Posted by tjkamper

glad you're okay. please post some pics of the damage. Hope you can get it back together soon.

I plan on posting some pics but somehow after our 70 degree day yesterday it snowed this morning

[mrlmd]

Leave the throttle on if the rear wheel starts to slide. If you transfer all the weight to the front wheel by letting off the throttle, you lighten the rear and make it slide more. Also, if you let the throttle off and then put it back on you could have risked a highside if the rear wheel suddenly regained traction. And, if you had the rear brake on and the back slides out, don't release the brake, or you risk a highside if the rear regains traction when it resumes spinning. Basically, try not to brake in a turn, don't let up on the throttle. You actually need a little more throttle going around the turn.
Was there anyway you could have just steered straight into the grass then tried to brake in a straight line if you thought you were going to fast for the sand?
Too many things to think about all at once, it has to be automatic and that comes from practice, practice, more practice. But real glad to hear you're OK, nothing seriously damaged, and you can analyze the situation and learn from it.

[ninjabrewer]

Sorry to hear that, glad that you are ok.

nb

[Yoda]

One more glad your OK and you walked away to learn from it,

[dowmace]

Originally Posted by mrlmd

Leave the throttle on if the rear wheel starts to slide. If you transfer all the weight to the front wheel by letting off the throttle, you lighten the rear and make it slide more. Also, if you let the throttle off and then put it back on you could have risked a highside if the rear wheel suddenly regained traction. And, if you had the rear brake on and the back slides out, don't release the brake, or you risk a highside if the rear regains traction when it resumes spinning. Basically, try not to brake in a turn, don't let up on the throttle. You actually need a little more throttle going around the turn.
Was there anyway you could have just steered straight into the grass then tried to brake in a straight line if you thought you were going to fast for the sand?
Too many things to think about all at once, it has to be automatic and that comes from practice, practice, more practice. But real glad to hear you're OK, nothing seriously damaged, and you can analyze the situation and learn from it.

I tried to ride it into the grass but I had a limited amount of room before I hit trees so I was trying to stop really quickly, that's what caused my low side slide in he grass. Lets just say had I been going a reasonable speed I probably could've stopped before I even hit the grass but we were moving at a pretty good clip.

[tapdiggy]

Congratulations on being in one piece. Also congrats on learning why riding hard to keep up with others is bad.

[JeffM]

Glad your ok. ATGATT saves the day - again.

Also, post photos of your gear here: http://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=39097

[mrlmd]

Grass is good, a little slippery, but not as hard or abrasive as asphalt.

[CC Cowboy]

Were you the only one the crash or did those pesky liter bikes crash too?

Were you following them or were they behind you?

70MPH crash and only a bent brake lever and turn signal is pretty lucky.

Next time let the other guys crash.

[dowmace]

Originally Posted by CC Cowboy

Were you the only one the crash or did those pesky liter bikes crash too?

Were you following them or were they behind you?

70MPH crash and only a bent brake lever and turn signal is pretty lucky.

Next time let the other guys crash.

I was at the tail end at the time, I was the only one luck enough to look like a fool

[karlosdajackal]

Originally Posted by alex.s

It's good to hear you're alright!

excuse me for being new to the sport, but wouldn't the correct thing to do in a situation like this be to not chop the throttle and transfer all your weight to the front wheel while the back is sliding about, but rather to keep the throttle the same, or give it slightly more gas until the rear starts to get traction back?
that way most of your weight stays on the rear tire which not only helps it get traction back, but is where you want to keep it in a turn... 40/60, right?

if you were sliding because you were at your traction limit (not because of sand in the road), chopping the throttle and transfering your weight up front would only make it worse... right?

whats that saying? when in doubt, gas it out?

Originally Posted by mrlmd

Leave the throttle on if the rear wheel starts to slide. If you transfer all the weight to the front wheel by letting off the throttle, you lighten the rear and make it slide more. Also, if you let the throttle off and then put it back on you could have risked a highside if the rear wheel suddenly regained traction. And, if you had the rear brake on and the back slides out, don't release the brake, or you risk a highside if the rear regains traction when it resumes spinning. Basically, try not to brake in a turn, don't let up on the throttle. You actually need a little more throttle going around the turn.
Was there anyway you could have just steered straight into the grass then tried to brake in a straight line if you thought you were going to fast for the sand?
Too many things to think about all at once, it has to be automatic and that comes from practice, practice, more practice. But real glad to hear you're OK, nothing seriously damaged, and you can analyze the situation and learn from it.

I agree with both these gentlemen

More gas = good, yes the rear may have slid out on the sand but a motorbike is an oversteer device, it will continue to turn and eventually correct itself if you do nothing more than keep the gas on, as the bike accelerates it moves more weight back helping push that tire into the road. Instead you hit the brakes making a bad situation worse. Doh If you were in a car (most of which are setup as understeer devices) this might have had some positive impact.

How did you get road rash on your legs with proper gear? I'm guessing by ATGATT you think jeans count or something like that. Please do a track day or something with proper rider training. I know at the moment all the cool kids seem to think crashing your bike on mountain roads and learning from trial and error is the coolest way to do it, but I'm telling you now, its not eventually you won't get up and brush off one of those crashes.

A lot of people here are being very supportive but what you described yourself doing (no experience, going too fast on roads you don't know) sounds very squid like. I'm glad you posted this as if you didn't I guess you'd be crashing again soon, probably due to your incorrect thought that chopping off the gas would have helped (has the same effect on vehicle dynamics as hitting the rear brake, is that not stating the obvious?), if you actually thought that was a good Idea you really need to read some books or do some training, to stay safe, and keep the racing for the track please, the road is not just for you and your buddies to abuse.

[Snake]

Sorry to hear about the crash but I'm glad that you are ok.

[dowmace]

Edit: never mind I'm not giving anyone the satisfaction of making me angry.

[JeffM]

I'm not giving anyone the satisfaction of making me angry.

Jonathan, I think you did the right thing by posting and trying to analyze and learn after your spill. Things happen very quickly when we ride. We are all not Colin Edwards and able to catch our errors quick enough to avoid "incidents". (although we all sometimes we think we are )

I cannot speak for anyone else but myself, but I am guilty of overriding sometimes. I have sat down afterwords and had a small talk with myself about what is and what is not appropriate for the street and have posted about my incidents. I think that has made me a better and safer rider.

Just got my 2006 Ninja 250 on friday and can't get enough of riding on the thing. I've ridden alot of bikes before but this is the most fun I've ever had on 2 wheels!

Motorcycles or bicycles?

Have you taken a MSF class? If not, see if there is a class in your area. I have taken both the basic and experienced classes. I think that the classes teach and reinforce good habits.

I think I can safely say that everyone on this board is concerned abut the safety of new riders and sometimes state their point rather sharply. Remember, they are only concerned.

Anyway, fix that bike and get out riding.

Jeff

[dowmace]

Originally Posted by JeffM

Jonathan, I think you did the right thing by posting and trying to analyze and learn after your spill. Things happen very quickly when we ride. We are all not Colin Edwards and able to catch our errors quick enough to avoid "incidents". (although we all sometimes we think we are )

I cannot speak for anyone else but myself, but I am guilty of overriding sometimes. I have sat down afterwords and had a small talk with myself about what is and what is not appropriate for the street and have posted about my incidents. I think that has made me a better and safer rider.



Motorcycles or bicycles?

Have you taken a MSF class? If not, see if there is a class in your area. I have taken both the basic and experienced classes. I think that the classes teach and reinforce good habits.

I think I can safely say that everyone on this board is concerned abut the safety of new riders and sometimes state their point rather sharply. Remember, they are only concerned.

Anyway, fix that bike and get out riding.

Jeff

Motorcycles and dirtbikes, before my ninja I had a KZ305 and a CB400. But both were sit up standard no fun bikes. I never once got myself in trouble with them like I have with the Ninja but I never pushed them because they didn't have near the capabilities this bike does. I've been looking for an MSF around here I am going to call this week at one place I know for sure hosts them.

[JeffM]

Great.