Are Performance Parts worth it?

[RiderOnTheStorm]

Hello all,

I need your expertise!

I just started riding (I have all of 40 miles beneath my belt), but I hope one day to acquire a few more, bigger bikes. But for now the 250 is perfect.

But I am getting an itch to add an exhaust system and see what else I could do to make the 250 a little more beastly. Is it worth it? Like I said, down the road I would like a bigger bike - should I just save my money for that?

I am not trying to make this bike a 1000 - I am really trying to understand if the 250 becomes an even better experience with a little bit more power.

Thanks!

[CynicalC]

Depends on your definition of worth. For the performance gains, not really. There are very small, noticeable gains to be had, but nothing that'll blow you away. But if you value customization, then sure.

[Kevin2109]

If you plan on doing all the work yourself then yes I think its worth it from a stand point on learning how to work on bikes. If your looking for performance gains its kinda a waist (I spend almost $2k on mods on my 250, sold it 6 months later)

I think cosmetic stuff is worth it if you want to change the look

[choneofakind]

It makes a difference to how the bike feels. I have made changes to my bike with the idea that I know I'm keeping it till it dies, and I want to get as much as I can out of my bike, but within a reasonable budget.

If you're concerned about resale, but still want to make the bike your own, do the mods that are cosmetic, or the ones that are reversible, and keep the stock parts so you can part out the aftermarket ones and install the stock ones so the new owner gets a mechanically stock bike.

As for easy, inexpensive, performance mods that will give you a taste of what changes they make:

• remove the snorkel
• shim the needles out
• adjust the rear pre-load
• sticky tires

[akima]

A guy at work has been telling me it's not worth modding my 250 with performance parts, but he hasn't convinced me. I'm planning on getting an Area P full exhaust system and some better tires. I'm guessing that will set me back ~£1000, but for that I'm pretty sure the bike will perform better. When I feel 100% in control of and comfortable with my ninjette I might get a bigger engine bike, but right now I'm no where near that stage. In the mean time I like the idea of modding my ninjette to improve her in little ways.

[ninja250r81]

youtube some vids where the ninja 250r going around the track.

it leaves the 600's, 1000's braking, entering, mid corner, exiting the corners.
but after the corner and accelerating the 600's, 1000's have it.
handling and braking are better than 600's, 1000's

on the street/highway.

600's, 1000's luggage carrying
600's, 1000's ease of cruising 65 - 70mph

(my opinion) 250r have advantage on the street.

performance mods its all up to you.

hid's
15t front sprocket
air filter
full exhaust
change needles
cut off the rear licence plate holder tail until licence plate.

[icbm]

Well. This is my first "Small" bike. I have owned, built, ridden and raced bikes as powerful as 450hp. For me, I just about modify everything I have ever owned cars included.

On the 2008 250R I have so far put in about $2k in it but will end up having close to $2.5k. The cost of the bike was only $800 so in it for less than $3k is pretty good considering I am strictly racing it and needed it to be able to haul my 220lb suited ass around the track. I wanted to save money during the race season ie; tires as well as wear/tear on the bike.

For a street bike, I would say don't mod it as you have already put in your mind that you are going to eventually step up. Resell it when your ready and consider it a stepping stone.

[Jono]

When I got my bike I had told myself I wouldn't mod it because I wanted to keep it stock for resale reasons. Like you I am using the 250 as a stepping stone to get into the whole motorcycle thing. I had the idea of selling the ninja after about 2 years and moving on to another bike.

But everything changed when I crashed. I am so glad i didn't put thousands of dollars of mods into the bike because it would have made the crash that much more painful for me. It was bad enough that my bike got pretty beat up.

So now my mindset has changed. I will probably keep my ninja 250 until it dies because I realized I am nowhere ready to handle more power. If I do get another bike I would get a dual sport and still keep my ninja.

Basically what I am saying is, if you bought the ninja just to learn how to ride and then move on to another bike in a season or two. Then don't mod the thing. Save your money for buying that next bike. Just my 2 cents.

[ForceofWill]

Originally Posted by Jono

Basically what I am saying is, if you bought the ninja just to learn how to ride and then move on to another bike in a season or two. Then don't mod the thing. Save your money for buying that next bike. Just my 2 cents.

Agreed. You need to figure out what you want with this bike. There are those of us that love the 250 and will keep it forever in the stable, and the people that want to trade it away as soon as they learn to ride. If you don't plan on keeping it from the start, I would say don't waste your money.

[Nemesis]

Personally, I don't think it is if you're just street riding. However, if you plan on riding/racing the track as well then yes.

[greenaero]

FOr the OP, In my opinion some mods are fine if they better meet the needs of the rider. I mod the heck out my bikes for better fuel economy so I'm a big fan of sprockets changes and removing body panels and excess parts. I do make sure that all my mods are reversible so that I can sell the bike with greater appeal for the average rider.
As for as trying to radically increase the speed or power of the 250, its a waste of money and time unless you are racing in a specific class. If you want more speed o the street, get a bigger bike. my 2 cents

[massacremasses]

worth it? no.

Cosmetic mods? AWWW YEAH!

[Klondike1020]

Stickers add HP!

[Rexbo]

just sayin, the 250 will never be "beastly"

[CC Cowboy]

Best performance mod to any bike is learning to ride it better. Most bikes come out of the factory with more performance than most riders can handle. Tires would be the first thing to change. Then go to a track and learn how to ride it to the limit. Then it will be time to move up.

[greenaero]

CCCowboy has got it right, excellent advice

[koenigcitizen]

As long as you understand (and are fine with it), that mods will not add $ value to your bike, and you will probably not get that money back when you sell, I think they are fine!

Cosmetic mods are better though... There is not much performance to be gained on 250 (unless you put $5 000 in it - but you might as well just buy a bigger bike). At most you will gain 5 hp or so... hardly worth it.

The best performance mod, I would say, is tires

[blink]

Only get it if you want the sound.
The performace will be slight and you might feel it with the carb tuning but youll forget the power increase after a few more miles using it

If that makes sense

[massacremasses]

Originally Posted by koenigcitizen

As long as you understand (and are fine with it), that mods will not add $ value to your bike, and you will probably not get that money back when you sell, I think they are fine!

unless you bought a cheaper bike with cosmetic damage, and fix it up like me then you might actually make money

[250rr]

I'm in your shoes. I have less than 100 miles on the bike and don't plan on racing it (although I am planning on taking it to a track for some training). My plan is to ride it stock for a while, get better at riding in general, and then make a decision: Continue to ride the bike stock, or sell it and buy a Triumph Daytona 675.

I would resist the 'itch' to mod the bike at this time if I were you. I agree completely with Cowboy. Perhaps you could take the money you were planning on spending on the exhaust and buy some supervised track time. I'm most definately not an expert, but I'm going to make a wild guess here and say that you will be far faster after the track time than if you put a new exhaust system on the bike. Please someone more experienced correct me if I'm wrong!

That being said, it's your bike. If you want to mod it, mod it!! Ride it!! Have fun!!

We all have our itches. My itch is to buy the Daytona. Resisting...Daytona...purchase...please someone...help...me....not...enough experience....must not....sucomb to...foolish....emotional...desire to own...bike....beyond....my....current....abilities.....

[250rr]

Originally Posted by 250rr

I'm in your shoes. I have less than 100 miles on the bike and don't plan on racing it (although I am planning on taking it to a track for some training). My plan is to ride it stock for a while, get better at riding in general, and then make a decision: Continue to ride the bike stock, or sell it and buy a Triumph Daytona 675.

I would resist the 'itch' to mod the bike at this time if I were you. I agree completely with Cowboy. Perhaps you could take the money you were planning on spending on the exhaust and buy some supervised track time. I'm most definately not an expert, but I'm going to make a wild guess here and say that you will be far faster after the track time than if you put a new exhaust system on the bike. Please someone more experienced correct me if I'm wrong!

That being said, it's your bike. If you want to mod it, mod it!! Ride it!! Have fun!!

We all have our itches. My itch is to buy the Daytona. Resisting...Daytona...purchase...please someone...help...me....not...enough experience....must not....sucomb to...foolish....emotional...desire to own...bike....beyond....my....current....abilities.....

/\ Sorry for the mispelling...definitely is the correct spelling. I can never seem to type/spell that word properly the first time!

[gilmorec61]

I would have to say no. Its only a 250, and even if you did do alot of performance mods to it, your not going to get much more out of it. It would almost maybe be cheaper to buy a bigger bike if you wanted more performance. But, cosmetically, anything that makes it look better is worth it

[choneofakind]

Something I forgot to add to my post was that it all comes down to what you consider "worth it". It depends what you're looking for. If you're just going for something small, I would try pulling the snorkel and shimming. If you decide that you like playing with the jetting, get a K&N R-0990 and some jets. If you don't like it, put it back the way you found it.

I mean, we know that you aren't going to get another 20 hp out of these bikes ever. But small things that are inexpensive, or upgrading to better tires when you need new ones anyways seems worth it to me.

[ninja250r81]

keep practicing slow maneuvering all the time.

bikes with full exhaust, filter, jetting, tuned gets

250r 26 - 30hp atw - 15.385% increase
zx6r 108 - 116hp atw - 7.407% increase

2008-11 Suzuki Hayabusa 178 - 185hp atw - 3.695% increase

performance per $$ over other bike's are double the return.

"ohhhhh but the zx6r and the Hayabusa smashes the crap out of our bikes"

it has 584% more power than the ninja 250r, if it made the same performace % it should have 205hp atw.

in aussie this is our test to pass so that we can get our P's.
spray paint on the carpark and practice.

[Whiskey]

Originally Posted by akima

A guy at work has been telling me it's not worth modding my 250 with performance parts, but he hasn't convinced me. I'm planning on getting an Area P full exhaust system and some better tires. I'm guessing that will set me back ~£1000, but for that I'm pretty sure the bike will perform better. When I feel 100% in control of and comfortable with my ninjette I might get a bigger engine bike, but right now I'm no where near that stage. In the mean time I like the idea of modding my ninjette to improve her in little ways.

Tyres yes, brakes yes, full exhaust no

The best tyres & brakes available let you throw the bike around a bit more & get better faster.

The full exhaust on a restricted bike is a bit overkill to be honest, and if it's costing you about £750 it would want to be doing it's job (which it wont do on a restricted horsepower machine).

I'd hold onto the £750 and put it towards a bigger bike, a bit of touring or do the following & have ~£600 left over

The best 2 mods in terms of cost/benefit are braided brake lines & a proper suspension set-up by someone who knows exactly what they're doing.

[Jiggles]

Are you trying to say that a full exhaust doesn't increase performance?

[choneofakind]

UK bikes are restricted? are they physically restricted or is this just in the sense of there is a law that limits a newbie's hp and cc's

[Ytse Frobozz]

I agree with most of what's been said here. I'll probably get a larger displacement bike myself somewhere down the line, and for now I'm pretty content to enjoy the 250 for what it is. I think the best investments I've made so far are in quality riding gear, practical stuff like a new windscreen and tailbag, and good tools to work on my bike. Notice most of those things will still be useful for the next bike! That said, tires is a great upgrade, because it improves both performance and safety in one shot.

[akima]

Originally Posted by Whiskey

Tyres yes, brakes yes, full exhaust no

The best tyres & brakes available let you throw the bike around a bit more & get better faster.

The full exhaust on a restricted bike is a bit overkill to be honest, and if it's costing you about £750 it would want to be doing it's job (which it wont do on a restricted horsepower machine).

I'd hold onto the £750 and put it towards a bigger bike, a bit of touring or do the following & have ~£600 left over

The best 2 mods in terms of cost/benefit are braided brake lines & a proper suspension set-up by someone who knows exactly what they're doing.

Hello UK person! (A novelty in here)

Hmm. One of the things I didn't mention about my desire to get the Area P full system is that I'd like it for the noise it makes too! I like the noises my current 2fiddy setup makes, but I prefer the purrs of a 2fiddy with an Area P full system. Infact the only thing right now that draws me to bigger engine bikes is the noise They sound so nice. If I can get my ninjette a bit closer to that it will keep me happy for quite some time.

Also: I have a full license (not direct access though). My ninjette isn't restricted. If I put on the Area P full system I understand that I'll get maybe 3HP extra out of the bike: I don't think that will push my bikes performance above what I'm legally aloud.

I like the braided brake lines idea. I've heard people talking about that before. I was put off doing it in the short term on account of the fact a number of people in here have said that it doesn't increase the amount of braking power available, it simply makes braking more responsive. I'm happy with the responsiveness of my current plastic brake lines. I think when it comes to the time when Kawasaki recommend I replace my brake lines, then I'll switch to the beaded metal ones.

[MikeBudd]

Like most have said: is it worth it to you?

In reality its terrible bang for your buck and really adds nothing to the value. Personally because I LOVE my ninja I have upgraded a lot of things.

That's not to say things like exhaust and jetting don't make a difference. They do make a difference, and its definitely noticable when you jump on a stock bike versus the upgraded one.

Its all about what you want to do. If you think its worth it like I do, then it is, if you don't, then it isn't. I am keeping my ninja for atleast 2+ years, then probably upgrading. I might not even sell, which only further fuels my desire to have the best little ninja I can!
Posted via Mobile Device

[choneofakind]

Originally Posted by akima

They sound so nice. If I can get my ninjette a bit closer to that it will keep me happy for quite some time.

Just so you know, a ninja 250 is a 180 degree parallel twin engine. It's always going to sound like a parallel twin, no matter what exhaust is on it. (like they say, you can put lipstick on a pig ) as long as that's the sound you're going for and you aren't hoping for Supersport sounds, go for it

I suggest the Area P 18" Race system. Best looks imho, and best performance increase as well.

[akima]

Originally Posted by choneofakind

Just so you know, a ninja 250 is a 180 degree parallel twin engine. It's always going to sound like a parallel twin, no matter what exhaust is on it. (like they say, you can put lipstick on a pig ) as long as that's the sound you're going for and you aren't hoping for Supersport sounds, go for it

I suggest the Area P 18" Race system. Best looks imho, and best performance increase as well.

Sexy pig!

Wow,.. they claim a 33% increase in performance over the OEM exhaust:

the Race System is more than 10.5 hp (+33%) over the OEM exhaust, and 2.4 hp (+ 8%) over the Area P Standard system.

source

Until then I thought it gave identical performance to the Area P standard full system but was just mounted higher to allow for a steeper lean angle.

[choneofakind]

sqirrels + pigs =

yepp. and look at the dyno curves. The peak is way higher, and further up in the rpms, and doesn't fall off as drastically. There's more hp and torque the whole way up the rpm range. Even the torque curve is higher at the fall off at redline with that system than it is at peak stock. That might be different for you UK riders because the FI bikes have more torque to start out with.

[Whiskey]

Originally Posted by Jiggles

Are you trying to say that a full exhaust doesn't increase performance?

It will, but not to a massive extent on a bike that was designed to be at a specific (lower) bhp than it is naturally capable of.

I'm sure that with powercommander, a bit of tweaking on a dyno, & the full exhaust there would be reasonable gains, but the exhaust alone (without the PCIII & remap) wouldn't be the most bang for your bucks.

It's easier & cheaper to do on a carbed model, a quick re-jet should do, but the FI set-up needs more investment.

And if I was going to go for that sort of set-up I'd first get a nice 636 to do it on

Originally Posted by choneofakind

UK bikes are restricted? are they physically restricted or is this just in the sense of there is a law that limits a newbie's hp and cc's

I'm Irish but live in the UK, there's a EU (think federal) law that says learners can't have over 33bhp, but depending on national (think state) law that can be extended to people who have their licence less than 2 years.
UK has 2 different types of test a normal test where you have the 2 year restriction & a Direct Access test where you have to do a course before it & a harder test but then can ride any bike immediately. Ireland only has the first option

All 08+ bikes were designed to put out 25kw (33bhp), exactly what the EU wide law specifies as learner legal (for now, it's going to be changed to 35kw soon) so all newgens are 'restricted' by design if ya get me.
I dont want to get into the pregen vs new discussion, but it's the reason that they detuned the bike by ~7bhp.

Originally Posted by akima

Hello UK person! (A novelty in here)

Hmm. One of the things I didn't mention about my desire to get the Area P full system is that I'd like it for the noise it makes too! I like the noises my current 2fiddy setup makes, but I prefer the purrs of a 2fiddy with an Area P full system. Infact the only thing right now that draws me to bigger engine bikes is the noise They sound so nice. If I can get my ninjette a bit closer to that it will keep me happy for quite some time.

Also: I have a full license (not direct access though). My ninjette isn't restricted. If I put on the Area P full system I understand that I'll get maybe 3HP extra out of the bike: I don't think that will push my bikes performance above what I'm legally aloud.

I like the braided brake lines idea. I've heard people talking about that before. I was put off doing it in the short term on account of the fact a number of people in here have said that it doesn't increase the amount of braking power available, it simply makes braking more responsive. I'm happy with the responsiveness of my current plastic brake lines. I think when it comes to the time when Kawasaki recommend I replace my brake lines, then I'll switch to the beaded metal ones.

Hi!

Nothing wrong with getting the full system, it's more than I'd be willing to pay for the modest (damn I'm slow on this keyboard, 10bhp is far from modest) gain (without the remap) and certainly when you take the PCIII & dyno tuning into account

I like the sound of the Beowulf slip on stubby exhausts, but I'm nearing the end of my restriction. I've an Irish licence so no D.A. but it goes unrestricted on 1st of July & will probably move up to a bigger bike before long.

Braided lines are well worth the money, they make the braking more predictable especially on the front (I left the rear as OEM, it's easier to lock up the rear if you have braided)

Better brake pads will give better braking (or the expensive option of an upgraded calliper & master cylinder, but I'd say that's excessive on the 250)

HEL front braided line for under £25 + shipping

[JS73]

Originally Posted by CC Cowboy

Best performance mod to any bike is learning to ride it better. Most bikes come out of the factory with more performance than most riders can handle. Tires would be the first thing to change. Then go to a track and learn how to ride it to the limit. Then it will be time to move up.

+1
Spend your money on tires and adjust the nut that ties the seat to the bars.

[choneofakind]

Originally Posted by Whiskey

I'm Irish but live in the UK, there's a EU (think federal) law that says learners can't have over 33bhp, but depending on national (think state) law that can be extended to people who have their licence less than 2 years.
UK has 2 different types of test a normal test where you have the 2 year restriction & a Direct Access test where you have to do a course before it & a harder test but then can ride any bike immediately. Ireland only has the first option

All 08+ bikes were designed to put out 25kw (33bhp), exactly what the EU wide law specifies as learner legal (for now, it's going to be changed to 35kw soon) so all newgens are 'restricted' by design if ya get me.
I dont want to get into the pregen vs new discussion, but it's the reason that they detuned the bike by ~7bhp.

Ah I see. Very interesting, thank you.

I wonder if Kawasaki will beef up the 250 at all to meet this new law?

[akima]

@Whiskey: thanks for that info. Maybe when I get my new tyres fitted in the summer, I'll also get a beaded brake line fitted for the front brake.

Oh and "I'm Irish but live in the UK". Should I read much into that little sentence? I'm guessing you don't think people from northern Ireland are really Irish?

Dig the Irish accent btw! I have a boring "normal" English accent... I basically sound like the Queen (jk!)

[Whiskey]

Originally Posted by akima

@Whiskey: thanks for that info. Maybe when I get my new tyres fitted in the summer, I'll also get a beaded brake line fitted for the front brake.

Oh and "I'm Irish but live in the UK". Should I read much into that little sentence? I'm guessing you don't think people from northern Ireland are really Irish?

That's reading a bit more into it than I intended

Going from where you joined the MAG protest I'm guessing that I'm not too far from you (I'm in Cambridge, for now)

I'm from the republic, and would rather not talk politics on the north apart from the fact that I disagree with what the RIRA are up to.

Yeah people here seem to love the accent, but it takes a while for them to understand it

[Jiggles]

Originally Posted by akima

@Whiskey: thanks for that info. Maybe when I get my new tyres fitted in the summer, I'll also get a beaded brake line fitted for the front brake.

Oh and "I'm Irish but live in the UK". Should I read much into that little sentence? I'm guessing you don't think people from northern Ireland are really Irish?

Dig the Irish accent btw! I have a boring "normal" English accent... I basically sound like the Queen (jk!)

For the Americans going WTF!?

Link to original page on YouTube.

[choneofakind]

Originally Posted by Jiggles

For the Americans going WTF!?

Thank you Jiggles!! I'm lost over here.