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Old April 18th, 2011, 04:53 PM   #161
Rexbo
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Originally Posted by randomwalk101 View Post
after installing and using the 08 ninja 250 with GSRX shock for awhile, I feel like the shock is too hard for the 250. Everytime I hit a bump, the front end absorbs fine but the rear is too hard. I feel it right in my seat as the rear bounces over the bump. Am I alone on this?
haha shitload of posts! Sorry was racing this weekend!

Yes it is much stiffer than stock, I had to back off preload nearly all the way for it to be soft enough, and I also backed off both high and low speed compression a half turn, while increasing rebound damping a full turn. It'll never feel all soft and gushy like the stock shock, and especially if you still have the stock front springs, it will feel rough in comparison.

With those settings and me at 150 lbs, it feels perfect on the track with my 140 width bt003rs rear tire. Really easy to slide, extremely forgiving over bumps, and plenty quick for transition. Also helped me kick ass, so I've got no complaints
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Old April 18th, 2011, 05:51 PM   #162
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ok another race update!

Round 2 at CVMA went REALLY well. Missed out on friday practice, so got to the track saturday morning never having run it before counter clockwise, so not quite sure what to expect. Turns out the track is really fun counter-clockwise, and definitely faster (well at least to me), because all the decreasing radius turns are now increasing radius so you can really just keep the throttle hammered super early on in turns and just power(sorta) your way out of everything.

First practice goes alright but was shortened because of registration issues, spent most of the time trying to figure out the correct lines are, where to brake and where the rough patches are. Second practice gets cut short because of a pretty lame red flag call on the officials part, so by the time qualifying rolls around, I have maybe 3 truly at speed laps on the course. So I decide EFFZ it, I don't know how fast everyone else is here, so I go in 100%. TBH it was probably a bad idea because it was scary as crap. Front and rear tires sliding everywhere, touching toes on the ground, rear wheel chattering & bouncing at every braking zone, definitely overdoing it. But it paid off, I didn't crash and threw down a 2:09 qualifying lap, which was a solid 3-4 sec faster than everyone else, sticking me onto pole!

Rest of the weekend and the races went pretty uneventfully, though sunday race was more fun because Nemesis (john) got the jump on me off the line, so I followed him & some two stroke single cyl vintage bike into turn 2 where he was carrying more corner speed than I was, and was getting ready to take off down the straight and dust me, but he mis-shifted so I was able to keep my drive right on past him where I got stuck behind the two stroke guy for a few more turns, until eventually diving into the bowl inside of him, then the rest of the race was free sailing. For some reason I just clicked with either the bike or this particular track configuration or something, but I was flying, but still keeping some margin for error, posting a best race lap time of 2:12.

We need a bigger field of 250s for sure! You guys need to get out here! Only 4 bikes on the 250 starting grid is sad! Next time I think we're going to bring a kiddie pool because it was so freakin hot out there (mid-90s) and was definitely detrimental to my health. Thanks everyone who made it, and condolences to Peanut for throwing his bike off the track in from eyewitness reports, a fairly spectacular fashion.

Photos:

Here's lookin at you, kid:



Game on:



Saturday lap 2 entering turn 2, thats me off in front followed by an old man with a broken leg, Nemesis, cheeks and some single cyl vintage bike:



They say ninjas are sneaky:



Those two on the 125gp bikes behind me are like 13 years old and REALLY fast:



FU, wind resistance:



Everyone at the end of the day:



Anyway, it was once again a really fun weekend, and again WE NEED MORE NINJAS ON THE GRID! Come on out if you're even thinking at ALL about it!
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Old April 18th, 2011, 06:37 PM   #163
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Don't blame yourself over those kids one the 125 gp bikes. Those 2 stroke 125cc race bikes are a league above the ninja, I bet any one of us could go fast on those suckers too.
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Old April 24th, 2011, 09:15 PM   #164
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Don't want to hijack the thread too much about the GSXR shock, but I looked at my friend's service manual for the 06-07 GSXR to get the stock settings.

Spring preload- 176.4mm (6.94in) max, 186.4mm (7.34in) min with stock at 181.4mm (7.14in)

Rebound-turn clockwise fully for stiffest position, stock at 1 3/4 turns out

Low-speed compression-turn clockwise for stiffest position, stock at 1 3/4 turns out

High-speed compression-turn clockwise for stiffest position, stock at 3 turns out
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Old April 24th, 2011, 09:29 PM   #165
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Great photos!
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Old April 26th, 2011, 11:28 AM   #166
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Where do you guys buy the bolts & spacers?

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Old April 26th, 2011, 12:50 PM   #167
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are you guys running emulators for the front?
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Old April 26th, 2011, 01:18 PM   #168
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I've been reading up on threads in this forum about emulators/preload adjusters/gold valves/etc. and I still don't understand the difference. Although I know what preload adjusters do but the others...I'm at a lost.
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Old April 26th, 2011, 04:02 PM   #169
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Hopefully what I know of these things are correct, but obviously correct me if I'm wrong.

Preload adjusters- Let's you adjust your spring preload in your forks to match your weight (just like our rear preload). Basically to set your front sag while at rest. I have preload adjusters and I believe they're adjustable from 5mm-20mm with clipons.

Emulators- Used to mimic cartridge forks that most supersports come stock. They're used to set rebound dampening and compression dampening (how quickly the spring will bounce back). It's a way to have a plush ride while still being firm (think going over bumps).

Springs- Changing springs will either soften or stiffen the front (depending on what you need because of your weight). Ninja 250 has pretty average springs that will dive for many people so stiffer springs or progressive springs will help.

Oil- Also will help stiffen or soften the front.

I have preload adjusters and 15W fork oil installed and do feel how the front suspension needs help since I installed the GSXR shock. Without an emulator, going over a bump will either be harsh or soft, but cornering will be firm or wallow respectively. The goal is to have the front and back rebound and compress at the same rate. With a stock 250 shock, you can only adjust preload so I wouldn't think an emulator would be necessary. I liked having it at 5 to have firm cornering, but obviously most bumps were jarring for me since I weigh about 160. I'm trying to dial in the GSXR's shock to match my front to avoid having to get an emulator. Hope this helps
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Old April 26th, 2011, 07:08 PM   #170
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cuong is mostly correct, good info!

also emulators = gold valves haha

Just to add a few things: if you're bottoming out your suspension on the track, spring preload adjusters won't be a solution. You're mostly just adjusting the spring preload for normal road use, but preloading the springs more doesnt really make up for overly-soft springs. However, with stiffer springs you could use the preloader to fine-tune how the front end feels at the track.

Oil will soften or stiffen DAMPING only. The stock fork damping is pretty soft with not much low or high speed compression damping, and moderate rebound damping. Good for soaking up potholes and expansion joints, but less so for performance. If you switch to heavier oil, you're increasing all of these damping characteristics equally, which is an improvement but less than ideal. Thats why you get an emulator, because it changes the characteristics of the fork damping for a more performance-minded ride.

From experience, heres my impression of the improvements all these made on my bike on the track (with a pirelli supercorsa sc1 front & bridgestone bt003 rear tire):
1) Emulators & 15w oil: front end no longer chatters and bounces over broken pavement at the track at full lean like it used to with stock forks. It really does feel planted over nearly anything, and when it does slip, its pretty progressive and will run you wide instead of just tucking you into the ground, but I'm sure the tire has lots to do with this as well! Really... gives you a ton more confidence in the front end of the bike over stock! Again, this is really track-only feedback here.
2) Springs: Another MUST for racing/tracking even at my 150 lbs, since it keeps the front end from bottoming (mostly... I think I might get preload adjusters to tighten them just BARELY) under hard braking and cornering, letting the suspension soak up bumps and do its happy dance also increasing confidence.

Basically: for racing, emulators/springs/15w oil are essential if you're over like 120 lbs haha. It changed my bike from front end chattermonkey into planted and rear-slideypants, which I like better for SURE because it doesn't make you pucker up as much and I hate having to dig half my stinkybritches outta there.
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Old April 26th, 2011, 07:09 PM   #171
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Quote:
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are you guys running emulators for the front?
hey, you comin out to the next CVMA? Hint: correct answer is yes
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Old April 30th, 2011, 10:21 AM   #172
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Don't mean to jack this thread again but I have the Hyperco spring courtesy of Traxxion Dynamics rated at 500lbs/inch installed on the GSXR 600 shock.

Here is the pic.



I'm pretty sure I have the spacer on properly, however I wouldn't be suprised if some suspension expert will come on here and call me a dumbass.
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Old May 1st, 2011, 10:17 PM   #173
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rexbo View Post
hey, you comin out to the next CVMA? Hint: correct answer is yes
i might take the NRS at buttonwillow... however i really wanted to do a school first... unless you guys want a backmarker to feel like champions ill jump right in! j/k... i dont want to be a turtle forever though
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Old May 2nd, 2011, 04:54 PM   #174
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i might take the NRS at buttonwillow... however i really wanted to do a school first... unless you guys want a backmarker to feel like champions ill jump right in! j/k... i dont want to be a turtle forever though
the NRS really just teaches you how starting works, what the flags mean, what to do if you get penalized or what will happen if theres a red-flag event, its really just a track day where you're not allowed to crash with info sessions in between track time. All the info can be found in the rule book, its just a way for the race orgs to make sure that someone has told it to your face, so now the responsibility is on you to follow them.

Although, it is a pretty good way to follow fast people and see how they roll
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Old May 3rd, 2011, 12:59 PM   #175
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Just finished prepping mine for WERA at Barber on Sunday:

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Old May 3rd, 2011, 02:46 PM   #176
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nemesis View Post
I've been reading up on threads in this forum about emulators/preload adjusters/gold valves/etc. and I still don't understand the difference. Although I know what preload adjusters do but the others...I'm at a lost.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cuongism View Post
Hopefully what I know of these things are correct, but obviously correct me if I'm wrong.
...
Emulators- Used to mimic cartridge forks that most supersports come stock. They're used to set rebound dampening and compression dampening (how quickly the spring will bounce back). It's a way to have a plush ride while still being firm (think going over bumps).
...
Emulator is short for "Gold Valve Cartridge Emulator." That's Race Tech's name for the part.

Cuong is correct in that it improves front end feel, but emulators only affect compression damping. They sit on top of the damping rod already in the fork.

The damping rod in the fork has holes for both rebound and compression damping. When you put in an emulator, typically you drill out the compression holes in the damping rod so as to make them useless. That way the emulator now takes over the duties of compression damping, and the damper rod continues to do the duties of rebound damping.

The only way to affect rebound characteristics (in damping rod forks like in our Ninja 250's) is 1) to re-size the rebound holes in the damping rod or 2) to change the viscosity of the fork oil.

Hope this helps. And if you want to know more, I suggest you take a gander at Race Tech's Motorcycle Suspension Bible.
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Old May 3rd, 2011, 02:55 PM   #177
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Emulator is short for "Gold Valve Cartridge Emulator." That's Race Tech's name for the part.

Cuong is correct in that it improves front end feel, but emulators only affect compression damping. They sit on top of the damping rod already in the fork.

The damping rod in the fork has holes for both rebound and compression damping. When you put in an emulator, typically you drill out the compression holes in the damping rod so as to make them useless. That way the emulator now takes over the duties of compression damping, and the damper rod continues to do the duties of rebound damping.

The only way to affect rebound characteristics (in damping rod forks like in our Ninja 250's) is 1) to re-size the rebound holes in the damping rod or 2) to change the viscosity of the fork oil.

Hope this helps. And if you want to know more, I suggest you take a gander at Race Tech's Motorcycle Suspension Bible.
this is my understanding on race tech emulators as well. I have them in the dirt bikes.
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Old May 9th, 2011, 05:43 AM   #178
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went to buttonwillow this weekend, and for some reason my camera didn't work the whole day until the very last session of the day, and even then it only worked for like 2 minutes. Anyway it was a different video but here it is:

Link to original page on YouTube.


Last futzed with by Alex; May 9th, 2011 at 05:44 AM. Reason: embedded the video. hit edit to see how i did it.
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Old July 1st, 2011, 07:19 PM   #179
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Quick update:
Dyno'd the bike and got 30.9hp out of it, stock airbox and Sportisi exhaust. Got a set of Michelin Power Race tires, re-set rear preload & sag, changed brake pads, and if all the planets align and hell freezes over, racing AFM next weekend.

Gotta say, Matt's been pullin some ridiculous strings with AFM to make it happen, hope it works out!
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Old August 28th, 2011, 08:07 PM   #180
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Just finished prepping mine for WERA at Barber on Sunday:

What all have you done to this bike? How are the dudes at MM?
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Old August 28th, 2011, 09:11 PM   #181
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i'm soooo jealous!
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Old October 10th, 2011, 08:04 AM   #182
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just got the gsxr rear shocks from nemesis,it was hand carried all the way to Bali... that thing is heavy! felt rather bad for having the person lug that thing half way across the globe, but ah... its here now

gonna get cracking at it over the week end i think~ hope i don't run into any trouble installing it. but it looks quite straight forward...

did you fit this on your bike at all Nemesis? do i still need to drill some of the holes bigger? i didn't really try to figure it out yet, dropped it all off at the mechanics where ill work on it on Saturday, while they are taking the engine apart to bore her up.

what are the dials set at? which dial is which? rofl.... a lotta questions~
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Old November 12th, 2011, 01:21 AM   #183
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Hi Steve - Thanks for this thread. On my way to do the shock mod as you have suggested. I have 2 questions.

1. Can you shoot a pic of the other side of the under tail plastic thing. Cant figure out where exactly to dremel/hacksaw it thru for shock clearance.

2. Did you try with gixxer 1000 shock? Its 0.25" taller and i am wondering if you would have used the gixxer 1000 shock, then the 15mm gap would have been compensated.

I have access to some of the stock gsxr's and length measured from eyelet to eyelet is ::

05 gix 600 13”
06 07 gix 600/750 12.5”
05 06 gix 1000 12.75”
07 08 gix 1000 12.25”

Appreciate your help ! ... Also, what clipons are those on your racek bike?
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Old November 14th, 2011, 07:02 PM   #184
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The problem with the other gsxr shocks is that the resevoir will interfere with the air box, that's why I chose this one, because it won't collide with it. The spring rate is too high but I'm going to swap to a 2003 gsxr1000 spring that is a bit softer. I'm going to be shortening the dogbones 6mm to lift up the tail and get a little more head angle. Also increasing the fork oil to increase front damping and help decrease the pogoing that's happening under high loads.
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Old November 14th, 2011, 07:46 PM   #185
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Thanks Rexbo ...

Did you try the 05 gixxer 1000? Its almost the same length as the current Ninja 250 shock. I am not sure about the clerance though. Do you think the 03 gixxer 1000 shock will clear?

Yes, the 06-09 spring is tad stiffer 9.4kg/mm (almost close to my weight though for a Ninja 250 spring rate). And, thats my worry that i need to spend money to get another spring.

Please let me know your thoughts !
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Old November 15th, 2011, 01:08 PM   #186
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Thanks Rexbo ...

Did you try the 05 gixxer 1000? Its almost the same length as the current Ninja 250 shock. I am not sure about the clerance though. Do you think the 03 gixxer 1000 shock will clear?

Yes, the 06-09 spring is tad stiffer 9.4kg/mm (almost close to my weight though for a Ninja 250 spring rate). And, thats my worry that i need to spend money to get another spring.

Please let me know your thoughts !
The 2007-2010 GSXR1000 rear shocks should fit, and are the same length as stock, but the springs are way way too stiff. Here's my spreadsheet for what would work best:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...TM0V0xGZ1hTeEE

Take a spring highlighted in green and match it to a shock that fits (highlighted in green) and you have yourself a good combo. All this can probably be found on ebay for way cheap. I got my two shock assemblies off ebay/craigslist for a grand total of $40. Not bad at all.
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Old November 15th, 2011, 04:57 PM   #187
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Just checked the spreadsheet ... Have you checked all of these shocks (marked in green) individually for the reservoir fit? And, is it factoring in the cut that need to be done to the base tray.

Ohh, did you buy the 03 gixxer 1000 shock just to get the spring and put on the 06-09 gixxer 600? Why not the 05 gixxer 1000 spring ... thats even softer.

Thing is we cant touch the dogbones/links at AFM production. So i have to work around that.

btw - Are you Nemesis on Barf ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rexbo View Post
The 2007-2010 GSXR1000 rear shocks should fit, and are the same length as stock, but the springs are way way too stiff. Here's my spreadsheet for what would work best:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...TM0V0xGZ1hTeEE

Take a spring highlighted in green and match it to a shock that fits (highlighted in green) and you have yourself a good combo. All this can probably be found on ebay for way cheap. I got my two shock assemblies off ebay/craigslist for a grand total of $40. Not bad at all.
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Old November 15th, 2011, 05:05 PM   #188
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Originally Posted by abhijitz View Post
Just checked the spreadsheet ... Have you checked all of these shocks (marked in green) individually for the reservoir fit? And, is it factoring in the cut that need to be done to the base tray.

Ohh, did you buy the 03 gixxer 1000 shock just to get the spring and put on the 06-09 gixxer 600? Why not the 05 gixxer 1000 spring ... thats even softer.

Thing is we cant touch the dogbones/links at AFM production. So i have to work around that.

btw - Are you Nemesis on Barf ?
I havent checked them all, but from looking at photos its pretty easy to tell which shocks will and wont fit, if the reservoir sits above the upper shock eye, you got a no-go. Even the shock I bought interfered with the tray, but not the air box. I trimmed the tray and left it at that.

As for AFM rules... The only other way around this that I could see would be either dropping the upper shock mount down (which MAY get you some clearance for one of the longer gsxr shocks, or finding a way to elongate the lower fork on the GSXR lower shock fork.
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Old November 22nd, 2011, 12:56 PM   #189
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Thanks Rexbo. Please update how the 03 gixxer 1000 spring swap goes on 06 gixxer 600. Eagerly waiting for the results :thumbup
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Old November 22nd, 2011, 01:00 PM   #190
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Thanks Rexbo. Please update how the 03 gixxer 1000 spring swap goes on 06 gixxer 600. Eagerly waiting for the results :thumbup
I've got a track day this weekend so won't be able to take care of this before then, but I'll get to it in the next week or two!
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Old November 22nd, 2011, 06:21 PM   #191
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thats all i had to cut out for clearance.



dont have any clear pictures of it assembled tho, lol



i just cut out the concaved part of the plastic, and it was a perfect fit, didn't need to chop off the whole lip like some other DIY suggested.

---------------------------

how can i identify what year shock i have, i bought this one off a fellow member, (Nemisis), but i wasnt able to get the year of the shocks. i think the spring rate is a little on the stiff side atm. not sure if i should look into getting a softer one
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Old November 22nd, 2011, 06:38 PM   #192
Rexbo
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He prb got the same year shock as me which has a 9.4 kg/mm spring rate. Back off the preload a ton and your ride should get a little softer. If its still too harsh you can swap a softer spring on from a different year gsxr. Check my Google document I posted up earlier
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Old November 22nd, 2011, 07:09 PM   #193
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ya, i backed it up some already, but i think i might loosen it up some more, lol...

the bike handles well when im 2 up with my girlfriend, with the added weight on the back to compensate for the stiffer springs, hehe...

ill be able to tell better once i go on a bike ride where i push it into and out of the corners. just daily commute rides dont give the right kind of feedback.

thnx for the info!
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Old November 22nd, 2011, 07:12 PM   #194
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Maybe you picked up this one ? http://bayarearidersforum.com/forums...d.php?t=373513

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Originally Posted by wayanlam View Post
how can i identify what year shock i have, i bought this one off a fellow member, (Nemisis), but i wasnt able to get the year of the shocks. i think the spring rate is a little on the stiff side atm. not sure if i should look into getting a softer one
OTOH, i am waiting for feedback from Rexbo on the 03 gixxer 1000 spring and then i will shoot for the mod. Did you also compensate the front fork height?
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Old November 22nd, 2011, 08:07 PM   #195
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i lowered the front shocks by about 1 inch, cos i have KTC clipons, which go above the tripple clamp.

so the bike is angles a little steeper to the front now i believe.

what did you mean by compensate?
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Old November 22nd, 2011, 08:11 PM   #196
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and yes, thats the one i got

he brought it over to my office in LA, and then it was hand carried over to Bali by our sales manager that was by chance coming over here,


waiting at the metal lather who drilled out the 2 holes, hehe
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Old November 25th, 2011, 08:00 AM   #197
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Dang waylam

I installed and mod e everything by hand with a hand drill and grinder. You're lucky to have a whole machine shop
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Old December 16th, 2011, 05:47 PM   #198
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ha HA! Drinking and grinding.
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Old December 16th, 2011, 05:56 PM   #199
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rexbo, nice cuts... but i think you need to get rid of that 10lbs chemical plant you've got under your nuts!
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Old December 16th, 2011, 06:08 PM   #200
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ha HA! Drinking and grinding.
I'm confused

Is this still legal for 250 CVMA?
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