Anyone know how to do that typical movie moto move?

IF13 · September 18th, 2013, 07:06 PM

Most recently, it was shown in that Wolverine movie.

He's on the bike and he does a 180 turn on the motorcycle, camera zooms on the rear wheel (I think) as its spinning wildly and kicking up dirt.

How do you do that? I'm thinking it's kind of like a burn out but you've got the handlebar turned and I suppose the bike just tries to kind of straighten itself out as the rear wheel is spinning? I don't know.

Then there's the move where you're slowing down and you make a quick turn and you stop the motorcycle sideways like how an ice skater stops quickly. I don't have an idea on how that's done.

Sirref · September 18th, 2013, 07:27 PM

I don't know about the first one but for the second one I do that all the time on my mtb by locking the rear wheel up and using that to steer in general, occasionally to stop. I have never and will never attempt that on a motorcycle as it's the sort of thing where with the heavier bike you have less control over it and it poses more risk of damage and such. my mtb is a tank, and I'd rather not scratch up my 300 or any other motorcycle for that matter if I could avoid it by not doing stupid stuff.

but yea you can do it by locking up the rear and letting it step out, be warned there is a risk of just having it slide out from under you and leaving you on the ground

IF13 · September 18th, 2013, 07:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sirref

I don't know about the first one but for the second one I do that all the time on my mtb by locking the rear wheel up and using that to steer in general, occasionally to stop. I have never and will never attempt that on a motorcycle as it's the sort of thing where with the heavier bike you have less control over it and it poses more risk of damage and such. my mtb is a tank, and I'd rather not scratch up my 300 or any other motorcycle for that matter if I could avoid it by not doing stupid stuff.

but yea you can do it by locking up the rear and letting it step out, be warned there is a risk of just having it slide out from under you and leaving you on the ground

Ugh but it looks so cool. Then again, now it just feels like something only people who really know their bikes should do and Ive yet to achieve some sort of symbiotic relationship with my ninjette so scratch that.

Also the first one, I guess it's simply doing a 180 on your motocycle from zero.

subxero · September 18th, 2013, 07:53 PM

it obviously requires you to put the rear wheel into a spin then turn the bars and you pivot off the inside foot and use your body to slightly push the bikes back end to initiate the arc movement of the rear. It's super easy on a dirt bike but they are light and well generally on dirt. It would be fairly easy on a street bike on gravel or dirt but they are heavy and if you get slightly off balance or have poor throttle control you will drop it or worse let go of bars then rear grabs traction and launches.

Doing it on pavement is that much more sketchy, again it all rides on you keeping the rear wheel spinning and not hooking up with the ground, if you mess that up and the tire grabs you are screwed, again street bikes are heavy and can not be muscled around very easily. If you want to do it, do it on a dirtbike if you want to risk dropping your street bike or worse try it with the street bike but do it in a safe place

Sirref · September 18th, 2013, 08:16 PM

I agree with the do it on a dirtbike thing, though you can get the same effect on a mtb

CycleCam303 · September 18th, 2013, 08:34 PM

You come to almost a stop, stomp on the rear brake and turn the bars hard in the direction you want to go no countersteering since you should be going slow, rev bike up while doing this and dump/use clutch control to keep the rear tire in a constant state of traction loss. You can't hesitate on the throttle. If the rear hooks you'll get thrown into a sideways wheelie or the bike will launch right out of your hands. When transitioning from rear brake to throttle plant a foot and lightly weight it to make the 180 or 360 or whatever you plan on doing. Your body position needs to be straight up and down while you lean the bike away from you. Like a dirt bike.

A ninja 250 needs about 70 more hp and 2.5 times the torque for this to even happen on any kind of Tarmac. It's not easy on a dirt bike and it requires good balance and clutch and throttle control. You're tipping the bike in but not too much because you'll drop it and you're using the right amount of throttle to get the bike to stand up but not totally light up the rear so you low side.

I did drills doing this exact maneuver with klx140s set up as dirt track racers with feel like a pro dirt.

IF13 · September 18th, 2013, 09:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CycleCam303

You come to almost a stop, stomp on the rear brake and turn the bars hard in the direction you want to go no countersteering since you should be going slow, rev bike up while doing this and dump/use clutch control to keep the rear tire in a constant state of traction loss. You can't hesitate on the throttle. If the rear hooks you'll get thrown into a sideways wheelie or the bike will launch right out of your hands. When transitioning from rear brake to throttle plant a foot and lightly weight it to make the 180 or 360 or whatever you plan on doing. Your body position needs to be straight up and down while you lean the bike away from you. Like a dirt bike.

A ninja 250 needs about 70 more hp and 2.5 times the torque for this to even happen on any kind of Tarmac. It's not easy on a dirt bike and it requires good balance and clutch and throttle control. You're tipping the bike in but not too much because you'll drop it and you're using the right amount of throttle to get the bike to stand up but not totally light up the rear so you low side.

I did drills doing this exact maneuver with klx140s set up as dirt track racers with feel like a pro dirt.

I love technique talk, reading this post was like motorcycle erotica or something. It's just amazing that stunters make this look so damn easy and natural as if it's the only way of stopping the bike. Guess it'll remain a dream on the 250 then.

Anyways, do you happen to know what this way of stopping/ turning is called?

CycleCam303 · September 18th, 2013, 10:53 PM

In the car world when you dona 180 and stop its called a J turn. If you want to show off at a group meeting point I've done the lock the rear tire and turn then stop. Just ask @anacron and @tfkrocks how I abuse the rear brake and tire in the dirt

You need to make it predictable so you don't drop the bike. Here's how I would do it.

While slowing down with the front or both brakes slow to about 15ish mph. Maybe 20 I don't know how fast I'm going to be honest. Pull in clutch and don't let go until stopped and into position. The engine will stop if you don't pull in the clutch and of you need to give it gas or let out the clutch the bike will still be in gear and it will be like having the brake on.

While still going straight or before input lock the rear tire. As soon as it locks start turning the bars into the direction you want to be facing. Depending on how fast and how much steering you add you may have to counter steer. Not the counter steer like what you do at speed the counter steering into the direction of the slide to prevent the bike from turning too far from sliding.

No matter what once the rear is locked DO NOT get off the rear brake. If you get the bike sideways and let go the force from the rear tire regaining traction will pop you straight up and probably spit you off or you'll lose grip and have the bike fall on you.

You won't look quite as cool as the movies. But locking the rear while turning the bike is not very predictable unless you've done it a couple 100 times. Once the rear is locked in a straight line the turning movements will create a slower transition from straight to sideways. You'll just have to be a bit more deliberate with your body and steering.

Leaning with the bike while doing this makes the rear step out farther. Staying on top will provide more predictable rear slides but will make it harder for the tail to rotate. So then more/quicker steering will get the desired angle. It takes practice. Remember the good stunt guys all practice that stuff and their bikes are torn up for a reason. You're going to crash while learning.

mikromo · September 19th, 2013, 03:08 PM

As an ex dirtbike racer (hare scrambles) I used the rear brake to steer the bike quickly. The harder you are on the front brake, the less traction on the rear, so brake sliding to make a tight turn, was the best way to get it done. However, It takes some practice to do it at will. Since loss of traction happens at quite low speeds in the dirt, and dirtbikes (2 strokes) are light, it doesn't take long to master the skills needed. Not to mention that it doesn't hurt as bad to take a spill in the dirt, as compared to the pavement. Sliding the rear to tighten your "arc" is known as oversteering. You may be able to ride the Ninjette to a stop, without falling down, with the rear locked up, shouldn't be so hard, but to also do a 180 and stay upright.....doubt you could do it if you wanted to. Remember that M/C wheels act like gyroscopes when spinning (keeping you upright), when you lock one up all bets are off.

September 18th, 2013, 07:06 PM	#1
IF13 WOT WOT WOT Name: Ken Location: Suffolk Join Date: Jul 2013 Motorcycle(s): '12 Ninja 250R Posts: 421	Anyone know how to do that typical movie moto move? Most recently, it was shown in that Wolverine movie. He's on the bike and he does a 180 turn on the motorcycle, camera zooms on the rear wheel (I think) as its spinning wildly and kicking up dirt. How do you do that? I'm thinking it's kind of like a burn out but you've got the handlebar turned and I suppose the bike just tries to kind of straighten itself out as the rear wheel is spinning? I don't know. Then there's the move where you're slowing down and you make a quick turn and you stop the motorcycle sideways like how an ice skater stops quickly. I don't have an idea on how that's done. __________________________________________________ May your roads stay clear....

September 18th, 2013, 07:53 PM	#4
subxero dirty boy Name: Joe Location: Johnstown, PA Join Date: Sep 2012 Motorcycle(s): I don't even know anymore?? Posts: A lot. MOTM - Apr '14	it obviously requires you to put the rear wheel into a spin then turn the bars and you pivot off the inside foot and use your body to slightly push the bikes back end to initiate the arc movement of the rear. It's super easy on a dirt bike but they are light and well generally on dirt. It would be fairly easy on a street bike on gravel or dirt but they are heavy and if you get slightly off balance or have poor throttle control you will drop it or worse let go of bars then rear grabs traction and launches. Doing it on pavement is that much more sketchy, again it all rides on you keeping the rear wheel spinning and not hooking up with the ground, if you mess that up and the tire grabs you are screwed, again street bikes are heavy and can not be muscled around very easily. If you want to do it, do it on a dirtbike if you want to risk dropping your street bike or worse try it with the street bike but do it in a safe place __________________________________________________ I love the smell of burning pre-mix in the morning I don't think I'm a lot dumber than you thought that I think that I thought I was once.

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September 18th, 2013, 07:27 PM	#2
Sirref Private Joker Name: Ben Location: Towson, MD Join Date: Nov 2012 Motorcycle(s): '99/'01 Ninja 250 "sketchy", '13 Ninja 300 "yoshi", '03 GSXR 600 "merlin" Posts: A lot. MOTM - Mar '14	I don't know about the first one but for the second one I do that all the time on my mtb by locking the rear wheel up and using that to steer in general, occasionally to stop. I have never and will never attempt that on a motorcycle as it's the sort of thing where with the heavier bike you have less control over it and it poses more risk of damage and such. my mtb is a tank, and I'd rather not scratch up my 300 or any other motorcycle for that matter if I could avoid it by not doing stupid stuff. but yea you can do it by locking up the rear and letting it step out, be warned there is a risk of just having it slide out from under you and leaving you on the ground

September 18th, 2013, 08:16 PM	#5
Sirref Private Joker Name: Ben Location: Towson, MD Join Date: Nov 2012 Motorcycle(s): '99/'01 Ninja 250 "sketchy", '13 Ninja 300 "yoshi", '03 GSXR 600 "merlin" Posts: A lot. MOTM - Mar '14	I agree with the do it on a dirtbike thing, though you can get the same effect on a mtb

September 18th, 2013, 08:34 PM	#6
CycleCam303 King Hamfist Name: Cameron Location: NorCal East Bay Join Date: Oct 2012 Motorcycle(s): 2007 Crf 150R, 2011 Hypermotard 796 Posts: 940	You come to almost a stop, stomp on the rear brake and turn the bars hard in the direction you want to go no countersteering since you should be going slow, rev bike up while doing this and dump/use clutch control to keep the rear tire in a constant state of traction loss. You can't hesitate on the throttle. If the rear hooks you'll get thrown into a sideways wheelie or the bike will launch right out of your hands. When transitioning from rear brake to throttle plant a foot and lightly weight it to make the 180 or 360 or whatever you plan on doing. Your body position needs to be straight up and down while you lean the bike away from you. Like a dirt bike. A ninja 250 needs about 70 more hp and 2.5 times the torque for this to even happen on any kind of Tarmac. It's not easy on a dirt bike and it requires good balance and clutch and throttle control. You're tipping the bike in but not too much because you'll drop it and you're using the right amount of throttle to get the bike to stand up but not totally light up the rear so you low side. I did drills doing this exact maneuver with klx140s set up as dirt track racers with feel like a pro dirt.

September 18th, 2013, 10:53 PM	#8
CycleCam303 King Hamfist Name: Cameron Location: NorCal East Bay Join Date: Oct 2012 Motorcycle(s): 2007 Crf 150R, 2011 Hypermotard 796 Posts: 940	In the car world when you dona 180 and stop its called a J turn. If you want to show off at a group meeting point I've done the lock the rear tire and turn then stop. Just ask @anacron and @tfkrocks how I abuse the rear brake and tire in the dirt You need to make it predictable so you don't drop the bike. Here's how I would do it. While slowing down with the front or both brakes slow to about 15ish mph. Maybe 20 I don't know how fast I'm going to be honest. Pull in clutch and don't let go until stopped and into position. The engine will stop if you don't pull in the clutch and of you need to give it gas or let out the clutch the bike will still be in gear and it will be like having the brake on. While still going straight or before input lock the rear tire. As soon as it locks start turning the bars into the direction you want to be facing. Depending on how fast and how much steering you add you may have to counter steer. Not the counter steer like what you do at speed the counter steering into the direction of the slide to prevent the bike from turning too far from sliding. No matter what once the rear is locked DO NOT get off the rear brake. If you get the bike sideways and let go the force from the rear tire regaining traction will pop you straight up and probably spit you off or you'll lose grip and have the bike fall on you. You won't look quite as cool as the movies. But locking the rear while turning the bike is not very predictable unless you've done it a couple 100 times. Once the rear is locked in a straight line the turning movements will create a slower transition from straight to sideways. You'll just have to be a bit more deliberate with your body and steering. Leaning with the bike while doing this makes the rear step out farther. Staying on top will provide more predictable rear slides but will make it harder for the tail to rotate. So then more/quicker steering will get the desired angle. It takes practice. Remember the good stunt guys all practice that stuff and their bikes are torn up for a reason. You're going to crash while learning.

September 19th, 2013, 03:08 PM	#9
mikromo ninjette.org member Name: Mike Location: Independence, MO Join Date: Sep 2013 Motorcycle(s): 1970 Moto Guzzi Ambassador, 1999 Honda VFR800, 2001 Kawasaki ZRX1200R, 2010 Kawasaki ninja 250 (sold) Posts: 59	As an ex dirtbike racer (hare scrambles) I used the rear brake to steer the bike quickly. The harder you are on the front brake, the less traction on the rear, so brake sliding to make a tight turn, was the best way to get it done. However, It takes some practice to do it at will. Since loss of traction happens at quite low speeds in the dirt, and dirtbikes (2 strokes) are light, it doesn't take long to master the skills needed. Not to mention that it doesn't hurt as bad to take a spill in the dirt, as compared to the pavement. Sliding the rear to tighten your "arc" is known as oversteering. You may be able to ride the Ninjette to a stop, without falling down, with the rear locked up, shouldn't be so hard, but to also do a 180 and stay upright.....doubt you could do it if you wanted to. Remember that M/C wheels act like gyroscopes when spinning (keeping you upright), when you lock one up all bets are off.