RE: Theater Shooting...

[Whiskey]

Originally Posted by slickt0mmy

They also found explosives inside the theater, which they believed he either planted or threw into the crowd, from last I heard.

Banning guns will not stop people from trying things like this. They will simply find another means of doing the same thing they wanted to do in the first place. Humans will always find ways to kill other humans. Banning "dangerous things" is not going to change that.

I think rather than focus on banning guns, why are we not teaching gun safety classes in high school? I'm sure even the most liberal of parents would like their child to at least know what to do with a loaded gun, in the event that they run across one (at a friend's house, left in a public restroom by a police officer [believe me, it happens]).

So why did you leave your sidearm in the gents, and how did you discover it...

I @adouglas, I couldn't have put it better myself, especially the parts about training & criminals using whatever tool is readily available to them.

Anyone who owns a firearm should know exactly how to use it, when it's acceptable to use it & how to properly make that decision.

[FrugalNinja250]

The first post was by a tool who almost literally climbed up upon the still bleeding pile of bodies so he could wave his trollish ideological bait around. This thread should have been closed right then, IMHO. That being said, there has only been one post expressing sympathy for the victims of this horrific crime, and that post was made by someone in another country.

To me, that says more about the state of our society than anything else posted in this thread.

This tragedy has destroyed and damaged the lives of hundreds of people in this great nation, and my heart goes out to all who have been hurt by this.

[xSean13]

Originally Posted by Jono

This guy was so crazy but had a clean record. It is quite scary how insane some people can be. The man obviously needed help. I wonder if anybody knew that the shooter might be troubled.

I think we need some stricter laws on buying guns. Apparently he bought all these guns and ammo within 60 days. How is that not like a red flag? Doesn't anybody look at this. I think Heed might be right when he said it is harder to get a drivers license in this country. But I guess it doesn't matter. If someone wants a gun they can get one. Legally or illegally.

I think when I turn 21 I am going to get a handgun and then try to get a CCW permit. I want to be able to protect my ass from crazies!

Both of my sisters, bro-in-law (he's a cop...so, obviously), and my dad have their concealed carry permit...they're putting the pressure on me!

[slickt0mmy]

Originally Posted by Whiskey

So why did you leave your sidearm in the gents, and how did you discover it...

Nah, not me. But it's happened here locally once or twice. News stories about a 12 year old discovering a loaded pistol sitting on the sink in a Walmart bathroom, if I remember correctly. Come to find out later, it belonged to a local PD officer who forgot it. Could have been a tragic situation if the kids discovering it were a little less responsible and a little more curious. Which brings me to my point about teaching gun safety in school.

[lgk]

Originally Posted by FrugalNinja250

To me, that says more about the state of our society than anything else posted in this thread.

that's not a fair statement.
just because something wasn't posted doesn't mean people didn't feel it...

i meditated and prayed for the families for hours at a time.
looked for ways i could help them, analyze the perps equipment, tried to place myself in the scenario, etc.

[FrugalNinja250]

Originally Posted by lgk

that's not a fair statement.
just because something wasn't posted doesn't mean people didn't feel it...

i meditated and prayed for the families for hours at a time.
looked for ways i could help them, analyze the perps equipment, tried to place myself in the scenario, etc.

My opinion was offered only as such. Anyone can read through this thread and make their own decision. The OP should be banned, IMHO.

[Countersteer]

Originally Posted by FrugalNinja250

My opinion was offered only as such. Anyone can read through this thread and make their own decision. The OP should be banned, IMHO.

Frugal, you should try to understand my point before you start calling for a "banning". If you really want to understand, PM me; otherwise continue responding emotionally.

[Stingray1000]

Originally Posted by Alex

Bullshit. Post them or link to them, and the faulty logic and/or math will be clear to all.

So I have a permit for a handgun, Had a Makarov 9mm in a lockbox hidden in an access panel in my closet. A theif broke into my home and stole the whole lockbox among other things. It almost looked as if he was digging around the closet and decided to look in the panel and BINGO, GUN! Had to report the weapon stolen... Now because of my permit and my gun someone has the ability to shoot someone else. And most people don't hide/protect there weapons the way I did, they make it easier to find.... Now I have to wonder everyday if someone lost a life because my gun was used on them..... Permits with more people owning guns means that more peopkle will be able to steal guns and more crimes would be comitted... I think it would be equal "Crime" but more people would lsoe their lives committing or stopping them.

[lgk]

Originally Posted by Stingray1000

So I have a permit for a handgun, Had a Makarov 9mm in a lockbox hidden in an access panel in my closet. A theif broke into my home and stole the whole lockbox among other things. It almost looked as if he was digging around the closet and decided to look in the panel and BINGO, GUN! Had to report the weapon stolen... Now because of my permit and my gun someone has the ability to shoot someone else. And most people don't hide/protect there weapons the way I did, they make it easier to find.... Now I have to wonder everyday if someone lost a life because my gun was used on them..... Permits with more people owning guns means that more peopkle will be able to steal guns and more crimes would be comitted... I think it would be equal "Crime" but more people would lsoe their lives committing or stopping them.

why weren't you carrying it?

[Stingray1000]

Originally Posted by lgk

why weren't you carrying it?

Because I wasn't going in a shady area, and I considered my license a privelage I didn't want to lsoe. I'm not a cop and it's not my duty to protect or serve. Someone snatches it off me or somehting to that effect. Lots of reason. Just because you're allowed to do somehting doesn't always mean you should.....

[Stingray1000]

And BACK ON TOPIC:

God bless the families who lost loved ones that night.

[lgk]

Originally Posted by Stingray1000

Because I wasn't going in a shady

Crime doesn't only happen in "shady" areas...

Originally Posted by Stingray1000

I considered my license a privelage I didn't want to lsoe.

the supreme court says that firearm ownership is a right not a privilege.
you cant be barred from buying a pistol, unless your a felon, or been involuntarily committed to a mental institution.

Originally Posted by Stingray1000

I'm not a cop and it's not my duty to protect or serve.

cops don't have to protect anyone, but it is your responsibility to protect yourself so you can pay taxes.

Originally Posted by Stingray1000

Someone snatches it off me or somehting to that effect. Lots of reason.

you had no control over it, thats why it was stolen.
carrying it is responsible.
don't blame yourself for a murder, it was no ones fault except for the criminal.

Originally Posted by Stingray1000

Just because you're allowed to do somehting doesn't always mean you should.....

that's up to your comfort level... and the law.
you need to be more relaxed about carrying.

[slickt0mmy]

Originally Posted by Stingray1000

Because I wasn't going in a shady area, and I considered my license a privelage I didn't want to lsoe. I'm not a cop and it's not my duty to protect or serve. Someone snatches it off me or somehting to that effect. Lots of reason. Just because you're allowed to do somehting doesn't always mean you should.....

Because violent crime only ever happens in shady areas, right?

But you're definitely right about concealed carry permit holders not being cops. It is not our duty to protect anyone other than ourselves and the ones we love. However, it's not the duty of the police either. The Supreme Court ruled that the police have no constitutional duty to protect individuals from harm. (Warren v. District of Columbia) They will, if possible, but in general, police get there AFTER a crime has been committed.
So with that in mind, you are truly on your own. And so am I. And anyone else reading this. We are all responsible for our own safety. Even a police response time of less than a minute is too slow when two men have kicked down your front door and are coming at you right NOW.

[Alex]

Originally Posted by Countersteer

Frugal, you should try to understand my point before you start calling for a "banning". If you really want to understand, PM me; otherwise continue responding emotionally.

Why don't you make your point clear in public, so we all can come to an informed opinion of whether you are being trollish on purpose or inadvertently?

[AznJoJo]

Sad, what happened. I'm surprised at how quickly he's in court already.

[lgk]

Originally Posted by AznJoJo

Sad, what happened. I'm surprised at how quickly he's in court already.

looks like a bond hearing.
this is going to be drawn out for months, hopefully i'm wrong...

[capriccio]

Coming from an Asia country where all guns are banned, I can tell you I've never heard of a mass shooting in my country. I believe if you ban all guns, there won't be mass shooting anymore. However, I don't know how the crime rate and the mass shooting rate correlate.

And to remind the guys who said someone with gun can stop the shooting in that cinema, think again. That freak had all amours and gas mask. I'm pretty skeptical about the ability of a normal guy shooting in panic + gas... Who knows, if someone shot the suspect and couldn't kill him, he might get his "game face" on and decide to use ALL his weapons.

[Countersteer]

Originally Posted by Countersteer

I am thankful that so many men of Aurora, Colorado in the theater that fateful evening were armed and ready to defend not only their lives but the lives of others. Without their prompt action in a time of crisis I am certain that many more would have lost their lives or been seriously injured.

What a great country we live in, with a Constitution that insures our right to protect ourselves and those we love; where logic prevails over emotion. It is terrible circumstances such as this that ensures our right to bear arms!

The reason I wrote this and even had this thought was simply because I am saddened by the fact that I live in a country that is so politically correct and so removed from ideas of personal defense on a national scale that a man can walk into a public space and start shooting people and NO ONE returns fire or attacks in any way.

How is this possible?

What has happened to America, the land of the free and home of the brave? Next time you sing along to the national anthem, please think about the words you sing and the truth of them.

I am truly saddened by this event, however, I am saddened even more by what will inevitably be the wrong response by this nation and it will lead to even more death and dismay at the hands of lunatics like James Holmes. His set the bar for mass shootings in this country. Who will step up next? Someone will, especially as this nation grows weaker and weaker and more and more defenseless at the individual level.

And remember, I believe I appropriately posted this in the "off-topic" category and you chose to read and respond.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troll_%28Internet%29
In Internet slang, a troll is someone who posts inflammatory,[2] extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as an online discussion forum, chat room, or blog, with the primary intent of provoking readers into an emotional response[3] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.

[slickt0mmy]

Originally Posted by capriccio

Coming from an Asia country where all guns are banned, I can tell you I've never heard of a mass shooting in my country. I believe if you ban all guns, there won't be mass shooting anymore. However, I don't know how the crime rate and the mass shooting rate correlate.

And to remind the guys who said someone with gun can stop the shooting in that cinema, think again. That freak had all amours and gas mask. I'm pretty skeptical about the ability of a normal guy shooting in panic + gas... Who knows, if someone shot the suspect and couldn't kill him, he might get his "game face" on and decide to use ALL his weapons.

You're right. If you were able to magically snap your fingers and all guns would disappear from the earth, there wouldn't be mass shootings anymore. Except now you're left with mass bombings, stabbings, bludgeonings, etc. Do you really think taking away firearms is going to stop anyone intent on murdering another human being? Do you think we had no murders before guns were invented?

And contrary to what you see in movies, body armor isn't a magical shield against bullets. You can still die from the blunt force trauma, as well as suffer some pretty nasty broken ribs. At the very least, you get the wind knocked out of you and are vulnerable to attack until you get your bearings.

Like I said before, if you carry a gun, you need to have continuous and professional training. Any firearms instructor worth his salt would teach the "Failure Drill" (also known as the "Mozambique Drill") which involves two shots to the chest and one to the head. Body armor ain't gonna do much for you then.

[Jiggles]

If only they had banned swords 800 years ago, so many lives could have been saved

[capriccio]

Well, that's why I said mass shooting and crime rate don't correlate. I'm not 100% against having a gun. Says if you are a single mom in dangerous area of Detroit, the gun could provide you safety. But the thing is people in America can but whatever guns (a little exaggerated) they want. What do you need an assault rifle for ? Protect against alien invasion ? Why do you need 10 guns to protect you ?
It is like you said you buy a bike as a transportation mean, but then you start buying cruiser, touring bike, supersports. But in this case, it is not necessary good. Can anyone invent a law that restrict maximum one gun per household ?

[Jiggles]

You are not too familiar with guns are you

[capriccio]

Jiggle, how many guns do you have ? or you titties are enough to scare anyone who wants to harm you ?

[Jiggles]

Three. Would have more but motorcycling consumed my finances. I've been wanting a replica 1887 for a very long time. Only $800, actually I think I can swing that now. I'll make a call too my gun dealer tomorrow

[YORCHI]

Originally Posted by capriccio

Well, that's why I said mass shooting and crime rate don't correlate. I'm not 100% against having a gun. Says if you are a single mom in dangerous area of Detroit, the gun could provide you safety. But the thing is people in America can but whatever guns (a little exaggerated) they want. What do you need an assault rifle for ? Protect against alien invasion ? Why do you need 10 guns to protect you ?
It is like you said you buy a bike as a transportation mean, but then you start buying cruiser, touring bike, supersports. But in this case, it is not necessary good. Can anyone invent a law that restrict maximum one gun per household ?

Why do we want to have 10 guns or more and a million rounds ammo, because we want to. We don't need most of the crap in our lives but we have it because we want to or because we tell ourselves that we need it but we really don't. Why do girls have hundreds of pairs of shoes but only wear a few? Why do we eat fast food when we know it's bad for us? Why do people still do drugs or drink and drive knowing it's illegal? It's all because people want to do these things and as long as they're following the law they shouldn't be stopped from doing things they want to as long as they're legal.

A more serious response about wanting more than one gun would be this: I personally just bought a 9mm Glock that my wife and I can both use easily and safely. I want to buy a 12 gauge shotgun because they are very versatile and also very good weapons to have for security. I can use the shotgun to break locks, to kill birds, and to shoot people in self defense.

I also want to buy a .22 rifle that I can use to shoot for fun at a range or in the woods and to hunt down small animals if I ever need to. Like during the zombie apocalypse when I need to hunt squirrels for food.

Lastly, I would want to buy an AR-15 because I'm very familiar with them since I'm in the Marines and I know how good they are at everything. I wouldn't necessarily use it for home defense but I can still use it at the range or in the woods for target practice or to hunt as well. And when the zombies come, I can use it to kill zombies from much further away than my 9mm and shotgun would be able to.

Now, I'm a 29 year old Marine with a wife and a daughter. I have never done anything wrong and I have no criminal record at all. If I have a house and very secure gun safe what is so wrong about me having all four of those guns plus plenty of ammo on hand at all times? I always follow the law and I only shoot my guns at the range or in a secure area where I can practice. I hope to God I never have to use them for self defense but I will never be sure of that so I prepare for the worst and hope for the best.

[lgk]

Originally Posted by Jiggles

If only they had banned swords 800 years ago, so many lives could have been saved

if only the dark ages was banned, so many lives could have been saved...

[espacef1fan]

If only murder was banned...then NOONE would be able to use it on people.

Wait....

[lgk]

Originally Posted by capriccio

Can anyone invent a law that restrict maximum one gun per household ?

why don't we restrict peoples forum access to one post per household?

how effective are your rights then?

[Alex]

Or perhaps restrict to one terrible analogy per day.

[slickt0mmy]

Originally Posted by capriccio

Well, that's why I said mass shooting and crime rate don't correlate. I'm not 100% against having a gun. Says if you are a single mom in dangerous area of Detroit, the gun could provide you safety. But the thing is people in America can but whatever guns (a little exaggerated) they want. What do you need an assault rifle for ? Protect against alien invasion ? Why do you need 10 guns to protect you ?
It is like you said you buy a bike as a transportation mean, but then you start buying cruiser, touring bike, supersports. But in this case, it is not necessary good. Can anyone invent a law that restrict maximum one gun per household ?

Everyone else that has commented on your post has made excellent points, and said pretty much all that I would have.

But just to clear something up, an "assault rifle" is a rifle with full auto capabilities. A generic AR-15, like the one used in the theater shooting, is NOT an assault rifle. It is simply a semi-automatic sporting rifle.

This:
and this:
are EXACTLY the same, under the law. They each fire one round (of relatively similar size, btw) with one pull of the trigger. The main reason everyone throws a fit about the bottom one is that it looks scarier.

Real "assault rifles" (ones with full auto capabilities) cost well over $10,000, require completely different forms to be filled out when purchasing, and buyers are put through a much more rigorous background check than when buying normal firearms. This means that any person who legally obtains an "assault rifle" is squeaky clean and really of no worry to you or anyone else.

I know it seems nit-picky, but it's hard to have a conversation about firearms when most people don't know correct terminology. Not that I blame you. The media bombards everyone with so much misinformation just to spread their agenda, unless you're a firearms enthusiast you wouldn't generally know these things.

[lgk]

Originally Posted by Alex

Or perhaps restrict to one terrible analogy per day.

both statements are equally ridiculous.

my point is that rights should not be limited by quantity.
you want to write a hundred books, go ahead.
want to buy a couple of guns and a stockpile of ammo, that's fine also.

[Jiggles]

Originally Posted by slickt0mmy

This:
and this:

The bottom one is illegal in california even if it is semi auto and limited to a 10 round magazine. The reason? Front grip.

In California, a front vertical grip on any rifle is considered an assault rifle and therefore banned.

Want to make a ruger 10/22 an assault rifle, front grip that **** lmfao

[slickt0mmy]

Originally Posted by Jiggles

The bottom one is illegal in california even if it is semi auto and limited to a 10 round magazine. The reason? Front grip.

In California, a front vertical grip on any rifle is considered an assault rifle and therefore banned.

Want to make a ruger 10/22 an assault rifle, front grip that **** lmfao

Haha Yeah, I figured the 30 round magazine would get pointed out but I was not aware of the front grip law. Thanks for the info!

Although technically, Kommifornia shouldn't count since it's basically another country when it comes to gun rights.

[Jiggles]

Haha yea, I have a nice little hand book "How to own a gun in california and not go to jail"

Yea you need to buy a handbook and read up on all the laws so that you do not accidentally commit a felony

[slickt0mmy]

Also, turns out that he wasn't even wearing body armor. It was simply a tactical vest to hold all his crap.

http://www.sfgate.com/news/article/R...sh-3730881.php

[lgk]

So this confirms a ccw would have made a difference....

[Jiggles]

Aim for the head not the chest

[slickt0mmy]

Originally Posted by lgk

So this confirms a ccw would have made a difference....

Well not necessarily. It definitely would have if they had a clear shot and were well trained enough to take that shot, despite the other distractions in the room.
The main thing is that this should silence all the nay-sayers going "But he was wearing body armor! He's practically invincible!!"

[lgk]

Originally Posted by Jiggles

Aim for the head not the chest

in this case it wouldn't have made a difference.
a couple of center of mass shots with a 9mm would have stopped him.

[lgk]

Originally Posted by slickt0mmy

Well not necessarily. It definitely would have if they had a clear shot and were well trained enough to take that shot, despite the other distractions in the room.
The main thing is that this should silence all the nay-sayers going "But he was wearing body armor! He's practically invincible!!"

what im saying is the the ccw would not have any negative impact on the situation.

the ccw holder should be able to carry any place that is open to the general public.