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Old May 23rd, 2021, 01:54 PM   #1
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Resto-mod for my 98 Ninja 250

Hello everyone, I'm back, and of course I've got a new idea/project.

My 98 has served me well for the past 7 years, but I need and engine for it. So I started looking for a replacement, then I came across a complete with ECU, wiring harness, etc 2017 Ninja 300, with very low miles.

So I'm gonna put that in my 98.

This should be interesting to say the least. If anyone has done this before, please feel free to post things I need to know.
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Old May 24th, 2021, 06:48 AM   #2
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You have the wiring harness and the ECU, so essentially everything need to make the engine start and run.

Never done this sort of thing myself, but some immediate items that come to mind are:

- Fitting the 300 harness to the 250 frame; ground points, switches, etc.

- Fueling; do the petcocks differ at all? how foes the 300 get gas to the FI versus how the 250 pulls gas into the carbs?

- cooling; do you have the 300 rad? are they even different? will the 250 hoses fit?

- Engine mounting: do the mount holes line up? will you need need to fabricate brackets? does the output shaft line up with the rear sprocket?
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Old May 24th, 2021, 07:25 AM   #3
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Here's everything I'm getting with the engine,

Every single sensor is there with the wiring narness.

Comes with:

Engine

Air box

ECU

display/cluster

Exhaust

Brake master cylinder

Brake caliper

Radiator and it's piping

Wiring harness

I'm probably forgetting some stuff.

Cooling it shouldn't be an issue, and I think I have to do some grinding on one of the mounts.

Fuel is gonna be the tricky one, the fuel pump, level sensor in all one unit, and mounts inside the tank, I figured I'd go with an external pump.

Wiring should be interesting, but knowing Kawasaki, it should be to far off.

I'm excited about taking this project on, and can't wait to see it done.

All else fails, I'll just use the carbs, and change out the flywheel and side cover.
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Old May 24th, 2021, 08:55 AM   #4
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Guessing the Goldwing is all buttoned up?

Or maybe you have the same bad habit that I do....starting more than 1 project at a time.
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Old May 24th, 2021, 11:49 AM   #5
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I have the same plan for my ZZR250. I was in the middle of a 315cc (64mm bore in 250 cylinders) high compression big bore when I bust my arm falling off my Versys-x 300 Grrrrrr. So nearly back to enough function to start wielding spanners again. Be interesting to see how yours goes.
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Old May 24th, 2021, 12:07 PM   #6
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Cool project.
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Old May 24th, 2021, 02:24 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by davenay67 View Post
Guessing the Goldwing is all buttoned up?

Or maybe you have the same bad habit that I do....starting more than 1 project at a time.
Almost just a few more days, and it's done.

I didn't plan on replacing the engine in the 250 this soon, but I got the 300 engine for cheap, seriously cheap.
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Old June 2nd, 2021, 01:32 PM   #8
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Okay so I got the engine, and all the stuff that came with it. Some of the connectors are marked from the last person, whom thought enough to make some, but not all.

So looks like a bit of research is needed of course, and if anyone has any information, please feel free to post it, or if you need a better picture of something.
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Old June 18th, 2021, 02:02 PM   #9
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After looking at the possibility of mounting the OEM FI intank set-up, I was going to cut up the bottom of a 300 tank, then weld it into the bottom of an 07 250 tank, but the frame backbone of the 250 wouldn't allow this, it doesn't seem like there's room.

So for now in going external pump, regulator, and filter, which is a different problem of fitment. I've ordered these, so we'll see.

stay tuned......
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Old July 18th, 2021, 02:59 PM   #10
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Been busy finishing up another big project, now I can start on this one



Hooked up a battery while it's still on the cart, just to see if it would



Link to original page on YouTube.



A small shot of starting fluid, it sputtered to life, kinda. All looks good, the only thing is I was told it only had about 7k miles, but as you can see it's pretty much double that.



So the first thing was to install the PAIR valve elimination kit from Smartmoto. A nice complete kit, with stainless steel hardware too, looks nice and clean.


So I'm about to start this project, got a few things to work out, but I can start by removing everything from the Ninja 250, engine and the complete wiring harness, etc... everything no longer needed.

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Old July 25th, 2021, 11:41 AM   #11
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I finished up my other two motorcycle projects, so it's time to start on this.

Step one remove all the stuff I don't need anymore. I did look at the oil when I drained it, and there was A LOT of metal in it, so it's most definitely dead to me.

Remove all the fairings, engine, wiring harness, etc.. easy enough to do on these bikes.

So as I said earlier, from what I've read I'll need to grind the upper front mount on the engine, so it can fit the mount. but it turns out I don't have to.

I counted on Kawasaki being lazy, and they were. I got the upper mount off a Ninja 300, and it bolts right in, you just need to use the old bolts that go through the frame. But I'm gonna drill out the old frame so I can use Ninja bolts, as they are 10mm instead of the 8mm old bolts. I'll let you know how the goes.

This makes the engine at least a true bolt in job, no grinding, etc ..

This is good to know, as the 300, and newgen 250 engines are pretty much the same. Interesting note they don't use the same upper mount brackets, the 300 has a rubber mount style, the 250 doesn't, but the thru bolt is the same size for both 10mm x 210mm.



Now at this point I could have swapped out the 250 flywheel, stator cover, rejet carbs, and be going down the road. But I have a complete 300 Ninja 300, with everything.



My next thing to figure out is the fuel pump.
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Old July 26th, 2021, 08:29 AM   #12
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Old July 26th, 2021, 12:13 PM   #13
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Gonna be a sleeper!
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Old July 26th, 2021, 02:35 PM   #14
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Watching.
I like how you note that you could swap the carbs over to the 300 and be done. That's a highly legit upgrade right there, and some folk would prefer to stick with the carbs.
I am a fan of FI so I applaud your efforts moving forward.
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Old July 29th, 2021, 02:38 PM   #15
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I thought I'd post some of links I used when researching about doing this project, and to give others whom might be interested in doing the swap, or something like it more than just my way if doing it.

https://www.bayarearidersforum.com/f...d.php?t=494205

https://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=153624

https://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=165565

https://forums.ninja250.org/posting....&t=88113&tro=1
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Old July 31st, 2021, 02:53 PM   #16
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More progress, first off I decided to drill out the upper frame mount, first I used a 3/8", then 7/16" bit, and perfect for the 10mm bolts. After that I bolted the 300 engine, with no issues, and the radiator just to see how it looks.

Next up was the change out the rear sprocket to 42T(OEM 300 gearing) rather than the 45T( OEM pregen 250 gearing) to keep the speedometer accurate, being I'll be using the 300 dash. I did notice that the speed sensor bracket was broke, so I'll need to replace that.

Next mocking up the 300 exhaust system, so goodbye center stand, but then I found out the rear exhaust mount lines up perfectly with the right side frame center stand mount. Thank again Kawasaki for being lazy again.

I decided I'd try to use the 300 airbox, I got it in, but it does make for a few issues I got to figure out, all else fails, I'll go back to the pregen airbox.
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Old August 7th, 2021, 12:13 PM   #17
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Just a thought, I'm thinking about going with pod filters, as this will make the whole filter thing easier
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Old August 7th, 2021, 12:27 PM   #18
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using the 32mm carbs?
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Old August 8th, 2021, 01:39 AM   #19
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Nope, gonna with fuel injection on this as I got everything with the engine. I'm currently working out the fuel pump issues.

Those 32mm carbs were awesome, it made the old 250 engine better for sure.

If anybody needs them please let me know, or if you want them back.
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Old August 8th, 2021, 05:58 PM   #20
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I may be down for the carbs, I'll pm you unless somebody else jumps on them.
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Old August 10th, 2021, 02:36 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thedrewski86 View Post
I may be down for the carbs, I'll pm you unless somebody else jumps on them.
Got your pm, and reply back.

Here is the write-up on the 30mm to 32mm swap, it should answer your questions.

https://www.ninjette.org/forums/show...58#post1111258
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Old August 29th, 2021, 05:05 PM   #22
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Link to original page on YouTube.



Link to original page on YouTube.





Project HQ300 IT'S ALIVE!!!!! Started it several times before I shot the video, so oil was warmed up, and flowing, so don't get on me about reving a cold engine. Also found out the neutral safety switch was bad, fortunately the one from the dead 98' 250 engine was the same.



Before I started it, it got new NGK iridium plugs, stainless steel hardware for the exhaust manifold, Shell Rotella T6, K&N oil filter, and Vortex stainless steel magnetic drain plug.



I had the run a tap for the new exhaust studs to clean up the threads so the installed easily.



I'm happy with the results, the engine is good, so is the used fuel pump.



What do you all think so far?

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Old August 29th, 2021, 06:55 PM   #23
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Woohoo!!! That's pretty darn awesome! Good work!!!
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Old August 29th, 2021, 11:45 PM   #24
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Sweet. I’m still working on my big bore engine, and have my Ohlins shock off for a service whilst I sort out the rear suspension. So I will likely get it tested as a 250 later this year then do the 315cc conversion over the winter, so I can run it in the spring/summer before it needs another annual test. If the engine works out good, then I can do the same again for my X300 too
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Old August 30th, 2021, 07:47 AM   #25
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This is so great, I really commend you for sticking it out and going with fuel injection on this project! I want to do the same thing but keep it carb'd... just because (I don't know, to be different )

Hey, you gotta sell me those 32mm carbs, my little 2-fiddy needs a boost
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Old September 18th, 2021, 08:35 AM   #26
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Retire that poor keyboard operator.
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Old September 18th, 2021, 09:04 AM   #27
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So 300 exhaust hanger bracket lines up with pre-gen centrestand mount? That’s bizarre as in-between new-gen model didn’t have centrestand or even mount for it. I suppose Kawi has some common frame template they used throughout all generations. Tick off boxes for features wanted and click “build”.
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Old October 14th, 2021, 11:09 PM   #28
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Very cool
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Old October 16th, 2021, 10:50 AM   #29
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Progress on Project HQ300, new stuff to install, set of sprockets from arashimoto these have a rubber to cut down on chain noise?! I've never used these as JT has always been my first pick. Removing the nut on the output shaft was a bit of a pita but got it off, 2' breaker bar and 220 lbs. I used anti-seize compound on the new nut, and torked to 92 foot pounds. Rear wasn't an issue, as I've used anti-seize compound on these, plus the titanium nuts I installed years ago.

Aluminum radiator, & pink silicone hoses. I had to replace the OEM radiator due to it was slightly bent, so why not change the OEM hoses out for some pink silicone ones. The new aftermarket radiator is slightly bigger, should hold more coolant, also added a radiator protector as well.
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Old October 16th, 2021, 10:54 AM   #30
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i like it
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Old October 17th, 2021, 11:54 AM   #31
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I used anti-seize compound on the new nut, and torked to 92 foot pounds.

Have you considered adjusting the torque value due to adding anti-seize?
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Old October 17th, 2021, 01:27 PM   #32
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Have you considered adjusting the torque value due to adding anti-seize?
Good question,
I don't believe it's necessary, as Kawasaki recommends using moly grease before installing the nut.
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Old October 18th, 2021, 07:45 AM   #33
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Correct me if I'm wrong, but adjusting a tq value due to an anti-seizing lubricant would defeat the purpose, no? If a bolt is spec'd to 10ft/lbs, the anti-seize just makes sure you are as close to that value as possible by preventing the bolt from seizing before you hit the required torque value. It makes your torquing more precise.

I guess you would have the option to adjust the torque value from 10ft/lbs to 10.0ft/lbs
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Old October 18th, 2021, 10:03 AM   #34
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If a bolt is spec'd to 10ft/lbs

Wet vs dry torque values are different. Wet is usually 10-20% less torque, some people say up to 40%. If you wanna be picky, so are slightly dirty bolts or threads (including skin oil). Even never used vs once used torque values are technically slightly different due to the way threads of nuts and bolts bite into each other when torqued.
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Old October 18th, 2021, 10:31 AM   #35
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Quote:
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Wet vs dry torque values are different. Wet is usually 10-20% less torque, some people say up to 40%. If you wanna be picky, so are slightly dirty bolts or threads (including skin oil). Even never used vs once used torque values are technically slightly different due to the way threads of nuts and bolts bite into each other when torqued.
Huh, I have never run across that. I know used vs new bolt torque is different, I guess I was just making the assumption when it comes to anti-seize. I learn something new every day
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Old October 18th, 2021, 11:07 AM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thedrewski86 View Post
Correct me if I'm wrong, but adjusting a tq value due to an anti-seizing lubricant would defeat the purpose, no? If a bolt is spec'd to 10ft/lbs, the anti-seize just makes sure you are as close to that value as possible by preventing the bolt from seizing before you hit the required torque value. It makes your torquing more precise.

I guess you would have the option to adjust the torque value from 10ft/lbs to 10.0ft/lbs
Never-Seez recommends a 30% reduction in specified torque values when using their regular anti-seize product. I didn't know that when I was 18 and used it on the threads of the head bolts of my 427 boat engine. I used the Chevy specified value of 80 lb-ft and pulled the threads out of the block in a couple places, requiring Helicoils to repair them. It seems that the little metal spheres in the compound are very slippery.

They recommend various torque reductions for their various products, so if you're using one, you need to read about it before you tighten bolts with it on the threads.
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Old October 18th, 2021, 11:09 AM   #37
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Yeah, ARP's head-torque recommendation varies depending upon whether you're using motor-oil or their special lube on threads. My friend @ Lucas Aviation in S.B. says no bolt ever goes on planes dry, it always has lube, anti-seize or locking compound.

From the manual, I guess you have to be careful with what they specify:
Quote:
"In these illustrations you will find the
instructions indicating which parts require spec-
ified tightening torque, oil, grease or a locking
agent during assembly."
Quote:
2 Engine Sprocket Nut 127 N*m 13 kgf*m 94 lb*ft MO
MO: Apply molybdenum disulfide oil solution. (mixture of engine oil and molybdenum disulfide grease
in a weight ratio 10 : 1).

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Old October 19th, 2021, 02:29 AM   #38
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One must also keep in mind, there is a lock washer, so it shouldn't be able to loosen up on its own.
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Old April 21st, 2022, 11:49 PM   #39
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It's spring time in Kentucky, so stay tuned for more updates.
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Old April 22nd, 2022, 07:26 AM   #40
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I keep Ninja 300 engines pretty fresh in my Ebay search... I really anticipate making this upgrade once I get some more miles on the little 250 as it currently sits.
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