Two questions about power mods

[Kurgan]

1. Is there a set formula for which carb jets to use for specific parts combinations? Like since I finally got the Two Bros carbon full system, I want to combine it with the K&N air and oil filters with Royal Purple oil, and maybe the airbox/snorkel modification recommended by the DynoJet kit. Which jets should be used?

2. Exhaust wrapping or ceramic coating. Is it worth it on the 250, especially on an the 2Bros full system? Does it make the bike at least feel like its running cooler when the summer temperatures finally get here to Texas?

[fishdip]

Originally Posted by Kurgan

1. Is there a set formula for which carb jets to use for specific parts combinations? Like since I finally got the Two Bros carbon full system, I want to combine it with the K&N air and oil filters with Royal Purple oil, and maybe the airbox/snorkel modification recommended by the DynoJet kit. Which jets should be used?

2. Exhaust wrapping or ceramic coating. Is it worth it on the 250, especially on an the 2Bros full system? Does it make the bike at least feel like its running cooler when the summer temperatures finally get here to Texas?

Oil filters and oil has nothing to do with your jets.

[Kurgan]

Originally Posted by fishdip

Oil filters and oil has nothing to do with your jets.

Dyno tests have proven that oils like Royal Purple have less friction, and free up some horsepower, not much, but even 1HP is a noticeable gain on a small bike like this.

That means the carb and jet settings (or EFI mapping on injected bikes) COULD need to be changed to accommodate the higher horsepower potential.

[fishdip]

Originally Posted by Kurgan

Dyno tests have proven that oils like Royal Purple have less friction, and free up some horsepower, not much, but even 1HP is a noticeable gain on a small bike like this.

That means the carb and jet settings (or EFI mapping on injected bikes) COULD need to be changed to accommodate the higher horsepower potential.

Any links to said dyno test?

[alex.s]

Royal purple is a waste of money and will not make any difference at all for power unless you switched from something like ... vegetable oil or something 100k miles old.

covering your headers will make the bike run hotter.

[cbinker]

you may see gains in HP on an 8 cylinder high displacement engine, but a 2 cylinder 250, no.

[Somchai]

Some oils, like Motul 300V, can give a power-gain up to 3% (even on a 2-cylinder).
But also please keep in mind, that Motul 300V is a real racing-oil though it's declared as street legal.

[fishdip]

Originally Posted by Somchai

Some oils, like Motul 300V, can give a power-gain up to 3% (even on a 2-cylinder).
But also please keep in mind, that Motul 300V is a real racing-oil though it's declared as street legal.

Once more any actual test done? not just words on the bottle?

[cuong-nutz]

Google. Bing. Dogpile.

[Somchai]

Originally Posted by fishdip

Once more any actual test done? not just words on the bottle?

OK, I have to admit that my numer of 3%, taken from the talk in german forums may have been a little bit to hopeful, so take this from the Motul-Webiste: ...300V Factory Line Road Racing gives a power increase of 1.30%...
Link: https://www.motul.com/de/en/about/30...tion-lubricant

By the way there are many sites in the www where one could find things like this by himself/herself (if one wants).

[fishdip]

Originally Posted by Somchai

OK, I have to admit that my numer of 3%, taken from the talk in german forums may have been a little bit to hopeful, so take this from the Motul-Webiste: ...300V Factory Line Road Racing gives a power increase of 1.30%...
Link: https://www.motul.com/de/en/about/30...tion-lubricant

By the way there are many sites in the www where one could find things like this by himself/herself (if one wants).

But no proof that this is not just marketing hype. And I have try looking for it and have never found true facts showing the add power. remember most of the stuff they can say on a product dose not need to be true.

[Somchai]

Fish, enjoy the vid

Link to original page on YouTube.

[alex.s]

Originally Posted by Somchai

OK, I have to admit that my numer of 3%, taken from the talk in german forums may have been a little bit to hopeful, so take this from the Motul-Webiste: ...300V Factory Line Road Racing gives a power increase of 1.30%...
Link: https://www.motul.com/de/en/about/30...tion-lubricant

By the way there are many sites in the www where one could find things like this by himself/herself (if one wants).

increase of 1.3%......... compared to WHAT? the shittiest oil on the market. that's what they don't tell you. running ANY reasonable oil will give you the same "performance increase" over terrible crappy oil.

[fishdip]

Originally Posted by Somchai

Fish, enjoy the vid

Link to original page on YouTube.

My only issue with this video is its done by a person who stands to make money off the oil in this test. I notice the car is angel different in the runs. also It kind of sounds like they are sand baging it on the first run

[Somchai]

Originally Posted by fishdip

My only issue with this video is its done by a person who stands to make money off the oil in this test. I notice the car is angel different in the runs. also It kind of sounds like they are sand baging it on the first run

So do I understand you right, that informations like this, given from an American company one can not trust, since they are cheating the people to sell more parts?
So what should we think about dyno runs showed from companies here in the forum i.e. about exhaust systems?
Would you say when they need to sell them then we should also not trust in their results?
Lucky one for sure can trust in any such information given from a German company

[fishdip]

Originally Posted by Somchai

So do I understand you right, that informations like this, given from an American company one can not trust, since they are cheating the people to sell more parts?
So what should we think about dyno runs showed from companies here in the forum i.e. about exhaust systems?
Would you say when they need to sell them then we should also not trust in their results?
Lucky one for sure can trust in any such information given from a German company

Any time someone stands to make money from any product I don't trust them 100% they are there to sell a product. How can a German company be trust? Do you have better laws protecting the consumer and are the laws strictly enforced?

[Somchai]

Originally Posted by fishdip

Any time someone stands to make money from any product I don't trust them 100% they are there to sell a product. How can a German company be trust? Do you have better laws protecting the consumer and are the laws strictly enforced?

The answer to your question is quiet simple: Germany stands for 100% Quality and the reason for this is that the german workers and labor, especially the older ones, have learned to use their brain when they work.
But also the laws and regulations are so clear that the rules for everything are strictly given and enforced.
Also please don't forget i.e. about the TUV - which worldwide stands for the best test organisation, just remember the DIN EN ISO 9000 Quality Management System.
Make a selftest and ask you which high-tech cars nearly everyone in the world would like to have (besides the Italians and not the Japanese) or where the worldwide best high-tech machines are produced...
And now please let's stop this off-topic talk before it could become political and not break this thread more than we already did - @Kurgan excuse me please for the off-topic.

[cbinker]

Originally Posted by Somchai

Some oils, like Motul 300V, can give a power-gain up to 3% (even on a 2-cylinder).
But also please keep in mind, that Motul 300V is a real racing-oil though it's declared as street legal.

.03 x 27 = .81 - hardly worth it.

[Kurgan]

Originally Posted by cbinker

.03 x 27 = .81 - hardly worth it.

Since the ultimate fate of the bike is a track day toy a year or two down the road, every ounce of power is needed.

Also just to clarify, I already know all of you that say "RP oil doesn't work" are wrong. I've been running the stuff for 5 years already and I was able to feel the difference the minute I finished the oil change from the oil that was in it from the dealership with the stock oil filter which was then changed out to RP 10W40 and the K&N oil filter.

Those were the ONLY changes that day because I went out for a short ride to warm up the stock oil before the change, then went right back out after it was changed and could definitely feel the difference. The bike had more power, the oil really does work as advertised.

[liberpolly]

Originally Posted by Kurgan

I've been running the stuff for 5 years already and I was able to feel the difference the minute I finished the oil change from the oil that was in it from the dealership with the stock oil filter which was then changed out to RP 10W40 and the K&N oil filter.

Placebo.

[liberpolly]

Originally Posted by alex.s

increase of 1.3%......... compared to WHAT? the shittiest oil on the market. that's what they don't tell you. running ANY reasonable oil will give you the same "performance increase" over terrible crappy oil.

It sounds like it's result on Formula 1 cars, they don't put crappy oil in those OTOH, results in Formula 1 car are not very likely to be applicable to a $3000 bike. In high performance engines, all other power gains are already taken, so the high performance oil might have measurable effect. On our bike, there is so much of uncorked potential gains, that unless you spend many, many thousand dollars on it, high performance oil will not start moving the needle.

[alex.s]

Originally Posted by Somchai

Fish, enjoy the vid

Link to original page on YouTube.

old mobile 1 versus brand new motul 300v. it would have seen the same result if they replaced it with brand new mobile 1. oil breaks down over time

[alex.s]

also, 335 torque vs 352 torque? yeah. i'm SURE the oil did that. had NOTHING to do with the way they set up the dyno, or any other mods to the car.

[cbinker]

Originally Posted by Kurgan

Since the ultimate fate of the bike is a track day toy a year or two down the road, every ounce of power is needed.

Also just to clarify, I already know all of you that say "RP oil doesn't work" are wrong. I've been running the stuff for 5 years already and I was able to feel the difference the minute I finished the oil change from the oil that was in it from the dealership with the stock oil filter which was then changed out to RP 10W40 and the K&N oil filter.

Those were the ONLY changes that day because I went out for a short ride to warm up the stock oil before the change, then went right back out after it was changed and could definitely feel the difference. The bike had more power, the oil really does work as advertised.

new oil will have different effects over old oil.

[fishdip]

Originally Posted by alex.s

also, 335 torque vs 352 torque? yeah. i'm SURE the oil did that. had NOTHING to do with the way they set up the dyno, or any other mods to the car.

Sand baging it.

[Somchai]

After here so much high qualified answers were given, I want to ask those whose high expertise knowledge apparently must be larger than that of the engineers in the concerned companies, why don't you start a production and give us the honor with the best product forever?
I for sure would buy it

[cbinker]

Statements like that would have nothing to do with selling a product now would it?

[alex.s]

Originally Posted by Somchai

After here so much high qualified answers were given, I want to ask those whose high expertise knowledge apparently must be larger than that of the engineers in the concerned companies, why don't you start a production and give us the honor with the best product forever?
I for sure would buy it

i believe technical explinations. so far only marketing has been presented.

[Kurgan]

Originally Posted by cbinker

new oil will have different effects over old oil.

The old oil only had 1000 miles on it, the vast majority of which were babied slow miles during break-in.

To the person who said "placebo", nope.

Now, end the oil garbage, I know the stuff works, and it's obvious that none of you have the guts to try the stuff because you'd rather believe the naysayers than anyone who claims positive results. You're so deathly afraid of "being marketed to" that you already form a negative opinion about something regardless of what you hear otherwise.

Now back to my question......K&N Air filter, Two Brothers M2 Carbon Black Series full pipe, DynoJet kit, possible snorkel and airbox mods.

Which jets to use???

[Somchai]

Originally Posted by Kurgan

The old oil only had 1000 miles on it, the vast majority of which were babied slow miles during break-in.

To the person who said "placebo", nope.

Now, end the oil garbage, I know the stuff works, and it's obvious that none of you have the guts to try the stuff because you'd rather believe the naysayers than anyone who claims positive results. You're so deathly afraid of "being marketed to" that you already form a negative opinion about something regardless of what you hear otherwise.

Now back to my question......K&N Air filter, Two Brothers M2 Carbon Black Series full pipe, DynoJet kit, possible snorkel and airbox mods.

Which jets to use???

I'm no help in case of jetting the Ninjettes carbs, but I'm sure that here in the forum you'll find many qualified experts about that.
Also when you search for that you'll find the following links with great informations too.
Links: https://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=10208
https://www.perthstreetbikes.com/for...d.php?t=120566
http://www.kawiforums.com/ninja-250r...-database.html
http://www.kawiforums.com/ninja-250r...iscussion.html
http://www.250ninja.net/articles/ninja_250_jetting.html
Good luck for your project

[cbinker]

buy a jet kit and follow instructions on the kit.

[Kurgan]

Originally Posted by cbinker

buy a jet kit and follow instructions on the kit.

I already bought the DynoJet Stage 2 kit, it comes with multiple jets of different sizes, and doesn't tell you specifically which ones to use.

I was hoping that someone would have already tried this parts combination before and could give some actual help on the subject....

[cbinker]

i used the biggest jet, and put the washers in the middle of the pins. I have a K/N pod filter and muzzy slip on exhaust. Ran it on the dyno and it was pretty smooth topped at 27hp @ about 3500 ft. Elevation

[bruce71198]

Originally Posted by Kurgan

I already bought the DynoJet Stage 2 kit, it comes with multiple jets of different sizes, and doesn't tell you specifically which ones to use.

I was hoping that someone would have already tried this parts combination before and could give some actual help on the subject....

Under 1000 feet run a 110 dynojet jet and the dynojet needle in with the clip in the middle position. I do t think your kit comes with a 110 though.

[Kurgan]

Originally Posted by bruce71198

Under 1000 feet run a 110 dynojet jet and the dynojet needle in with the clip in the middle position. I do t think your kit comes with a 110 though.

No, it doesn't come with a 110, just a pair each of 94, 96, 98, and 100 main jets.
.