August 6th, 2017, 09:46 AM | #1 |
Nooblet
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Rider behaves strangely after crash. How would you deal with him?
(you can skip the first minute if you want to jump straight to the event)
Link to original page on YouTube.
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August 6th, 2017, 09:54 AM | #2 |
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Tough call to make? I don't know?
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August 6th, 2017, 10:15 AM | #3 |
ninjette.org sage
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Keep talking to him, try to discourage him from riding and get an ambulance. If he rides off anyway, at least you tried to help.
If you were ambulance personnel/police and determined that he could not help himself or was a danger to self/others, then you would stop him from doing anything as consent is now implied. The initial head injury and how it will progress is mostly unpredictable until you get the person to a hospital and get a CT scan. I think its better to side with caution and action with regards to consent (be careful about how you treat another's autonomy) and how you treat the injury. |
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August 6th, 2017, 10:27 AM | #4 |
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Adrenaline from crashing can mask pain and hide injuries. People have died from concussion days later. That guy seems disoriented from crash. Visit to hospital certainly would do no harm and possibly prevent fatal crash later.
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August 6th, 2017, 11:02 AM | #5 |
Nooblet
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That's the really difficult part. It's his life, his bike and his body.
If he was trying to drive off in a car it would be a very easy decision for me to make: I'd stop him from driving by whatever means because he'd pose a major risk to other road users. On a bike though: I think the risk to others is very low and I'd find it harder to justify restraining him or taking his property on the grounds of protectng others. Your point about implied consent is definitely a big factor though. He would almost certainly consent to having his keys taken from him and maybe even being restrained if he'd been asked in advance how he would want people to respond to him in that state. I consent right now to being having my keys taken from me if I hit my head hard and am obviously barely functioning. I know it would be in my best interest.
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August 6th, 2017, 11:30 AM | #6 | |
ninjette.org sage
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Quote:
One may not be comfortable with taking away the keys, but you can always keep talking to them to figure out why they are not taking what may seem to be the logical choice. Maybe try to convince them to be safer. At the end of the day, I think inaction is the only wrong choice if you're a bystander. |
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August 6th, 2017, 12:01 PM | #7 |
Guy Who Enjoys Riding
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If I were in the guy's place, I would expect bystanders to try to evaluate my condition. I've been through things like that enough to know that I can't safely evaluate my own condition without a few minutes passing. I'd sit down and take my helmet off, and rest for a while. If people were around me, I'd talk to them and see how I felt. If I were alone, I'd try to decide if I felt fully aware and conscious, and go from there.
Since this guy didn't know better, I think the people with him should have looked at him in the eyes and firmly told him that if he rides off, he could pass out and get hurt worse, and that they'd like to sit with him for a few minutes to see how he feels then, see if his pupils are equal in size, etc.. Of course for all we know the guy might have been drunk, for example, which caused the crash in the first place, and he wanted to get out of there before anyone figured it out. |
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August 6th, 2017, 04:19 PM | #8 |
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I was riding near Bear Mtn in NY and came over a rise and 2 or 3 cars and a few bikers were standing by the side of the road. A guy had driven his car off the other side of the road and was stuck.
He was in the car and was acting odd. People were trying to help him get his car unstuck. Eventually by pushing they got him unstuck and back on the road and instead of saying thanks or stopping to check out his car to see if there was damage he just took off. It was a weird scene with the people that just helped the guy just standing around wondering wtf just happened. So I jumped back on my bike and a few miles down the road the same guy was pulled over with a flat. This time I didn't stop because 1. **** that guy and 2. he was acting odd and I thought maybe he was drunk and that's why he took off. It was a pretty heavily patrolled area so I figured he wasn't going anywhere and with any amount of luck a trooper or park ranger would happen on the guy. So back to the video at hand. If it was me and I didn't know the guy and he took off like that after I tried to stop him then that's on him. I'd probably call the cops and tell them that a dude on a red panigale license plate XYZ just dropped his bike, didn't seem like he was in his right mind, and took off heading southbound on ABC road. While a bike presents less danger than a car 600lbs of metal and meat is really going to ruin your day if he t-bones somebody at 75mph. That's more than enough energy to kill somebody in a car never mind a pedestrian or a bicyclist. |
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August 6th, 2017, 05:11 PM | #9 |
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What can you do? For starters, the guy who picked it up can hit the kill-switch. The guy may not notice and be unable to start his bike. Not everybody's used to using the switch. Gives you a few minutes to get emergency personnel there to evaluate him, anyway, while he tries to figure out what's wrong.
My husband suggests his ego was bruised and he was embarrassed, so he took off. Doesn't make it smart, but that's a definite possibility. |
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August 7th, 2017, 05:42 AM | #10 |
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Name: Nick
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When they first attended to the guy they should have had him sit down. People who suffer concussions can act out in anger. In any accident you should take the time to stop and recollect yourself to evaluate what all has happened. They could have helped by not helping him pick his bike up. They should have kept his keys until they could figure out if he was fully coherent. When I was younger I got a purdy serious concussion and all I remember was minor flashes before gaining my coherency at the hospital and throwing up. I found out that a neighbor had seen it happen and had held me down until the ambulance came. Unfortunately, the ambulance wasn't the one who took me to the hospital, they were too busy standing around trying to make a decision (volunteer unit). However, I am thankful to that neighbor for doing what he did. Even though I don't remember it, it sounded like he had his hands full trying to prevent me from running off.
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August 7th, 2017, 06:58 AM | #11 |
Guy Who Enjoys Riding
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I understand the not picking the bike up idea, but that would very likely lead to leaking gasoline around a hot engine and exhaust system.
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August 7th, 2017, 07:18 AM | #12 |
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What can you do? He wasn't responsive to their suggestions.
Definitely in no shape to ride, but off he goes... |
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August 7th, 2017, 09:42 AM | #13 |
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I didn't watch the entire video, but based on the 30 seconds or so after the crash that I saw that guy definitely has a head injury and should not be riding.
I base that on my own crash and head injury experience. Now what can you do? Tough call, if it was a friend of mine I would have taken the keys and told him no way he was riding the bike. Random stranger, that's a problem taking his stuff. IN the video from what I saw several people were trying to convince him not to get on the bike. While the right thing to do would be hold him down until the paramedics get there, I don't think you can legally do that. Another possibility, that I have encountered on the road is that his blood sugar was off (and that's why he crashed). A diabetic with low blood sugar act disoriented and almost drunk. |
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August 7th, 2017, 12:38 PM | #14 | |
Nooblet
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Quote:
I also had a similar thought to the above related to picking his bike up. If people left this guy to pick the bike up on his own, the guy could be doing a lot of additional damage to his spine if he had a spinal injury.
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August 7th, 2017, 04:16 PM | #15 |
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Take the key, shoot him in the leg. If he gets back up, shoot him in the other leg.
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August 7th, 2017, 06:09 PM | #17 |
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Not a lot you can do. They did what they could he was not going to listen.
The only thing they could of done differently was keep the keys. Or try to get him talking by asking questions. But, both could of made things worst by aggravating him.
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