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Old March 16th, 2019, 05:30 PM   #1
Dninja
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Bought Used 2012 Ninja 250r. Bike turns off after I press the throttle after a stop

Hey Guys! New to this forum and riding. Just bought a 2012 ninja 250r and with only 1,500 i knew it was to good to be true. When I was test riding it, the moment I put it in first and pressed the throttle the bike died. The seller said to put the choke on and let it warm up first bc it hadnt been started. So I did that and it rode fine but still when I came to a stop, and pressed the throttle again it stalled on me again. I overlooked this issue and thought it was maybe bc of the weather being in the 40’s so I took a chance and bought it. I came home and Ive rode it a few times to figure out whats going on. Everytime I come to a complete stop and put the bike in first or even second gear and press the throttle, the bikes will try to move a little but then shut off. Ive been reving the engine to 5-6k and slowly let off the clutch to avoid it from shutting off on me. Could it be the carbs?? I hope not because I just spent all the money I had saved on the bike. Any advice?? Thanks
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Old March 16th, 2019, 07:23 PM   #2
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It does tend to do that then the engine isn't warmed up, but if it's still doing it once warmed up, the carbs probably need to be cleaned.
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Old March 16th, 2019, 09:30 PM   #3
Dninja
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Yeah it was still doing it even after I was riding it for almost an hour. I know cleaning the carbs would be the most effective thing to do. But, Ive heard of using seafoam to possibly help the problem. Do you know how I would go about that? Also the owner informed me that he had it stored for the winter and he never emptied the gas tank, he just filled up some more gas before he sold it to me and added some sea foam in there. Could the old gas that hsnt finished in the tank yet be causing the issue too?
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Old March 16th, 2019, 11:14 PM   #4
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Could be the old gas, drain it all out and put fresh gas in. You could try Seafoam, just follow the instructions on the bottle. I've heard mixed reviews of it, never tried it myself.

It's quite likely that old gas has gummed up the carbs though, and a real cleaning is the only reliable way to remedy that. @ducatiman provides a very well reviewed cleaning service, he'll make your carbs look and run like new.
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Old March 17th, 2019, 05:04 AM   #5
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your best bet is to send the carbs to ductiman. you will never get your carbs back to factory new unless you have special equipment. sounds like everything is gummed up from old gas. also check your inline filter. its in your carb inlet tube. welcome by the way and spend a little more to do the right thing.
https://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=226815


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Old March 17th, 2019, 06:58 AM   #6
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thank you, members, for positive comments

before jumping to a carb clean, I'd like to ask @Dninja at what RPM is warm idle set at?
Any starting difficulties apparent when either cold or warm?
How long does it take to transition from cold start to warmed up (enough to ride) ?
After warm, does it idle steady? Any up/down of idle? Does the bike readily accept throttle input? And when throttle released, any RPM hanging? Any missing, hesitation when transitioning from idle to midrange both stopped in neutral and under load (riding) conditions?

Try at least 1 tank dosed with Seafoam...I'd suggest to make sure a carb clean is, in fact actually called for, or perhaps can be avoided. Carb removal and replacement (R & R) a "challenge" to say the least.

Let us know how/if the Seafoam works out. We can then dig deeper if needed.
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Old March 17th, 2019, 10:34 AM   #7
Dninja
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Warm Idle is set at about 1.7k.

No starting difficulties when cold or warm.

I just bought it yesterday, so I would say maybe 4 min choke on, ride it with it, then turn it off.

Yes, it idles pretty steady close to 1.7k. The needle might move a little but nothing crazy.

No, throttle is not hanging when throttle is released. I have noticed that in almost every gear, the rpms are pretty high. Even in 6th gear going about 45 the rpms are at about 7k. Idk if thats normal.

The problem, is basically when I come to a stop, and then put it in 1st gear , (tried it with 2nd gear too) hold the throttle and slowly let go of the clutch to ride, the bike will either shut off (it has at intersections, even after i rode for almost an hour). Or ill hold the throttle, and the moment i let go of the clutch to move, the rpms will drop and the bike will almost shut off but I will quickly turn the throttle even more until the rpms start going, then ill stsrt going except with a quick jump because the rpms are high.

Should I remove the gas thats in it right now, if yes, how do I do that? Also with adding the seafoam, 1 full bottle with gas already inside? Or 1 full bottle then fill up gas?

Just want to say I appreciate all the help! I never thought I would get so much help on here.
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Old March 17th, 2019, 12:41 PM   #8
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Contrary to other forums...I think you'll find ninjette more personal and user friendly. Consistent and long time members too.

1700RPM is a bit much, use the black knob and back it down to 1400 or 1500.
(wondering if its been intentionally cranked up to "mask" something)

4 minute choke is excessive, try *sequentially* turning the choke down, little by little, after 30 seconds or so....as much as needed to stay running, of course. Also, get the choke entirely off before riding.

On takeoff, you are "slipping the clutch" and applying throttle properly, as needed? Avoiding operator induced stalling? Is this your first motorcycle? Not insulting your ability...just trying to eliminate "operator error" or technique before moving on to possible electrical or carburetion error.

Note there are numerous "cut-off" safety switches...it is conceivable a weird electrical problem exists somewhere there.

Any way to know how old the fuel is in the tank? I use a siphon into a fuel jug...transfer the "winter storage" fuel into the cars (won't hurt them) and replace with fresh to bikes. If the fuel is old but still able to combust, you can safely put in a car.
No need to get every ounce...remove as much as your siphon (auto store) will allow. Get at least half tank of fresh in there...add a couple ouce per gallon of Seafoam, ride it as normal, give it 50-100 miles and see if any improvement. If the bike sat for winter...can't hurt the carbs at all. May help. We gotta see.

Welcome to motorcycling, you'll soon accrue tools, gadgets, parts, accessories, gear, friends and enemies....etc etc. It never freakin ends.

Post back with effects of lowering your idle....any wavering of RPM?
And refining/lessening the use of choke...any negatives?

PS i'm still not convinced a carb problem exists. We'll see. I'm sure other members will chime in with info and ideas.
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Old March 17th, 2019, 12:49 PM   #9
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we aim to please. try 1500 rpm for idle. yes drain the old gas out. the petcock is operated by vacuum. you will need to use a screwdriver and a long hose connected to a waste tank. turn petcock to prime to drain tank. you will have to remove seat and tank hold bolts. lift up on tank and place block of wood underneath rear or tank. this will give you room to access petcock and install your drain hose. smaller hose on petcock is vacuum hose.
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Old March 17th, 2019, 09:08 PM   #10
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It almost sounds like a safety switch engages randomly at the stops. Something swings? Kickstand switch? That's how mine acted when I left the kickstand down and tried to take off. A little jerk and the engine died.
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Old March 20th, 2019, 05:59 PM   #11
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UPDATE

I started with the small things like changing the air filter, draining the gas and adding sea foam. It seemed to help a little but the throttle was still not giving enough power after 1st gear and was causing my bike to shutoff unless I gave the throttle a lot of power..

I took out the spark plugs and noticed the soark plugs that the previous owner put in were not NGK ones, they were infact E3 spark plugs. Could this be causing the loss in power issue and high rpm’s. So i went to my nearest parts store and found The NGK iridium spark plugs and NGK CR8E. When i put in the iridiums and started the bike, I had the rpms moving quite a bit. Only had it started for a few minutes. The throttle response seemed a little better, but even when I revved the bike, the first rev wouldnt catch power as much, but it did seem a little better than before. Took them out and changed to the NGK CR8E’s and the bike was dying when i pressed the throttle even i after i put the choke on for about 2 minutes.

Could it be that I maybe didnt tighten the spark plugs all the way. I had tightened them with my spark plug tool and then maybe twisted it half way once with a wrench and that was it. I just made sure that I couldnt hand loosen them before I put the rubber boot back on. I also noticed there was a black hose that was not attached to anything when I removed the gas tank. I am putting a picture of the hose, should it be like this or should it attach to something.

I just want to enjoy and ride my bike. Maybe I should try to put Iridiums back and make sure to tighten them more?
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File Type: jpg 28E8F228-ABCE-4B09-9EDC-A18E5E461660.jpg (96.8 KB, 9 views)
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Old March 20th, 2019, 06:59 PM   #12
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Follow that hose back to see where it originates from. (Airbox?)
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Old March 20th, 2019, 10:12 PM   #13
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Spark plugs are fine. You most likely have clogged circuits in your carbs, resulting in insufficient petrol delivery.

Also I recommend shoving fuel hose all the way up petcock's fuel-outlet nipple and moving hose-clamp over that junction. Currently fuel-hose is at risk of falling off while you're riding. Resulting in fiery death!

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Old March 20th, 2019, 10:48 PM   #14
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Would that require just a cleaning of the carbs. Yes! I loosened up the fuel hose when I was taking the tank off. I already tightened it up. Thanks.

Im still suprised when I changed to the NGK spark plugs, why the RPM’s were acting wierd and the bike was was shutting off when i pressed the theottle, replicating the exact same issue I had before except making it worser with the CR8E’s. And making the RPM’s jumpy with the Iridiums.
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Old March 21st, 2019, 12:10 AM   #15
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New plugs just confirms that previous plugs were not problem, since behavior did not change. Therefore issue is elsewhere.

Real problem is your carbs have clogged fuel-passages. When you open throttle, you increase rate of air-intake through engine & carbs. However, due to clogged fuel-passages, your carbs aren't able to increase their fuel-delivery as fast as increase in air-intake. Super-lean mixtures doesn't burn and engine dies.

Yes, to clean carbs, you need to disassemble them down to every last nut, bolt, washer, o-ring, jets, etc. With loss of chlorinated compounds in modern carb "cleaners", you might as well pee in your carbs to clean them. Every single jet, fuel-circuit, passage where fuel flows needs to be mechanically scrubbed and soda-blasted to ensure sufficient cleaning to restore to factory-fresh condition. Some related threads for your review:

https://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=330960
https://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=321223
https://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=317977
https://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=317810
https://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=316395
https://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=315193
https://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=280658

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Old March 21st, 2019, 01:19 PM   #16
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Random hose

[/RESIZE][/GMAP]
Quote:
Originally Posted by dodgerdad View Post
Follow that hose back to see where it originates from. (Airbox?)
The hose comes put of the carb box i think. Its a long wire, should i be like this? Im about to reinstall the gas tank.

Heres a video of the hose.
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File Type: mov 503A6582-EC21-4B8B-8A17-557DBA02B801.MOV (9.13 MB, 8 views)
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Old March 22nd, 2019, 10:52 AM   #17
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If that's vent-tube is connected to middle of carb-assembly, it should be routed down between carb-intake tubes and come out by bottom of shock. Ends up at drain for crankcase and vent for gas-tank. Outlet of vent-tube should be lower than carbs.

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Old March 22nd, 2019, 11:33 AM   #18
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So It shouldnt be connected to anything then? Just an open hose
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Old March 22nd, 2019, 12:24 PM   #19
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Yup, if it's the vent-hose, open-end provides atmospheric-pressure reference signal for carbs.

The difference between ATM and vacuum created by carb venturi dicates opening-position of slides and therefore fuel-delivery.
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Old March 23rd, 2019, 06:27 AM   #20
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Seafoam won't do much. If you're going to hope an additive helps, at least use Techron or equivalent. I've actually had that stuff save me from a carb disassembly. Techron has polyetheramine (PEA) in it, but Seafoam has nothing special I can find in the MSDS, other than up to 25% alcohol.

https://seafoamsales.com/uploads/201...161205-ENG.pdf
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Old March 23rd, 2019, 01:41 PM   #21
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Yeah, Seafoam is proof that marketing works; snake-oil from gypsies, selling ice-cubes to Eskimos! It's similar to the '80s marketing campaign for STP Oil Treatment. Ended up costing Granatelli millions and millions in class-action lawsuits... We'll see another for Seafoam soon enough.

On other hand, fuel-system cleaners with high dose of PEA really does good job of removing dried-petrol varnish. Use some of following:

- Red Line SI-1
- Techron Concentrate Plus
- Gumout All-in-One
- 3M Max Strength Fuel System Cleaner #08814
- Royal Purple Max Atomizer 18000


But if varnish is too thick or too hard from sitting around, even these won't be able to clear clogged fuel-circuits or jets. Complete disassembly and mechanical scrubbing by machines is only way.
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