February 21st, 2016, 06:28 PM | #1 |
ninjette.org newbie
Name: albert
Location: raymond n.h.
Join Date: Sep 2015 Motorcycle(s): (1) 84 honda sabre v4 700 (2) 2010 ninjette Posts: 4
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valve adjustment
hi folks sabre-al here. just thinking as a machinist, why not lap the required amount from each valve shim instead of buying more. two parallels and some valve grinding compound should not take long to remove .005 - .007" from your existing shims as needed. chime in with your thoughts.
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February 21st, 2016, 06:32 PM | #2 |
The Corner Whisperer
Name: Chris (aka Reactor)
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Welcome Albert!
Someone will chime in soon.
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February 21st, 2016, 06:38 PM | #3 |
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The only downside is that if you take too much, you're gonna need a shim anyway.
The upside is that if you're very careful, this can be done and you can save 10 bucks in shims. IMO, doing this is not worth the 10 bucks in shims I can get from the local shop.
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February 21st, 2016, 06:46 PM | #4 |
ninjette.org newbie
Name: albert
Location: raymond n.h.
Join Date: Sep 2015 Motorcycle(s): (1) 84 honda sabre v4 700 (2) 2010 ninjette Posts: 4
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valve adjustment
yes, if shims can be obtained for just ten bucks or so, it wouldnt be worth fooling with.
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February 21st, 2016, 06:54 PM | #5 |
ninjette.org newbie
Name: albert
Location: raymond n.h.
Join Date: Sep 2015 Motorcycle(s): (1) 84 honda sabre v4 700 (2) 2010 ninjette Posts: 4
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valve adjustment
wouldnt it be nice if the valve shims were the same hardness as the valves and seats so they would wear approximately the same, increasing adjustment intervals.
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February 21st, 2016, 06:55 PM | #6 | |
Vintage Screwball
Name: B
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Quote:
Don't order an entire 80 dollar shim kit. The shop I have local, last time I went, just exchanged the three shims I needed for the ones I had at no cost.
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February 21st, 2016, 07:48 PM | #7 |
The Asian Caucasian
Name: Abu Mishary Mohd Fairus
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My "shims-ing" will only be done by the mechanic.
I just sit and watch. Welcome Albert!
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February 23rd, 2016, 05:18 PM | #8 |
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Welcome.
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February 24th, 2016, 09:28 AM | #9 |
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welcome.
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February 25th, 2016, 10:25 AM | #10 |
ninjette.org certified postwhore
Name: Jay
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A lot of people and places say the shims are case hardened, so removing material will remove the outer most and hardest portion, resulting in excessive wear later on.
But I did what you said, I have a surface grinder at my job and brought each shim in and took off the required amount (.002-.003 in most cases). No issues with my or my friends bike as of yet. I have purchased the shim kit for the future only because I wanted to be able to do the valve job without having to wait a day or so to bring parts to work and grind them.
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February 25th, 2016, 10:42 AM | #11 | |
Participant
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Quote:
The shims don't wear at all. It's the valve/seat interface that slowly wears away due to the hot temperatures and thousands of opening/closing cycles every minute. During operation, the shims don't even make contact with the camshaft lobes (or rocker mechanisms, depending on engine configuration): there's a oil film between the two metal surfaces. |
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March 1st, 2016, 06:03 AM | #12 |
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Hello and welcome!
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March 1st, 2016, 07:05 AM | #13 |
ninjette.org newbie
Name: albert
Location: raymond n.h.
Join Date: Sep 2015 Motorcycle(s): (1) 84 honda sabre v4 700 (2) 2010 ninjette Posts: 4
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valve adjustment
i would think case hardening would penetrate deeper than a couple thousandths, making that a non issue , if you remove half off each side.you know ,grind and or lap .002" off each side to remove .004" total would reduce the possibility of breaking through the hardened surface.
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March 1st, 2016, 08:31 AM | #14 | |
ninjette.org guru
Name: Jesse
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Quote:
I don't know a whole lot about the hardening process, but here's how I have seen it done for the 29.5 mm shims both my Suzuki's use. The shims are stamped at the factory with the thickness, which, if that side is installed down that side is basically stationary other than spinning in the bucket. Which is a lot of movement but not nearly the action the top side is getting from the cam. When you grind a shim (my brother did a few with a mill a while back) just grind the side where the thickness was marked, so you don't have the wrong thickness. Then install that ground side down. That way if it's lost any hardening from the grinding, it will be on the side that doesn't get beaten on thousands of times a minute. Oh, and I don't know if it's an issue for the Kawi's, but I remember receiving an adamant warning to make sure the shims are NEVER exposed to magnetism. Apparently a magnetized shim could stick to the cam and lift out of the bucket in a perfect storm and wreak a lot of havoc in your motor. Fishing those suckers out of the head I could see the temptation to grab it with a magnetic screwdriver. I used these huge 6-inch long tweezers and they worked without a whole lot of cursing.
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March 1st, 2016, 08:32 AM | #15 |
ninjette.org guru
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And PS: Welcome to the forum!!
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March 1st, 2016, 08:40 AM | #16 | |
Vintage Screwball
Name: B
Location: Washington
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Quote:
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March 1st, 2016, 08:44 AM | #17 | |
ninjette.org guru
Name: Jesse
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Quote:
I assumed that was the norm for shim setups. So anyways ignore all I've said here lol.
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March 1st, 2016, 09:40 AM | #18 | |
Vintage Screwball
Name: B
Location: Washington
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Quote:
A lot of Japanese car and truck engines used them. I don't buy in to the magnetism thing unless you really juiced them with a rare earth magnet or something. A small magnet on the end of a wand won't do any harm.
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March 23rd, 2016, 10:30 PM | #19 |
ninjette.org guru
Name: xorbe
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I've seen shim grinding videos on YT done somewhere in Asia.
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June 13th, 2016, 09:37 PM | #20 |
ninjette.org member
Name: Tim
Location: Lake Havasu City,AZ
Join Date: Jun 2016 Motorcycle(s): 2014 Ninja 300 SE Posts: 22
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Do not think I will worry about valve shims or 600 mile maintenance. I have road raced and thrashed bikes for years and checked clearances and have found very minimal clearance issues. I do all maintenance myself but I have a lot of experience. If you have little or no experience with motorcycle maintenance I would highly recommend having an experienced mechanic service your bike. Maintenance issues can cause serious safety concerns.
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June 14th, 2016, 05:31 AM | #21 | |
ninjette.org certified postwhore
Name: Tom
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Quote:
I wouldn't go through the trouble of lapping the shims because I don't have the equipment to do so. For the small price of the shims it isn't worth the hassle. And Welcome to the Ninjettes. |
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July 2nd, 2016, 11:30 AM | #22 | |
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