Clutch Issues

[n4mwd]

I think my clutch has a return spring problem. I don't think its a problem with the standard internal clutch springs because when these fail, the clutch starts slipping, and I am not noticing that (yet).

What is happening is that the transmission lever is not fully retracting when tension is released on the clutch cable. This free play is significant. I can adjust the cable so that this slack is gone, but it means the clutch will disengage with only slight pressure on the handlebar lever.

The bike is a 2006 Ninja 250R with about 6K miles on it.

Anybody know how to fix this problem?

[dubojr1]

Do you have your owners manual? The specs and procedure for adjusting are in there.

[n4mwd]

Actually, no. The original owner refused to part with it. I have had to scavenge around just to find out what kind of oil to put in the thing.

But as far as adjusting the clutch cable, I did that. It will take up the slack, but then causes the clutch to disengage with only a slight pull on the lever. I want the friction zone to be in the middle.

If I move the friction zone to the middle, the transmission wont retract the clutch cable all the way causing excessive clutch lever free play. I can push the transmission lever down and manually retract it though.

PS: I'm not sure if this is relevant, but shortly after I got it I laid the bike down at low speed on the left side. Nothing except the shifter appeared damaged.

[dubojr1]

Use this website to get an owners manual. I understand what your trying to do but I think stock specs disengages the clutch shortly after pulling the clutch lever and not in the middle. I would say mine disengages at about 1/4 pull.

http://www.kawasaki.com/DefaultFrame...OSEVEHICLE.ASP

[Apex]

Mine does the same thing. I think I may adjust it in the future. Right now I move the lever back maybe 1/8-1/4" and it disengages. However, it never "fully" disengages. If it is warm and I'm at a stop, with the clutch in and in 1st gear, it wants to pull forward. I can hold it back with my feet, but it is rather annoying. I will most likely mess with it next valve adjustment.

You aren't alone with this problem.

[dubojr1]

This issue should be able to be addressed. Adjust to specs and if that doesn't fix it then there must be an internal clutch part failure. Either way IMHO I would not let this concern go on.

[DaBlue1]

There are two place to adjust the clutch. It sounds like your cable is actually too tight. Try loosening it at the lever first then adjust it properly at the clutch (on the engine). Loosen the adjuster bolts a little, then fine tune the adjustment at the lever.
Pull the clutch lever just enough to take up the free play
Measure the gap between the lever and the lever holder.
If the gap is too wide, the clutch may not release fully.
If the gap is too narrow, the clutch may not engage fully.
In either case, adjust it. Clutch Lever Free Play Standard is: 2 ~ 3 mm

Also you can try here http://faq.ninja250.org/wiki/Adjusting_the_clutch_cable

[n4mwd]

Originally Posted by dubojr1

http://www.kawasaki.com/DefaultFrame...OSEVEHICLE.ASP

Thanks, I went there and downloaded it. (18 files).

I was browsing another clutch thread and there was a photo of the inside of the clutch cover. There was a rubber piece near where the lever sticks in. Is this rubber what they use for the clutch return spring? Could it be bad?

I have not had the cover off so I am not 100% sure how it works other than what I have seen in photos and diagrams.

Again, I can adjust the clutch cable to minimize the problem, but it doesn't seem right that there is so much free play at the transmission lever. If I push down on the transmission lever, the free play at the clutch lever on the handlebar goes to zero.

Is is possible that it is normal to not retract the lever? Am I just seeing a problem when there is none?

Update: I measured the handlebar clutch lever free play. Its 3mm. After playing with the transmission lever a bit, I am suspecting that my cable may need to be lubricated because it seems stiff. Its possible that this is what is causing the retraction problem. I'm going to lubricate the cable and report back what happens.

[dubojr1]

Originally Posted by n4mwd

Again, I can adjust the clutch cable to minimize the problem, but it doesn't seem right that there is so much free play at the transmission lever. If I push down on the transmission lever, the free play at the clutch lever on the handlebar goes to zero.

Wait, so your saying the lever where the clutch cable is attached at the transmission can be moved up and down?

[n4mwd]

Originally Posted by dubojr1

Wait, so your saying the lever where the clutch cable is attached at the transmission can be moved up and down?

Yes. Moving it down retracts the main clutch lever. Then it can be moved up (causing more free play at the main lever) until it hits the disengaging point.

Part of my problem may be a sticky cable. I'm going to lube it and see what happens.

[dubojr1]

Originally Posted by n4mwd

Yes. Moving it down retracts the main clutch lever. Then it can be moved up (causing more free play at the main lever) until it hits the disengaging point.

Part of my problem may be a sticky cable. I'm going to lube it and see what happens.

I'm almost positive that should not happen. There is a bearing inside the clutch cover that the lever shaft should stay nice and straight with no movement and I would guess some kind of retainer inside the cover to keep the lever shaft steady. Can you post that picture you seen of the inside of the cover or at least a link to it.

[DaBlue1]

Lube and proper adjustment may do you good. A binding cable is capable of not allowing the the clutch to fully engage/disengage.

[n4mwd]

Originally Posted by dubojr1

Can you post that picture you seen of the inside of the cover or at least a link to it.

Um no. I think we got out of sync somewhere. I have never taken the clutch cover off so I don't know for a fact what is in there. When I say transmission lever, I mean the clutch lever external to the transmission and not anything on the inside.

I am leaving now to go to the store and buy a cable lubrication tool. I will be back later.

If lubing the cable doesn't fix it, I'm starting to think that this is just the way its supposed to work and I may be overreacting.

[dubojr1]

Originally Posted by n4mwd

Um no. I think we got out of sync somewhere. I have never taken the clutch cover off so I don't know for a fact what is in there. When I say transmission lever, I mean the clutch lever external to the transmission and not anything on the inside.

I am leaving now to go to the store and buy a cable lubrication tool. I will be back later.

If lubing the cable doesn't fix it, I'm starting to think that this is just the way its supposed to work and I may be overreacting.

One of your earlier post said you had seen diagrams and pictures of the inside. Thats the photo I was asking if you could re-post here.

[dubojr1]

Originally Posted by DaBlue1

Lube and proper adjustment may do you good. A binding cable is capable of not allowing the the clutch to fully engage/disengage.

This may in fact need to be done as maintenance but it doesn't have anything to do with the clutch cable lever at the clutch cover.

[n4mwd]

Originally Posted by dubojr1

One of your earlier post said you had seen diagrams and pictures of the inside. Thats the photo I was asking if you could re-post here.

See if this comes through...



I'm not sure what the black thing is made out of, but if its rubber, then this could be part of the problem.

UPDATE: I went to the store and bought a cable lube tool. I just got back and haven't had a chance to use it yet. However, I think I'm on the right track because I measured the force required to retract the clutch and take up the handlebar lever slack and its about 15 ounces. That seems too stiff for a cable with no load. I'm going to try to get it lubed either tonight or tomorrow morning. That should make a difference anyway.

This may in fact need to be done as maintenance but it doesn't have anything to do with the clutch cable lever at the clutch cover.

If the cable is too stiff, it wont let the clutch cover lever retract properly. Anyhow, lubing and properly adjusting the clutch cable will eliminate a variable to the problem.

[DaBlue1]

The black thing you see is the clutch release shaft. If there was a problem with this it would not shift at all and probably have no tension.

[n4mwd]

I lubed the clutch cable. It was a big improvement. It still doesn't retract the lever all the way, but the feel is much better. I am thinking about using an external spring at the transmission to fully retract the clutch lever.

[DaBlue1]

A little lube on the release lever shaft could help also.

[kkim]

is the release lever down by the engine sitting any higher than it's supposed to be? IIRC, it's supposed to be almost all the way down when properly seated.

[n4mwd]

On my bike, the oil filler is on the right side in the picture. The lever as shown does not go all the way down on its own and is up a little bit. I can push it down the rest of the way. I am currently looking for a spring to help it out.

After lubing the cable, I am pretty happy with the feel, but I want to try the external spring to see if it makes a big difference.

[dubojr1]

If a spring were needed then the Kawasaki engineers would have added one. I'm thinking at this point we should address any mechanical part failures to make sure your bike is safe. There has to be something there that is not quite right. That black piece on the inside is suspect at this stage. Can you take some pictures of your concern and post them so we can make sure we all are on the same page.

[n4mwd]

When I first got it about a month ago, I promptly laid it down at slow speed on its left side trying to learn to ride. I am wondering if this somehow shook things loose a little bit. I will try tipping the bike to the right and see if I can force some of the oil up in the black thing. Before I lubed the cable, it was seriously dry and stiff. So at this point, I think its a lube problem.

As far as why the clutch isn't fully retracting beyond the engaging point I am not sure. I would like to compare it to another 2006 ninja if I can find one.

Today I rode it about 30 miles with no problems shifting.

[kkim]

that clutch arm at the engine should be pretty much flush and should not stick up. In the past, people that have turned that arm too far had the same problem of getting it to sit flush. It does make a difference and to correct it, I believe you need to remove the clutch cover.

here is a DIY on clutch replacement that has great photos of a pregen being taken apart.

http://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=25301

[n4mwd]

Ok, I think we got out of sync. The clutch lever shaft at the engine is not pulled out of the housing and sits flush against it (just like in the photo above). What I mean by "up" is that it does not naturally rotate all the way back down (towards the ground) to pull the cable and retract the handlebar lever all the way to its normal stopping point.

After studying the drawings and photos, I am pretty sure that the only cure for this is to add an external spring between the clutch lever at the engine and the frame to pull it the rest of the way. I really don't want to mess with the bike's innards any more than absolutely necessary.

It is also possible that part of my problem is that I am using the wrong kind of oil in it right now. I changed the oil about a week ago to standard 10w40 before I knew better. Turns out that the engine requires full synthetic. I'm not going to change it again at this time, but the next time will be full synthetic. This may also cure the lurching when I put the bike in 1st when the engine is cold.

That was a very good post by pupspeed. I really enjoyed reading it and looking at all the photos.

Thanks.

[dubojr1]

Originally Posted by n4mwd

Ok, I think we got out of sync. The clutch lever shaft at the engine is not pulled out of the housing and sits flush against it (just like in the photo above). What I mean by "up" is that it does not naturally rotate all the way back down (towards the ground) to pull the cable and retract the handlebar lever all the way to its normal stopping point.

Some freeplay is in fact required. The clutch lever at your bars SHOULD have some movement in it prior to pulling the clutch cable. Hope this helps.