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Old September 14th, 2014, 05:41 PM   #161
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Are you going to the Ohio mile at the end of Sept?
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Old September 14th, 2014, 06:13 PM   #162
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Old September 15th, 2014, 07:32 AM   #163
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Yes, I will be there
Super jealous!

I wont be able to do anything until next year
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Old September 16th, 2014, 04:25 AM   #164
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good stuff Eric !! this is gonna be a hot winter....
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Old September 16th, 2014, 06:39 AM   #165
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Super jealous!

I wont be able to do anything until next year
That is OK. I will be there next year also
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Old September 26th, 2014, 07:32 AM   #166
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Racer-X do you know if at the super streetbike challenege you have to have a OEM headlight or does it jut have to have a headlight?
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Old September 26th, 2014, 05:27 PM   #167
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Sorry, we are not going to make it down to watch you run
Good luck! The weather will be perfect!
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Old January 4th, 2015, 01:30 PM   #168
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Update on the nitrous bike.
I took the bike to Ohio in September. Good everything I mean everything was perfect. Bad112 mph????
Now 112 is a record speed but about thirty mph slower than I wanted. I took the bike to 10000 rpm and hit the button around 90 mph. The bike jumped to 110 and pulled at 112 for over half a mile on nitrous. EGT was perfect and the plugs looked perfect. The engine sounded great but was 1000 to 2000 rpm down. I still need to go on the Dyno but on the three identical runs I changed plugs, fuel pressure and timing maps. But I did not have enough time to start changing nitrous volume.

Changing the nitrous at the track is tricky and best. I think I added 10 hp and that went perfect. So now I will go on the dyno and add nitrous volume to the setup.
Next race in Ohio is May 2.
For the 2015 season I am building. Brand new engine. 249cc balanced crank Carillo rods and JE pistons. The head will be stock with two intake cams and the only other upgrade to the engie is the Brnett clutch. Simple as I can make it.
I will see how much power I can get out of the 265cc engie I have now. And since I will not be using it to race. I want to push the 70 hp barrier. I will get so videos of that haha.
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Old January 4th, 2015, 07:04 PM   #169
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Sounds awesome!!! So you will only be in the 250 class this year? Or gunna push that 265 to the limit with nitrous on the track as well?

Cant wait to see how much power with nitrous you can get her up to!

When will you be boosting? We need more turbo 250's out there...

I just got in this weekend a different data logger, should help me out gather WAY more info... Going to log RPM, TPS, O2, Vacuum/boost, EGT, Oil pressure, Fuel pressure, coolant temp, and oil temp. Switched to a innovate LM-2 with a LMA-3 (Aux-Box). Can also monitor acceleration and side to side G forces as well lol.... will make for some good videos with a dash display on the screen.
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Old January 5th, 2015, 02:01 AM   #170
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The 265 engine is in good shape. But I am going to use it and the 282 for the street. I am going to only race 250-4 fuel class. The bike is ready for warm weather. Just need to dyno it then swap in the 249cc engine. Who makes your data logger?
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Old January 5th, 2015, 05:47 AM   #171
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Old January 5th, 2015, 06:48 AM   #172
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I tried the lm2. . It did not function. it lost data every time I tried to use it. They said it was to much vibration from the bike. I chucked it in a drawer. They really posses me off with that. Because I talked to them about what o was doing with it before I ordered it . I hope yours works. You need data. I use the go pro and record the KOSO rx2 dash.
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Old January 5th, 2015, 07:00 AM   #173
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Wow thats weird, I have heard their customer service sucks but I have yet to have any problems with them. Guys running 200+mph run these all day long down south.

The one thing I do know is they are very picky about what memory cards are inside them. They actually need the older SD cards to work properly.

I'll let ya know how mine holds up! For now I'm just going to monitor the RPM, TPS, o2, EGT and Boost. I have the Analog input cable as well which will give me up to 5 more inputs if I decide to monitor oil pressure or fuel pressure or other temps.

The software is what I really like, I have been using a WEGO III from Daytona sensors but their software is not up to todays standards. Logworks from Innovate is one of the best data displays I have ever used.

I'll keep ya posted....

P.S. I should be on the dyno friday!
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Old January 5th, 2015, 09:50 AM   #174
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I am so jealous of those rods.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Racer x View Post
Update on the nitrous bike.
I took the bike to Ohio in September. Good everything I mean everything was perfect. Bad112 mph????
Now 112 is a record speed but about thirty mph slower than I wanted. I took the bike to 10000 rpm and hit the button around 90 mph. The bike jumped to 110 and pulled at 112 for over half a mile on nitrous. EGT was perfect and the plugs looked perfect. The engine sounded great but was 1000 to 2000 rpm down. I still need to go on the Dyno but on the three identical runs I changed plugs, fuel pressure and timing maps. But I did not have enough time to start changing nitrous volume.

Changing the nitrous at the track is tricky and best. I think I added 10 hp and that went perfect. So now I will go on the dyno and add nitrous volume to the setup.
Next race in Ohio is May 2.
For the 2015 season I am building. Brand new engine. 249cc balanced crank Carillo rods and JE pistons. The head will be stock with two intake cams and the only other upgrade to the engie is the Brnett clutch. Simple as I can make it.
I will see how much power I can get out of the 265cc engie I have now. And since I will not be using it to race. I want to push the 70 hp barrier. I will get so videos of that haha.
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Old January 5th, 2015, 12:25 PM   #175
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Old January 5th, 2015, 12:43 PM   #176
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Question Jets

10 HP. Those must be some tiny, tiny jets for a 10HP boost on a twin cylinder engine.

Does the setup use individual nozzles for gas and nitrous, or is it a single combined nozzle? Which model controller are you using. I checked out the website. That brand is new to me for sure. Is it a single stage or progressive system?
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Old January 5th, 2015, 03:12 PM   #177
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The Wizards system is different than US made systems. It is a progressive system. The nitrous is jetted and the volume is controlled through the jets and settings in the computer. Same with the fuel. I have atomizing nozzles at the intake and fuel pressure is manually adjusted to get the mixture right. I can add as much power as needed and change power levels for each gear and RPM. There are also numerous safty systems built in.
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Old October 22nd, 2016, 07:38 PM   #178
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Old October 23rd, 2016, 01:45 AM   #179
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I have moved to Iowa. That forced me to take some time off. So this year I did not run. I built a new bike for the nitrous. I now have two bikes four good engines and am really ready to go.

That's the good news. Bad news is the ECTA lost the track in Ohio. So I'm not sure what I'll do next year. But the bike is ready to go and should be better than ever.
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Old December 8th, 2016, 12:04 PM   #180
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Quote:
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This is a video of a run in Ohio. It is a test run to see how the nitrous worked. I hit the button at 92mph and held it to the finish. the speedo read 110 but the time slip went to 111.0.

Link to original page on YouTube.

I take it those are EGT readings below the dash, I'd be concerned about the difference between the left & right temps.
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Old December 8th, 2016, 01:38 PM   #181
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are you all kiding me? my stock ninja 250 FI from 2008 did 180km/h (112MPH)
with diffente sprockets, akrapovic slip on, green filter, and snorkel removed does 193km/H (120MPH)
and you need nitro to get to 200km (124MPH)? REALLLY?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zePwX39g30k not my bike (but same stock fi engine)
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Old December 8th, 2016, 02:26 PM   #182
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are you all kiding me? my stock ninja 250 FI from 2008 did 180km/h (112MPH)
with diffente sprockets, akrapovic slip on, green filter, and snorkel removed does 193km/H (120MPH)
and you need nitro to get to 200km (124MPH)? REALLLY?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zePwX39g30k not my bike (but same stock fi engine)
So you believe the stock speedo that reads at least 10% high. On that video I see a max 185kph, which -10% (18.5kph) = a real 166.5kph which is 103mph max.

You need an accurate speed measuring device. Racer X does certified speed runs, using certified timing gear for speed over distance.
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Old December 8th, 2016, 02:50 PM   #183
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A new 300 will barely make it to 110 MPH on a good day in perfect conditions.

Basing your top speed claims on the speedometer is a rookie mistake...
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Old December 9th, 2016, 12:35 AM   #184
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I shoulda got one of them old FI 250's durn thing is faster than my 300
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Old December 9th, 2016, 02:33 AM   #185
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TLN motor sports went 116 on a basically stock 250 no nitrous. He had 1.5 miles and a good tailwind. The only mods he used were a Brock exhaust and my 88-94 ignition module plus my old cut down gas tank and gearing. That is the new speed to beat on an all motor 250 ninja.

The 300 s go close to 115 all motor. So far no one has gone faster than 123 on a nitrous 250. But There a couple nitrous racebikes that have done 130. Both cooked the motor doing so but that is the way it goes sometimes
The 110 in that video was the first run using a new nitrous system. Yes the sis to side dice fence is a concern. I believe it is accurate. But I don't know how to change it. That has always been the case. I think it's in the carbs as it does that even without the notrous.
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Old December 9th, 2016, 09:59 AM   #186
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If the EGT is bad without NO2, then as you say probably the carb, which as temp increases as fuelling gets lean & I saw a max of approx 400F difference, then either one is really lean or one is really rich !

If it was mine, I'd add a O2 port to each header & then run the bike with the O2 senor on one pipe or the other on a repeatable run, NO nitrous, log 3 runs on each port then compare & adjust. Then repeat with NO2 at various levels, just to check BOTH cylinders are working at their maximum performance & at a similar level.

Main jet or needle position changes will be required to balance both intakes. I'm assuming you have the butterflies balanced already.
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Old December 9th, 2016, 06:41 PM   #187
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I wish I could get that many runs in to test. It is sometimes ok and sometimes not. The problem with O2 sensors is the sensors are expensive and fragile. On the last run that was the problem, or at least one of the problems. I was at 1100 on the left side and it hit 1700 on the right. I could not see the EGT because of a fogged up visor. It looked like 1100 on both. That was before I hit the nitrous. Really lean on the right side for sure. Then a nitrous shot ended the day. Not the nitrous fault. I heated the bottle to a higher pressure that I was tuned for because I usually have a long wait at the start line. But I only waited seconds and had to go as soon as I got to the line. So cold engine and cold air . Lean mixture over heated the combustion temp then a lean nitrous shot took off the plug tip. Game over.

But now I am confident I can work around all of this with just a little tuning. First j need to sort out the irregular EGT. Second I am going to tune for a low bottle pressure. Like 700-750 . Rather than 900-950. That will make the starting line less of a problem.

My new plan is a bit ratical. I am adding headlights and brake lights to the bike. Yes Project X is going on the street. Riding every day for a week will help me sort out the carb. If I can get the bike to just go down the highway at 75 mph for a couple miles. Then going 100 plus will be easy. From there adding 25-30 mph with nitrous will be a snap. The dyno is not really helpful and it is expensive.
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Old December 9th, 2016, 08:44 PM   #188
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Old December 10th, 2016, 02:33 AM   #189
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Aha, I take it you are running open carbs right ? Or throttle bodies if EFI now, not sure.
Either way, then without a steady air supply when testing on a dyno everything can be fine, but once moving, the placement of components & the fairing can affect the air pressure around the intakes, as can a cross wind. It's one of the reasons most ramair systems are now centrally mounted on the fairing to reduce the crosswind effect on a dual intake system.

I'd advise you look at a means to guarantee static ambient or higher pressure air at the intake to stabilise the feed their as much as possible.

Re the O2 sensors, they are not so expensive now, the newer Bosch LSU 4.9 is an amazing piece of kit. I have one that I used to manually tune my VFR800 to a new to me TBR performance exhaust on the road & was impressed when on the dyno the AFR was near perfect If you are worried about tip melt if fitted 12" from the exhaust port, then do what they do in dyno's add a small 8mm port & a vacuum pump, you could use an intake tap vacuum pump to reduce complexity & mount the sensor remotely. If you did two of those, then you could wire in an ignition kill for a set AFR like 15-1 etc, thus saving your engine !
Have a look at outboard engine fuel pumps for an idea as to how an intake vacuum pump works or speak nicely to your dyno guy to let you see how DJ do it for their AFR probe !

Last idea, use surface discharge plugs they are now available quite cheaply, they have no protruding electrode to over heat !

Just a few ideas, hope they help.
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Old December 10th, 2016, 07:22 AM   #190
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I believe you are correct about the open carbs. I have always had a problem with one side or the other. I think I will build an air box. My current setup leaves little room for air filters but I will come up with something.

As for O2 sensors. I just don't want to do it. I would need the sensors and the gauges. I tried them before and nitrous caused them to clog.

I definitely need surface plugs. I currently use a home made side gap plug that worked well. The surface gap plugs used to cost 90 dollars each. That's a lot when you need a case of ten.

Street riding the bike is going to pay off. My original orange bike is now completely sorted out . No nitrous no fairing and I can break any open record ever set. It is faster than most fairing bikes at 109mph. The blue Project X bike should be able to go 115 on the new engine. Then I only need ten mph more with nitrous. My problem since Maxton closed. Is I only get four passes at one or two events a year. That gives me no chance to tune and test. At maxton I could make twelve passes a day.

Now that Ohio is closed. I am looking at one event a year. 3000 miles of driving is hardly worth four miles of racing.
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Old December 10th, 2016, 08:26 AM   #191
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You don't need a filter with an airbox. If you are running open carbs & are happy with that, then an airbox with no filter is no different. Just remember to clean it out before a run.

Surface discharge from NGK £25GBP in UK, there are other makes that may be cheaper.
http://www.sparkplugs.co.uk/ngk-raci...-plug-r0045j-9

Are then any airtfields near you ? find a drag or LSR crowd & approach them to use it if its a low use military field etc.
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Old December 10th, 2016, 09:54 AM   #192
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I don't like to run without a filter on the street. I am spinning with ideas about how to bring in stable air to the carbs. I never ran an air filter because it cost power on every dyno I tried. But with nitrous that is not an issue.

There is nothing. There is a drag strip but it is not close. Also I currently don't have a van. My old Astro blew up after 570000 miles and I have not replaced it. I rent a van to go to the track but that is a big expense. I recently moved to Iowa and am not working full time so money is an issue also. But I never give up. I just need to spend next year working and tuning and hoping the ECTA gets a new track close to me.
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Old December 10th, 2016, 10:28 AM   #193
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Ok, now I see, yes on the street a filter is essential. As a minimum a fine mesh gauze will provide the least restriction, but still filter out anything that would cause damage.

I feel for you with lack of facilities & lack of cash, I'm in the same boat I was laid off a few weeks back, so busy looking for a new job pronto. I guess looking at where Iowa City is, there must be some long straight rarely used roads you could use as ahem test strips I also lack a van or trailer, so that will be rectified next year.
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Old December 10th, 2016, 12:19 PM   #194
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Iowa is a 1000 miles from anywhere. The drag strip is also not close. But it's Iowa,all roads are straight and there is a relatively low traffic volume. If I just ride to work for a week I can gather enough data to get what I need. I don't need to speed. 75 mph is good enough. Going 75 in third gear is fine for top RPM testing. I can test nitrous near my house and not go that fast. Close enough to push home.

I am thinking about a sorta backwards ram air pulling in air from the back . One filter and a long three inch pipe maybe make it look like a muffler on the side. That part is easy. My tank blocks everything . That's the problem.
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Old December 10th, 2016, 01:29 PM   #195
Mohawk
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Ha ha 100 mile3s from nowhere more like

Don't try the reverse ram air, their is no high pressure zone after the bike breaks the air.
You should be able to run two hoses to the front from each side of the airbox, or add a section of double skin to the fairing, that will feed ambient+ pressure to the airbox, every little helps.
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Old December 10th, 2016, 02:38 PM   #196
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I don't want hoses going forward. That opens up a can of worms with jetting. I want still air. Plus I don't want to mess with aerodynamics up there. I do have room out back sorta. It might be just behind the carbs and pull for underneath.
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Old August 14th, 2018, 07:25 AM   #197
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I am going to be testing nitrous systems again. First I have a system called Boss Noss.

https://youtu.be/bUhHUbLpGQI

I will first try twenty horse power shot then a thirty hp shot mixing methanol and nitrous. The engine will be running on 110 octane gasoline. I am hoping the methanol will keep engine exhaust temp lower than when I spray nitrous and regular gasoline.

I will also be testing my Wizards of nitrous system. This is a normal nitrous and gasoline injection and can make anything from 10-40 hp.
The event in September is four days. Thursday is tech then three days of racing. I will have three engines and an extra cylinder head. A bunch of plugs and tools . Should be a fun weekend if the weather cooperates.
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