At a loss, plea for help. Dies with load

[rainpowder]

Thank you for viewing this, I'm not sure what else to do.

2011 Ninja 250r 10k miles. Not sure of any prior service other than what I've done which is the basic, oil change, fluid flush (brakes and coolant). I laid the bike down a while back. I drove it home and it was fine. While waiting for my knee to heal up it had sat for about a month. I played with it, removing the kleen air system and snorkle. Shimmed the needles with two washers and all dandy. I noticed though when I was working on it the plug boot kept popping out on mid range revs 5-6k. Found out the spark plug was loose / not threaded all the way in. Fixed. THe other day I went to ride it and it ran terrible the entire time to the store and back.

For the past two days, I've pulled and cleaned the carbs, cleaned the pilot and main jets. (YES CLEANED CLEANED even ran a wire through them to ensure nothing was blocking it). Put everything back together, the bike runs great and strong with no hesitation all the way to rev limiter. Put it in gear on a stand and it revs all the way up, tire spins( yet not every fast) the whole show. Put it on the ground, it dies in gear, bogs down and won't get past 2k.

Please for the love of carb cleaner, someone anyone have any ideas? Because I'm freaking done

THank you again for viewing.

[jkv45]

Did you remove the caps from the idle mixture screws, remove the screws, and clean the passages? Set them to 2.5 turns out?

I would also check the carb diaphragms for damage. Any chance the carb wasn't assembled properly? Did you remove the jet holder and collar (needle jet)? Are the collars in place?

I might remove the shims (for now) and make sure the needles are installed properly.

Check for vacuum leaks. Make sure nothing could be blocking the intake snorkel. I would even check the battery voltage.

Make sure the gas is good. If here's any question (it's old or has been sitting at a low level for a while) drain and refill with fresh before moving on.

Check the plug that was loose again. It could be stripped and coming loose. Pull both plugs and compare the color.

Running the bike up to the limiter without load (and probably not up to operating temp) is not a good idea, and tells you nothing (as you found out).

[rainpowder]

jkv45 Thanks for the reply
Caps removed from idle mixture screws, they were set to 2.5 turns out.

No issues with the diaphragms, I did the sunlight test, no light coming through.

As for the needles within the diaphragms, it was just the needles in there, I haven't seen anything else.

I'll check the battery yet it's given me no issues starting every time.

The gas was drianed, checked petcock lines and filter going into carbs. new gas added.

About to check the plugs.

Thanks for all the tips, maybe running through everything again in a list will help discover something. Lord I hope so.

[jkv45]

I'm not familiar with the Ninja's clean air system, but it is possible that removing it created a vacuum leak or affected the carb in some way?

[rainpowder]

It's been tested that the effects of removing the Kleen air system doesn't affect head pressure or vacuum with the carbs

[RacinNinja]

Originally Posted by rainpowder

It's been tested that the effects of removing the Kleen air system doesn't affect head pressure or vacuum with the carbs

If you forget to plug a vacuum line or have a leak in one of your plugs it will.......

[rainpowder]

Originally Posted by RacinNinja

If you forget to plug a vacuum line or have a leak in one of your plugs it will.......

I'm thinking thats where it has to be. But I've looked over the DIY and traced the lines back, everything is hooked up just like the instructions.

[juliusmichaelhonrada]

Originally Posted by rainpowder

I'm thinking thats where it has to be. But I've looked over the DIY and traced the lines back, everything is hooked up just like the instructions.

remove the shimming washer in the needles and try again

[rainpowder]

battery voltage normal, shimms removed, new gas. Still the same. The plug boot popped out again yesterday after getting everything back together. Ill have to check the plugs and maybe put the kleen air system back on.

[jkv45]

Was the plug tight?

Can you pull them both out and compare their condition? Might give you some more info to help narrow down your search for the problem.

[Motofool]

Originally Posted by rainpowder

battery voltage normal, shimms removed, new gas. Still the same. The plug boot popped out again yesterday after getting everything back together. Ill have to check the plugs and maybe put the kleen air system back on.

If properly torqued, a plug gets loose only when the aluminum thread is damaged.
Subsequent insufficient compression in one cylinder can explain the reduced torque of the engine when under load.

[rainpowder]

And I'm guessing the only solution to the damaged threads is the jb weld fix or replace it. FML

[Motofool]

Originally Posted by rainpowder

And I'm guessing the only solution to the damaged threads is the jb weld fix or replace it. FML

http://forums.ninja250.org/posting.p...&t=85863&tro=1

[Lazarus]

I may have missed it in your original post or a subsequent post by someone else but could there be a tear/rip/pinhole in one of the diaphragms inside the carb?

[rainpowder]

Originally Posted by Lazarus

I may have missed it in your original post or a subsequent post by someone else but could there be a tear/rip/pinhole in one of the diaphragms inside the carb?

Thanks Lazarus, but no the diaphragms are fine, I checked and rechecked them. I spoke with my father about helicoils and he said no problem it's easy. I love having a master mechanic as a father, wish I knew half of what he does! So since the plug boot popped out again I'll check to see if the plug is loose if so tighten and test again. If it jumps again I know there are damaged threads. Sigh unfortunately on the right track I believe. I haven't had time to play around with it lately.

Thank you all for the responses!

[Lazarus]

Had a spark plug in my first car shoot out of the threads while running. Oil everywhere, not pretty, helicoil should do fine for cutting new threads. Definitely good you have a master mechanic to help you out! Cutting new threads is always a test of patience and a steady hand.

Hope it works out well!

[juliusmichaelhonrada]

Originally Posted by rainpowder

Thanks Lazarus, but no the diaphragms are fine, I checked and rechecked them. I spoke with my father about helicoils and he said no problem it's easy. I love having a master mechanic as a father, wish I knew half of what he does! So since the plug boot popped out again I'll check to see if the plug is loose if so tighten and test again. If it jumps again I know there are damaged threads. Sigh unfortunately on the right track I believe. I haven't had time to play around with it lately.

Thank you all for the responses!

if it didnt work you can rethread the head in a machine shop in the next bigger size spark plug

[juliusmichaelhonrada]

Originally Posted by rainpowder

Thanks Lazarus, but no the diaphragms are fine, I checked and rechecked them. I spoke with my father about helicoils and he said no problem it's easy. I love having a master mechanic as a father, wish I knew half of what he does! So since the plug boot popped out again I'll check to see if the plug is loose if so tighten and test again. If it jumps again I know there are damaged threads. Sigh unfortunately on the right track I believe. I haven't had time to play around with it lately.

Thank you all for the responses!

if it didnt work you can rethread the head in a machine shop in the next bigger size spark plug, i had seen 125cc with 18mm hex spark plug lol

[rainpowder]

Ok, I finally got a day to look at this again, checked the spark plug that keeps blowing the boot off. Still tight in the head. So I've back tracked and reinstalled the Kleen air system, now the plug boot doesn't pop off yet it still dies under load. I'm guessing the petcock needs a refreshing since it seems like the bike isn't getting enough fuel. I checked the "fuel filter" that is in the line from the tank to the carbs. It's clean so it would have to be higher up. Although the bowls fill with gas I'm guessing it's not allowing enough to flow and starving itself under load. Guess we'll see.

[Triple Jim]

If it dies immediately when loaded, I would suspect something other than the petcock, since it takes a few seconds to use enough fuel to lower the level in the carb bowls enough for your symptoms to show up.

There's something serious going on if your spark plug boot blows off. Obviously combustion gas is leaking past the spark plug, whether it's the plug, or threads, or a crack in the head.

[rainpowder]

Originally Posted by Triple Jim

If it dies immediately when loaded, I would suspect something other than the petcock, since it takes a few seconds to use enough fuel to lower the level in the carb bowls enough for your symptoms to show up.

There's something serious going on if your spark plug boot blows off. Obviously combustion gas is leaking past the spark plug, whether it's the plug, or threads, or a crack in the head.

Thanks Triple Jim I'll continue to update this as I get time hopefully it is not as serious as a cracked head.

[rainpowder]

Apparently excess pressure from the head was blowing the boot out. Putting the Kleen air system back on it has stopped. I'm looking to see how the Kleen air system originally hooked up to ensure I have everything back properly. I had one of the hoses from the tee connected to the smaller side of the petcock. Well today disconnecting that the bike ran fine, connecting it cause the bogging issue. Possibly the petcock is blocked on that vacuum side/smaller side. I'll have to look at it further, but I'm making headway. Atleast its not a cracked head or something that serious . I'll post back with photos

[Triple Jim]

I don't understand what part of the "kleen air system" could pump air under the spark plug boot. The only thing I know of that could make it pop off is a spark plug that's not tight, or a crack in the head in that area.

[rainpowder]

Originally Posted by Triple Jim

I don't understand what part of the "kleen air system" could pump air under the spark plug boot. The only thing I know of that could make it pop off is a spark plug that's not tight, or a crack in the head in that area.

Triple Jim, Speaking with my father since there is a sleeve that the boot sets in he said if there is a crack in the gasket from where the tower and head meet, pressure could escape into the sleeve and since the boot has a seal at the top pressure building up within the sleeve can cause the boot to pop off. Seems logical to me.