Finding 1st gear?

[Focus Mike]

Anyone have any issues finding first gear? It seems like very rarely it will not go into gear. I have to squeeze the clutch a few times or stomp like hell.

The bike only has 100 miles on it as of today

Could this be to a the trans not breaking in or something?

Also I sometimes shift at 5K even though I'm not supposed to. Is it THAT bad!?

1 more question.

I put 93 Oct. in the tank but I believe the manual says I can run 87 Oct?

Does it really matter?

Thanks
-Mike

[noche_caliente]

goodness - you have lots of questions, most of which can be answered looking at previous threads...

make sure that you are practically stopped when you are shifting down into first, but not completely stopped- seriously under about 7 mph before dropping it to first

you do not need to run premium gas - run the regular unless you like wasting money

[Focus Mike]

Sometimes I am completely stopped and it rarely gives me an issue but sometimes it will not click into first...

Is it safe to blame it on everything being so tight as in new?

[almost40]

complete all your downshifting before you come to a complete stop. If you downshift while rolling 5-10 mph it will click down the gears like butter.

Dont waste your money on 93 its not needed. Try to buy gas with no alcohol if your looking for max performance.

Search for break in threads theres a ton of info on break in. No you wont hurt it to rev it a little it might help. Just dont ride at a constant RPM, vary the revs and youll be fine.

[kkim]

http://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=23550

[Alex]

Don't stomp on the lever, if it's not going in relatively easily, stomping it may not end well (bent shift fork, bent linkage, etc.).

[kkim]

Originally Posted by Alex

Don't stomp on the lever, if it's not going in relatively easily, stomping it may not end well (bent shift fork, bent linkage, etc.).

That's good advice. I treat all my manual transmissions like the delicate, intricate pieces of machinery that they are. Never slam or force anything into gear. It should be a smooth effortless switch from one gear to the next.

That said, the transmission on the 250R is sort of "agricultural" and is not the slickest, smoothest tranny around. Still... don't abuse it or you'll be in for some very expensive repairs that won't be covered under warranty.

[Alex]

Originally Posted by kkim

That said, the transmission on the 250R is sort of "agricultural" and is not the slickest, smoothest tranny around.

I've heard this on this board before, but it surprises me a bit. I've owned some really bad transmissions (Buells, older BMW's), and some of those really did feel like tractor transmissions. Horrible shift feel, huge travel at the lever, clunky noises, just awful. I've found the transmissions on our ninjettes to be quite nice, actually. Very short lever travel, not noisy, consistent shift action; I was always pleasantly surprised that they were able to get a decent one into a bike that is so clearly built to a price point. It's nicer than the transmission I had on an R6 only a few years ago, which was incredibly finicky and clunky unless you were shifting at 10000 rpms or higher.

[kkim]

Guess I'm used to snickity, snick transmissions on the Honda street and dirt bikes. The ones I've had have been absolutely jewel like. I find the 250 tranny sort of "clunky" for a street bike.

Yes, the euro bikes (and cars) are horrible with regard to transmission throw and feel. Those are not agricultural, they are stone aged.

[Xuracing]

I have the same problem multiple reviews state the same thing. Its fairly common.
This transmission feels really grainy if you know what i mean. Compared to my other two hondas. The hondas click and automatically click right in. If it doesnt go into the gear it will bounce back to the nearest gear above or below it... So it will always be in gear unlike this thing. Neutral light will be off and just rev.

I wouldn't worry about it Just make sure when you click it down you feel the clunk of the initial first gear engagement.

[headshrink]

I'll take the octane question.

All the hours of research you will be doing will tell you this.... use 87 octane.
Many doubt (I did too), and think premium MUST be better, but it isn't. "Premium" is merely a marketing term. The ONLY differences between regular and premium is the amount of compression they ignite under..... oh, and they have misleading names. So if it is built for 87, use it.

To look at it another way... for the 250r, regular IS premium.

[Nickds7]

Sometimes you can kind of just let the clutch out to its friction point allowing you to easily put it into 1st gear. Not sure if it is the most healthy practice but if you don't get it into 1st before you stop, this may help. I usually never have much trouble getting it into 1st even if after fully stopped (not that I do it often )

[mxnello]

Indeed this topic has been beaten like a dead horse, but the 250r is not the best shifting bike. As I was looking over shifting linkage it appears a little sloppy maybe this may attribute to its grainy nature. Going to full syn at next change and will see if it 'improves'.

[tjkamper]

Try blipping the throttle up to about 3500 rpm right before looking for the gear. I've had this problem with several bikes. Honda Rebel 250, Suzuki SV650, Ninjette.

The Honda also had the problem going from first to nuetral. It would just go up to second if I didnt rev the engine up before makng the shift.

[BlueRaven]

Has the bike even been dropped on the left side? I recently dropped it and broke the rearset. I've been noticing that if i go in neutral and then try to go into first it won't go even if the neutral light goes off. I've had to force it a couple of times so i'll have to do a complete check to make sure that anything wasn't bent or damaged. I don't have this problem if i don't go to neutral.

Went for a ride tonight and checked to make sure everything was tight before leaving and the problem didn't come up. Went from first to neutral a few times to see if it would happen again and luckily it didn't.

[Focus Mike]

I figured out that its better to just downshift if you think the light is going to go green and if you know you can stop for sure just clutch in and downshift to 1st. Its easy that way, its how I learned to ride and its worked so far.

My first gear does make a funny clunk sound when I downshift.

Its like click, click, click, click, clunk. It's probably normal.

[Hokie11]

sometimes, i hold my clutch all the way in, go down to first, try to go down one more, feel it lock off, then go back to 2nd, all while clutch is still engaged... until i get use to the "feel", thats the only way i can find 1st and 2nd at the moment..

is it okay to do so? since the clutch is fully engaged the entire time, i didnt think it would matter

[NoobNinja]

sometimes i have the same prob. just kinda release the clutch to relieve pressure and it'll go down. make sure to note it at your first scheduled maint.

[mista350z]

It happens to me sometimes too. I think I posted a thread about it awhile back. What works for me is I try to always downshift to 1st gear before I come to a complete stop like almost40 said, then I click back to neutral if I am waiting at the light. If it does get stuck though, I try and shift up to 2nd and then neutral, and then back to first. Also, try rocking the bike a little, that works for me all the time.

[Cedilla]

Mine got stuck yesterday, I dropped my bike cause of it. When I picked my bike up it clicked right down into first, maybe yall should just throw the bikes down to assert your dominance?

[mista350z]

Originally Posted by Cedilla

Mine got stuck yesterday, I dropped my bike cause of it. When I picked my bike up it clicked right down into first, maybe yall should just throw the bikes down to assert your dominance?

lol i guess that is an option too.

[capt_bugaloo]

If you think the Ninja 250 has a clunky transmission, try riding an Enfield Bullet 500.
I've rode a pretty wide variety of bikes over the years (all the major Japanese, HD Sportster, my old Enfield, BMW F650, R80, cruiser, sportbike, standard, dual-purpose, etc.) and I think my '08 250r has the smoothest, most flickable transmission of them all. If you seriously think it has a clunky transmission, I would have to say there is something wrong with either your bike's transmission or with your shifting technique!

To the OP: as others have written, it sounds like you are not downshifting properly as you come to a stop. Sure, sometimes you have an emergency stop, and have to grab a fistful of clutch and brake, but that should not be routine stopping. You should be planning your stops as you approach intersections, etc. and drilling down through the gears 1-by-1 as you slow.

And if your bike runs well on 87 without any knocking, pinging, bogging, etc. (and your EX-250 should run well on 87) then you're wasting your money on the higher octane stuff.

[headshrink]

Originally Posted by mista350z

It happens to me sometimes too. I think I posted a thread about it awhile back. What works for me is I try to always downshift to 1st gear before I come to a complete stop like almost40 said, then I click back to neutral if I am waiting at the light. If it does get stuck though, I try and shift up to 2nd and then neutral, and then back to first. Also, try rocking the bike a little, that works for me all the time.

If you are talking about being at a complete stop, how are you getting into 2nd? We have that "positive neutral finder" that is supposed to prevent this at a stand still.

[mista350z]

I just shift up I mean like to goto 2nd and it pops into neutral, then i downshift back to 1
st.

[headshrink]

Originally Posted by mista350z

I just shift up I mean like to goto 2nd and it pops into neutral, then i downshift back to 1
st.

Oh, I gotcha now..... yes, I do the same to hit N at a light. So I actually rely on this handy-dandy gadget.

[Cedilla]

Do most bikes have a positive neutral finder nowadays? Seems like it would be a pain in the butt not to have it.

[Alex]

Only Kawi's. But most Kawi's do have one.

[Cedilla]

Sweet, sounds like one more reason to for me to stay in the kawi family.

[DarkNinja52]

anyone get stuck in neutral *without* the neutral light staying on when trying to go from N to 1st?

[rockNroll]

Originally Posted by DarkNinja52

anyone get stuck in neutral *without* the neutral light staying on when trying to go from N to 1st?

I haven't been stuck in neutral, but I've had the bike in neutral and the Neutral light not illuminate.

[demp]

I've yet to have any shifting problems like this on the 250, *Crosses fingers*

[headshrink]

I once hit N between 5 and 6, then downshifted to every N in between each remaining gear, as I rolled to a stop (so much for engine braking). That sucked, but it was pretty funny.

[DarkNinja52]

ive been practicing engine breaking a ton but shifting into first (when it works) almost brings the bike to an immediate halt even though im below 3k rpm

but i still have problems with getting stuck in neutral *without* the freaking light going on but only while i have the clutch in and im shifting to first and then to neutral then back out without letting go of the clutch.

[An Examiner]

Same problem here. Sometimes I'll stop at a light and be unsure whether I'm in 2nd or 1st. So I'll try to click it down. If I'm actually in 1st, it won't click down, and about 50% of the time this happens it'll bump back into Neutral. You can't feel it bump into neutral and the light doesn't come on. But boy, it makes for a fun attempt to start going out.

So now, if I think it's bumped back into N, I'll either click it up into N and then back down to 1 and make sure I feel it go into 1, or I'll gradually let out the clutch to the beginning of the friction zone with no/little throttle and see if the bikes starts to pull forward and/or stall.

I also quickly figured out that if the bike is warmed up you never need to go lower than 2nd. Starting from 2nd is a lot smoother for me, for whatever reason, as there's less bucking. Any repercussions from this?

[Alex]

Originally Posted by DarkNinja52

but only while i have the clutch in and im shifting to first and then to neutral then back out without letting go of the clutch.

I wouldn't get in the habit of doing this. Most bikes can't do it, and if you try and force one that can't thinking it works like our ninjette, it's possible to bend a shift fork.

Originally Posted by An Examiner

I also quickly figured out that if the bike is warmed up you never need to go lower than 2nd. Starting from 2nd is a lot smoother for me, for whatever reason, as there's less bucking. Any repercussions from this?

A little more clutch wear, but it's hard to tell if it would be significant enough to ever make too much of a difference.

[DarkNinja52]

Originally Posted by Alex

I wouldn't get in the habit of doing this. Most bikes can't do it, and if you try and force one that can't thinking it works like our ninjette, it's possible to bend a shift fork.



A little more clutch wear, but it's hard to tell if it would be significant enough to ever make too much of a difference.

Good point about the shift fork, usually i just do it to know where the shifter really is, I should prob trust my gut because i tend to be right about it, just like to make sure though..

and about starting in 2nd, im sure it would be smoother and would definitely be convenient but idk how confident I feel about doing it because i'm not sure how it would affect the clutch or transmission.

[headshrink]

You could always add an aftermarket gear indicator.... but you would have to add an electronic speed sensor due to our [stupid] cable-driven speedometers (looks similar to the ones on like a bicycle).

I can't vouch for their accuracy, and haven't seen one on the 250r, but some people like them.

[DarkNinja52]

Originally Posted by headshrink

You could always add an aftermarket gear indicator.... but you would have to add an electronic speed sensor due to our [stupid] cable-driven speedometers (looks similar to the ones on like a bicycle).

I can't vouch for their accuracy, and haven't seen one on the 250r, but some people like them.

I've never seen those, sounds like a bit of work.

i think im goin to stick with "if the bike makes noise and moves, its in gear, if it just makes noise, its not"

[headshrink]

Yeah, it is better to learn to "be one" with the bike, then to rely on a gauge.... Developing better skills/habits are more valuable than using a crutch - however, an argument may be made that the visual reinforcement of the gauge, in conjunction of speedo, tach, along with the sound/feel of the bike might , for some, help them learn faster.... (I learn that way).

I don't NEED one, but would like one anyway. Partly as a farkle, well mostly as a farkle. I don't misjudge my gear as often as I did in the beginning, but occasionally still do. I don't want it bad enough to modify the bike for it, but perhaps the next bike will have one.