Carbon Fiber Rear Hugger

[Actualize Composites]

Hey Guys,

I'm designing a carbon fiber rear hugger for the 08-09 Ninjette and was looking for some design input from you guys. Design idea so far are stemming from a cross sort of between the Lambourghini Reventon and the A-tech style rear hugger. The pics of what I have so far are below (the last pic's of what the proposed vent will look like atm). The edges will be rounded slightly so it won't look out of place on the bike, but still have the faceted look it has now. Was wondering what you guys think with regards to the angles, vent style, A-arm shape etc. Let me know and we'll all be able to have a sweet carbon fiber rear hugger we all like for our bikes by next season.

Cheers, Alex

www.acarbon.ca

143kyvl.jpg nehmi8.jpg osd1mu.jpg whxmad.jpg zm16jb.jpg

[adouglas]

Personally I think the angular approach will not complement the styling of the bike.

Look at the bodywork... it's all flowing curves. The angular vents and cutouts serve to highlight the curves... they are not the central theme.

This might look good on, say, a Fischer, which looks like origami... all angles and flat surfaces.

For cues about the curves, look at the rear bodywork from above, the curvature of the side panels as seen from above, and the tank, both from above and from the side. Note that all have a similar theme of a gentle curve flowing into a line, and that the curve radii are all similar.

This is also why I don't particularly go for some of the seat cowls out there (Sportisi? Not sure.) It's all angular when the bike itself isn't. The OEM seat cowl complements the styling perfectly because it's all about soft curves.

Also... vent where none is needed. Doesn't do it for me, sorry.

Just my $0.02. I'm sure somebody will love it.

PS: It's "Lamborghini." Speling kownts, espeshally wen u want to look profeshunal.

[Actualize Composites]

Hi Andrew,

Thanks for your comments on what I've got so far. I was going for the angular approach to make it stand out a little bit from the bike, not look hidden away under the tail or of an overly rounded "jelly bean" design that a lot of other huggers seem to be imho. It won't seem so angular once finished, as the hard edges are being used to make sure the faces are planar - the edges will be rounded down eventually - but you bring up a good point with the design elements and the hard lines complementing the curves. What are other people's opinions about fitting in with the bike (dominant curves highlighted with hard lines) vs. being more unique in a Fischer/KTM design style?

The vents are meant to fit in with the faceted design (was thinking of adding some more) since a large carbon fiber surface needs extra design elements imho, just thinking of carbon fiber hoods I see. That's what I like though, what are other people's opinions?

Cheers, Alex

[bob706]

I like what I see so far. Is there anyway you could photoshop it and give folks an idea what it will look like on the bike?

[Actualize Composites]

Hi Sean,

I'm glad you like the design. I'll either put it on my bike or photoshop it on if it's hard to see. I want to see how well it actually matches up with the bike's lines and angles myself to make sure I'm on the right track.

Question I forgot to ask everyone before was regarding covering the swing arm or not. The picture of it on the bike should give a better view, but I know some people had beef with A-tech's hugger and the fake A-arm cover.

Also, what do people think regarding the vents? More, less or two's fine?

Cheers, Alex

Actualize Carbon
www.acarbon.ca

[Shift250R]

I think it looks good and its not even done yet.

[CZroe]

Originally Posted by Actualize Composites

Hi Andrew,

Thanks for your comments on what I've got so far. I was going for the angular approach to make it stand out a little bit from the bike, not look hidden away under the tail or of an overly rounded "jelly bean" design that a lot of other huggers seem to be imho. It won't seem so angular once finished, as the hard edges are being used to make sure the faces are planar - the edges will be rounded down eventually - but you bring up a good point with the design elements and the hard lines complementing the curves. What are other people's opinions about fitting in with the bike (dominant curves highlighted with hard lines) vs. being more unique in a Fischer/KTM design style?

The vents are meant to fit in with the faceted design (was thinking of adding some more) since a large carbon fiber surface needs extra design elements imho, just thinking of carbon fiber hoods I see. That's what I like though, what are other people's opinions?

Cheers, Alex

I like the Sportisi because it fits the design of the bike so well. I HATE the eBay hugger because of that jelly-bean shape that makes it look generic. I like the other Indonesian hugger that's made to look like a GSXR 600, but the actual hugger piece is small and not as prominent as I'd like it (no reason to make it EXACTLY like a GSXR 600; just mimic the open but fluid swingarm frame and go from there). The A-tech one looks nice but really only belongs on a black or customized bike (white or lots of other CF parts or '09 SE-like black mid-fairing paint job w/o the white stripe, etc).

Sportisi is king of huggers, IMO, so taking cues from them while differentiating for your own unique style seems like the way to go to me.

Sorry, I can't really visualize yours right now because my low-res netbook display hates your pics.

[ztrack157]

I would redesign the vents. There are no sharp angles on the bike styling wise so tone down as much as you can. Also is this a 1 or 2 piece design. Other than that I can't help you much since it would be shooting myself in the foot.

[Actualize Composites]

First of all, I just want to say thanks to everyone who's taken the time so far to help with the comments and suggestions, I definitely appreciate it. The design's coming along, but I don't have any more pics for you guys at this time. The next ones should be in a day or two when I take a picture of it on my bike, primarily to show you guys what it looks like better and secondly for myself to make sure the design of the fairing doesn't clash with the design of the bike. In addition, the pictures will be in two sets for low and high resolution such that people with smaller resolutions (laptops) can see them properly.

The vents will most likely be designed to look more like louvers instead of one large one on either side, just so it doesn't stand out too much, but I'm really interested to hear what you all have to say on this. In the end, it all comes down to what we all think fits design-wise when on the bike. The vents will also be functional, just because I'm an engineer and not a big fan of functional design features which aren't. Fake hood intakes and such come to mind. The fact that close tolerences on a rear hugger look amazing, (Sportisi did a great job with this), but also add a large amount of drag also comes into play with making the vents functional (to decrease drag) and with the amount of power this bike has it can't really afford to lose any ponies.

A word on the direction of the design though. Kawasaki did an awesome job designing the 250, there's absolutely no doubt about that, the flowing curves accented by sharp lines and some planar surfaces look absolutely amazing, the reason we're all owners and on this forum to begin with really. The way I look at it though, with any high-production product, you can only push the envelope with your styling so far, (Honda & Toyota products for instance), since you need to satisfy so many clientele. I personally like my styling a bit edgier as you can see, whereas some people are obviously going to be at the other end of the spectrum and as such Kawasaki can't stray too far from the middle in order to keep 10,000+ people happy. The point I'm trying to make is that I'm designing this part to stand out a bit from the bike by drawing from some of the hard lines and angular surfaces the bike already has (look at the sides of the front fender for instance). As much as the bike already has smooth curves complemented by hard lines, I want the rear hugger to stand out without clashing from the bike. Whether shelling out money or putting in hours for a rear hugger, I'd want it to at least be a bit noticeable and not look like it just came with the bike. That being said, it's still very much in the middle of the design process, but by the end I will be making sure it doesn't look out of place on the bike, just noticeable through it's more aggressive styling. Again, you guys have definitely been a huge help in this and I welcome more of your comments.

I plan to make this in carbon fiber at the moment, but if enough people want it in flat black, gloss black, silver, fighter jet camo, etc., I'll make it in fiberglass too. I think this would look hideous in OEM colours, but that's just me. What do all of you think?

[Zero260]

Originally Posted by Actualize Composites

I think this would look hideous in OEM colours, but that's just me. What do all of you think?

What colors were you thinking about ?

I don't understand. I would think that most people including me would want it to match their bike. To give you an example, I just talked to Matt about buying a Sportisi rear hugger. He has it in 2008 black but not the 2009 black. Because I want it to match perfect, I'm SOL until he gets one in.

I just think that if you want them to sell, you need to offer the OEM colors.

[bob706]

What's the price range for this hugger? While carbon fiber would be cool, having a choice of color would also be nice.

[CZroe]

Guys... imagine the A-Tech hugger in OEM colors. Yuck. That's what he's talking about. But CF or FG Black, yeah, that'd work.

[Actualize Composites]

It would definitely look good in black, I was thinking of Kawasaki's bright red, blue & green (the colour I have) with regards to my comment before. If enough people want them in those colours though, I'll paint it those. I just don't see a lot of people wanting it in those based on my opinion, but I could be wrong.

Price-wise I'm not sure yet, it depends how good it ends up looking in carbon fiber. Most likely between the Sportisi and the A-tech hugger since carbon fiber commands a premium, quite a bit less for a fiberglass one. If people want it painted, I'd have to see what that would cost me, I have no idea at the moment.

[Actualize Composites]

And Zero260, if you want the 09 black and have access to a paint shop, apparently Colorrite.com sells OEM colours. You have to go with the polyurethane spray gun grade (in a tin) though, I bought touch up paint from them before and it was close but didn't match.

[ztrack157]

If it is a one piece model do not paint it anything other than black. my .02

[k-os]

Originally Posted by ztrack157

If it is a one piece model do not paint it anything other than black. my .02

I agree. If the whole piece was painted OEM colors the part that covers the swingarm would look ridiculous.

[overload]

i love it ... i'll even pay for shipping to SOUTH AFRICA ... just lemme know how much ...

[Actualize Composites]

Here's what the hugger looks like on the bike finally. The sharp angles and lines definitely get hidden by the muffler and other parts, so I almost could have done more, but I like the degree to which I've taken it so far. The vents have started to be cut out and I'm experimenting with the cardboard pieces, however I plan on making the vents like the mock-up on on the right side of the hugger (without the green tape), similar to the style of the large vent on the side of the 250. The side with green tape is made to look like louvers, which I really like, but doesn't work with the bike. The very top part of the hugger will be angled down a bit more aggressively so the hard lines will show, in conjunction with bringing the hugger tighter to the wheel to create the small tolerances. The side/bottom parts of the hugger will also be sculpted to emulate a swing arm, either dished or cut out to see through, haven't decided yet, still need to play around a bit. What do you all think? I'm interested in your opinions on the two styles going together, ideas for the vents & swing arm and what you like/dislike overall.

PS - Thank you to the moderator who cleaned up my first posting of photos so they're more viewable.

Rear Hugger 001.jpg Rear Hugger 007.jpg Rear Hugger 009.jpg Rear Hugger 011.jpg Rear Hugger 014.jpg Rear Hugger 017.jpg Rear Hugger 018.jpg

[rockNroll]

Pointy huggers are ugly.

[k-os]

I actually like it. Will the finished version be so thick at the tip? (I'm guessing that's just what you need to do to be able to use it for the molding process) Also, what zie tires will it fit? Are you going to make it work with 160?

[adouglas]

Looks better on the bike, but I still think it needs some rounded edges at least, like the edge of the tail bodywork.

[overload]

I dont know about you guys but i love it ...

[bob706]

Hot damn, I think that looks good. It can only get better looking at this point. How will it attach on the right side?

[noche_caliente]

I really don't like the way it looks from the rear angle third pic - will it actually be that thick?

[Actualize Composites]

Hey Everyone,

Thanks for the comments, all your input is definitely helping with the progress so far. The styling's definitely out of phase at the moment between the hugger and the bike since the hugger's been designed seperately up until now. I almost wasn't going to post the pictures I took this morning because of how bad I thought it looked at this specific point in time, but wanted to keep you guys updated and get your input. In other words, it's the ugliest it will ever be at the moment since none of the lines match up, gaps are everywhere etc., but I've already been working today to improve everything.

The back of the hugger will definitely not be that thick, razor thin in fact, but it looks chubby because of all the foam underneath, which is just used for the moulding process like k-os said. The rear hugger will eventually be a thin layer of carbon/fiberglass where the pink colour is, while the foam represents the space between the hugger and the wheel, which will eventually be air. So from the back, the foam you see represents the space between the hugger's thin rear edge and the tire, just like how the A-tech hugger pokes up. I'm moving the sides of the hugger closer to the wheel so that it actually "hugs" as closely as possible (only at one point since it's a flat surface and a round wheel), but the hugger will definitely not be thick anywhere, it will be about 2mm or 1/16th inch thick all over.

Right now it's just made to fit the stock tires since a hugger needs to have close tolerances and stock tires are all I have to work with. When I get 150s on my bike it won't be too much trouble to move some surfaces and make the rear hugger fit that tire. I'd also like to make a more rounded hugger in the future since there's been a lot of people commenting who like that style better than the angular one I've been making here. All the rounded styles I've seen aside from the A-tech haven't been to my liking (Sportisi came close), so you might see a thread on here featuring a Daytona 675 style rear hugger a year or so down the road.

In terms of attachment methods, I plan on utilizing the stock mounting points on the left side, contact the front of the swing arm and have something come down to hook under the right side of the swing arm to keep it in tension. The areas of the part in contact would have a rubberized surface (hidden from view) of EPDM tape or something of the sort to resist movement and prevent any scratching. I know there's been some issues voiced about mounting deficiencies with the A-tech hugger, so I'll make sure the prototype is attached securely and doesn't rattle around.

[Actualize Composites]

For those concerned about the top of the hugger, the blue foam represents the gap of air you see in this picture:

[CZroe]

Will it create a false swingarm on the muffler side? All the tiny exhausts and undertail mods I've seen are ruined by revealing that dinky swingarm over there unless they have the right hugger.

I'm liking the angles more now that I see that they match with the lower fairing cuts. The thing is, people won't see it that way if they aren't colored the same. A false swingarm in black with a colored hugger piece looks a whole lot better than those whole-colored Skidmarx ones (ugh). Otherwise, all black or CF.

[ScorpionNinja]

So far of all ive looked at online (pics)

#1 - that if the Price wasnt so much ($200 us)
is the Skidmarx (UK) one! IMO

Either Semi-gloss Black (to match the underneath of the bike)
or the OEM colors!

Id rather have Sunbeam Red (2009) of the Skidmarx one!
I wont pay $200 for a hunk of plastic, nor spend more on a real CF hunk (why? only cuz CF would be Half the normal weight? even so, if weight your looking to CHOP off your 250R, just RID all Plastic body on your bike!)

hugger_kawasaki_zx9re_0001.jpg hugger_kawasaki_zx12_03.jpg

All other ones, if i remember right... DONT have the added, molded in-chain guard! W/O it, it allows more 'lube fling' also more chain exposed, NOT as safe, ya know!

[noche_caliente]

I also love the skidmarx!

[k-os]

I really don't like the look of the Skidmarx. The solid color just doesn't look right.

[addy126]

Those that have N-250 huggers installed have you noticed any "stone chipping" on the upper & side portion of the hugger? I have on mine and its merely a matte black to blend into the black scape of the bike. I prefer the looks of the more streamlined, rounded huggers rather than the angular representation.

[CZroe]

Originally Posted by k-os

I really don't like the look of the Skidmarx. The solid color just doesn't look right.

Agreed. How ANYONE can think that looks good is beyond the scope of my comprehension. It's flat-out TERRIBLE, and then, to consider the price, it's even worse than "terrible." Are they complete idiots or is there some reason why they don't offer it with a black chain guard? Even then, it wouldn't match the Ninjette's styling as well as Sportisi nor would it hide the wimpy-looking swingarm (important, considering that you're drawing attention down there and you may be removing passenger pegs and such for a better view).

Anyway, I asked bprayogo (Sportisi) if they could add something like this:

hugger_guard.jpg

...and he said:

Originally Posted by bprayogo

YES, that is easy to make perhaps you want to order 10 sets ? I give you that add on for free :P

Of course, i only want one.

[00v_Lucky]

I like the style you are going for! All of these other people are too dull They are not like us, we are the few people that have "edge"


I cannot wait to see the final product!

[k-os]

Any updates on this?

[Actualize Composites]

The rear hugger's still in the works, I've just put it aside for a bit while I finish the moulds for the Ninja 250 carbon fiber front fender (week or two away) and carbon fiber dash. I like the edginess I had, but wasn't quite liking how everything was matching up, so it'll be redesigned to fit better when it's completed. Thinking Feb/March 2010 time-wise as a ballpark.

[sixer]

yeah carbon fiber dash would rock