Aftermarket tuning soon to be a thing of the past?

ninjamunky85 · January 14th, 2015, 03:42 PM

So a buddy of mine recently sold his dizzer 400sm and bought a brand new 2015 Husqvarna FE501s (basically the same bike as the KTM 500 exc). Last weekend he had me help him gut the muffler and remove all the smog crap. His plan was to take in into the dealer he bought it from and have them re-map the ecu to the euro spec race map.

Well he took it into the dealer on Monday and when they tried to re-map it locked the ecu. After doing a little research online I found out that as of 2012 KTM dealers are no longer allowed to alter the ecu on any KTM for any reason, and that any dealer that does can be fined big $$$ or even lose their KTM endorsement.

KTM will allow the map to be changed, but it requires you sending them your VIN, in which case they will remove your green sticker and make sure that the bike can no longer be plated.

A little more research and I found out that aftermarket companies that sell tuners, like superchips, are being sued by the EPA because they can't ensure that their products aren't being used on the street. Apparently the diesel guys are pissed because they were sent updates that wiped out their tuners.

It just makes me wonder how long it will be before any companies that sell aftermarket exhausts and the tuning products that go with them will be forced out of business. I know that aftermarket exhausts for street motorcycles have already been outlawed in Cali and that most companies won't even send their products there anymore.

I'm sure that my buddy will get his issues sorted out as the dealership said they would make it right and that they have changed maps in the past for other customers. It makes me think though that the days of these modifications are numbered.

csmith12 · January 14th, 2015, 03:46 PM

Jason5885 · January 15th, 2015, 07:29 AM

Well this is a scary thought

Somchai · January 15th, 2015, 07:36 AM

@ninjamunky85 thanks for coming up with this.

JohnnyBravo · January 15th, 2015, 08:20 AM

Somebody will always find a way to tune if they want too

Brother Michigan · January 15th, 2015, 08:21 AM

I can't find any information regarding any sort of EPA lawsuit against ECU tuning companies. Do we have anything concrete on this or is it just hearsay? I would think if there was really going to be any sort of lawsuit of this kind, it would have happened over aftermarket exhausts a LONG time ago. Check pretty much any aftermarket system or slip-on and you'll see they say they aren't for road use.

As for locking the ECU, it should always possible to unlock it again with the proper know-how.

Hero Danny · January 15th, 2015, 08:26 AM

First they try to take our free speech, then our guns, but now they've gone TOO far!

On a serious note, this is ridiculous, it's not the companies responsibility to make sure their customer's are using the product on the street or not. Should Cutco be responsible if someone takes one of their kitchen knives and stabs someone with it? Should Toyota be responsible if someone buys a car from them then runs over 5 people and then run from the police with the camry (lol)? Absolutely not! This is ridiculous, F this country.

ninjamunky85 · January 15th, 2015, 09:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brother Michigan

I can't find any information regarding any sort of EPA lawsuit against ECU tuning companies. Do we have anything concrete on this or is it just hearsay? I would think if there was really going to be any sort of lawsuit of this kind, it would have happened over aftermarket exhausts a LONG time ago. Check pretty much any aftermarket system or slip-on and you'll see they say they aren't for road use.

As for locking the ECU, it should always possible to unlock it again with the proper know-how.

This was what I'd seen on that. Read the fifth post down.http://www.thumpertalk.com/topic/957...t-be-unlocked/

I haven't looked into it anymore that that though.

Brother Michigan · January 15th, 2015, 09:52 PM

Meh, this line tells me that nothing is actually happening:

Quote:

We have strong reason to believe all companies that continue to engage in the business of manufacturing, distributing, or selling these kinds of products in the United States will be subject to enforcement action from both the United States EPA and the California Air Resources Board.

Even if the EPA were to actually pursue legal action, it would be pretty easy to absolve the companies of responsibility. (If someone runs a pedestrian over because they're driving their car on the sidewalk, it's not the automobile manufacturer's fault.)

nickjpass · January 16th, 2015, 01:18 AM

Let's pollute this earth while we can.

Run 'em rich boyz!!!

ninjunk · January 16th, 2015, 11:04 AM

ha ha yeah it just takes the aftermarket a bit longer to catch up with new technology. The ecu thing is getting harder and harder the more they are integrated into the vehicles... try doing an ecu swap on some crazy hybrid thing with a dashboard video monitor and all that stuff...

Its also getting to a point where companies can produce very powerful and very efficient engines, leaving less to be improved upon. you just about can't get a more powerful exhaust for a late model sportsbike or dirtbike, intake especially are so well tuned and designed, you can get more top end but usually end up loosing a lot of midrange. Its not like the good old days when OEM engines were choked down and detuned giving you a lot of room for improvement

jkv45 · January 16th, 2015, 11:14 AM

Won't be an issue when electric cycles become the norm.

Polaris just bought Brammo, so it looks like they think it's not too far off.

And I believe there have been fines handed-out to aftermarket companies in California that haven't followed the letter-of-the-law.

Bubba · January 19th, 2015, 01:28 PM

Sorry, but its about time, we all have to breathe the air.
If you want a faster bike, buy a faster bike. You can get them up to 200hp now.
Most of these guys fooling around with ECUs and pipes end up worse than stock, and in the end, they spend more money than just buying a faster bike.

ForceofWill · January 19th, 2015, 01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bubba

Sorry, but its about time, we all have to breathe the air.
If you want a faster bike, buy a faster bike. You can get them up to 200hp now.
Most of these guys fooling around with ECUs and pipes end up worse than stock, and in the end, they spend more money than just buying a faster bike.

Rofl, you think the big bad modders are the cause for your air pollution? Have an idea of the % of people that do to cars/bikes?

Why don't you direct your focus to the shipping industry.

crimsondragon · January 19th, 2015, 07:06 PM

I'll stick with my pre-2005 vehicles. Seems like anything after 2005 is getting harder to crack. I also hate the TPMS sensor requirements as well. Not my fault some people are too retarded to notice they have a flat tire.

ninjamunky85 · January 28th, 2015, 10:06 AM

Well the dealership got everything worked out and my buddy's bike is running like a champ now... So how do you make a brand new $10k dirt bike even more badass? Mount up some 17's of course

Brother Michigan · January 28th, 2015, 10:20 AM

That thing looks like a lot of fun. I think a sumo might be the next thing to go in my garage... as soon as I get a garage, that is.

Alex · January 28th, 2015, 11:20 AM

Was just reading about that 501 in CycleWorld this morning; it got a stellar review. Everything fun about the KTM version, plus some neat upgrades on the frame & suspension.

January 14th, 2015, 03:42 PM	#1
ninjamunky85 Que Buenos Son!!! Name: Ryan Location: Grovetucky, OH Join Date: Jun 2012 Motorcycle(s): Aprilia Shiver 750, Husaberg FE 450, Ninja 300 (sold), xr100 Posts: A lot. MOTM - Nov '14	Aftermarket tuning soon to be a thing of the past? So a buddy of mine recently sold his dizzer 400sm and bought a brand new 2015 Husqvarna FE501s (basically the same bike as the KTM 500 exc). Last weekend he had me help him gut the muffler and remove all the smog crap. His plan was to take in into the dealer he bought it from and have them re-map the ecu to the euro spec race map. Well he took it into the dealer on Monday and when they tried to re-map it locked the ecu. After doing a little research online I found out that as of 2012 KTM dealers are no longer allowed to alter the ecu on any KTM for any reason, and that any dealer that does can be fined big $$$ or even lose their KTM endorsement. KTM will allow the map to be changed, but it requires you sending them your VIN, in which case they will remove your green sticker and make sure that the bike can no longer be plated. A little more research and I found out that aftermarket companies that sell tuners, like superchips, are being sued by the EPA because they can't ensure that their products aren't being used on the street. Apparently the diesel guys are pissed because they were sent updates that wiped out their tuners. It just makes me wonder how long it will be before any companies that sell aftermarket exhausts and the tuning products that go with them will be forced out of business. I know that aftermarket exhausts for street motorcycles have already been outlawed in Cali and that most companies won't even send their products there anymore. I'm sure that my buddy will get his issues sorted out as the dealership said they would make it right and that they have changed maps in the past for other customers. It makes me think though that the days of these modifications are numbered. __________________________________________________ Don't do something because it's easy,.. Do it because it's not! If you aren't going forward, then you're falling behind. "Drive it like you stole it"!!!
	1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.

January 14th, 2015, 03:46 PM	#2
csmith12 The Corner Whisperer Name: Chris (aka Reactor) Location: Northern KY Join Date: May 2011 Motorcycle(s): 2010 250 (track), 1992 250, 2006 R6 (street/track), 2008 R6 (track) Posts: Too much. MOTY 2015, MOTM - Nov '12, Nov '13	__________________________________________________ Goal: Shake A Million Hands \| Look through the corners \| Track Day Prep \| Closest track? \| The Mid-Ohio School

January 15th, 2015, 08:20 AM	#5
JohnnyBravo Certifiable nontundrum Name: Harper Location: NC Milkshake stand Join Date: Mar 2013 Motorcycle(s): 2013 SE NINJA 300 Posts: Too much. MOTM - Sep '13, Sep '16	Somebody will always find a way to tune if they want too __________________________________________________

January 15th, 2015, 08:21 AM	#6
Brother Michigan ninjette.org sage Name: Aaron Location: Winder, GA Join Date: Jun 2012 Motorcycle(s): 2013 Ninja 300 Posts: 718	I can't find any information regarding any sort of EPA lawsuit against ECU tuning companies. Do we have anything concrete on this or is it just hearsay? I would think if there was really going to be any sort of lawsuit of this kind, it would have happened over aftermarket exhausts a LONG time ago. Check pretty much any aftermarket system or slip-on and you'll see they say they aren't for road use. As for locking the ECU, it should always possible to unlock it again with the proper know-how. __________________________________________________ DISCLAIMER: I generally have no idea what I'm talking about.

January 15th, 2015, 08:26 AM	#7
Hero Danny Inline 4!!! Name: Danny Location: MA Join Date: May 2014 Motorcycle(s): 2008 CBR600rr, 1987 KLR 250 Posts: A lot.	First they try to take our free speech, then our guns, but now they've gone TOO far! On a serious note, this is ridiculous, it's not the companies responsibility to make sure their customer's are using the product on the street or not. Should Cutco be responsible if someone takes one of their kitchen knives and stabs someone with it? Should Toyota be responsible if someone buys a car from them then runs over 5 people and then run from the police with the camry (lol)? Absolutely not! This is ridiculous, F this country. __________________________________________________ Be careful. Remember you are invisible
	2 out of 2 members found this post helpful.

January 15th, 2015, 07:29 AM	#3
Jason5885 ninjette.org member Name: Jason Location: Scotland Join Date: Nov 2014 Motorcycle(s): 2010 Kawasaki Ninja 250r FI Posts: 205 Blog Entries: 1	Well this is a scary thought

January 15th, 2015, 07:36 AM	#4
Somchai Freedom for Germany Location: This World Join Date: May 2011 Motorcycle(s): Ninja 250R-FI Posts: A lot.	@ninjamunky85 thanks for coming up with this.

January 16th, 2015, 01:18 AM	#10
nickjpass #squid Name: nickypoo Location: Five Guys Join Date: Jul 2011 Motorcycle(s): Track dedicated 2008 ZX6R Posts: A lot. MOTM - Jul '16	Let's pollute this earth while we can. Run 'em rich boyz!!! __________________________________________________

January 16th, 2015, 11:04 AM	#11
ninjunk Lostcause enthusiast Name: Graham Location: Austin, TX Join Date: Jan 2015 Motorcycle(s): 2000 EX250F Posts: 178	ha ha yeah it just takes the aftermarket a bit longer to catch up with new technology. The ecu thing is getting harder and harder the more they are integrated into the vehicles... try doing an ecu swap on some crazy hybrid thing with a dashboard video monitor and all that stuff... Its also getting to a point where companies can produce very powerful and very efficient engines, leaving less to be improved upon. you just about can't get a more powerful exhaust for a late model sportsbike or dirtbike, intake especially are so well tuned and designed, you can get more top end but usually end up loosing a lot of midrange. Its not like the good old days when OEM engines were choked down and detuned giving you a lot of room for improvement

January 16th, 2015, 11:14 AM	#12
jkv45 Rev Limiter Name: Jay Location: WI Join Date: Jul 2013 Motorcycle(s): '06 SV650n, '00 Derbi GPR, '64 CA77 Dream 305, '70 CL450 Scrambler, numerous dirt bikes Posts: A lot. MOTM - Jun '18, Oct '16	Won't be an issue when electric cycles become the norm. Polaris just bought Brammo, so it looks like they think it's not too far off. And I believe there have been fines handed-out to aftermarket companies in California that haven't followed the letter-of-the-law.

January 19th, 2015, 01:28 PM	#13
Bubba ninjette.org member Name: Bubba Location: Hamilton, Canada Join Date: Jun 2014 Motorcycle(s): 300 Posts: 99	Sorry, but its about time, we all have to breathe the air. If you want a faster bike, buy a faster bike. You can get them up to 200hp now. Most of these guys fooling around with ECUs and pipes end up worse than stock, and in the end, they spend more money than just buying a faster bike.
	0 out of 1 members found this post helpful.

January 19th, 2015, 07:06 PM	#15
crimsondragon ninjette.org member Name: Tim Location: NJ Join Date: Sep 2013 Motorcycle(s): 2006 Ninja 250 Posts: 47	I'll stick with my pre-2005 vehicles. Seems like anything after 2005 is getting harder to crack. I also hate the TPMS sensor requirements as well. Not my fault some people are too retarded to notice they have a flat tire.

January 28th, 2015, 10:06 AM	#16
ninjamunky85 Que Buenos Son!!! Name: Ryan Location: Grovetucky, OH Join Date: Jun 2012 Motorcycle(s): Aprilia Shiver 750, Husaberg FE 450, Ninja 300 (sold), xr100 Posts: A lot. MOTM - Nov '14	Well the dealership got everything worked out and my buddy's bike is running like a champ now... So how do you make a brand new $10k dirt bike even more badass? Mount up some 17's of course __________________________________________________ Don't do something because it's easy,.. Do it because it's not! If you aren't going forward, then you're falling behind. "Drive it like you stole it"!!!

January 28th, 2015, 10:20 AM	#17
Brother Michigan ninjette.org sage Name: Aaron Location: Winder, GA Join Date: Jun 2012 Motorcycle(s): 2013 Ninja 300 Posts: 718	That thing looks like a lot of fun. I think a sumo might be the next thing to go in my garage... as soon as I get a garage, that is. __________________________________________________ DISCLAIMER: I generally have no idea what I'm talking about.

January 28th, 2015, 11:20 AM	#18
Alex ninjette.org dude Name: 1 guess :-) Location: SF Bay Area Join Date: Jun 2008 Motorcycle(s): '13 Ninja 300 (white, the fastest color!), '13 R1200RT, '14 CRF250L, '12 TT-R125LE Posts: Too much. Blog Entries: 7	Was just reading about that 501 in CycleWorld this morning; it got a stellar review. Everything fun about the KTM version, plus some neat upgrades on the frame & suspension. __________________________________________________ Montgomery Street Motorcycle Club / cal24.com / crf250l.org / ninjette.org ninjette.org Terms of Service Shopping for motorcycle parts or equipment? Come here first. The friendliest Ninja 250R/300/400 forum on the internet! (especially Unregistered)

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