Possible dead battery

[roc0487]

Hope everyone is having a nice Easter Sunday!

Now onto my little issue...

The other day at idle, warmed up at a stop light I notice the Neutral and High Beam indicator lights were pulsing with the engine. Also, the tach needle at idle will bounce at random with no rpm change. Last season they were bright and stable and everything was fine. Bike starts and runs perfectly other than those issues.

Upon searching I checked connections, tight as possible... so I throw it on about an hour charge (12v@2Amps)... let it sit for about 30 minutes to let the surface charge dissipate. Here are my findings.

After the 30 minute rest 12.93v

Starting the bike 9v (read somewhere that anything below 10v points to dead cell)

Idle (13-14v) unsure exactly because I got discouraged.

Also, during the winter I pulled battery and stored it in the garage... I didn't pick up a Tender yet.

Battery issue? Voltage regulator? Any help much appreciated! Thanks in advance.

[Ghostt]

Double check all connections, including the grounds especially.

Have the battery checked out, auto zone, advanced auto etc....

Is this he battery wet cell? Gel? Sealed?

Battery Testing can be done in more than one way. The most accurate method is measurement of specific gravity and battery voltage. To measure specific gravity buy a temperature compensating hydrometer, to measure voltage use a digital D.C. Voltmeter. A quality load tester may be a good purchase if you need to test sealed batteries.

For any of these methods, you must first fully charge the battery and then remove the surface charge. If the battery has been sitting at least several hours (I prefer at least 12 hours) you may begin testing. To remove surface charge the battery must be discharged for several minutes. Using a headlight (high beam) will do the trick. After turning off the light you are ready to test the battery.


State of Charge Specific Gravity Voltage
* * 12V 6V
100% 1.265 12.7 6.3
75% 1.225 12.4 6.2
50% 1.190 12.2 6.1
25% 1.155 12.0 6.0
Discharged 1.120 11.9 6.0

Load testing is yet another way of testing a battery. Load test removes amps from a battery much like starting an engine would. A load tester can be purchased at most auto parts stores. Some battery companies label their battery with the amp load for testing. This number is usually 1/2 of the CCA rating. For instance, a 500CCA battery would load test at 250 amps for 15 seconds. A load test can only be performed if the battery is near or at full charge.

The results of your testing should be as follows:

Hydrometer readings should not vary more than .05 differences between cells.

Digital Voltmeters should read as the voltage is shown in this document. The sealed AGM and Gel-Cell battery voltage (full charged) will be slightly higher in the 12.8 to 12.9 ranges. If you have voltage readings in the 10.5 volts range on a charged battery, that typically indicates a shorted cell.

If you have a maintenance free wet cell, the only ways to test are voltmeter and load test. Any of the maintenance free type batteries that have a built in hydrometer(black/green window) will tell you the condition of 1 cell of 6. You may get a good reading from 1 cell but have a problem with other cells in the battery.

When in doubt about battery testing, call the battery manufacturer. Many batteries sold today have a toll free number to call for help.

[DaBlue1]

Originally Posted by roc0487

..... I notice the Neutral and High Beam indicator lights were pulsing with the engine. Also, the tach needle at idle will bounce at random with no rpm change.

Upon searching I checked connections, tight as possible... so I throw it on about an hour charge (12v@2Amps)... let it sit for about 30 minutes to let the surface charge dissipate. Here are my findings.

After the 30 minute rest 12.93v

Starting the bike 9v (read somewhere that anything below 10v points to dead cell)

Idle (13-14v) unsure exactly because I got discouraged.

Also, during the winter I pulled battery and stored it in the garage... I didn't pick up a Tender yet.

From the NinjetteWiki

- if you notice the lights are dim, recharge the battery.

- when revving the engine, and the lights dim you may need to replace the battery or the rectifier/regulator

- if activating the horn, brakes or turn signals increases the rpm speed, charge or replace the battery.

- if your lights on the Ninja 250 begin to flicker or your gauges or engine speed start to act erratically, check your battery connections

- charge the battery if the motor fails to start or the starter relay makes a clicking noise

Because bike batteries are small, a lot of times they do not give advance warnings when they start to go bad. They can be fine one moment and dead the next. troubleshooting a battery can be difficult. Most people figure that just because a battery shows 12 volts on a multi-meter that it is fine. However, the resting voltage should not be below 12.2 volts.

- if the battery fails to hold a charge, and voltage drops below 12.2 volts, get a new battery.

- if after charging the battery it fails to turn the starter over but still reads 12.0 volts or more of output, the amperage of the battery may be to low. battery replacement is recommended.

- for all practical purposes if the battery is below 12.2 volts, it’s dead.

- the ideal voltage should be more like 12.6-12.8 volts after the bike has been sitting a few days and also at idle.

[Ghostt]

If you need to replace the R/R, might I suggest upgrading to a mosfet R/R

https://www.ninjette.org/forums/blog.php?b=8354

https://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=213507

[asdfman]

Originally Posted by Ghostt

Double check all connections, including the grounds especially.

I had problems with my battery/charging system before and I found that a loose ground wire from the battery was indeed causing the problems. roc, It sounds like your charging system is okay, but have a look at this flow chart just in case: https://www.electrosport.com/media/p...ng-diagram.pdf

[cuong-nutz]

Battery. Just let it sit on the charger for a day or two and see.

[roc0487]

Thanks everyone, I appreciate the knowledge/advice. I just had the bike at Napa and he said the battery was ok. However; I don't believe it was load tester... merely a voltmeter. I'm about to head to Autozone and have it put on their device, I'll report back with any findings.

I've also kept record of a few findings post napa:

While cranking it doesn't drop below 10v now.
Running, about 4k rpm 14.1v

This is going to sound dumb as hell... but do your Neutral and High Beam lights have a slight pulse also? Am I being too damn anal? Regardless, I did notice the tach needle bounce from idle with no change to actual rpm twice.

Again, thank you all for your input.

[Ghostt]

Did you check the grounds?

[InvisiBill]

I'm not familiar with the size of the 250's battery, but make sure they load test it for the proper CCA rating. Someone on the 500 forum said that parts stores generally default to the 100CCA setting for motorcycle batteries, while the 500's battery is actually 210CCA.

[dcj13]

Originally Posted by roc0487

While cranking it doesn't drop below 10v now.
Running, about 4k rpm 14.1v

Am I being too damn anal?

Probably a little... But awareness is a good thing. It's even normal under some conditions to sense the car's RPMs change a tiny bit when the flashers are operating.

Do what Ghostt suggests: examine the attach point for the ground cable to the frame.

When checking electrical joints, don't merely check for tightness of fasteners. Take the joint apart and clean both surfaces with steel wool or emery paper until both sides of the interface are clean. Then reassemble.

[rgx107]

If it's above 10 V when cranking then the battery is OK, cranking is as good a load test as you can get. I don't have a 250 but would also suspect poor ground when indicators and lamps are acting up. Like others said.

[cuong-nutz]

What is your idle set at? 1500 seems to me a magic number for me.

[roc0487]

As the voltage at 4k rpm is between 13.7-14.3, Kawasaki suggests that the VR and rest of the charging system are in working order. I'm about to check the grounds, will report back.

Also, the gentleman I spoke with asked if I rode the bike after I charged it... since I didn't I just took a fully charged battery to be tested so of course it checked out ok.

Thanks again.

[roc0487]

asdfman,

Upon testing based on the link you attached, the charging system is fine.

Idle- 14.27
2500-14ish
5000-14.2

Last time I tested:

Idle-12.87
3000- 14.1

All grounds from battery are snug and clean. I haven't riden the bike but I plan to after work tomorrow, worst case scenario I'll grab a new battery. I bought the bike used last year so it's hard to tell how old it is.

I appreciate all of your help.

[cuong-nutz]

Just keep riding. Battery stays happy, you stay happy. Winner winner chicken dinner

[dcj13]

Eat your meal, you won't get thinner!

[Ghostt]

If your still having intermittent problems, double check the wiring again.

[dcj13]

And check those ground connections! At the frame.

[Ghostt]

Agreed

[roc0487]

I checked the main ground on frame, and also the thinner wire at the connection on the right side of the bike. I haven't had a chance to really get out on the bike due to certain legal restrictions and weather. Once I get out and/or replace the battery, I will post back with any changes.

[roc0487]

Problem solved.

As much as I hate to admit it... the entire issue stemmed from the idle being around 900rpm, I guess the bike wasn't getting enough juice and was so close to choking out that the neutral and high beam indicator lights pulsed and that also made the tach needle jump.

Thank you all for your advice and knowledge. If nothing else, this was a learning experience for me. Much appreciated.

[Ghostt]

I have a stupid question, how often do you just idle the bike?

Of you ride it, then it should charge the battery.

[roc0487]

It only idles if I'm at a stop light/sign. I've seen/heard that pure idle warm-ups aren't as good as riding easy with choke briefly while you ride, then getting off of the choke asap. Makes sense to me, my understanding is that if you're moving the oil moves under varying pressures vs just sitting there... probably not even coming the entire was to the valve train?