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Old May 31st, 2009, 08:37 PM   #401
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Don't forget old too.
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Old May 31st, 2009, 08:39 PM   #402
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hey, look who crawled out from under the rock!

...and this is not an old, cheap, effective mod.
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Old June 4th, 2009, 06:23 AM   #403
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this question may be off topic.
i will try to attempt this. however, i do have questions relating to this.
since i have to remove the fairings and tank could i also remove the airbox at the same time and replace it with k&N filter? what's the purpose of removing the airbox besides the look? with the airbox remove do i have to rejet or can i just do this mod?
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Old June 11th, 2009, 08:38 PM   #404
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Did this mod today with two 3mm washers along with removing the snorkel. I would say it is a royal PITA if you don't have the proper tools. I found it difficult to get a screwdriver in there to take the carb covers off. Once I got some different tools (a mini ratchet/wrench thing that fits in VERY tight spaces and works with any screw head) then it was smooth sailing. Also had some troubles with the screws and nearly stripped one but managed to make it work. Haven't taken it out for a ride yet as it's raining quite a bit but it sounds much better than it did before.
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Old June 11th, 2009, 09:29 PM   #405
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I guess I was lucky. My carb screws came out with a regular #2 screwdriver and some good old elbow grease without any stripping. I think the key is that you apply a lot of downward pressure before you even turn the screwdriver. I had a tougher time keeping that one metal bracket lined up with the screws to put them back on.
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Old June 12th, 2009, 08:19 PM   #406
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I have noticed two negative changes to my bikes performance since I shimmed my needles. While the power is improved, I find that engine braking is not as effective as it once was, AND I am running ~9K RPM at 80 MPH (indicated) when it used to read somewhere between 8K and 8.5K RPM

These are two things I have not yet seen discussed..... normal?
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Old June 12th, 2009, 08:23 PM   #407
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AND I am running ~9K RPM at 80 MPH (indicated) when it used to read somewhere between 8K and 8.5K RPM
that one sounds like the infamous tach problem, not from the shimming.

less engine braking?? dunno.
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Old June 12th, 2009, 08:40 PM   #408
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I found engine braking, while I have to start a little sooner, was a lot smoother.
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Old June 12th, 2009, 08:41 PM   #409
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that one sounds like the infamous tach problem, not from the shimming.

less engine braking?? dunno.
I have always had the infamous tach bounce, it just reads a little higher now... I don't know this for sure since I am no expert, but in combo with the engine braking issue, it seems to make more sense to me that the needle shims have something to do with it.

I can still engine brake, it just provides less braking power. I used to drop a single gear at a time to prevent the rear from sliding or my torso from being violently flung forward, but now I have to drop 2 gears at a time to get significant braking power (to brake, not slide or fly).
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Old June 12th, 2009, 08:48 PM   #410
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Quote:
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I have always had the infamous tach bounce, it just reads a little higher now... I don't know this for sure since I am no expert, but in combo with the engine braking issue, it seems to make more sense to me that the needle shims have something to do with it.

I can still engine brake, it just provides less braking power. I used to drop a single gear at a time to prevent the rear from sliding or my torso from being violently flung forward, but now I have to drop 2 gears at a time to get significant braking power (to brake, not slide or fly).
Are you not blipping the throttle while the clutch is pulled in before engaging the next lower gear? If you don't match the RPMS up, you would definitely get that jerky feeling (unless your downshifting really low below 5,000, which is usually not practical).
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Old June 12th, 2009, 11:41 PM   #411
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Yes, I blip. It was all good until the shim (I think).
I thought the extra gas in the mixture meant it was alway running a bit "hotter," therefore even engine braking would have a little "hotter" activity in the engine (don't know how else to describe it)... am I wrong?
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Old June 13th, 2009, 06:40 AM   #412
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Quote:
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Yes, I blip. It was all good until the shim (I think).
I thought the extra gas in the mixture meant it was alway running a bit "hotter," therefore even engine braking would have a little "hotter" activity in the engine (don't know how else to describe it)... am I wrong?
Every bike is different. I found it easier to blip as, before my shimming, it took more twist to get the gas going. With the shims, it's easier and faster to blip, making me able to downshift more efficiently with a lot more confidence.

How much are you blipping? I found the word implied a little twist, as opposed to really revving the engine as high as 10k rpm in order to make for smooth shifting, depending on the speed and the distance from wanting to stop.
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Old June 13th, 2009, 07:52 AM   #413
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It is hard to say... but it feels and sounds prety smooth; no jerking (before and after shim).
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Old July 2nd, 2009, 10:46 AM   #414
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So I picked up a 12 inch phillips, and I still managed to mess up the one screw head. I sent a PM to the DIY author who apparently did the same, but perhaps some of the rest of you will have an idea as well?

"Hey, I'm going through your DIY on shimming the carb needles (ty btw!). I managed to strip one of the screws - how difficult was it for you to remove the carbs out, and did you need any special tools to do it?"
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Old July 2nd, 2009, 10:55 AM   #415
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NaughtyusMaximus View Post
So I picked up a 12 inch phillips, and I still managed to mess up the one screw head. I sent a PM to the DIY author who apparently did the same, but perhaps some of the rest of you will have an idea as well?

"Hey, I'm going through your DIY on shimming the carb needles (ty btw!). I managed to strip one of the screws - how difficult was it for you to remove the carbs out, and did you need any special tools to do it?"
It's not hard just take your time. Also helps if you have a serice manual on hand. The hardest part for me was getting the air box out of the way. If you run into any other problem we are here to help.
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Old July 2nd, 2009, 11:13 AM   #416
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But there aren't any special tools required, right? I'm taking the bike up to a remote area tonight - I'd prefer to have all the proper tools on hand before I get up there if possible. (I'm sending my wife up in the car ahead of time )
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Old July 2nd, 2009, 12:23 PM   #417
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Adrian - I was able to get the screw out, even after it was stripped by using a pair of needle-nosed pliers... you could also try using a dremel to cut a slot in the top of the screw to get it out with a flat-head screwdriver...
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Old July 2nd, 2009, 01:17 PM   #418
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Good thinking - I'll give the pliers a shot! I'm taking a dremel with me for sure, I'm just a little wary of using it without taking the carbs out first
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Old July 2nd, 2009, 07:59 PM   #419
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I stripped one, did the dremel trick and it worked out just fine. I even put that screw back in
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Old July 3rd, 2009, 02:40 AM   #420
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Got it out fine with a dremel. Ended up taking the shims out though, the bike ran horribly with them in (and the snorkel out). Back to stock for now
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Old July 3rd, 2009, 10:23 AM   #421
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what size washers did you use?
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Old July 3rd, 2009, 10:33 AM   #422
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3mm
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Old July 3rd, 2009, 06:18 PM   #423
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that's surprising that the bike ran bad with the shims. glad you're back to stock and it's working for ya, though.
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Old July 4th, 2009, 10:22 AM   #424
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washers

hi guys finally got around to raising my needles. after bike was apart on a sunday morning needles out found out had the wrong washers #6 finally found some #4 but the thickness is 42 ths installed 2 each anyway bike runs great with the yoshi slip on snorkel removed no flat spots no backfires like before.
what thickness sre you guys using i just want to know if mine are to thick.
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Old July 4th, 2009, 10:24 AM   #425
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if it runs great, don't worry about it.

good job.
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Old July 4th, 2009, 10:39 AM   #426
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thanks kkim.
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Old July 4th, 2009, 10:56 AM   #427
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Peter... sorry, did I miss something? when did you pick up a 2009?
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Old July 4th, 2009, 11:18 AM   #428
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welcome peter! glad to see this mod worked for you!
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Old July 4th, 2009, 12:44 PM   #429
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picked up my nov.2008 it was stored for the winter in my garage with my other toys.
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Old July 4th, 2009, 01:05 PM   #430
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The screws on those covers are Japanese Industrial Standard screws, and not US-style #2 Phillips -- which is very similar but NOT THE SAME. You need to be extra careful, as well, as those screws are very soft metal and easy to strip.

When I work on those carbs, I don't have a JIS screwdriver, so I put the carbs in a vice on my bench and use a hand impact driver with a #2 Phillips bit to loosen them before turning them out.

If you guys are shimming the needles (#4 washers are a good choice, BTW) with the carbs on the bike, I would really strongly suggest using the right screwdrivers. It's not so bad now when then bikes are new, but wait 'till the screws have been in there for a few years.

I hate Keihin for doing this, BTW. What morons.

Here is a page discussing various types of cross-head screws: http://www.instructables.com/id/SAD3S3IFOVXPGXR/

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Old July 4th, 2009, 01:42 PM   #431
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I'm not sure what was going on with my bike - it could just be that I messed something up, as I was doing it at ~2am. When it was 1:30am and it wasn't working properly, I just wanted to make sure that I could ride home ok, so I put it back stock. I'm going to go hunting for some better screws for the carb covers today, and maybe I'll give it another go again tomorrow.

Does anyone know where I can find the specs for the screws, or have a good suggestion for what to replace them with?

Edit: Maybe a better question would be, where or what type of store did you guys find replacements for the carb cover screws? I see on the Kawasaki website they list them as SCREW-PAN-WSP-CROS,4X18
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Old July 4th, 2009, 01:58 PM   #432
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I suggest taking one of the screws out and taking it with you when you purchase some replacements. Get some allen head screws to replace the stock screws.
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Old July 4th, 2009, 02:14 PM   #433
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Thats the plan, but my bike is my best source of transportation
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Old July 12th, 2009, 03:56 PM   #434
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Went to a local Kawa dealer yesterday, and he gave me a fistful of screws that look about right. Found a local R/C Hobby store that should have 3mm washers too, so hopefully I'll be all set pretty soon

Edit: I don't trust the washers I used last time.
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Old July 13th, 2009, 06:50 AM   #435
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Any hardware store should stock #4 washers. These are not a hard-to-find item.

The expensive store on the planet probably wants about a dime each for them. Not worth your gas shopping around.

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Old July 13th, 2009, 07:41 AM   #436
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You'd be surprised. I've been to the following stores to find 4mm or #6 (or #8 even) as the smallest:
Home Depot, Lordco Auto, B&J Parts, and Rona. And if I ask anyone who works at these places, they look at me like I'm asking for something abnormally strange and out of the ordinary. Lordco was the only place I bothered asking if they could be ordered in from, and he tried to tell me that his manufacturer doesn't even make them that small (and that I'm crazy for even trying).

I did find some at Canadian Tire, but I had problems with them that makes me suspect that they're closer to 4mm.
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Old July 13th, 2009, 02:17 PM   #437
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Radio Shack - easy and cheap
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Old July 13th, 2009, 02:20 PM   #438
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Yeah, that was on the list too actually. Went to three different ones. One of them had a set of mixed washers, which included #4's, but they were plastic.

Unfortunately Circuit City decided to decapitate Radio Shack here in Canada. They're a small ****** version of Best Buy now.
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Old July 13th, 2009, 03:53 PM   #439
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Actually, Circuit City is doing a better job running Radio Shack than Tandy Leather Goods has for the last 15 years. The parts shelves actually have stuff on them now. RS Canada and RS in the US haven't had anything to do with each other in a good 20 years or so, although RS USA is actually moving up here sometime soon.

What kind of problems did you have with the #4 washers sourced from Canadian Tire? Either they are #4 flat washers and they fit fine, or they aren't and they don't.

Try the grey slidey display at crappy tire, I'm pretty sure that's where I got mine. They'll probably have them in stainless and brass.

At home depot, they should be in the spinny display near the trim washers (like what you use for kitchen counters).

Thanks for the note about plastic washers. That reminds me that I was able to find nylon ones at crappy tire a few years ago as well. I wanted those 'cause they were a little thicker. I can't see any reason they'd be a problem, they are not exposed to gasoline although they ARE exposed to fumes.

You could also try
VANCOUVER (Brafasco-CTF) - Map
443 Terminal Ave.
Vancouver, BC
V6A 2L7
Phone: 778.327.4397 | Fax: 778.327.4395

Fastenal Canada Co
www.fastenal.com

36 5th Avenue East
Vancouver, BC V5T 1G8
(604) 876-2658

You want #4 flat washers and don't really care what they're made out of. Give the choice, I'd pick aluminium, but only to keep the weight down.

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Old July 13th, 2009, 04:08 PM   #440
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It isn't a big deal, as I've found a source right near my house in an RC hobby shop. I went to a home depot in Kamloops as well as one in Coquitlam, and both didn't stock anything smaller than #6. The guy working that area didn't have any thoughts on where to get them. With the ones from Cambodian Tire, the bike just bogged, and I could barely get rolling. I tried both one and two shims, and it was slightly better with just one. The symptoms are similar to those described when people used 4mm washers instead of 3mm ones.
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