Really dirty oil

[OddlyOrdinary]

Hey Guys,

I just changed my oil for the first time since I purchased the bike used. The previous oil was incredibly dirty though I didn't see any metallic flecs in it. I was just curious, what should the oil look like if changed at the proper intervals?

Also where do you go to get the motorcycle sized oil filter. My autozone, and o'reillys and walmart didn't have any that matched the bike.

[Magz]

It'll still look like black, dirty oil. I don't know how "incredibly" dirty yours looked, but as long as you are changing it regularly and there aren't any shavings in it then it is what it is, nothing to worry about.

As for the filter, just ask O'Reilly to order it. I know they carry K&N, tell them you need a KN-401.

[DerTeufel]

Originally Posted by OddlyOrdinary

Hey Guys,

I just changed my oil for the first time since I purchased the bike used. The previous oil was incredibly dirty though I didn't see any metallic flecs in it. I was just curious, what should the oil look like if changed at the proper intervals?

Also where do you go to get the motorcycle sized oil filter. My autozone, and o'reillys and walmart didn't have any that matched the bike.

Unless you are sending the oil out for analysis, determining how dirty the oil actually is really subjective. If you are going merely off color, some oils turn black rather quickly, while some retain a golden hue for a while. Change the oil at regular intervals and you'll be ok. I like to (while wearing protective gloves) feel how "slippery" the oil feels whilst draining the sump. If there isn't any perceivable grit in the oil and the sump plug isn't fuzzy with metal shavings, all is good to go. You have to remember that the engine and transmission share the same oil, so a lot of the stuff that makes oil look black comes from the clutch plates.

As for motorcycle oil filters, I go to, well, where they sell motorcycle parts! I know Walmart and a few auto parts stores sell motorcycle specific oils and filters, but the selection sucks. Your motorcycle dealer (as long as they sell Kawasaki) or Cycle Gear will have the proper filter.

[C L]

Here are the oil filters listed from http://faq.ninja250.org/wiki/Oil_Filters
that I could find on amazon.

Purolator ML16812 $5.59

Wix 24941 $8.06

Fram CH6012 $6.77

K&N KN-401 $7.38

If you have Amazon Prime, all of these are free shipping.

The local auto store where I live charge me $14 for the K&N filter. Much cheaper to just buy online

[OGjackafidy]

Go to motorcycle superstore.com, best store on the web

[OddlyOrdinary]

Thanks for the suggestions, I was just surprised how black the oil was. I didn't check how slippery it was but I'll do that next time. I didn't think about amazon prime being free, that's awesome ordered a couple to stock up.

But I have noticed a problem with my bike. It has a small oil leak. When I park my bike after a ride about 30 minutes later there will be a small dot of oil on the ground about the size of a silver dollar. It's not a lot of oil and soaks up in the concrete completely. The oil appears to have dripped form the front fairing bottom corner, and I can trace the oil back along the fairing to the area near the kick stand. I can't tell where the oil is coming from.

If I leave the bike for a day or two no fresh oil spots appear. I went away for the weekend with no extra oil dropping. I assumed there was too much oil from the previous owner, so put in about 1.6quarts oil when I did the change. After a good 30minutes of riding I parked and went inside, came out and theres another small area of oil drops.

Any idea what might be causing this? Things to check out?

[cuz]

the 2 O rings on the oil filter or the did you put the washer back on the drain plug? next time I would clean the oil screen ill link it late when I'm on the computer ps congrats on ur 1st oil change: )
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[Boom King]

Originally Posted by OddlyOrdinary

The oil appears to have dripped form the front fairing bottom corner, and I can trace the oil back along the fairing to the area near the kick stand. I can't tell where the oil is coming from.

Just to eliminate other possibilities, you are sure this "oil" is not chain lube?

[OddlyOrdinary]

@cuz, the oil doesn't appear to be dripping from the actual oil plugs or the filter. I have trouble looking inside the bike to see where it's coming from so I might have to check it out and learn how to get my bike naked.

@BoomKing /noob How would I tell the difference?

[CZroe]

My oil always comes out very black and smells like gasolene. I notice that it turns black again very quickly. Should I be concerned?

Originally Posted by cuz

the 2 O rings on the oil filter or the did you put the washer back on the drain plug? next time I would clean the oil screen ill link it late when I'm on the computer ps congrats on ur 1st oil change: )
Posted via Mobile Device

Also, was it a new crush washer? They are intended to deform when tightened and only meant to be used once.

[cuz]

Originally Posted by OddlyOrdinary

@cuz, the oil doesn't appear to be dripping from the actual oil plugs or the filter. I have trouble looking inside the bike to see where it's coming from so I might have to check it out and learn how to get my bike naked.

so it drips everytime u ride it? are you useing a crush washer for the drain plug or a normal steal 1?did you just lube the chain? I would wipe everything dry from the filter 2 the oil plug houseing(u know that circle looking thing you take off to get too the oil screen) I mean dry so you know precisely were it starts if you are able to post some pics that would rock
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[cuz]

Originally Posted by CZroe

My oil always comes out very black and smells like gasolene. I notice that it turns black again very quickly. Should I be concerned?

Originally Posted by DerTeufel

Unless you are sending the oil out for analysis, determining how dirty the oil actually is really subjective. If you are going merely off color, some oils turn black rather quickly, while some retain a golden hue for a while. Change the oil at regular intervals and you'll be ok. I like to (while wearing protective gloves) feel how "slippery" the oil feels whilst draining the sump. If there isn't any perceivable grit in the oil and the sump plug isn't fuzzy with metal shavings, all is good to go. You have to remember that the engine and transmission share the same oil, so a lot of the stuff that makes oil look black comes from the clutch plates.

the black sounds normal for were the oil has to pass by but the gas smelling part ayyy mine nerve smells like gas maybe that because I change mine every 300~400 miles yea I know crazy how often do you change it? how is you mpg? runing rich lol idk really
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[CZroe]

I used full synthetic Shell Rotella T6 so I went a bit farther than usual for my springtime oil change but I changed early when we did the valves in August. It smelled like gas both times.

[cuz]

the float bowl needle does over feeding gas to the bowls then off to the cylinders
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[cuz]

and if it really smell like gas (strait from the pump) I wouldn't start it cuz the gas would thin out your oil
Posted via Mobile Device

[CZroe]

Well. I've put thousands upon thousands of miles on it since and it's still running.

I'll be changing again soon. I'll keep a sample. Thanks. I think your "mobile device" picked the wrong word when autocorrecting because I can't really understand this:
"the float bowl needle does over feeding gas to the bowls then off to the cylinders"

[dubojr1]

Originally Posted by OddlyOrdinary

Hey Guys,

I just changed my oil for the first time since I purchased the bike used. The previous oil was incredibly dirty though I didn't see any metallic flecs in it. I was just curious, what should the oil look like if changed at the proper intervals?

Also where do you go to get the motorcycle sized oil filter. My autozone, and o'reillys and walmart didn't have any that matched the bike.

Do you have a NAPA? They carry a store brand that is made by WIX. Part #PS4941, Cost is under $7.

Here is another good source too, cost here is $3.92 plus shipping! The more you buy though, the cheaper they get due to combined shipping.

http://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=85722

[cuz]

CZroe Well. I've put thousands upon thousands of miles on it since and it's still running.

I'll be changing again soon. I'll keep a sample. Thanks. I think your "mobile device" picked the wrong word when autocorrecting because I can't really understand this:
"the float bowl needle does over feeding gas to the bowls then off to the cylinders"

lol then its cool if its not that much. yea i meant that it could be your float bowl needle over feeding the carbs bowls since its gravity feed then the extra gas gets into your cylinders

[JLinde1339]

I found mine at autozone. They weren't with the auto filters. So I went up to the counter to ask if they could order it, and the guy was like "there's none there?" I turned around to look at the back wall where I had looked and they were on the end cap right behind me. So I know autozone can get them. I checked another autozone in another town and they did not have them, but the girl said they could order them from the warehouse. Since I was visiting the area, I didn't bother. But the one I got was the fram ch6012. Was like $6. They're not packaged like the auto filters either, so if you just scan the shelves, you might not notice it like the regular orange fram boxes.

I had the same oil drip like you, sounds like its from either the drain plug or filter cap. I didn't use a torque wrench, so I was extra careful not to crank it on. Maybe too careful, but I tightened it a little more. Its good now.

Just be careful and check the large O-ring before you buy it cuz mine was a tad warped when I went to install it. It wouldn't sit in its seat very well, and took me longer than it should have to make sure it stayed put.
Posted via Mobile Device

[CZroe]

Originally Posted by cuz

lol then its cool if its not that much. yea i meant that it could be your float bowl needle over feeding the carbs bowls since its gravity feed then the extra gas gets into your cylinders

Thanks. When we did the valves last, we noticed that the tank leaked out onto the floor a bit. Does that mean it could be slowly filling up the cylinders even when parked?

[cuz]

Thanks. When we did the valves last, we noticed that the tank leaked out onto the floor a bit. Does that mean it could be slowly filling up the cylinders even when parked?

maybe, im pretty sure its your pedcock then also the engine needs to be running to create the vacuum needed to open the petcock normaly

[dubojr1]

Originally Posted by CZroe

Thanks. When we did the valves last, we noticed that the tank leaked out onto the floor a bit. Does that mean it could be slowly filling up the cylinders even when parked?

Under normal conditions the petcock should be activated by an engine vacuum. If in fact the petcock is seeping some fuel by then the carb floats should also prevent the fuel overflow into the cylinders. This issue could be a combination of both or it could a couple other things too.

1. How's the plugs look? If you are burning excessively rich then the unburned fuel could be seeping by the piston rings and into the oil.
2. What's your current mileage? Have you always had oil changes done on regularly intervals?
3. Is the petcock in the "On" position or is there a chance it could be in the "Prime" position?
4. Do you ever see or smell fuel leaking out the overflow tube under the bike?

IMO... I'd say it's prolly just time to do a carb rebuild and make sure those float needles are sealing good.

[cuz]

Typical Lean Conditions:

- Poor acceleration; the engine feels flat.

- The engine won't respond when the throttle is snapped open, but it picks up speed as the throttle is closed. (A too-large main jet also mimics this symptom.)

- The engine runs hot, knocks, pings and overheats.

- The engine surges or hunts when cruising at part-throttle.

- Popping or spitting through the carb occurs when the throttle is opened. Or popping and spitting occurs through the pipe on deceleration with a closed throttle.

- The engine runs better in warm weather, worse in cool.

- Performance gets worse when the air filter is removed.

Typical Rich Conditions

- Engine acceleration is flat and uneven and loses that "crisp" feel.

- The engine "eight-strokes" as it loads up and skips combustion cycles.

- The engine's idle is rough or lumpy, and the engine won't return to idle without "blipping" the throttle.

- The throttle needs to be open continuously to maintain acceleration.

- Black, sooty plugs, a sooty exhaust pipe and black smoke from the tailpipe that stinks of unburned fuel.

- Poor fuel economy.

- The engine works better when cold. Performance falls off as it warms up or the ambient temperature rises.

- Engine performance improves when the air cleaner is removed.



Read more: http://www.motorcyclecruiser.com/tec...#ixzz1b8R1gdXF

[dubojr1]

That's some good info there. We should get this in the Wiki somewhere.

[Alex]

Originally Posted by dubojr1

That's some good info there. We should get this in the Wiki somewhere.

http://www.ninjette.org/wiki/Lean_or_Rich

[dubojr1]

Looks good Alex. Should come in handy in the future.

[CZroe]

Originally Posted by dubojr1

Under normal conditions the petcock should be activated by an engine vacuum. If in fact the petcock is seeping some fuel by then the carb floats should also prevent the fuel overflow into the cylinders. This issue could be a combination of both or it could a couple other things too.

1. How's the plugs look? If you are burning excessively rich then the unburned fuel could be seeping by the piston rings and into the oil.
2. What's your current mileage? Have you always had oil changes done on regularly intervals?
3. Is the petcock in the "On" position or is there a chance it could be in the "Prime" position?
4. Do you ever see or smell fuel leaking out the overflow tube under the bike?

IMO... I'd say it's prolly just time to do a carb rebuild and make sure those float needles are sealing good.

Plugs read lean.
Mileage is 31,000. MPG is usually less than 40MPG. Missed about one oil change but was running full synthetic Shell Rotella T6.
Petcock is "On."
Never saw fuel on the ground.

Originally Posted by cuz

Typical Lean Conditions:

- Poor acceleration; the engine feels flat.

- The engine won't respond when the throttle is snapped open, but it picks up speed as the throttle is closed. (A too-large main jet also mimics this symptom.)

- The engine runs hot, knocks, pings and overheats.

- The engine surges or hunts when cruising at part-throttle.

- Popping or spitting through the carb occurs when the throttle is opened. Or popping and spitting occurs through the pipe on deceleration with a closed throttle.

- The engine runs better in warm weather, worse in cool.

- Performance gets worse when the air filter is removed.

Typical Rich Conditions

- Engine acceleration is flat and uneven and loses that "crisp" feel.

- The engine "eight-strokes" as it loads up and skips combustion cycles.

- The engine's idle is rough or lumpy, and the engine won't return to idle without "blipping" the throttle.

- The throttle needs to be open continuously to maintain acceleration.

- Black, sooty plugs, a sooty exhaust pipe and black smoke from the tailpipe that stinks of unburned fuel.

- Poor fuel economy.

- The engine works better when cold. Performance falls off as it warms up or the ambient temperature rises.

- Engine performance improves when the air cleaner is removed.



Read more: http://www.motorcyclecruiser.com/tec...#ixzz1b8R1gdXF

These that are bolded are familiar but we read the plugs during the last valve service and Casey/KC/ninja250 said they looked lean (chalky look).

[dubojr1]

Seems weird the plugs read lean but your description indicates rich...

[CZroe]

Originally Posted by dubojr1

Seems weird the plugs read lean but your description indicates rich...

I think I may just need the carbs cleaned and synced and the tank leak corrected, so I'll tackle those before I worry about much else. My exhaust fumes have been "gassy" since my first valve job and my fuel economy has suffered in turn.