So much out there, but what do I need?

Mless5 · March 23rd, 2016, 09:23 AM

New rider here, take it easy on me please. Got me a helmet and boots, now looking into other safety necessities. I have prematurely bought a used Alpinestars jacket of CL that has padding, but I will be unloading it for more serious protection. I need better upper body protection and lower body protection. Where do I start? I've been browsing Revzilla, but not sure if I should get some sort of an armor vest and keep my jacket to wear on top or should I be looking at something else? Would like to have chest, spine, should protection. Part of the reason I was thinking about unloading my jacket is that it is all black - I'd like to have some visibility.

What about padded pants vs shin pads + riding pants on top?

I should mention that I will be doing casual rides on weekends through back roads, no commuting.

Thank you for any advice/words of wisdom!

RacinNinja · March 23rd, 2016, 09:37 AM

Get a two piece leather suit that zips together around the waist and a spine protector.

Or, get a quality textile jacket with armor and some leather pants that will zip together.

Zipping together is key. Separate pieces will, well, separate.

CaliGrrl · March 23rd, 2016, 09:38 AM

Welcome! I'm pretty new, too.

I really love my kevlar leggings that I got from gogogear. They've got knee armor, and it's removable for washing and whatnot. I've also got a couple pairs of Bilt IronWorker jeans from Cycle Gear, but they're going to be used pretty much only for commuting and hot weather. They're not warm at all.

Jacket- I love my leather jacket, but again, it's not that warm since it's perforated leather. It is purple, though, so I wear it anyway. I bought a second jacket (Sedici Storm or Surge or something like that) and that is yellow, white, and black. I haven't worried about back armor yet, though my friend recommended D3L plating and I haven't researched it yet.

I think most of it comes down to preference. I tend to like things all in one piece, so a vest plus jacket would be obnoxious for me, but I see a lot of riders who wear that type of gear.

So when I go out: helmet, jacket, gloves, kevlar leggings, and boots. Husband has leathers that he wears a lot on weekend rides. As far as visibility, you can get retro-reflective stickers for your jacket or helmet. I'm told it even comes in black, so it won't show up during the day.

VaFish · March 23rd, 2016, 09:39 AM

You'll get a lot of differing opinions on this. But I think the simple answer is to buy the best gear you can afford. Leather has more abrasion resistance than the synthetics, but the synthetics are catching up and provide good protection for one crash. Quality leather will last several crashes.

Me personally, I wear a leather jacket with shoulder and back armor in it, Kevlar lined jeans with knee armor, hiking boots, gloves, and a helmet. For added visibility I often wear a high visibility vest (which is required on the military bases I visit).

adouglas · March 23rd, 2016, 10:15 AM

Good for you for being safety-minded.

FWIW I've been riding for 29 years. My gear of choice is a full-face helmet, gauntlets, perforated leather jacket and pants that zip together and have upgraded back protection, plus motorcycle boots.

Yes, all this stuff costs a lot. However, leather is very durable and will outlast textile gear. Also, it's cheap insurance. Read this blog post for some perspective on that: https://www.ninjette.org/forums/blog.php?b=8384

Here's a useful thought experiment:

Imagine yourself riding in a van, the kind with a sliding side door, wearing whatever you ride in. The van is traveling down the street at 30-40 mph. Go to the side door and slide it open. Crouch in the doorway. Watch the street going by.

Now roll out.

You will fall about two feet to the pavement going 30-40 mph, slide and maybe tumble. That's just about exactly what will happen to you in a typical crash.

Ask yourself if the gear you have chosen will protect you. Even if you don't know much about gear, you should be able to conjure up the image. If what you've chosen won't protect you, then why did you choose that gear?

That is why I wear full leathers at all times.

Some specifics:

- Shorty gloves are useless, as are any gloves not made entirely of leather. This is because you're hard-wired to try to protect yourself by throwing your hands out in front of you when you fall. The scaphoid (meaty part of your palm) is the first thing to hit, and your hands will be flexed, palm-out, exposing your wrist if you're not wearing gauntlets.

- Jeans will shred instantly and your skin will shred shortly thereafter. Some believe in kevlar jeans. I don't, but have no direct experience.

- Look for CE-rated armor. Most jackets have adequate shoulder and elbow/forearm protection, but come with a stupid foam back pad that is useless. Get upgraded back protection, preferably CE level 2.

- Wear clothes that fit. A lot of riders wear gear that's too loose. Go back to the thought experiment: The pavement will grab your clothing and try to wrench it off of you. An armor pad that can move will, leaving the body part it was supposed to protect exposed. Put your jacket on, reach around and try to yank the elbow pad out of position. If you can, it's too loose.

- Motorcycle boots are best but strictly speaking, not required. Sturdy work boots provide adequate ankle support. However, the shifter will tear them up fast.

Mless5 · March 23rd, 2016, 10:20 AM

Thanks. This is all very helpful. I've read read stickies etc regarding different materials and their properties.

Good visual on that van test - thanks!

Yes, long gloves with padded areas are already on the list, just need to figure out upper and lower protection keeping in mind advices above and the fact that I sweat quite a bit.

Keep them coming! What worked for you, what brands/combinations you did not like etc. I know it is all very personal, but still every little bit helps. I want to feel protected well.

csmith12 · March 23rd, 2016, 10:35 AM

Having been down a few times

, including a 100mph crash. Here is the bottom line on how you should prioritize you gear purchases.

1. Helmet - a good fit is above all!!!!
2. Gloves - get the best you can afford that fully cover the wrist
3. Boots - a great pair will save your ankles
4. Suit - of course leather is better, but not always practical or affordable. Cortech makes a 2 piece textile suit that I have seen fly down the pavement at 80mph and the rider get back up without a scratch.
5. Armor upgrades - start with a stand alone armor chest/back protector. Buying used will save you $$$ here. That $75 used gear item saved my back at when I hit the tarmac at near triple digits and rolled and tumbled for nearly 75ft. Next hit up your local sporting good shop to find some padded shorts, $20 should get you a nice pair. Have a look at the knee and elbow pads too, they can be put on under your jacket and overpants. Remember the rule about armor... It only works if it stays in place when you need it and should not feel bulky when not needed.

Gear shopping is fun but sucks the crap outta your budget. The end goal here is to be more protected while riding, but the biggest benefit in good gear is being more comfortable while riding. Great gear is cooler in the summer than jeans and a tshirt and warmer in the cooler weather than jeans and hoodie.

Have fun with it... and happy shopping!

EDIT: Welcome to riding... just learn to love sweat, it's part of how gear works to keep you cool. While your at the sporting goods store, have a look at the moisture wicking shirts ($10) to address that issue and help the gear work even better.

Roark · March 23rd, 2016, 10:58 AM

The best advice I've ever heard about gear, advice that I now pass onto anyone who asks, is the cost of good gear will always be astronomically cheaper than the cost of repairing your body without it.

That black AStars jacket should do fine for protection, but adding a CE level back protector would make it better. For visibility, consider adding a reflective vest on top. A cheap one from Walmart would work, but Icon makes a pretty nice Mil-Spec one, as well.

Another thing is that though the classic "gear" is a helmet and jacket, statistics show the most often harmed part of the body during a crash is the LOWER body! That's because most people lowside when they wreck, which causes lots of sliding on the hips, butt, and legs. Point is, wear a jacket and pants. Better yet, ATGATT! All the gear, all the time.

EDIT: Another important thing.. When people say things like "Why so much gear.. you're only going X amount of miles.. Do you really wreck that much??" I remind them that gear, to me, is 50% crash protection and 50% rider comfort. I'm sure one could argue that it's more 10% protection/90% comfort based on the actual % of crashes in a given amount of riding per rider, but it still holds true. My gear keeps me cool and protected in the summer, it keeps me warm and protected in the winter, and it keeps me dry and protected in the rain. Comfort alone is worth paying for good gear, without even considering the crash protection it offers.

adouglas · March 23rd, 2016, 11:17 AM

Chris reminded me of my favorite summer trick. It's an old idea I've always called a "swamp cooler."

Before gearing up, take your wicking base layer and get it wet. Put it on, still wet, and let air flow cool you as the moisture evaporates. Works like a charm.

I forgot to mention I also wear a lightweight balaclava or at minimum a skull cap, and do the wetting trick there too. At track days I even take it off and chuck it in the ice chest between sessions. Caveat: I shave my head but even if I did have hair getting it messed wouldn't particularly bother me.

Chris also emphasized good-fitting gear, and I second that. Really, really important. Your riding jacket is not a fashion item. It's for protection... so one that's snug and works in the riding position (arms pre-curved and rotated forward) is best.

You asked about specifics of what works and what doesn't:

- You want the jacket and pants to zip together because of what I mentioned above... the pavement is a dirty old man and will try to pull your clothes off. Having your jacket ride up is not something you want to have happen. Unfortunately, manufacturers have not standardized on zippers so it's hard to mix and match. The good news is that jackets and pants generally come with the mating half of the zipper... all you need to do is sew it into the other garment.

- A big +1 on used. I bought my A* jacket that way and saved a couple of hundred bucks. Also look for closeouts, especially over the winter. You can save a lot on last year's stuff and in general, gear doesn't wear out (helmets do have a shelf life, though: rule of thumb is 7 years from date of manufacture or 5 years from date of first use, whichever comes first).

- I like my pants a lot... they're AGV Sport Willow perforated leather. One of the less-expensive options out there at less than $200, and when mine wear out I'll probably buy another pair.

- If you do go with dedicated leather pants, wear wicking long johns underneath. They don't make you any hotter, and they'll keep the leathers from getting stanky.

- I've used work boots in the past but the wear on the toe was so bad that it made economic sense to buy motorcycle boots. On the street I wear Bilt Trackstars, which are actually more of a touring boot. Cheap, but they do the job. On the track I wear proper race boots.

- The ever-present challenge is gear vs. street clothes. My solution: If I really need street clothes for where I'm going, I carry them in a backpack and change out of my riding gear when I get there. Aside from work, this has not ever been really necessary. Yes, I've gone to restaurants wearing my riding pants and boots.

- Re hi-viz. As you can see from my avatar, I'm a believer. However, it's only helmet and gloves. The reason is that on a sportbike, I'm crouched over and oncoming traffic can't really see my torso anyway. So my jacket and pants are black, but you can see my helmet from orbit.

CaliGrrl · March 23rd, 2016, 02:59 PM

Oh, yeah, wicking shirts!

All the gear all the time- you never know when you'll need it. So it isn't that you crash all that often, but that it happens as a surprise.

cadd · March 23rd, 2016, 03:54 PM

OP, which Alpinestars jacket do you have? Generally, Alpinestars is considered a pretty good brand. Almost all jackets do not come with proper spine and chest protection. Back protectors and chest protectors have to be purchased separately. These items are can be inserted into the jacket's built in back & chest compartments.

adouglas · March 23rd, 2016, 05:11 PM

By the way, Igor...

you said you'd be doing "casual rides."

What about a "casual" ride makes it different from any other ride?

The laws of physics still apply. Speed is speed, force is force.

Mless5 · March 26th, 2016, 02:56 PM

Thanks a lot for your suggestions everyone!

So far my plan for the upper body is to by a dedicated "turtle", I found a gently used Icon Field vest that i plan on putting under my jacket (if I can fit in a jacket with it). For the hot summer days my plan is to buy EVS G6 Ballistic jacket to wear atop of a long sleeve jersey.

Still haven't figured out a plan for the lower body. Thinking dedicated knee/shin pads and some riding pants on top maybe?

By casual riding I meant a weekend cruise along the shore rather than track riding or seeing who can get faster to the next light while weaving through traffic in jeans and tshirt (seems to be common around here unfortunately). 100% agreed on "physics is physics", need to be well protected regardless.

Here is A* jacket I bought - padding is pretty flimsy IMO:

Icon vest I am looking to wear under Alpinestars:

EVS G6 jacket I am thinking about picking up:

Am I on the right track?

Thank you!

adouglas · March 26th, 2016, 03:11 PM

Yep.

IIRC csmith12 wears an icon vest just like that on the track.

Before I bought my leathers I had something like that EVS, which I wore under a textile shell. The leather jacket is a lot more convenient, to be honest.

You'll find your own solution. For me, the additional abrasion resistance of leather, plus the simplicity of fewer pieces of gear, was the way to go.

cadd · March 26th, 2016, 03:28 PM

Do you know what model Alpinestars jacket that is? Does it say on the inside label? It doesn't look like it has any CE rated shoulder or elbow protection...which is weird. I thought all jackets come with shoulder & elbow/forearm protection built in.

Mless5 · March 26th, 2016, 03:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by adouglas

Yep.

IIRC csmith12 wears an icon vest just like that on the track.

Before I bought my leathers I had something like that EVS, which I wore under a textile shell. The leather jacket is a lot more convenient, to be honest.

You'll find your own solution. For me, the additional abrasion resistance of leather, plus the simplicity of fewer pieces of gear, was the way to go.

Do you wear any armor under your leather jacket?

Quote:

Originally Posted by cadd

Do you know what model Alpinestars jacket that is? Does it say on the inside label? It doesn't look like it has any CE rated shoulder or elbow protection...which is weird. I thought all jackets come with shoulder & elbow/forearm protection built in.

T-GP Plus air. There are some inserts... that don't quite cut it to be called armor IMO.

cadd · March 26th, 2016, 04:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mless5

T-GP Plus air. There are some inserts... that don't quite cut it to be called armor IMO.

Link to original page on YouTube.

To answer your other question, I do not wear armor under my leather jacket. I purchased a proper backprotector for the back and chest protector for the chest. These will slide right into the jacket. I find my shoulder & elbow protection that came with the jacket to sufficient. They are CE rated.

Back: http://www.revzilla.com/motorcycle/a...otector-insert

Chest: http://www.revzilla.com/motorcycle/a...tector-inserts

adouglas · March 26th, 2016, 04:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mless5

Do you wear any armor under your leather jacket?

The jacket has CE armor for forearm/elbow and shoulders already. I have installed a Forcefield CE level 2 back insert in it, and use the A* accessory chest pads as well. Chances are they're the same inserts your jacket has.

So no, no armor underneath. It's all built in, and the jacket fits snug so it will all stay in place. I also have a 360 zipper that mates to the pants, so in effect I'm wearing a suit.

Pants have CE armor built into the knees/shins and pads in the hips.

If I had a textile jacket I'd do what you're doing.

Mless5 · March 26th, 2016, 04:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by adouglas

The jacket has CE armor for forearm/elbow and shoulders already. I have installed a Forcefield CE level 2 back insert in it, and use the A* accessory chest pads as well. Chances are they're the same inserts your jacket has.

So no, no armor underneath. It's all built in, and the jacket fits snug so it will all stay in place. I also have a 360 zipper that mates to the pants, so in effect I'm wearing a suit.

Pants have CE armor built into the knees/shins and pads in the hips.

If I had a textile jacket I'd do what you're doing.

Thanks. I'll keep the jacket now that I know that additional armor could be added.

adouglas · March 27th, 2016, 06:04 AM

Here's why I wear leather and not textile, demonstrated. How long do you think a textile jacket and pants would last?

Link to original page on YouTube.

Linkin · April 3rd, 2016, 11:44 PM

The most important thing is the quality of the garment, and how it fits you. It HAS to be comfortable with no irriation when you're on the bike.

A word on CE rating. It's only ever the armour in the garment that's CE rated, not the piece of clothing itself. Keep that in mind when buying armoured stuff.

Anecdotally, the weight of a jacket or suit will give some indication as to its protection value. Good gear is going to be heavy (save for helmets). I trust my alpinestars leather jacket more then my hein gericke one, because it fits better when on the bike and it's about double the weight.

MrAtom · April 4th, 2016, 04:01 AM

Get one of those vests that cruiser riders wear that generate a forcefield around the rider. Oh, and one of those bells that ward off evil spirits

Mless5 · May 5th, 2016, 08:35 AM

Picked up AVS Covert jeans at revzilla as well as hip padding for them. Current boot would not work with shin pads my friend let me test ride due to height restrictions. Order should be arriving on Monday.

In the meanwhile, I settled for Alpinestars jacket with ICON vest worn on top - it is bright yellow (a plus!).

So I am geared up well at this point.

motodancer · May 28th, 2016, 07:18 PM

Okay, I know this is a couple months old, BUT...

Quote:

Originally Posted by adouglas

Wear clothes that fit. A lot of riders wear gear that's too loose. Go back to the thought experiment: The pavement will grab your clothing and try to wrench it off of you. An armor pad that can move will, leaving the body part it was supposed to protect exposed. Put your jacket on, reach around and try to yank the elbow pad out of position. If you can, it's too loose.

Question about this.
So my jacket & pants (which do zip into each other (Rev'it)) fit perfectly/tight as far as waist, length, hips, etc. However, they are loose around my arms and legs.
For example, when I'm standing, my knee armor falls slightly below, but it's perfect when I'm sitting/riding. Same with my jacket / elbows.
They do fit slightly better with the liner in, but since it's hot out, I've taken the inner liner out from both the pants and the jacket so they are looser.
THOUGHTS?!?!

verboten1 · May 28th, 2016, 07:20 PM

There should be straps and snaps on the sleeves to tailor the fit.

motodancer · May 28th, 2016, 07:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by verboten1

There should be straps and snaps on the sleeves to tailor the fit.

Ah there are only adjustable straps/snaps around the wrists & ankles area (other than waist).

CaliGrrl · May 28th, 2016, 08:51 PM

You might be able to get things tailored, but I wouldn't worry too much about it so long as it all sits where it belongs while you're riding. My knee armor in my kevlar jeans does that. Feels great riding, though!

You might also be able to use some velcro around the sleeve to make it stay tighter once you have it on.

March 23rd, 2016, 09:23 AM	#1
Mless5 ninjette.org member Name: Igor Location: Salem, MA Join Date: Feb 2016 Motorcycle(s): '04 Ninja 250 Posts: 51	So much out there, but what do I need? New rider here, take it easy on me please. Got me a helmet and boots, now looking into other safety necessities. I have prematurely bought a used Alpinestars jacket of CL that has padding, but I will be unloading it for more serious protection. I need better upper body protection and lower body protection. Where do I start? I've been browsing Revzilla, but not sure if I should get some sort of an armor vest and keep my jacket to wear on top or should I be looking at something else? Would like to have chest, spine, should protection. Part of the reason I was thinking about unloading my jacket is that it is all black - I'd like to have some visibility. What about padded pants vs shin pads + riding pants on top? I should mention that I will be doing casual rides on weekends through back roads, no commuting. Thank you for any advice/words of wisdom!

March 23rd, 2016, 09:37 AM	#2
RacinNinja Vintage Screwball Name: B Location: Washington Join Date: Feb 2016 Motorcycle(s): 2011 Ninja 250, 2008 Ninja 250, 2019 KTM 1290SDR, 2017 FZ10 Posts: A lot. MOTM - Mar '16	Get a two piece leather suit that zips together around the waist and a spine protector. Or, get a quality textile jacket with armor and some leather pants that will zip together. Zipping together is key. Separate pieces will, well, separate. __________________________________________________ Goin' fast on slow bikes!

March 23rd, 2016, 10:15 AM	#5
adouglas Cat herder Name: Gort Location: A secret lair which, being secret, has an undisclosed location Join Date: May 2009 Motorcycle(s): Aprilia RS660 Posts: A lot. Blog Entries: 6 MOTM - Jul '18, Nov '16, Aug '14, May '13	Good for you for being safety-minded. FWIW I've been riding for 29 years. My gear of choice is a full-face helmet, gauntlets, perforated leather jacket and pants that zip together and have upgraded back protection, plus motorcycle boots. Yes, all this stuff costs a lot. However, leather is very durable and will outlast textile gear. Also, it's cheap insurance. Read this blog post for some perspective on that: https://www.ninjette.org/forums/blog.php?b=8384 Here's a useful thought experiment: Imagine yourself riding in a van, the kind with a sliding side door, wearing whatever you ride in. The van is traveling down the street at 30-40 mph. Go to the side door and slide it open. Crouch in the doorway. Watch the street going by. Now roll out. You will fall about two feet to the pavement going 30-40 mph, slide and maybe tumble. That's just about exactly what will happen to you in a typical crash. Ask yourself if the gear you have chosen will protect you. Even if you don't know much about gear, you should be able to conjure up the image. If what you've chosen won't protect you, then why did you choose that gear? That is why I wear full leathers at all times. Some specifics: - Shorty gloves are useless, as are any gloves not made entirely of leather. This is because you're hard-wired to try to protect yourself by throwing your hands out in front of you when you fall. The scaphoid (meaty part of your palm) is the first thing to hit, and your hands will be flexed, palm-out, exposing your wrist if you're not wearing gauntlets. - Jeans will shred instantly and your skin will shred shortly thereafter. Some believe in kevlar jeans. I don't, but have no direct experience. - Look for CE-rated armor. Most jackets have adequate shoulder and elbow/forearm protection, but come with a stupid foam back pad that is useless. Get upgraded back protection, preferably CE level 2. - Wear clothes that fit. A lot of riders wear gear that's too loose. Go back to the thought experiment: The pavement will grab your clothing and try to wrench it off of you. An armor pad that can move will, leaving the body part it was supposed to protect exposed. Put your jacket on, reach around and try to yank the elbow pad out of position. If you can, it's too loose. - Motorcycle boots are best but strictly speaking, not required. Sturdy work boots provide adequate ankle support. However, the shifter will tear them up fast. __________________________________________________ I am NOT an adrenaline junkie, I'm a skill junkie. - csmith12 Nam et ipsa scientia potestas est. Heri historia. Cras mysterium. Hodie donum est. Carpe diem.
	1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.

March 23rd, 2016, 10:20 AM	#6
Mless5 ninjette.org member Name: Igor Location: Salem, MA Join Date: Feb 2016 Motorcycle(s): '04 Ninja 250 Posts: 51	Thanks. This is all very helpful. I've read read stickies etc regarding different materials and their properties. Good visual on that van test - thanks! Yes, long gloves with padded areas are already on the list, just need to figure out upper and lower protection keeping in mind advices above and the fact that I sweat quite a bit. Keep them coming! What worked for you, what brands/combinations you did not like etc. I know it is all very personal, but still every little bit helps. I want to feel protected well.
	1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.

March 23rd, 2016, 10:35 AM	#7
csmith12 The Corner Whisperer Name: Chris (aka Reactor) Location: Northern KY Join Date: May 2011 Motorcycle(s): 2010 250 (track), 1992 250, 2006 R6 (street/track), 2008 R6 (track) Posts: Too much. MOTY 2015, MOTM - Nov '12, Nov '13	Having been down a few times , including a 100mph crash. Here is the bottom line on how you should prioritize you gear purchases. 1. Helmet - a good fit is above all!!!! 2. Gloves - get the best you can afford that fully cover the wrist 3. Boots - a great pair will save your ankles 4. Suit - of course leather is better, but not always practical or affordable. Cortech makes a 2 piece textile suit that I have seen fly down the pavement at 80mph and the rider get back up without a scratch. 5. Armor upgrades - start with a stand alone armor chest/back protector. Buying used will save you $$$ here. That $75 used gear item saved my back at when I hit the tarmac at near triple digits and rolled and tumbled for nearly 75ft. Next hit up your local sporting good shop to find some padded shorts, $20 should get you a nice pair. Have a look at the knee and elbow pads too, they can be put on under your jacket and overpants. Remember the rule about armor... It only works if it stays in place when you need it and should not feel bulky when not needed. Gear shopping is fun but sucks the crap outta your budget. The end goal here is to be more protected while riding, but the biggest benefit in good gear is being more comfortable while riding. Great gear is cooler in the summer than jeans and a tshirt and warmer in the cooler weather than jeans and hoodie. Have fun with it... and happy shopping! EDIT: Welcome to riding... just learn to love sweat, it's part of how gear works to keep you cool. While your at the sporting goods store, have a look at the moisture wicking shirts ($10) to address that issue and help the gear work even better. __________________________________________________ Goal: Shake A Million Hands \| Look through the corners \| Track Day Prep \| Closest track? \| The Mid-Ohio School
	1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.

March 23rd, 2016, 09:38 AM	#3
CaliGrrl ninjette.org certified postwhore Name: Kerry Location: Ventura, CA Join Date: Jan 2016 Motorcycle(s): Ninja650 Posts: A lot. MOTM - Apr '18, Apr '17, Apr '16	Welcome! I'm pretty new, too. I really love my kevlar leggings that I got from gogogear. They've got knee armor, and it's removable for washing and whatnot. I've also got a couple pairs of Bilt IronWorker jeans from Cycle Gear, but they're going to be used pretty much only for commuting and hot weather. They're not warm at all. Jacket- I love my leather jacket, but again, it's not that warm since it's perforated leather. It is purple, though, so I wear it anyway. I bought a second jacket (Sedici Storm or Surge or something like that) and that is yellow, white, and black. I haven't worried about back armor yet, though my friend recommended D3L plating and I haven't researched it yet. I think most of it comes down to preference. I tend to like things all in one piece, so a vest plus jacket would be obnoxious for me, but I see a lot of riders who wear that type of gear. So when I go out: helmet, jacket, gloves, kevlar leggings, and boots. Husband has leathers that he wears a lot on weekend rides. As far as visibility, you can get retro-reflective stickers for your jacket or helmet. I'm told it even comes in black, so it won't show up during the day.

March 23rd, 2016, 09:39 AM	#4
VaFish ninjette.org certified postwhore Name: Tom Location: Northern Virginia Join Date: Jul 2015 Motorcycle(s): 2001 Ninja 250, 2019 Harley Ultra Classic, 2001 Suzuki SV650 Posts: A lot. MOTM - Jan '16	You'll get a lot of differing opinions on this. But I think the simple answer is to buy the best gear you can afford. Leather has more abrasion resistance than the synthetics, but the synthetics are catching up and provide good protection for one crash. Quality leather will last several crashes. Me personally, I wear a leather jacket with shoulder and back armor in it, Kevlar lined jeans with knee armor, hiking boots, gloves, and a helmet. For added visibility I often wear a high visibility vest (which is required on the military bases I visit).

March 23rd, 2016, 10:58 AM	#8
Roark ninjette.org sage Name: James Location: Lakeland Join Date: Aug 2014 Motorcycle(s): 2007 Ninjette Posts: 809	The best advice I've ever heard about gear, advice that I now pass onto anyone who asks, is the cost of good gear will always be astronomically cheaper than the cost of repairing your body without it. That black AStars jacket should do fine for protection, but adding a CE level back protector would make it better. For visibility, consider adding a reflective vest on top. A cheap one from Walmart would work, but Icon makes a pretty nice Mil-Spec one, as well. Another thing is that though the classic "gear" is a helmet and jacket, statistics show the most often harmed part of the body during a crash is the LOWER body! That's because most people lowside when they wreck, which causes lots of sliding on the hips, butt, and legs. Point is, wear a jacket and pants. Better yet, ATGATT! All the gear, all the time. EDIT: Another important thing.. When people say things like "Why so much gear.. you're only going X amount of miles.. Do you really wreck that much??" I remind them that gear, to me, is 50% crash protection and 50% rider comfort. I'm sure one could argue that it's more 10% protection/90% comfort based on the actual % of crashes in a given amount of riding per rider, but it still holds true. My gear keeps me cool and protected in the summer, it keeps me warm and protected in the winter, and it keeps me dry and protected in the rain. Comfort alone is worth paying for good gear, without even considering the crash protection it offers. __________________________________________________ "That's what" -she
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March 23rd, 2016, 11:17 AM	#9
adouglas Cat herder Name: Gort Location: A secret lair which, being secret, has an undisclosed location Join Date: May 2009 Motorcycle(s): Aprilia RS660 Posts: A lot. Blog Entries: 6 MOTM - Jul '18, Nov '16, Aug '14, May '13	Chris reminded me of my favorite summer trick. It's an old idea I've always called a "swamp cooler." Before gearing up, take your wicking base layer and get it wet. Put it on, still wet, and let air flow cool you as the moisture evaporates. Works like a charm. I forgot to mention I also wear a lightweight balaclava or at minimum a skull cap, and do the wetting trick there too. At track days I even take it off and chuck it in the ice chest between sessions. Caveat: I shave my head but even if I did have hair getting it messed wouldn't particularly bother me. Chris also emphasized good-fitting gear, and I second that. Really, really important. Your riding jacket is not a fashion item. It's for protection... so one that's snug and works in the riding position (arms pre-curved and rotated forward) is best. You asked about specifics of what works and what doesn't: - You want the jacket and pants to zip together because of what I mentioned above... the pavement is a dirty old man and will try to pull your clothes off. Having your jacket ride up is not something you want to have happen. Unfortunately, manufacturers have not standardized on zippers so it's hard to mix and match. The good news is that jackets and pants generally come with the mating half of the zipper... all you need to do is sew it into the other garment. - A big +1 on used. I bought my A* jacket that way and saved a couple of hundred bucks. Also look for closeouts, especially over the winter. You can save a lot on last year's stuff and in general, gear doesn't wear out (helmets do have a shelf life, though: rule of thumb is 7 years from date of manufacture or 5 years from date of first use, whichever comes first). - I like my pants a lot... they're AGV Sport Willow perforated leather. One of the less-expensive options out there at less than $200, and when mine wear out I'll probably buy another pair. - If you do go with dedicated leather pants, wear wicking long johns underneath. They don't make you any hotter, and they'll keep the leathers from getting stanky. - I've used work boots in the past but the wear on the toe was so bad that it made economic sense to buy motorcycle boots. On the street I wear Bilt Trackstars, which are actually more of a touring boot. Cheap, but they do the job. On the track I wear proper race boots. - The ever-present challenge is gear vs. street clothes. My solution: If I really need street clothes for where I'm going, I carry them in a backpack and change out of my riding gear when I get there. Aside from work, this has not ever been really necessary. Yes, I've gone to restaurants wearing my riding pants and boots. - Re hi-viz. As you can see from my avatar, I'm a believer. However, it's only helmet and gloves. The reason is that on a sportbike, I'm crouched over and oncoming traffic can't really see my torso anyway. So my jacket and pants are black, but you can see my helmet from orbit. __________________________________________________ I am NOT an adrenaline junkie, I'm a skill junkie. - csmith12 Nam et ipsa scientia potestas est. Heri historia. Cras mysterium. Hodie donum est. Carpe diem.
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March 23rd, 2016, 02:59 PM	#10
CaliGrrl ninjette.org certified postwhore Name: Kerry Location: Ventura, CA Join Date: Jan 2016 Motorcycle(s): Ninja650 Posts: A lot. MOTM - Apr '18, Apr '17, Apr '16	Oh, yeah, wicking shirts! All the gear all the time- you never know when you'll need it. So it isn't that you crash all that often, but that it happens as a surprise.

March 23rd, 2016, 03:54 PM	#11
cadd cadd cadd cadd Name: Cadd Location: 41°21'13.1"N, 74°41'37.4"W Join Date: Jan 2014 Motorcycle(s): 300 Posts: A lot. MOTM - May '15	OP, which Alpinestars jacket do you have? Generally, Alpinestars is considered a pretty good brand. Almost all jackets do not come with proper spine and chest protection. Back protectors and chest protectors have to be purchased separately. These items are can be inserted into the jacket's built in back & chest compartments. __________________________________________________ Riding it like I financed it.

March 23rd, 2016, 05:11 PM	#12
adouglas Cat herder Name: Gort Location: A secret lair which, being secret, has an undisclosed location Join Date: May 2009 Motorcycle(s): Aprilia RS660 Posts: A lot. Blog Entries: 6 MOTM - Jul '18, Nov '16, Aug '14, May '13	By the way, Igor... you said you'd be doing "casual rides." What about a "casual" ride makes it different from any other ride? The laws of physics still apply. Speed is speed, force is force. __________________________________________________ I am NOT an adrenaline junkie, I'm a skill junkie. - csmith12 Nam et ipsa scientia potestas est. Heri historia. Cras mysterium. Hodie donum est. Carpe diem.

March 26th, 2016, 02:56 PM	#13
Mless5 ninjette.org member Name: Igor Location: Salem, MA Join Date: Feb 2016 Motorcycle(s): '04 Ninja 250 Posts: 51	Thanks a lot for your suggestions everyone! So far my plan for the upper body is to by a dedicated "turtle", I found a gently used Icon Field vest that i plan on putting under my jacket (if I can fit in a jacket with it). For the hot summer days my plan is to buy EVS G6 Ballistic jacket to wear atop of a long sleeve jersey. Still haven't figured out a plan for the lower body. Thinking dedicated knee/shin pads and some riding pants on top maybe? By casual riding I meant a weekend cruise along the shore rather than track riding or seeing who can get faster to the next light while weaving through traffic in jeans and tshirt (seems to be common around here unfortunately). 100% agreed on "physics is physics", need to be well protected regardless. Here is A* jacket I bought - padding is pretty flimsy IMO: Icon vest I am looking to wear under Alpinestars: EVS G6 jacket I am thinking about picking up: Am I on the right track? Thank you!

March 26th, 2016, 03:11 PM	#14
adouglas Cat herder Name: Gort Location: A secret lair which, being secret, has an undisclosed location Join Date: May 2009 Motorcycle(s): Aprilia RS660 Posts: A lot. Blog Entries: 6 MOTM - Jul '18, Nov '16, Aug '14, May '13	Yep. IIRC csmith12 wears an icon vest just like that on the track. Before I bought my leathers I had something like that EVS, which I wore under a textile shell. The leather jacket is a lot more convenient, to be honest. You'll find your own solution. For me, the additional abrasion resistance of leather, plus the simplicity of fewer pieces of gear, was the way to go. __________________________________________________ I am NOT an adrenaline junkie, I'm a skill junkie. - csmith12 Nam et ipsa scientia potestas est. Heri historia. Cras mysterium. Hodie donum est. Carpe diem.

March 26th, 2016, 03:28 PM	#15
cadd cadd cadd cadd Name: Cadd Location: 41°21'13.1"N, 74°41'37.4"W Join Date: Jan 2014 Motorcycle(s): 300 Posts: A lot. MOTM - May '15	Do you know what model Alpinestars jacket that is? Does it say on the inside label? It doesn't look like it has any CE rated shoulder or elbow protection...which is weird. I thought all jackets come with shoulder & elbow/forearm protection built in. __________________________________________________ Riding it like I financed it.

March 27th, 2016, 06:04 AM	#20
adouglas Cat herder Name: Gort Location: A secret lair which, being secret, has an undisclosed location Join Date: May 2009 Motorcycle(s): Aprilia RS660 Posts: A lot. Blog Entries: 6 MOTM - Jul '18, Nov '16, Aug '14, May '13	Here's why I wear leather and not textile, demonstrated. How long do you think a textile jacket and pants would last? Link to original page on YouTube. __________________________________________________ I am NOT an adrenaline junkie, I'm a skill junkie. - csmith12 Nam et ipsa scientia potestas est. Heri historia. Cras mysterium. Hodie donum est. Carpe diem.

April 3rd, 2016, 11:44 PM	#21
Linkin Down Under Name: Linkin Location: Sydney, Australia Join Date: Jun 2014 Motorcycle(s): Kawasaki ZXR250C Ninja Posts: 296	The most important thing is the quality of the garment, and how it fits you. It HAS to be comfortable with no irriation when you're on the bike. A word on CE rating. It's only ever the armour in the garment that's CE rated, not the piece of clothing itself. Keep that in mind when buying armoured stuff. Anecdotally, the weight of a jacket or suit will give some indication as to its protection value. Good gear is going to be heavy (save for helmets). I trust my alpinestars leather jacket more then my hein gericke one, because it fits better when on the bike and it's about double the weight.
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April 4th, 2016, 04:01 AM	#22
MrAtom . Name: . Location: . Join Date: Aug 2014 Motorcycle(s): . Posts: A lot. MOTM - July '15	Get one of those vests that cruiser riders wear that generate a forcefield around the rider. Oh, and one of those bells that ward off evil spirits

May 5th, 2016, 08:35 AM	#23
Mless5 ninjette.org member Name: Igor Location: Salem, MA Join Date: Feb 2016 Motorcycle(s): '04 Ninja 250 Posts: 51	Picked up AVS Covert jeans at revzilla as well as hip padding for them. Current boot would not work with shin pads my friend let me test ride due to height restrictions. Order should be arriving on Monday. In the meanwhile, I settled for Alpinestars jacket with ICON vest worn on top - it is bright yellow (a plus!). So I am geared up well at this point. Last futzed with by Mless5; May 31st, 2016 at 07:38 PM.

May 28th, 2016, 07:20 PM	#25
verboten1 ninjette.org certified postwhore Name: Jason Location: Monroe, MI Join Date: May 2013 Motorcycle(s): '75 CB550:.'82 XV920:.'00 KLR650:.'00 EX250:.'08 Ninja 250 Posts: A lot. MOTM - June '15	There should be straps and snaps on the sleeves to tailor the fit. __________________________________________________ '82 XV920: Soon to be tracker--'00 KLR685:adv --'04 DRZ400E--'12 Super Tenere --'13 Versys Ride more, worry less.

May 28th, 2016, 08:51 PM	#27
CaliGrrl ninjette.org certified postwhore Name: Kerry Location: Ventura, CA Join Date: Jan 2016 Motorcycle(s): Ninja650 Posts: A lot. MOTM - Apr '18, Apr '17, Apr '16	You might be able to get things tailored, but I wouldn't worry too much about it so long as it all sits where it belongs while you're riding. My knee armor in my kevlar jeans does that. Feels great riding, though! You might also be able to use some velcro around the sleeve to make it stay tighter once you have it on.