Tyre bead / rim leak

[Aidan]

The Bike: 1998 ZZR-250 (EX250-H)
The Tyres: Pirelli Sport Demon
The Problem: Slooooow weep on the front bead / rim. Approx 5-8psi per week. I've dunked it in a big bucket of water and watched the tiniest bubble every few seconds.
I've Tried: Taking it to a tyre shop who removed the tyre, cleaned the rim and confirmed there was some minor corrosion. Said that if it didn't fix it, they could put a tube in it for me.
My Questions:

• Any thoughts or advice on chucking a tube in a tubeless tyre. I'm aware of the heat/friction thing. Is it a wise long term solution?
• I've thought about popping the bead myself and giving the rim a smear of rtv or similar and letting it dry before re-mounting tyre.
• Any other thoughts or suggestions from others who have faced this?

Any help or previous experience greatly appreciated. Yes I've searched myself for an answer, but can't find a clear consensus on the best approach - apart from 'clean the rim' which I trust the tyre shop did properly...

[Triple Jim]

I can almost always get them to seal by sanding them with 400 wet sandpaper in the sink until all the corrosion and rough spots are gone. In bad cases sanding with coarser paper may be necessary first, or a Scotchbrite wheel in a drill or grinder may be needed. I would much rather go through that work than put a tube in, which adds a couple (or more) pounds of unsprung weight.

There are products made to fix the problem without the effort of the above method, known as "bead sealers". It's some sort of magic goo you brush on and then mount the tire as usual. I don't have any personal experience with those, other than they probably do their job on slow leaks like yours. The trouble is you'd have to use the sealer every time you get a new tire. If you clean up the rims the hard way, they should be good for future tires too.

Shops like to just put a tube in because they get to sell a tube, and because it gets you off their back quickly.

[Aidan]

Thanks Triple Jim, I appreciate that. I was hoping to avoid removing the tyre completely if I could, but I can see that maybe there's only one proper way - and everything else is a bit of a bodge

Time to get me some proper sized tyre levers and hit youtube to edumacate myself methinks.

Now the final question is: when will I finally get sick of airing up every 2nd day or so and put in the time to fix this for good??

[Triple Jim]

The single biggest thing to remember when mounting or dismounting a tire is to make sure the beads are squeezed together and in the dropped center section of the rim everywhere except where you're working with the irons. That's how you get enough slack to get the bead over the rim flange. Well, and use good tire lube.

[DannoXYZ]

Originally Posted by Aidan

I've Tried: Taking it to a tyre shop who removed the tyre, cleaned the rim and confirmed there was some minor corrosion. Said that if it didn't fix it, they could put a tube in it for me.

Not sure if I read this correctly, how is the leak now after you've taken to shop and they cleaned rim? Does it still leak?

As mentioned, proper procedure is to clean/repair the rim as needed for a permanent fix. Making surface even and smooth will take care of any leaking.

[Aidan]

Yeah, it still leaks the same after taking it to (a motorcycle) tyre shop. They said they cleaned it as best they could and the next step was a tube.

Unfortunately it was a 'come back in 30min and she'll be done' arrangement so I didn't get to watch the work. I'm wondering whether 'clean' meant quickly brush off any loose crap or powdery corrosion but not use any kind of abrasive to smooth the surface.

I guess I'll find out when I get the time / courage to pull it apart myself

[Triple Jim]

The shop can't afford to spend an hour or two wet sanding the bead seating area smooth. They gave it a quick cleaning and it didn't seal, so they want to sell you a tube and be done with it. To stay in business, a shop has to charge $70-$100 per hour for labor, and they know if they spend two hours doing the job right, you'd be horrified at a $200 bill for mounting the tire.

[Aidan]

I hate threads where a someone asks a question and people help, but then they never get back with the final solution, so I'm deciding not to be that guy!

Thank you to Triple Jim and JacRyann for your help.

So while I was trying to figure out a day when I'd have time to tackle this, I found a younger wheel on Gumtree for $40Aud. For that price I'd be silly not to try. Especially since I also had a rotor issue with a loose spot that was not noticable at med/firm braking, but was obvious and pissed me off under gentle braking.

So I tried the new wheel, the rotor was good and even though the tyre was worn out, it held pressure fine which gave me some confidence that the rim was better than my original. So I swapped the tyre over using the zip tie / duct tape method and hey presto, no more leak and she's much smoother

So what did I find when I popped the original tyre rim combo? Snot! and lots of it. To my untrained eye it looks like some dried up goop was in there making a mess and maybe contributing to some corrosion or leak. At any rate, the nature of it (random gobs and not spread so evenly) makes me think maybe it's not soap used for mounting the tyre - and that maybe the shop told me a fib about 'cleaning the tyre and rim'. Plus there is an obvious corrosion spot that aligns with the leak location - with little to no evidence that the it (or the surrounding area) has been recently cleaned up or rubbed back. Methinks I was taken for a ride. Not to worry, it's solved now and I've learned new skills.

I made sure I cleaned up the tyre with a fine wire brush before putting it on my 'new' rim. Now I just need to figure out what to do with the old one.

[Ram Jet]

Originally Posted by Aidan

I hate threads where a someone asks a question and people help, but then they never get back with the final solution, so I'm deciding not to be that guy!

Thank you to Triple Jim and JacRyann for your help.

So while I was trying to figure out a day when I'd have time to tackle this, I found a younger wheel on Gumtree for $40Aud. For that price I'd be silly not to try. Especially since I also had a rotor issue with a loose spot that was not noticable at med/firm braking, but was obvious and pissed me off under gentle braking.

So I tried the new wheel, the rotor was good and even though the tyre was worn out, it held pressure fine which gave me some confidence that the rim was better than my original. So I swapped the tyre over using the zip tie / duct tape method and hey presto, no more leak and she's much smoother

So what did I find when I popped the original tyre rim combo? Snot! and lots of it. To my untrained eye it looks like some dried up goop was in there making a mess and maybe contributing to some corrosion or leak. At any rate, the nature of it (random gobs and not spread so evenly) makes me think maybe it's not soap used for mounting the tyre - and that maybe the shop told me a fib about 'cleaning the tyre and rim'. Plus there is an obvious corrosion spot that aligns with the leak location - with little to no evidence that the it (or the surrounding area) has been recently cleaned up or rubbed back. Methinks I was taken for a ride. Not to worry, it's solved now and I've learned new skills.

I made sure I cleaned up the tyre with a fine wire brush before putting it on my 'new' rim. Now I just need to figure out what to do with the old one.

I have an 82' Honda. I replaced the original tire a few years ago and found that the sealing area of the rim was horribly corroded. I surmise some idiot put in either a tire balancing liquid or a stop-leak kind of junk. It ruined my rim. It was tube or replacement rim. I chose a replacement rim. I am now so paranoid that I will use no water based rim lubricant when mounting a tire. If you ever do have to install a tube be sure to load-up the inside of the tire carcass with talcum powder. It helps get the tube friendly with the inside of the tire carcass, reduces your chances of pinching the tube with the tire iron and reduces rubbing friction between the tube and tire. As far as you old wheel goes, the salvage yard made my old wheel part of the purchase price of the replacement wheel. I suspect your old wheel has some significant scrap value.

Glad you solved your problem.

Bill

[Triple Jim]

Thanks for the update, Aidan,