DIY- Chain Adjustment and Rear Wheel Alignment

[kkim]

Originally Posted by Ken08Ninja

kkim, you have changed your front sproket correct? The new sprocket might be shimmed out to far. Now that you have the rear wheel aligned by the string method try removing a shim on the front sprocket and check it again with the Motion Pro tool.
Ken

nope... still have the stock sprockets on the bike.

[ScorpionNinja]

Here is a Pic of my hitch pin (hairpin cotter pin) on my bike, in place of the stock cotter pin! my pins about 1.5" in length the size on package says its for 3/8-1/2".

Its 2pcs, cost 98 cents! (other one is a spare, or use for front axle wheel nut later on.)

[Purspeed]

Great DIY KKim! Excellent pic's.

[ScorpionNinja]

Oh and for your guys pleasure....
heres a Pic of a newly bought Item i picked up! (i got mine,was the last one on self) @ Magic Racing here in shelby twp, Mi. for $11.65

Its the GRUNGE BRUSH! For Cleaning your chains up before putting on your Lube!

It works great, i recomend it!

[ScorpionNinja]

a thought. Use Simple Green to clean chain? BIO-safe... it cant hurt the O-rings... can it?

[noche_caliente]

Dave - where did you get the grunge brush?

[ScorpionNinja]

Originally Posted by noche_caliente

Dave - where did you get the grunge brush?

http://www.magicracing.com/The-Grunge-Brush_p_4036.html

this is a LOCAL place for me to ride too! But this is where i bought mine 2 weeks ago.

[CZroe]

Under $4 at Harbor Freight.

Note that it says that it's "for ... wheel alignment"

[CZroe]

Originally Posted by noche_caliente

Dave - where did you get the grunge brush?

I found mine at a dealer for ~$15 with a little bottle of cleaner, $11 without. I used it vigorously but my chain is still clogged with dark-colored crap (Motul chain lube). I found a huge blob in my lower-left fairing where it dripped from under the front sprocket. It was surprisingly firm for grease/lube... almost like a waxy puddy. I figure I'll use it before my next few lubes and see if it starts to make a difference.

[Momaru]

Maybe I'm using it wrong, but the grunge brush I have (looks like the same one) didn't do a very good job cleaning the chain, despite going over it with a lot of repetition and solvent. It did a fantastic job of getting everything within 3' of the chain dirty though.

[CC Cowboy]

Originally Posted by Momaru

Maybe I'm using it wrong, but the grunge brush I have (looks like the same one) didn't do a very good job cleaning the chain, despite going over it with a lot of repetition and solvent. It did a fantastic job of getting everything within 3' of the chain dirty though.

You are right. You're doing it wrong. If your chain isn't getting clean you must be either not following the instructions, a complete idiot (which I vote for), completely drunk (which I am), or you're using a tooth brush and a high pressure hose. It isn't that hard to clean your chain. Actually, it isn't even that important to clean your chain. If it is lubricated it is more important that clean (and adjusted correctly, but if you can't clean it you probable can't adjust it either.

Sorry for being honest (or intoxicated) but not both.

[CZroe]

Originally Posted by CC Cowboy

You are right. You're doing it wrong. If your chain isn't getting clean you must be either not following the instructions, a complete idiot (which I vote for), completely drunk (which I am), or you're using a tooth brush and a high pressure hose. It isn't that hard to clean your chain. Actually, it isn't even that important to clean your chain. If it is lubricated it is more important that clean (and adjusted correctly, but if you can't clean it you probable can't adjust it either.

Sorry for being honest (or intoxicated) but not both.

Two against one, I vote for none of the above. It's probably that we are using wax-based lubes and the biodegradable oil solvent stuff doesn't work on it.

[Momaru]

Originally Posted by CZroe

Two against one, I vote for none of the above. It's probably that we are using wax-based lubes and the biodegradable oil solvent stuff doesn't work on it.

Czroe was right. The solvent they sent with the grunge brush did just about nothin' to my chain wax (Royal Purple), even at full concentration. Kerosene took the old lube/wax right off with a truly frightening amount of crud and the brush worked wonderfully removing even more.

[Choter]

Never use the harbor freight version of the motion pro alignment tool, they dont sit square on the sprocket and the rod is also not square to the un-square cut of the part that sits against the sprocket anyways.

Laser alignment tool

http://www.jpcycles.com/product/910-...utm_medium=cse

They make a dot one and a line one but check this out

Harbor Freight

http://www.harborfreight.com/laser-marker-93242.html

5 bucks shoots a laser line just line it up on the back links and see if it stays on the same links all the way to the front and your straight.....even china harbor freight cant make the laser shoot crooked.

[Alex]

But as demonstrated multiple times within this same thread, getting perfect chain alignment is not the same thing as getting wheel alignment. More importantly, the latter is a heck of alot more important than the former anyway.

[CZroe]

Originally Posted by Choter

Never use the harbor freight version of the motion pro alignment tool, they dont sit square on the sprocket and the rod is also not square to the un-square cut of the part that sits against the sprocket anyways.

Laser alignment tool

http://www.jpcycles.com/product/910-...utm_medium=cse

They make a dot one and a line one but check this out

Harbor Freight

http://www.harborfreight.com/laser-marker-93242.html

5 bucks shoots a laser line just line it up on the back links and see if it stays on the same links all the way to the front and your straight.....even china harbor freight cant make the laser shoot crooked.

The Harbor Freight one I got looks IDENTICAL to kkim's Motion Pro unit, but the Motion Pro one I saw at Cycle Gear today was different. Mine seems to line up just fine. Also, it was on clearance when I bought mine over a year ago so I doubt many will still be able to find it.

Originally Posted by Alex

But as demonstrated multiple times within this same thread, getting perfect chain alignment is not the same thing as getting wheel alignment. More importantly, the latter is a heck of alot more important than the former anyway.

I wonder if the incongruity between chain and tire alignment is due to unshimmed pre-gen counter-sprockets (most fitment guides say that they fit the current-gen but do not mention shims)?

[kkim]

Originally Posted by CZroe

I wonder if the incongruity between chain and tire alignment is due to unshimmed pre-gen counter-sprockets (most fitment guides say that they fit the current-gen but do not mention shims)?

Nope, I have stock sprockets on my bike.

[CZroe]

Originally Posted by kkim

Nope, I have stock sprockets on my bike.

I don't know if that's something that gets done at the factory or during setup after un-crating at the dealer, but is there any chance a dealer could have put it on backwards originally? I remember there being a lot of discussion about the proper orientation of JT sprockets with conflicting answers in different threads.

[Alex]

Sprockets are on in the crate from the factory. Unlikely they are installed improperly, but I guess anything's possible.

[karlosdajackal]

possible a dumb question but i'm going to ask it anyway....

On the chain side of the swingarm we have a 17mm, on the brake side we have 24mm. Which of these is valid

* Torque 17mm and 24mm to 72 lbs/ft
* Tighten 17mm and Torque 24mm to 72 lbs/ft
* Tighten 24mm and Torque 17mm to 72 lbs/ft

The reason I ask is I have a 17mm socket for my torque wrench, and a 24mm standard socket wrench. So I can do the 3rd option at the moment or wait until my 24mm 3/8" comes in from ebay next week.

Off to adjust chain, count bolt threads and await and answer. Thanks in advance

[kkim]

you should torque the nut and not the bolt, is what I've always been told, but I don't see why you can't torque the 17mm bolt head side. as long as you use a cotter pin, the nut can't back out even if your torque value is off by torquing the bolt instead of the nut. It would be close, I'd bet.

[karlosdajackal]

Originally Posted by kkim

you should torque the nut and not the bolt, is what I've always been told, but I don't see why you can't torque the 17mm bolt head side. as long as you use a cotter pin, the nut can't back out even if your torque value is off by torquing the bolt instead of the nut. It would be close, I'd bet.

[shiftyninja]

You should be fine torquing the bolt. Would possibly make ~1lb difference if any.

[alex.s]

need... brainz... zombie thread has risen from the grave.


probably closer to 10-15ish ft/lbs difference torquing the bolt vs the nut.

[shiftyninja]

yeah I apologize, I forgot to see the date. I'm sorry but I don't see how there would be that much of a difference. Why or how did you come to that conclusion? Essentially you would be doing the same thing. If the bolt was welded to the swing arm would that make a difference?

[diablos991]

Just made my own tool like the one in that link.

I used plastic conduit as it was a ton cheaper! Total cost is around $8 at Lowes.

2012-05-01 19.00.18.jpg

[Navigator]

My rear wheel was grossly misaligned and I only found out after I crashed.

Before the crash, the bike would always want to go sideways every time I locked up the rear tire. I have since corrected the misalignment and it doesn't go sideways any more. New tires too!

I crashed when a cager did an abrupt u-turn in front of me while I was going 80+kph, in the rain. I braked hard and the bike went sideways then went under. My collar bone was broken from the impact with his front tire and my head ended up right in front of the wheel.

Misalignment is truly bad because it makes the bike run skewed to your actual direction of travel. Since the weight distribution will also be off (left vs right) relative to your direction, you are almost guaranteed that the bike will go sideways once the rear wheel slips......

Sorry for resurrecting an old thread.

[MasterCylinder]

Found a vid.... Vids help :P

Link to original page on YouTube.

[shiftyninja]

Originally Posted by diablos991

Just made my own tool like the one in that link.

I used plastic conduit as it was a ton cheaper! Total cost is around $8 at Lowes.

Attachment 18329

This tool is a little more like $5-6 dollars, which is a little less than a pack of cigarettes right now. Works awesome. Less tedious than the string method. Thanks Diablos991!

[CZroe]

I thought I should mention that the rear sprocket carrier hub is "floating" until you tighten down the axel, which is usually AFTER you've made all your adjustments. This is probably why the chain always seems to tighten after you've finished adjusting and aligning and torque everything down (annoying, isn't it?). It's difficult to get it all just right. This also means that the chain alignment tool is completely useless while the wheel is loosened for adjustment and can only check chain/sprocket alignment correctly after you've locked it all down.

The string method is too tedious for regular maintenance, the thread method is unproven, the alignment marks are way off, and the adjustable bar tool just seems like the best all-around solution.

[CZroe]

Originally Posted by diablos991

Just made my own tool like the one in that link.

I used plastic conduit as it was a ton cheaper! Total cost is around $8 at Lowes.

Attachment 18329

Parts list? What link? I know there's a DIY on ninja250.org but was it the same one?

[diablos991]

Originally Posted by CZroe

Parts list? What link? I know there's a DIY on ninja250.org but was it the same one?

Parts list is pretty much the same as ninja 250.org.
I used PVC instead since it was cheaper.

[SwagenGTI]

I am curious, I will probably be building one of these tools today but unless the hangar bolts are a lot bigger than they look, is there enough clearance to use this on the exhaust side?

[TBC]

Anyone have another DIY? The image links are shot on this one.

I tried to do this yesterday and bent one of the chain adjusters. I think an overview of what exactly to do might help me avoid doing that again .

[cadd]

I didn't want to start a new wheel alignment thread since this thread seems to have good info already. I'm stumped!

I purchased this bike used with just under 2,000 miles a few months ago. The previous owner looks like he didn't touch the rear wheel or chain. Stock IRC is still currently on the bike. I will be changing those out as soon as the garage gets a little warmer.

I was just messing around today and did the string test for the wheel alignment.

Here's what I did (let me know if you see an issue with the method I'm using):

- Tied a piece of string and wrapped it around the rear wheel/tire. Used tape to set the string in place.

- Rotated the rear tire downwards so that the string can reach the front tire without any interference from the rotors/sprocket/kickstand/fairings/fork, etc.

- I tied the string to two hammers for the front so it's nice and tight.

- I positioned the hammers (string) so that it just barely comes in contact with two points of the rear tire (I did this for both sides).

- I then adjusted the steering so that the front wheel is parallel to the two strings next to it.



Right side of the bike (looking from front to back):






Left side of the bike (looking from front to back):




And from me just eyeballing the chain, it looks aligned:




What does this tell you?

[flitecontrol]

Originally Posted by cadd

What does this tell you?

You need to realign the rear wheel. Count the threads as outlined in the previous posts.

[Somchai]

Originally Posted by cadd

I didn't want to start a new wheel alignment thread since this thread seems to have good info already. I'm stumped!

I purchased this bike used with just under 2,000 miles a few months ago. The previous owner looks like he didn't touch the rear wheel or chain. Stock IRC is still currently on the bike. I will be changing those out as soon as the garage gets a little warmer.

I was just messing around today and did the string test for the wheel alignment.

Here's what I did (let me know if you see an issue with the method I'm using):

- Tied a piece of string and wrapped it around the rear wheel/tire. Used tape to set the string in place.

- Rotated the rear tire downwards so that the string can reach the front tire without any interference from the rotors/sprocket/kickstand/fairings/fork, etc.

- I tied the string to two hammers for the front so it's nice and tight.

- I positioned the hammers (string) so that it just barely comes in contact with two points of the rear tire (I did this for both sides).

- I then adjusted the steering so that the front wheel is parallel to the two strings next to it.

What does this tell you?

Maybe you could find a possible solution in reading the following links:
Part 1 - http://rg500delta.com/RG500_chassis_...nt%20part1.pdf
Part 2 - http://rg500delta.com/RG500_chassis_...nt%20part2.pdf

But also you should know that, from what I'd read in many german forums, it seems to be normal for all brands that the alignment from the front to the rear wheel is off by up to 15 mm.

And my experience with my 2-fiddy, after measuring the rear wheel, is that the marks on the swing arm are off by 2 mm, what means that the right side has to be adjusted 2 mm more back than the left to have the wheel aligned with the swing arm.
But also please keep in mind that I have an aftermarket swing arm from aluminum, so maybe this must not be valid for the oem.
And looking to my chain with a laser tool (SE-CAT) shows that my chain is absolute straight.
Link Laser Tool - http://www.profi-products.de/en/down...uebersicht.pdf