To filter or not to filter that is the question

[cadd]

And it's the question that wasn't answered. I'm sorry, but the rider was in a pretty bad spot. Not exactly the most visible spot. But then again, why did the driver reverse?

Link to original page on YouTube.

[Motofool]

It seems to me that he was visible enough.
Just a crazy move from the driver.

Didn't the driver stop for the accident ???

Poor bike, ............. poor rider ..........

Something similar happened to me in a gas station, just arriving to the pump.
I saw the reverse lights and had just enough time to fly away from the pump.
In my case, the driver was an old lady.

[DEFY]

Cagers fault, obviously didn't check at all or did it on purpose

[Ghostt]

Once again providing that just when you've seen it all, some ass will top it.

The rider was lucky, good thing he was properly in the left of the lane, just imagine if he was directly behind the cage, it would have been a lot worse.

I personally would call the police and report it as a hit and run, best part is the rider has the ultimate proof, video.

[cadd]

I think the driver probably thought the rider told him "hey mate, I'm ok....you can leave" when in actuality, the rider told him to move up so he can pick his bike up! But either way, if you get into an accident, no matter how big or small, shouldn't all operators of all vehicles stay at the scene of an accident?!?! Maybe things are different in Australia than they are here in the US? I just don't get it.

[Hero Danny]

He has video proof along with the plate information... That ahole is going to get in a lot of trouble for leaving the scene of an accident...

[akima]

Originally Posted by Motofool

It seems to me that he was visible enough.
Just a crazy move from the driver.

Agreed. The rider was very visible. You could see the bike was in line of sight of the driver's mirror.

You escaped your gas station incident with tyre side down and this guy didn't. What do you think you did that he didn't?

Originally Posted by cadd

I think the driver probably thought the rider told him "hey mate, I'm ok....you can leave" when in actuality, the rider told him to move up so he can pick his bike up!

At first I thought that, but then I factored in that the driver had just reversed into a biker ramming his bike to the floor. If I was the driver I couldn't possibly assume that the driver meant for me to leave. Could the driver have really assumed the biker was thinking:
"It's all good - I'll pay for the damage you did by myself - I don't need any assistance getting my broken bike off this four lane heavily trafficked road. You continue rushing to work. It's way more important you get to work on time."
...

I think the driver just realized he messed-up, was slightly shocked at what he had done and decided that rather than face up to the consequences he would just run away from the situation he created... like a child might.

[Whiskey]

Originally Posted by cadd

And it's the question that wasn't answered. I'm sorry, but the rider was in a pretty bad spot. Not exactly the most visible spot. But then again, why did the driver reverse?

He was in direct line of sight of the mirror & in the escape position for if anything came up from behind... the ****tard in the merc reversed for no reason

I thought he may have found reverse instead of drive, but on second view the traffic in front wasn't moving off, so he had no reason to move anywhere let alone backwards.

That reminded me of one story a cop told me. A woman was driving in front of him & she cuts out at a major junction. everyone blowing horns ect. the cop gets on the tannoy & says "okay gentlemen calm down, we all had to learn onc..." at this point she gets the car started & it shoots backwards, the 2nd cop shouts across the first who's still on the tannoy "WATCH OUT THE SILLY COW'S FOUND REVERSE"

[cadd]

Originally Posted by Whiskey

He was in direct line of sight of the mirror & in the escape position for if anything came up from behind... the ****tard in the merc reversed for no reason

I don't know what they're teaching student drivers nowadays, but when I was taking driving lessons, it was drilled in my head that I have to turn my entire torso around and look out the back windshield. This way, your peripheral vision also sees out the back windows as well.

To this day, I lift my ass off the seat and put my right arm behind the passenger seat and twist my torso so I can have a nice big view when I'm backing up.

But I see all sorts of people backing up looking ONLY at their rear view mirror (especially at the mall parking lots). No checking side mirrors. No turning head back. So if this idiot driver just looked at the rear view mirror, there was no way he could've seen the rider.

That's what I meant when I said the rider was in a pretty bad spot.

[akima]

Originally Posted by cadd

To this day, I lift my ass off the seat and put my right arm behind the passenger seat and twist my torso so I can have a nice big view when I'm backing up.

Car yoga!

[Jono]

Just another reason why filtering should be legal everywhere.

[csmith12]

Originally Posted by Jono

Just another reason why filtering should be legal everywhere.

Law allowing or not, a rider may choose to NOT filter.

Seems this guy did everything right aside of two things that might have helped;

1. Stop on the drivers side of the lane (right side in this case) - maybe the rider felt it was better on the left in this case due to having a better escape route option.
2. He didn't use his horn - If you are behind a cage and see reverse lights... If possible, that is the time make the call to use the escape route or not, otherwise... LAY ON THE HORN. If you're not seen, maybe you can be heard. Be ready to evac as needed if both fail. Even in this case, reverse lights didn't give much time for warning.

Cager is a goofball for puttin' in reverse in that spot and is an as*hole for just drivin' off.

[Motofool]

Originally Posted by akima

Agreed. The rider was very visible. You could see the bike was in line of sight of the driver's mirror.

You escaped your gas station incident with tyre side down and this guy didn't. What do you think you did that he didn't?..........

Staying alert 100% of the time is 90% of the reason, IMHO.

With the years, you develop a sixth sense that alerts you that something wrong is about to happen.
It is hard to explain or understand, but somehow I receive a vague but opportune alerting sign.

I was just stopping and still in the saddle.
Rather than looking at the pump or in any other direction, instinctively I was looking at the car parked next to the pump ahead of mine.
As soon as I saw those reverse lights, I turned the handlebar all the way left, took off and then stopped to see what was going on.
Perhaps I could escape because she did not do the whole thing too quickly.
The lady actually backed-off several feet, probably by mistake, and then took off forward while my heart was pumping hard.

I don't believe that there was much thinking on my part, but pure reaction.
I had practiced taking off at full locked steering many times before that day, and I have continued practicing it since.
Here is a good example of that practice:
http://www.msgroup.org/Tip.aspx?Num=194&Set=

It is very difficult to avoid accidents that develop while you are moving very slow of very fast or standing still.
That is one of the reasons for which I always stop in an angle respect to cars or trucks ahead of my bike.
This rider did not have much chance to avoid what happened.

[snot]

Very odd. I know for me, I think I would of been in shocked at seeing reverse lights and would of forgot my horn too.

[cadd]

Originally Posted by Motofool

I had practiced taking off at full locked steering many times before that day, and I have continued practicing it since.
Here is a good example of that practice:
http://www.msgroup.org/Tip.aspx?Num=194&Set=

Very useful link. Thanks Motofool!!

I don't practice taking off at full lock. But close to full lock. I find it easier to take off if I lean the bike to the side I want to turn. So, if I want to make a 90 degree right turn from a complete stop, I put my right foot down and lean the bike to the right. I turn my head (not just eyes....but entire head) and look far down the road.

Then as I give it gas and release the clutch, I lean the bike over even more the split second I'm at the friction zone. Once the bike gets power, it wants to stand itself upright. And I just feel like I'm "carving" out the turn. It's a cool feeling....and I know I did it right when I am able to make the sharp right turn quickly.

[Motofool]

Originally Posted by cadd

Very useful link. Thanks Motofool!!

You are welcome

Spot on description, Cadd !!!

Link to original page on YouTube.

[cadd]

Nice video!!!!!! That's exactly what I do!

[akima]

Originally Posted by Motofool

Staying alert 100% of the time is 90% of the reason, IMHO.

From my short stint of motorcycle experience, I've noticed that alertness is one of the big things that differentiates a skilled rider who rarely crashes to an unskilled rider who is vulnerable and prone to crashing.

Although many don't agree, I think Mordeth13 is skilled. Part of the reason I think that is because he rides fast in Taiwan: one of the worst countries in the world in terms of motorcycle accident statistics. He does this with little to no incident.

Just recently he did actually have a bad crash. Guess what he was doing differently to normal: riding slow and paying far less attention to his ride and far more attention to the scenery. I think it was only days before his crash he made a video talking about how riding slow for his tours is a new thing for him and he finds it much harder to concentrate.

Originally Posted by Motofool

With the years, you develop a sixth sense that alerts you that something wrong is about to happen.
It is hard to explain or understand, but somehow I receive a vague but opportune alerting sign.

I was just stopping and still in the saddle.
Rather than looking at the pump or in any other direction, instinctively I was looking at the car parked next to the pump ahead of mine.
As soon as I saw those reverse lights, I turned the handlebar all the way left, took off and then stopped to see what was going on.

Animal instinct! A gift of the millions of years of evolution it took to produce the one and only Motofool!

Originally Posted by Motofool

I had practiced taking off at full locked steering many times before that day

Strange!

I've had 2 incidents where riding techniques I had refreshed myself on only hours prior became critically important when the thing I was practising for actually happened.

Coincidence or something more?!

I know there are lots of Christians on this forum and I think some believe in guardian angels. I'm not Christian, but things like this do make me wonder if there are forces out there quietly guiding us during times like this!

[cadd]

M13 is definitely skilled in my opinion. He's able to "read" traffic really well and ride defensively because of that. I've never been to Taiwan, but I've ridden in parts of Asia (particularly SE Asia) and you really do have to be 100% on alertness all the time. Traffic lights there are mere recommendations. Most people (in cars/trucks) stop at red lights....others don't.

I think you hit the nail right on the head. Not only is

alertness is one of the big things that differentiates a skilled rider who rarely crashes to an unskilled rider who is vulnerable and prone to crashing.

...risk assessment is another big factor. Those of us who approach intersections with cross traffic....slow down, scan cross traffic and cover our brakes....are more likely to react favorably than those of us who just blow by them expecting everyone to follow the rules of the road.

It's also the mentality of riding and the self-assessed skills that we have that also play a role. In this forum, a lot of people are extremely humble. Even those who are able to drag knee and elbow on the track still label themselves as "average" riders. Whereas in another forum, when I asked the question "how long did it take you to get comfortable in the twisties" the majority of riders said they were comfortable within a few days. I can think of two examples of riders who think they are above average....both of them had the same history.

1st person - Totaled the Ninja 300 last season. Purchased an R1 (not kidding) and in less than 60 days, totaled the R1. The other two bikes in his signature belong to his father.

Link to original page on YouTube.

2nd person - Totaled the Ninja 300 last season. Purchased a 636. Within a few months, crashed it on a highway detour barrier.

Both of them had one more thing in common. Says it wasn't their fault in any of the accidents.

I, personally have been riding for almost 10 years now on and off (mostly off). Yet, I still don't feel comfortable in the twisties. At least not as comfortable as I want to feel. I want the ability to instinctively choose a line, hit the corner in a relaxed fashion, and be able to change that line if a cardboard box appears out of nowhere mid corner.....yet still be very comfortable and relaxed doing that.

[akima]

Originally Posted by cadd

Both of them had one more thing in common. Says it wasn't their fault in any of the accidents.

I work with someone who got in a bad motorcycle accident last year. In his case it wasn't his fault, but he fails to have realized that his accident was completely avoidable.

He got hit on a roundabout which had a blind entrance onto it. Knowing that the entrance was blind and that a car could shoot through without seeing him, he could have pre-emptively adjusted his speed giving himself enough time to stop if the worst happened. In his case the worse did happen.

He's now given up riding because it's "too dangerous". In his case I think that's for the best. If you can't learn to take responsibility for the outcome of every ride and every situation then IMO, it's just a matter of time before you get hurt. Sad thing is, he wasn't a squid or low skill. He wore ATGATT, maintained his bike well and had good bike control (probably better than me). It was just his mindset and attitude that was wrong. He's one of those that expects "everyone to follow the rules of the road", like you said.

Originally Posted by cadd

I want the ability to instinctively choose a line, hit the corner in a relaxed fashion, and be able to change that line if a cardboard box appears out of nowhere mid corner.....yet still be very comfortable and relaxed doing that.

I want that ability too! I too am not there yet.