November 10th, 2010, 07:14 PM | #1 |
self wrencher
Name: john
Location: houston
Join Date: Dec 2008 Motorcycle(s): 08 250r and 07 600r Posts: A lot.
|
Cornering
Most of crashes (rider's fault) occurs in corner. Mostly hitting them too fast. So when you enter a corner a little too fast, what do you do?
Lean more? Rear brake? Engine brake? Soft front brake? Abandon bike and bail? Pray? |
|
November 10th, 2010, 07:22 PM | #2 |
ninjette.org member
Name: Drew
Location: Florida
Join Date: Nov 2010 Motorcycle(s): 2009 Ninja 250R Posts: 194
|
Don't quote me. But, I believe you lean more and accelerate a little. You'd be surprised how far the bike will lean. Make sure to look through the turn and not at the ground.
|
|
November 10th, 2010, 07:23 PM | #3 |
Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: Too much.
|
I typically trust the bike and hope it's capabilities are greater than mine. Complete the turn as planned. By the time you realize you're in trouble, you usually are.
|
|
November 10th, 2010, 07:24 PM | #4 |
.
Name: rock
Location: greenville, south carolina
Join Date: Jun 2009 Motorcycle(s): black Posts: A lot.
|
I think it's more of people THINK they entered the corner too fast and so they panic. If you do enter a corner a little too fast, just ride the corner like you're supposed to and you're probably gonna be fine. Steady in, roll on your throttle from your apex, etc. If you enter the corner a lot too fast, do the same thing but pray too!
__________________________________________________
Always get a second opinion because most of these people are makin' this stuff up |
|
November 10th, 2010, 07:56 PM | #5 |
ninjette.org member
Name: KT
Location: Left Coast
Join Date: Oct 2010 Motorcycle(s): 1 of them Big Four Posts: 84
|
|
|
November 10th, 2010, 08:08 PM | #6 |
CVMA #74 WSMC #750
Name: Nemesis
Location: On the track
Join Date: Oct 2009 Motorcycle(s): All of them Posts: A lot.
|
Sometimes it's not really your fault. LOL
Vid here Around 2:48 mark is when it happens. For me, it's mostly I'm not entering the turn/corner fast enough. If you're mind is telling you you're entering the turn/corner too fast just stand the bike up (assuming you're in mid-turn) and get on the brakes. But what most people don't understand is they think the speed you're entering the corner/turn is the speed you're be cornering which is not true. In other words, your "Oh shiet!" moment will most likely turn into a "Oh?" moment. |
|
November 11th, 2010, 11:26 AM | #7 |
ninjette.org certified postwhore
Name: Jason
Location: Jacksonville, Florida
Join Date: May 2010 Motorcycle(s): 09 Ninja 250R SE, 07 Honda CRF230F, 06 Honda CRF150F Posts: A lot.
|
+1
__________________________________________________
09 250R SE: Paying it forward one post at a time! Don't forget to add yourself to our Member Map |
|
November 11th, 2010, 11:30 AM | #8 |
Internet Slut
Name: Jeff
Location: L.A.
Join Date: Sep 2010 Motorcycle(s): 04 FZ1, 07 FZ6 Posts: A lot.
|
I push the bars a bit more, give a tad bit of throttle to get stable and trust the bike will hold.
|
|
November 11th, 2010, 01:46 PM | #9 | |
Professional belly dancer
Name: James
Location: Toronto
Join Date: Apr 2009 Motorcycle(s): 1992 GSX-R 750 Posts: A lot.
|
Quote:
If you think you're going in too hot, the only thing you can really do is either lean more or bail (or do all kinds of weird crap with the brakes). I'm willing to bet most noobs will bail first...or do things with the brakes. All in all, my emergency plan consists of falling back to maintenance throttle and leaning my brains out. I'd rather low side than touch the brakes and high side. My days of flying for the hell of it are well behind me. |
|
|
November 11th, 2010, 02:12 PM | #10 |
ninjette.org member
Name: Adam
Location: Guam
Join Date: Oct 2010 Motorcycle(s): 2010 Kawasaki Ninja 250R Limited Edition - R.I.P. 12/2/2010 Posts: 140
Blog Entries: 1
|
I just clench my buttcheeks and hope i didnt ruin a pair of good underwear.
__________________________________________________
"Your truth, is not my truth" -Bruce Lee |
|
November 11th, 2010, 03:34 PM | #11 | |
ninjette.org member
Name: Vincent
Location: Avondale, AZ
Join Date: Nov 2010 Motorcycle(s): 2012 Ninja 250 Posts: 79
|
Quote:
The turn (I was going the opposite way the bike was facing.) I could have made the turn at my speed too, more than likely. Just got overconfident and out rode my ability. Lesson learned and 10k clean miles since. |
|
|
November 11th, 2010, 04:04 PM | #12 | ||
ninjette.org sage
Name: Misti
Location: Vancouver, BC
Join Date: Oct 2010 Motorcycle(s): currently: Yamaha YZF 250 dirt/motard Posts: 787
|
Quote:
Quote:
I agree with what rockNroll says about continuing to ride through the corner like you're supposed to and rolling on the throttle, though I would advocate doing so asap once the bike is turned and not necessarily waiting until the apex to do so. So, how will rolling on the gas help ensure that you make it through the corner safely? How might the above suggestions (lean more, rear brake, engine brake, soft front brake, abandon bike and bail.....) make the situation worse? Misti
__________________________________________________
"Leap and the net will appear!" superbikeschool.com www.motomom.ca |
||
|
November 12th, 2010, 08:26 AM | #13 | |
Long Time Rider
Name: Blue
Location: Charlotte, NC
Join Date: Sep 2010 Motorcycle(s): 2009 Kawasaki Ninja 250R Posts: A lot.
|
Quote:
Light-moderate braking on the rear brake will cause the bike to squat slightly, it lowers the center of gravity thus helping with traction but still allows the bike to power through the turn. The trick is knowing how much rear brake too apply. The rear brake can control or modulate your speed much better than the front brake and abrupt (sudden) throttle input. All that put together is; Practice (practice is a confidence builder) and Pray before you get on the bike, prior to hitting a turn, set yourself and the bike up (engine braking, proper line and approach, looking through the turn) if you can prior to entering a turn, if you find yourself entering a curve too fast, stay calm and focus, continue to ride through the corner like you're supposed to, rolling on the throttle, doing so asap once the bike is turned and not waiting until the apex to do so, lean the bike a little more while applying some moderate rear brake and staying steady on the throttle. Stay on the bike. If you do lose it or you do lowside, having on good or proper gear, you will be able to in most cases walk away with little or no injury. Bailing or abandoning unnecessarily can cause injuries to you, not to mention damage to the bike, your wallet and ego. Most importantly is ride to your skill level and be safe. whew.. |
|
|
November 12th, 2010, 08:41 AM | #14 |
ninjette.org sage
Name: Matthew
Location: Toronto
Join Date: May 2009 Motorcycle(s): 2015 V-Star 950 Tourer (Deep Blue) Posts: 570
|
I've been there before.., that feeling like you're entering a turn too fast. Just lean! (and apply gas to keep her stable!)
You'll be amazed at what the ninja will do, no panicking. Moderate braking works just fine as long as you don't freak out and grab a handful of brake (or rear for that matter, in a turn I NEVER use the rear brake.. I won't risk locking it up like that). |
|
November 13th, 2010, 04:23 PM | #15 |
Ninja chick
Name: Allyson
Location: Athens, GA
Join Date: Jun 2009 Motorcycle(s): '13 Ninja 300 Posts: A lot.
Blog Entries: 4
MOTM - Dec '13, Feb '15
|
Never brake in a corner! The advice given so far is great, and there are tons of other cornering threads with a wealth of information if you want to read more. Your bike will lean a LOT further than you will be comfortable leaning it the first few times. Trust the bike.
__________________________________________________
Sometimes it's the journey that teaches you a lot about your destination. ~Drake Check out my Appalachian Trail journal, 2015! Postwhores are COOL! ~Allyson |
|
November 13th, 2010, 08:37 PM | #16 |
ninjette.org sage
Name: J
Location: Oklahoma
Join Date: Sep 2010 Motorcycle(s): 2008 250R Posts: 771
|
Ok, look at the last picture of Vince's post. See those oil spots in the right lane? Those scare the hell out of me. Am I over-reacting, or are do those typically have significantly-reduced traction?
__________________________________________________
Factory Pro Jet Kit, K&N R-0990 Pod Filter, Sportisi VR Black Exhaust, BRT TIS Ignition, White Paint, and 16/41 Sprockets. Soon: Maybe a 37T Rear Sprocket if I get things running like I'd hoped. |
|
November 13th, 2010, 09:12 PM | #17 |
Mr. 988
Name: Jeff
Location: Sandy, Utah
Join Date: Aug 2009 Motorcycle(s): One Posts: A lot.
Blog Entries: 1
|
Someone enlighten me: I was under the impression that a whiff of rear brake will settle the bike mid turn. Not saying you let off the throttle or not continue the turn but just add at touch of brake to tighten the turn.
__________________________________________________
"I'm the one that's got to die when it's time for me to die, so let me live my life, the way I want to" - Jimi Hendrix Cancer |
|
November 13th, 2010, 09:22 PM | #18 |
ninjette.org guru
Name: Kevin
Location: Athens
Join Date: Aug 2010 Motorcycle(s): 1981 Honda Cx500 Custom, 2002 Ninja 250 Posts: 289
Blog Entries: 1
|
When I hit a corner too fast, I usually am thinking two things. GAS and LOOK THRU!
Sometime I am thinking a third thing....am I wearing clean underwear?...or am I STILL wearing clean underwear???!!! I think if I ever lowside my buttcheeks will tear of vinyl seat cover as bike slides across road.
__________________________________________________
"Rudeness is a weak persons attempt at strength." |
|
November 14th, 2010, 12:07 PM | #19 |
ninjette.org guru
Name: Samer
Location: Jupiter, Florida
Join Date: Sep 2009 Motorcycle(s): 09 Ninja 250R SE Posts: 376
|
I can't agree with those who say accelerate if you get into a corner too fast. That makes no sense to me. If a person is entering a corner too fast, then accelerating obviously makes the problem worse. On the other hand, abruptly getting off of the throttle is a bad idea because that upsets the balance of the bike. So I believe committing to the turn and leaning over more while maintaining some throttle would probably be the way to go. Since you are sitting down and reading this then you have the ability to make sure you don't head into a turn too fast so that you can accelerate through the turn. Doing the braking prior to the turn is the way to go. I think we can all agree about that.
|
|
November 14th, 2010, 03:16 PM | #20 |
ninjette.org sage
Name: J.G.
Location: Austin
Join Date: Oct 2009 Motorcycle(s): '09 zx6r Green/Black, (ex-)Diablo Black '09 Ninja 250r Posts: 959
|
Really depends on body position - riding like every corner is on the track puts your body in more of a position to have better control of the outcome, regardless of the actions that are taken (i.e. more throttle, minor use of rear, even slowing during a turn if needed).
The one time I high-sided, I would have been able to make a better choice rather than just quickly letting go of the throttle and using both brakes - which caused me to drift wide and hit gravel and then the fun started. I know for a fact, had I been in a more "racing state of mind" instead of just out enjoying the twisties, my reaction to a sudden red light from the bike in front would have been different because my body position would have been more aggressive; which lends itself to a variety of possible corrections. |
|
November 14th, 2010, 03:20 PM | #21 | |
ninjette.org dude
Name: 1 guess :-)
Location: SF Bay Area
Join Date: Jun 2008 Motorcycle(s): '13 Ninja 300 (white, the fastest color!), '13 R1200RT, '14 CRF250L, '12 TT-R125LE Posts: Too much.
Blog Entries: 7
|
Quote:
If the bike is slowed down to the appropriate entry speed well before the turn, then no problem. It's a reasonable idea to keep a safety margin well below the bike's and rider's limits on the street.
__________________________________________________
Montgomery Street Motorcycle Club / cal24.com / crf250l.org / ninjette.org ninjette.org Terms of Service Shopping for motorcycle parts or equipment? Come here first. The friendliest Ninja 250R/300/400 forum on the internet! (especially Unregistered) |
|
|
November 15th, 2010, 09:07 PM | #22 | |
ninjette.org sage
Name: Misti
Location: Vancouver, BC
Join Date: Oct 2010 Motorcycle(s): currently: Yamaha YZF 250 dirt/motard Posts: 787
|
Quote:
Now, there are the occasional times when you might need to emergency brake in the middle of a corner to avoid hitting something unexpected. This is different from getting on the brakes in order to simply slow down (due to perceived too high entry speed). When these situations arise what is the safest method of doing so? How can you safely apply the brakes mid turn in an emergency situation? Misti
__________________________________________________
"Leap and the net will appear!" superbikeschool.com www.motomom.ca |
|
|
November 16th, 2010, 09:59 PM | #23 | |
ninjette.org member
Name: Vincent
Location: Avondale, AZ
Join Date: Nov 2010 Motorcycle(s): 2012 Ninja 250 Posts: 79
|
Quote:
http://faq.ninja250.org/wiki/Entering_a_turn_too_fast Regarding the accelerating: "Accelerate slightly through the turn. This is to balance the bike, not to speed up. Don’t grab a handful of throttle; just use slightly more than constant throttle. And don't do the opposite: Letting off the throttle will upset the bike’s suspension nearly as much as using the brakes. It overloads the front suspension and means more risk of a lowside." Notice the "slightly" part. Like stated, it's to balance the bike, not to speed up and making the problem worse. |
|
|
November 17th, 2010, 10:47 AM | #24 | |
ninjette.org Monkey Spank
Name: Kevin
Location: Illinois
Join Date: Apr 2009 Motorcycle(s): 2008 250R Track-Bike Woodcraft clip-ons and rearsets FZ-6 track bike Posts: A lot.
|
Quote:
If you havent rode the bike on the track. DO IT. Go, enjoy, learn. Riding over your own ability is easy if you have never done a trackday. riding over the bikes ability is hard with just "street skills".
__________________________________________________
Black 250R Full Area P QC Dyno Jet Kit 100 main 41T Rear Sprocket |
|
|
November 17th, 2010, 05:44 PM | #25 |
ninjette.org certified postwhore
Name: Paulette
Location: .
Join Date: Jun 2010 Motorcycle(s): 2010 Ninja 250R Posts: A lot.
|
I slow down while entering the corner, as soon as im in my turn i lean and roll the throttle as if i'm accelerating from a red light (slowly and smoothly)
__________________________________________________
sometimes I aim to please, but mostly I shoot to kill |
|
November 17th, 2010, 07:24 PM | #26 |
ninjette.org sage
Name: Cab
Location: Miami Beach
Join Date: Mar 2010 Motorcycle(s): Blue 10 250r Posts: 697
|
Never ever break! Lean lean lean, a low side is ALWAYS better than a high side.
|
|
November 21st, 2010, 04:47 PM | #27 |
ninjette.org guru
Name: Samer
Location: Jupiter, Florida
Join Date: Sep 2009 Motorcycle(s): 09 Ninja 250R SE Posts: 376
|
|
|
November 22nd, 2010, 12:56 PM | #28 |
ninjette.org sage
Name: J
Location: Oklahoma
Join Date: Sep 2010 Motorcycle(s): 2008 250R Posts: 771
|
I've been surprised how hard I can be turning and then still brake or just roll off the throttle without any slippage. Granted, this is largely me trying to keep away from the absolute limits since this is all on the street, but it is definitely nothing like the "touch the brakes and die!" :P .
__________________________________________________
Factory Pro Jet Kit, K&N R-0990 Pod Filter, Sportisi VR Black Exhaust, BRT TIS Ignition, White Paint, and 16/41 Sprockets. Soon: Maybe a 37T Rear Sprocket if I get things running like I'd hoped. |
|
November 22nd, 2010, 01:44 PM | #29 |
ninjette.org sage
Name: Cab
Location: Miami Beach
Join Date: Mar 2010 Motorcycle(s): Blue 10 250r Posts: 697
|
"I think you meant "brake" but it is a common mistake "
How embarrassing, I is usually a good speller. Cause I is an ex college student. "I've been surprised how hard I can be turning and then still brake or just roll off the throttle" You are practicing, bad technique SR#1(Keith said so). For whatever reason you felt you needed to "brake" or roll off, there was a better solution. You will eventually find the point where you can't brake or just roll off anymore. I personally still have trouble not doing it. SR#1 is hard to overcome. |
|
November 22nd, 2010, 03:57 PM | #30 |
ninjette.org guru
Name: .
Location: .
Join Date: Nov 2010 Motorcycle(s): . Posts: 331
|
put your foot down like they do on motards
|
|
November 22nd, 2010, 07:50 PM | #31 |
ninjette.org sage
Name: J
Location: Oklahoma
Join Date: Sep 2010 Motorcycle(s): 2008 250R Posts: 771
|
Oh I know it's bad, but the solution to every possible mid-turn situation cannot always be "more throttle and lean harder." For example, in one of my cases I looked up to see I was headed strait for a large piece of cardboard. I did not want to risk going around it, because in approaching the edge of the road I could have hit some gravel or even dust. So, between the options of hitting the piece of cardboard at nearly full-lean and KNOWING I will crash, or rolling off the throttle to go over it as vertically as possible, I chose the latter (and survived). I am not saying this is correct or anything, but I think as long as you are being at least reasonably sane it is not a guaranteed crash to do anything but get on the gas and lean harder. But, like I said, this could very well be because I try to stay away from my absolute traction limits since this is all street riding, which gives me more fudge room.
__________________________________________________
Factory Pro Jet Kit, K&N R-0990 Pod Filter, Sportisi VR Black Exhaust, BRT TIS Ignition, White Paint, and 16/41 Sprockets. Soon: Maybe a 37T Rear Sprocket if I get things running like I'd hoped. |
|
November 22nd, 2010, 07:53 PM | #32 |
ninjette.org sage
Name: J
Location: Oklahoma
Join Date: Sep 2010 Motorcycle(s): 2008 250R Posts: 771
|
That always seems crazy to me. My uncle tore all the ligaments in his knee (like, all the 'CLs) when he put his foot down to keep from falling sideways when doing a wheely on a dirtbike at maybe 15MPH. Like, most all of the tendons are some kind of rope now. I can't understand the logic in trying to brace a 300lb machine at 50mph with your human leg, lol.
__________________________________________________
Factory Pro Jet Kit, K&N R-0990 Pod Filter, Sportisi VR Black Exhaust, BRT TIS Ignition, White Paint, and 16/41 Sprockets. Soon: Maybe a 37T Rear Sprocket if I get things running like I'd hoped. |
|
November 22nd, 2010, 09:20 PM | #33 |
ninjette.org certified postwhore
Name: Greg
Location: Rhode Island
Join Date: Apr 2009 Motorcycle(s): 2013 ZX6R 636 Posts: A lot.
|
I have saved 2 low sides by putting a foot down. Once was I was crossed up like a flat tracker when my rear tire hit wet pine needles, the other was a rear wheel slipping on a cold morning on the center painted line. I didn't so much slam it down as just kind of dab, and it was my last resort. I think dirt bike riding helps alot in these situations where you are often putting your inside foot down in the turns. J - many people hurt their knees dirtbiking like your uncle did when they catch their foot in a rut and the knee gets twisted. MX boots often have smooth soles so that the riders foot doesn't get too much traction in the dirt and put stress on the knee. I have friends who are expert level MX racers who have blown out their ACL in such ruts. Terrible injury, my daughter has had a torn ACL over a year now from a HS sport injury. She will probably get it fixed at the end of this school year. She continued to play sports with the injury and lots of leg lifting - bit I digress, LOL.
|
|
November 22nd, 2010, 09:46 PM | #34 |
ninjette.org certified postwhore
Name: Spooph
Location: Golden, CO
Join Date: Jul 2010 Motorcycle(s): '08 Ninja 250R Posts: A lot.
MOTM - Oct '15
|
Lol, when I do go into a corner too fast I'm thinking OH CRAP OH CRAP OH CRAP OH CRAP..... Somehow my right wrist twists a bit more and I make it out OK...
__________________________________________________
My therapist has 2 wheels and a seat. If you are ever in doubt to my tone, please refer to my avatar. |
|
November 22nd, 2010, 10:13 PM | #35 |
ninjette.org certified postwhore
Name: Greg
Location: Rhode Island
Join Date: Apr 2009 Motorcycle(s): 2013 ZX6R 636 Posts: A lot.
|
^^^ oh yeah me too, well the oh crap part
|
|
November 22nd, 2010, 11:57 PM | #36 | |
ninjette.org guru
Name: .
Location: .
Join Date: Nov 2010 Motorcycle(s): . Posts: 331
|
Quote:
instinct told me that my foot would dislocate and rip out seeing how i was wearing sneakers w/o ankle support. i need to get some riding boots and try this more often though. |
|
|
November 23rd, 2010, 07:26 AM | #37 |
ninjette.org certified postwhore
Name: Greg
Location: Rhode Island
Join Date: Apr 2009 Motorcycle(s): 2013 ZX6R 636 Posts: A lot.
|
One reason I avoided the Hypermotard - I would be riding the bumpy backroads of Rhode Island with one foot down in every corner. When I first started riding the road I made a conscious effort to keep my feet on the pegs at all times (hard to do after riding dirtbikes since age 10 and now being in my forties), however I have only put foot out twice, in the situations above.
|
|
November 23rd, 2010, 11:23 AM | #38 |
IC2(SW)
Name: Kerry
Location: Pensacola
Join Date: Nov 2008 Motorcycle(s): . Posts: A lot.
|
Think all the above has worked, at one time or another
|
|
November 23rd, 2010, 02:19 PM | #39 |
ninjette.org member
Name: Brendon
Location: Sydney, Australia
Join Date: Oct 2009 Motorcycle(s): Ninja 250R 2008 Posts: 18
|
I remember when I was just starting out I had a 'enter corner too fast - going to hit a house' moment. Being so brand new to riding at the time I did the stupidest thing in the world and grabbed a handful of front brake. I wasn't too leaned over (I was just starting the turn) but enough to make me think 'STUPID STUPID STUPID'. Amazingly, no trouble, no locking up, the bike just slowed down and I made the turn.
Afterwards, I went through it a thousand times, and didn't ride for a week (knowing I could do something so stupid). Obviously it's the only time I've grabbed the front brake during a turn, (and now I know much better, thanks ninjette.org!) but am still amazed that the bike just slowed down, no fuss, no problem. It still puzzles the hell out of me. (in a 'oh look, I didn't crash. Now lets NEVER do that again!). All the advice here is great, but just wanted to share my cornering 'moment' (and if anyone can explain why I didn't launch into the air or low/highside, it would be appreciated) |
|
November 23rd, 2010, 02:46 PM | #40 | |
ninjette.org sage
Name: Misti
Location: Vancouver, BC
Join Date: Oct 2010 Motorcycle(s): currently: Yamaha YZF 250 dirt/motard Posts: 787
|
Quote:
Misti
__________________________________________________
"Leap and the net will appear!" superbikeschool.com www.motomom.ca |
|
|
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Thread Starter | Forum | Replies | Last Post |
Cornering without looking... | Kscreations08 | Riding Skills | 31 | June 1st, 2014 08:08 PM |
Cornering Practice (with video) | greenmachine | Riding Skills | 123 | August 4th, 2013 01:25 PM |
Cornering Rpms | greenmachine | Riding Skills | 35 | July 29th, 2013 04:05 AM |
The cornering bible | Yasko | Riding Skills | 30 | April 11th, 2013 11:41 AM |
Cornering at GMR Part 2/3 | adri99an | Videos | 18 | July 22nd, 2011 04:13 PM |
|
|