got on that 400r today

jonthechron · August 24th, 2010, 07:47 AM

So finally, I went to the dealership to get my bike fixed this morning. To my surprise they had the 400R in stock, I can tell you the bike is identical to the 650r, same body work, same everything, not an inch smaller, weight is about the same. I was showing the bike to my friend, I was telling him it's the 650r, until I saw the 400r sticker and was pretty surprised to see it was the 2011 model.

Kawasaki is offering all kindx of trade-ins offer for the 250r as they want people to upgrade.

I'm pretty sure an engine swap with the new-gen 650r would be a simple task.

backinthesaddleagain · August 24th, 2010, 07:49 AM

How 'bout the 400 engine in the 250?

Snake · August 24th, 2010, 08:38 AM

Hhhmmm...Do you think it will be offered in the U.S. ?

Cab305 · August 24th, 2010, 08:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by backinthesaddleagain

How 'bout the 400 engine in the 250?

That's what I'm talking about!

backinthesaddleagain · August 24th, 2010, 08:46 AM

Now that I think about it, its either a sleeved down 650 or a shorter stroke 650.

Snake · August 24th, 2010, 08:55 AM

A sleved 650 would give you more bottom end torque and a shorter stroke 650 would give you a higher reving engine with your power at the top end.

Jon, can you post a link of the specs from the Canadian Kawasaki site?

Flashmonkey · August 24th, 2010, 08:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by backinthesaddleagain

Now that I think about it, its either a sleeved down 650 or a shorter stroke 650.

This is definitely what I"m thinking it is.

capt_bugaloo · August 24th, 2010, 10:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snake

Jon, can you post a link of the specs from the Canadian Kawasaki site?

This link works for me....
http://www.kawasaki.ca/model/ninja-400r:1256

Here are the specs for just the engine:

Quote:

Type Liquid-cooled, 4-stroke Parallel Twin
Displacement 399 cc
Bore and Stroke 68.4 x 54.3 mm
Compression Ratio 11.0:1
Valve System DOHC, 8 valves
Fuel System Fuel injection: ø34 mm x 2 (Keihin)

camaroz1985 · August 24th, 2010, 10:24 AM

The 650 is 83 x 60 so it is both sleeved, and destroked. The 400 weighs only 1 kg less than the 650. I guess the big plus is it is $1200 CAD less than the 650. Still it is $2500 more than the 250 with about 40% more power. Just don't see the point really.

patw · August 24th, 2010, 10:33 AM

Still seems like a "State Farm" machine. Something designed specifically for insurance companies that go by engine cc only.

bob706 · August 24th, 2010, 11:11 AM

I guess it's cheaper than redesigning the 500 but they should have put that motor in a 250 frame. That would have been a sure fire winner in my book.

backinthesaddleagain · August 24th, 2010, 11:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by patw

Still seems like a "State Farm" machine. Something designed specifically for insurance companies that go by engine cc only.

+1

Snake · August 24th, 2010, 11:54 AM

400 CC's and fuel injection! You Canadians always get the good stuff first. I think I need to move to Canada.

addy126 · August 24th, 2010, 12:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snake

400 CC's and fuel injection! You Canadians always get the good stuff first. I think I need to move to Canada.

Ahhhhh no you don't Rick.... 6 months and you'd be beggin to be forgiven and move right back.

revstriker · August 24th, 2010, 01:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snake

400 CC's and fuel injection! You Canadians always get the good stuff first. I think I need to move to Canada.

And only 3 months of riding season.

pooter · August 24th, 2010, 01:30 PM

I'd seriously consider that if it was available in the US

revstriker · August 24th, 2010, 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pooter

I'd seriously consider that if it was available in the US

Unless you'd consider it for some kind of insurance discount, why would you consider it over the 250r or the 650r? I think if I would rather have a 250r. If I wanted something bigger I would go for the 650r. I'm not even sure how the 400r would fit into the lineup?

pooter · August 24th, 2010, 01:39 PM

That's exactly why I would consider it. I'm fine with the power of the 250 actually but like the FI and more upright seating position of the 650.

TrueFader · August 24th, 2010, 02:10 PM

that bike is all fail imo. why not just get the 650? there's no advantage to a 400cc motor in the 650 frame. the fuel injection is slightly tempting but the 400 engine in the 250 frame would have made a lot more sense. 400 is just a slow 650 now....

Snake · August 24th, 2010, 02:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by revstriker

And only 3 months of riding season.

Well maybe I should reconsider my decision.
I would still love to visit Canada though.

Méké · August 24th, 2010, 03:27 PM

This 400 R is very cool for us in Quebec , less than 401 cc is less money to immatriculate but more fun than a little Ninja 250 , mine is on sale ! only 4300 kilometers , always driven by a priest

revstriker · August 24th, 2010, 11:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pooter

That's exactly why I would consider it. I'm fine with the power of the 250 actually but like the FI and more upright seating position of the 650.

So why wouldn't you just consider the 650?

pooter · August 25th, 2010, 12:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by revstriker

So why wouldn't you just consider the 650?

I am considering it actually as an eventual upgrade; that or maybe the sv650s. But if given the option of a little less power but cheaper, I'd consider the 400 as a good middle step between the 250 and 650. It'd be cheaper for me long term too for insurance as you mentioned.

camaroz1985 · August 25th, 2010, 05:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pooter

I am considering it actually as an eventual upgrade; that or maybe the sv650s. But if given the option of a little less power but cheaper, I'd consider the 400 as a good middle step between the 250 and 650. It'd be cheaper for me long term too for insurance as you mentioned.

If you like the upright seating of a Ninja 650 you wouldn't like an SV650S.

capt_bugaloo · August 25th, 2010, 03:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by revstriker

And only 3 months of riding season.

Where I live, it's more like 11.5 months - there might be a couple of weeks in mid-January where I don't ride.

And yes, it's all about the insurance. In BC, it costs half as much to insure a 399cc bike as a 401cc bike.

want1sobad · August 25th, 2010, 03:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bob706

I guess it's cheaper than redesigning the 500 but they should have put that motor in a 250 frame. That would have been a sure fire winner in my book.

agreed, kawi needs to have someone troll this forum - or at least interpret the owner survey appropriately....

revstriker · August 25th, 2010, 04:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pooter

I am considering it actually as an eventual upgrade; that or maybe the sv650s. But if given the option of a little less power but cheaper, I'd consider the 400 as a good middle step between the 250 and 650. It'd be cheaper for me long term too for insurance as you mentioned.

I disagree that it would be a good middle step between a 250 and a 650. I think it would be an unnecessary step. A 250 is a good bike to learn on. But once you have this experience and are comfortable enough on the 250, you should be able to easily handle a 650. In fact, a 650 really isn't that bad for a first bike either. If you take insurance costs or any other cost differences out of the equation, I just don't understand why someone would want this 400 instead of the 250 or 650.

revstriker · August 25th, 2010, 04:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by capt_bugaloo

Where I live, it's more like 11.5 months - there might be a couple of weeks in mid-January where I don't ride.

And yes, it's all about the insurance. In BC, it costs half as much to insure a 399cc bike as a 401cc bike.

Just joking about the riding months.

And yeah, I know they do some weird things with insurance.

caliente103 · August 25th, 2010, 07:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by backinthesaddleagain

How 'bout the 400 engine in the 250?

that would make a nice kit
Posted via Mobile Device

DRivero · August 26th, 2010, 09:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by camaroz1985

Just don't see the point really.

The BF and I were discussing this night before last (yes, we discuss motorcyles....weird, I know), and that's pretty much the conclusion we both reached, too.
Posted via Mobile Device

backinthesaddleagain · August 26th, 2010, 10:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by caliente103

that would make a nice kit
Posted via Mobile Device

But if you could stuff the 400 motor in the 250 then may as well stuff the 650 in there.

pooter · August 26th, 2010, 10:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by revstriker

I disagree that it would be a good middle step between a 250 and a 650. I think it would be an unnecessary step. A 250 is a good bike to learn on. But once you have this experience and are comfortable enough on the 250, you should be able to easily handle a 650. In fact, a 650 really isn't that bad for a first bike either. If you take insurance costs or any other cost differences out of the equation, I just don't understand why someone would want this 400 instead of the 250 or 650.

Yeah but why would I take insurance or other cost differences out of the equation? People ride for different reasons and one of my main reasons (other being I enjoy riding) is cost. My car is a tuned up sports car that is ton to insure and guzzles gas like crazy so my bike is supposed to be my economical commuter both in terms of mpg and insurance, so this is in fact a significant factor in my consideration. Like I said, I'm happy with the power of a 250, but would pay a bit more for different ergos and FI. The power increase from a 250 is a bonus, but would not really be my main motivation.

bdavison · August 26th, 2010, 11:33 AM

Im willing to bet the 250R would give that 400R a good run for the money.

Its just too heavy....they should have stuck that 400 engine in the 250R frame, or better yet....a ZX6R frame. It would have been lighter (and faster).

I agree, I dont see the point.
Its like a bike for people who are bad at math.

backinthesaddleagain · August 26th, 2010, 11:42 AM

except for the insurance as some have indicated.

BlueRaven · August 26th, 2010, 07:30 PM

The only think i don't like about it is the banana seat. I can't believe that Kawi is still using them, they're fugly!!!

jonthechron · August 26th, 2010, 07:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Méké

This 400 R is very cool for us in Quebec , less than 401 cc is less money to immatriculate but more fun than a little Ninja 250 , mine is on sale ! only 4300 kilometers , always driven by a priest

That's right, in Quebec, we save over 300$/year in registration costs compared to the 650r

caliente103 · August 26th, 2010, 07:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by backinthesaddleagain

But if you could stuff the 400 motor in the 250 then may as well stuff the 650 in there.

to much hp for the 250 frame
Posted via Mobile Device

revstriker · August 28th, 2010, 06:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pooter

Yeah but why would I take insurance or other cost differences out of the equation? People ride for different reasons and one of my main reasons (other being I enjoy riding) is cost. My car is a tuned up sports car that is ton to insure and guzzles gas like crazy so my bike is supposed to be my economical commuter both in terms of mpg and insurance, so this is in fact a significant factor in my consideration. Like I said, I'm happy with the power of a 250, but would pay a bit more for different ergos and FI. The power increase from a 250 is a bonus, but would not really be my main motivation.

I was taking the insurance out of the equation to see if there was really a desire for anyone to own a 400. If people only buy a 400 because of they would save a few bucks on insurance, that tells me that they would rather have a 650. If this is the main motivation for this bike in the US, then I don't think it would be a success.

bdavison · August 28th, 2010, 07:12 PM

I dont think its an issue of insurance.
What I think most americans would like is a bike with around 50HP, and more superbike ergonomics and looks.

Kawasaki hit a home run with the newer 250R in my book, but they dropped the ball in producing a mid-range bike. Its either the 650R which in my opinion is nothing more than a cruiser with some sporty styling, or going to the ZX-6R which is way more than what we need in a intermediate bike.

And trying to sell a engine that has been sleeved/destroked to 400cc , in a overweight frame like the 650R to an American will be a lesson in futility.

There may be a few folks that will be mislead into thinking its actually an upgrade, but I think for the most part, Americans will do the research into specs, and quickly find that it fails miserably in comparison to even the 250R.

Reswob · August 28th, 2010, 07:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by backinthesaddleagain

except for the insurance as some have indicated.

Outside of America's Hat, I doubt there would be much difference in 400 vs 650cc bike in the same not-supersport class.

August 24th, 2010, 07:47 AM	#1
jonthechron ninjette.org sage Name: Jon Location: Usa Join Date: Jan 2010 Motorcycle(s): magHitVE Posts: 649	got on that 400r today So finally, I went to the dealership to get my bike fixed this morning. To my surprise they had the 400R in stock, I can tell you the bike is identical to the 650r, same body work, same everything, not an inch smaller, weight is about the same. I was showing the bike to my friend, I was telling him it's the 650r, until I saw the 400r sticker and was pretty surprised to see it was the 2011 model. Kawasaki is offering all kindx of trade-ins offer for the 250r as they want people to upgrade. I'm pretty sure an engine swap with the new-gen 650r would be a simple task.

August 24th, 2010, 10:33 AM	#10
patw ninjette.org guru Name: Pat Location: Barrie, Ontario Join Date: Jun 2009 Motorcycle(s): 2009 Ninja 250 SE Posts: 338	Still seems like a "State Farm" machine. Something designed specifically for insurance companies that go by engine cc only. __________________________________________________ 2013 CRF250L 1985 GL1200 Interstate

August 26th, 2010, 07:30 PM	#35
BlueRaven ninjette.org certified postwhore Name: Lil One Location: NB Canada Join Date: Mar 2009 Motorcycle(s): '09 Ninja 250 Black Posts: A lot.	The only think i don't like about it is the banana seat. I can't believe that Kawi is still using them, they're fugly!!! __________________________________________________ I'm not small, I'm fun sized

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August 24th, 2010, 07:49 AM	#2
backinthesaddleagain ninjette.org certified postwhore Name: Greg Location: Rhode Island Join Date: Apr 2009 Motorcycle(s): 2013 ZX6R 636 Posts: A lot.	How 'bout the 400 engine in the 250?

August 24th, 2010, 08:38 AM	#3
Snake ninjette.org certified postwhore Name: Rick Location: Alexandria, Louisiana Join Date: Jan 2009 Motorcycle(s): 05 Blue Ninja 250 Posts: Too much. MOTY - 2017, MOTM - Jan '19, Oct '16, May '14	Hhhmmm...Do you think it will be offered in the U.S. ?

August 24th, 2010, 08:46 AM	#5
backinthesaddleagain ninjette.org certified postwhore Name: Greg Location: Rhode Island Join Date: Apr 2009 Motorcycle(s): 2013 ZX6R 636 Posts: A lot.	Now that I think about it, its either a sleeved down 650 or a shorter stroke 650.

August 24th, 2010, 08:55 AM	#6
Snake ninjette.org certified postwhore Name: Rick Location: Alexandria, Louisiana Join Date: Jan 2009 Motorcycle(s): 05 Blue Ninja 250 Posts: Too much. MOTY - 2017, MOTM - Jan '19, Oct '16, May '14	A sleved 650 would give you more bottom end torque and a shorter stroke 650 would give you a higher reving engine with your power at the top end. Jon, can you post a link of the specs from the Canadian Kawasaki site?

August 24th, 2010, 10:24 AM	#9
camaroz1985 ninjette.org certified postwhore Name: Ryan Location: Carlisle, PA Join Date: Nov 2008 Motorcycle(s): 2008 WR250R, 2006 Ural Raven (Sold), 2009 Versys Green (Sold), 2008 Ninja 250R Green (Sold) Posts: A lot.	The 650 is 83 x 60 so it is both sleeved, and destroked. The 400 weighs only 1 kg less than the 650. I guess the big plus is it is $1200 CAD less than the 650. Still it is $2500 more than the 250 with about 40% more power. Just don't see the point really.

August 24th, 2010, 11:11 AM	#11
bob706 ninjette.org certified postwhore Name: Sean Location: Mary Esther, FL Join Date: Jan 2009 Motorcycle(s): 2008 Ninja 250 1998 HD Road King Posts: A lot.	I guess it's cheaper than redesigning the 500 but they should have put that motor in a 250 frame. That would have been a sure fire winner in my book.

August 24th, 2010, 11:54 AM	#13
Snake ninjette.org certified postwhore Name: Rick Location: Alexandria, Louisiana Join Date: Jan 2009 Motorcycle(s): 05 Blue Ninja 250 Posts: Too much. MOTY - 2017, MOTM - Jan '19, Oct '16, May '14	400 CC's and fuel injection! You Canadians always get the good stuff first. I think I need to move to Canada.

August 24th, 2010, 01:30 PM	#16
pooter ninjette.org member Name: Peter Location: San Francisco Join Date: May 2010 Motorcycle(s): 2007 Kawasaki Ninja 250 Posts: 67	I'd seriously consider that if it was available in the US

August 24th, 2010, 01:39 PM	#18
pooter ninjette.org member Name: Peter Location: San Francisco Join Date: May 2010 Motorcycle(s): 2007 Kawasaki Ninja 250 Posts: 67	That's exactly why I would consider it. I'm fine with the power of the 250 actually but like the FI and more upright seating position of the 650.

August 24th, 2010, 02:10 PM	#19
TrueFader ninjette.org member Name: Chris Location: California Join Date: Apr 2010 Motorcycle(s): '08 250 Posts: 129	that bike is all fail imo. why not just get the 650? there's no advantage to a 400cc motor in the 650 frame. the fuel injection is slightly tempting but the 400 engine in the 250 frame would have made a lot more sense. 400 is just a slow 650 now....

August 24th, 2010, 03:27 PM	#21
Méké ninjette.org member Name: Méké Location: QC , Canada Join Date: Dec 2009 Motorcycle(s): Ninja 300 2013 SE , Ninja 2009 blue/Honda Nighthawk S 1985 blue Posts: 222	This 400 R is very cool for us in Quebec , less than 401 cc is less money to immatriculate but more fun than a little Ninja 250 , mine is on sale ! only 4300 kilometers , always driven by a priest

August 26th, 2010, 11:33 AM	#33
bdavison Wartown, USA Name: Bryan Location: Warner Robins, GA Join Date: Nov 2009 Motorcycle(s): 2009 Ninja 250R SE, 2007 Ninja 650R, and assorted other bikes Posts: A lot.	Im willing to bet the 250R would give that 400R a good run for the money. Its just too heavy....they should have stuck that 400 engine in the 250R frame, or better yet....a ZX6R frame. It would have been lighter (and faster). I agree, I dont see the point. Its like a bike for people who are bad at math.

August 26th, 2010, 11:42 AM	#34
backinthesaddleagain ninjette.org certified postwhore Name: Greg Location: Rhode Island Join Date: Apr 2009 Motorcycle(s): 2013 ZX6R 636 Posts: A lot.	except for the insurance as some have indicated.

August 28th, 2010, 07:12 PM	#39
bdavison Wartown, USA Name: Bryan Location: Warner Robins, GA Join Date: Nov 2009 Motorcycle(s): 2009 Ninja 250R SE, 2007 Ninja 650R, and assorted other bikes Posts: A lot.	I dont think its an issue of insurance. What I think most americans would like is a bike with around 50HP, and more superbike ergonomics and looks. Kawasaki hit a home run with the newer 250R in my book, but they dropped the ball in producing a mid-range bike. Its either the 650R which in my opinion is nothing more than a cruiser with some sporty styling, or going to the ZX-6R which is way more than what we need in a intermediate bike. And trying to sell a engine that has been sleeved/destroked to 400cc , in a overweight frame like the 650R to an American will be a lesson in futility. There may be a few folks that will be mislead into thinking its actually an upgrade, but I think for the most part, Americans will do the research into specs, and quickly find that it fails miserably in comparison to even the 250R.