So you want to ride a motorcycle?

[CycleCam303]

In light of my other thread I wanted to read what other riders would suggest or advice they wish they had known when they were straight noobin'.

I found myself really thinking that I look at learning as a suggestion and not an absolute. I'm probably a bad person for saying this but I have no problem just talking to someone and already thinking, yes you shouldn't be riding in the street... Maybe reconsider?" Its not all destructive advice. I think my way is totally impractical. You should be very comfortable on a bicycle. Dirt biking on a dirt track or through the woods should be a requirement. And even then, I would ask the question, are you sure you want to ride in the street?

Then comes gear, what kind of bike, and where and who to ride with? I'm a strong believer in learning from peers and mentors. While thats a double edged sword, I did learn a few tricks from those "crazy" group rides. But it depends on who you're hanging with.

Hindsight is always 20/20. Let's hear it.

[alex.s]

i know racers who can't ride bicycles so i dont think that's important.

if i could suggest to anyone how to learn to ride a motorbike it would be do it on a track.
teach them the basics (everything in msf) one weekend in a big parking lot, then the following weekend, go take two days at the track. have the newb follow you and don't go above 25%. no brakes at first. come back and discuss how everything felt. next session go back out and have them follow with no brakes at the same pace as before but then after the second lap have them take the lead going the same pace. leave looooots of buffer. slowly work in more acceleration on straights with very light braking at the end. keep increasing things.

by the end of the second day, they will know how to ride a motorcycle better than 95% of the people on the road.

[CC Cowboy]

My advice would be to start at 2 on a bicycle, 3 on a dirt bike, 5 on a shift bike (dirt, street, dual). The rest will come naturally.

Both my kids started riding this way and they are both alive and great riders.

[ninjamunky85]

I usually tell people who've never ridden and want to learn to get a small dirt bike.

[CycleCam303]

Why don't they have track day events like that? It would be like nrs just toned down and all day.

[allanoue]

road bike in traffic

[adouglas]

I have never ridden a bicycle off road. It is in no way a requirement. In fact, dirt skills are in many ways the opposite of street skills (e.g. pushing the bike underneath you, relying on dabbing a foot to get around a corner).

If I could give one piece of advice it would be to check your attitude at the door. This is not about speed or an adrenaline rush. That way lies squidness. It is about control. It is about respecting a machine that can kill you faster than you can blink if you really provoke it. It is about being a perpetual student. It is about not being an adolescent, testosterone-addled boy.

If I could give a second piece of advice it would be to get rid of preconceived notions about what bike is right for you. As the now-disgraced Lance Armstrong wrote, "it's not about the bike." In his case it was about doping, but the phrase still holds true.

[choneofakind]

Originally Posted by adouglas

I have never ridden a bicycle off road.

I'm sorry for you.

[jeffb502]

Originally Posted by alex.s

i know racers who can't ride bicycles so i dont think that's important.

if i could suggest to anyone how to learn to ride a motorbike it would be do it on a track.
teach them the basics (everything in msf) one weekend in a big parking lot, then the following weekend, go take two days at the track. have the newb follow you and don't go above 25%. no brakes at first. come back and discuss how everything felt. next session go back out and have them follow with no brakes at the same pace as before but then after the second lap have them take the lead going the same pace. leave looooots of buffer. slowly work in more acceleration on straights with very light braking at the end. keep increasing things.

by the end of the second day, they will know how to ride a motorcycle better than 95% of the people on the road.

I like that idea...I'm still a learning n00b myself and even after taking the MSF class and before ever riding on a road I was wishing the MSF class had covered higher speeds. I think your idea of taking the MSF class, then learning higher speed skills at a track, and only after the track going on public roads makes more sense.

My first few times out on the public road by myself (since I didn't know anybody to ride with) I learned a lot, and I'm learning more every time I go out for a ride, but I think it's better and easier to learn in an environment with less people trying to kill you (i.e. a closed course).

It's been about 6 months and 3500 miles since that first time out on the public road, and I'm looking forward to my first track day; I'm thinking maybe in June. My only regret is not scheduling a track day or some kind of higher speed training sooner.

What I did right:

I took the MSF course BEFORE buying a bike, that way there was no temptation to go for a ride before taking the course or obtaining my motorcycle license.

I knew how to ride a bike, and had over 6000 miles of bicycle riding experience as an adult. I think riding a bike on public roads made me much more aware of the dangers of riding a motorcycle on public roads. I had a speedometer on the bicycle and I had been up to 35mph going down a hill on a 35mph road. I'd already learned about drivers not seeing you at speed and making a left turn in front of you from multiple experiences on the bicycle. I learned to expect the worst from other drivers, and have an escape route. I learned not to force myself into dangerous situations just because I have the right of way. I could go on and on, but I think everybody that is physically capable of doing so should be required to ride a bicycle on the road for at least a few thousand miles before getting a driver license.

What I would do differently: Skip buying all of the mesh/textile riding gear and touring boots I bought when I was first starting. I usually only wear my leather 1 piece. If I'm going super casual or if it's going to be unusually cold I'll wear my leather pants and leather jacket. I'm pretty much always wearing my TCX S-Race boots any time I'm on the bike; the other 3 pairs of boots just sit at home. If I had skipped the textile/mesh gear, shorty gloves, lower end boots, etc. I'd probably have enough for a full exhaust system or a couple of track days.

[Sirref]

I like alex.s' idea I'm going to spend my first track day like that except starting at a faster pace than an outright newbie. Braking and corner entry points are the first thing to get down when it comes to solid cornering skills imo they're like the foundation of your cornering experience, if you enter right then you exit fast.

[NinjaCowgirl]

I wasn't a true virgin noob when I started because I spent many years in the dirt on my brother's enduros and I raced bicycles in college (lots of training in lots of traffic, being harassed, doored, etc. builds stamina) . But, I do get middle-aged momma's (yes, I belong to that group) saying "wow! I want to ride a motorcycle too!"...and I tell them 1) idon't do it unless you really want to commit to it and 2) it's a sport. train for it and 3) spend lots of time in parking lots just working the breaks and cornering. And then they ask me what kind of Harley I ride...

[Finesse]

If I could give one piece of advice it would be to check your attitude at the door. This is not about speed or an adrenaline rush. That way lies squidness. It is about control. It is about respecting a machine that can kill you faster than you can blink if you really provoke it. It is about being a perpetual student. It is about not being an adolescent, testosterone-addled boy.

Exactly this...

Also I would throw in that you're going to find yourself not just riding, but shivering so hard at stop lights that your bike shakes underneath you; feeling completely frustrated by a problem with your bike that you don't know how to solve, then feeling like the superhero of the century for figuring it out and fixing it; finding yourself being given help, advice, parts, tools, and support that you had no idea existed among any group of people, and finding your faith in humanity both ruined by stupidity on the streets and then patched together by the people you will meet thru motorcycles... That has been my experience anyway.

Also your significant other needs to either leave you alone in the garage with your bike, or get one of their own, because you're about to start a new relationship lol

[alex.s]

Originally Posted by CycleCam303

Why don't they have track day events like that? It would be like nrs just toned down and all day.

they do. it's called C group. you go and ask a control rider for help.

[Brian]

Originally Posted by alex.s

i know racers who can't ride bicycles so i dont think that's important.

Serious? I think learning how to ride a bicycle is very much needed, just like it would be very beneficial for me to have hopped on a dirt bike before pulling my throttle and lowsiding on this bike not having any prior experience with a throttle before; shooting me off the bike. I think it's different for other things, but definitely balance, the feeling of speed, and the open air feeling (freedom) of a motorcycle should be something you can expect.

[Brian]

Originally Posted by adouglas

If I could give one piece of advice it would be to check your attitude at the door. This is not about speed or an adrenaline rush. That way lies squidness. It is about control. It is about respecting a machine that can kill you faster than you can blink if you really provoke it. It is about being a perpetual student. It is about not being an adolescent, testosterone-addled boy.

That's the most truthful stuff I've ever read. I still can't mark posts as helpful for some reason so I guess I'm putting some of that quote right in my signature!

[Aodrn]

You can ride on the street for years and have no concept of how to handle a motorcycle. If you can work the brakes, gas, and clutch then there is a track day for you. Sport bike track time has no passing in novice period. You line up in groups for novice. There are usually around 8. Work your way up from super slow 8 to 1. Then intermediate. This gives anyone the ability to take corners with no other thought than how to turn.

[rojoracing53]

No one should be riding in the street, it's to dangerous and everyone lacks the necessary skills. Everyone should just sell their bikes while they are still alive.

[GHill762]

Originally Posted by Aodrn

You can ride on the street for years and have no concept of how to handle a motorcycle. If you can work the brakes, gas, and clutch then there is a track day for you. Sport bike track time has no passing in novice period. You line up in groups for novice. There are usually around 8. Work your way up from super slow 8 to 1. Then intermediate. This gives anyone the ability to take corners with no other thought than how to turn.

do you do track days in stl? that's about the closest thing to me and some day I'd like to track a bike..

[GearMonkey]

Originally Posted by rojoracing53

No one should be riding in the street, it's to dangerous and everyone lacks the necessary skills. Everyone should just sell their bikes while they are still alive.

I agree. I will buy your bike for $300, in the interest of your safety.

[allanoue]

Originally Posted by GearMonkey

I agree. I will buy your bike for $300, in the interest of your safety.

I call dibs on the bike rack

[Ninja Bob]

The thing I wish I had known going in is to save up the money for a bike with no problems instead of a old, beat up mechanic's special. It's hard to really learn on a bike that you're constantly worried about breaking down at any moment.

The thing that I did right, and that I tell absolutely everyone that asks me to teach them how to ride, is to take the MSF course. It's cheap, they use their bikes, and they teach in such a honed, intricate way that surpasses any lessons your buddy can give you. Not to mention the invaluable safety lessons woven into the class that can save your butt and get you insurance discounts. The decision to take the class should be a no-brainer that will give a quality of life boost to your entire riding experience.

[Aodrn]

Originally Posted by GHill762

do you do track days in stl? that's about the closest thing to me and some day I'd like to track a bike..

Check out MCRA. There is a track day at the end of may at gateway. They do test the track, which has less gear requirement and is very cheap. If you know you want to do track, just get the gear and start in the novice class. Then start working overtime because you are going to spend your riding season very broke.

[Finesse]

The thing I wish I had known going in is to save up the money for a bike with no problems instead of a old, beat up mechanic's special. It's hard to really learn on a bike that you're constantly worried about breaking down at any moment.

I got an old, beat up cheap mechanic's special and there is no better way to learn to fix your own bike than when you HAVE to or you can't ride it... Yeah it's frustrating sometimes but it's often cheaper than a moto repair class, you can do it on your own time and then you learn a lot about your bike and how it works. If you never learn how to replace parts and never dig into the bike to see how it all works, and it does break down on you, you will be lost, whereas if you'd started working on it when you got it, you will be a little ahead.

That being said, I wouldn't suggest buying a bike that doesn't run, or has problems running that haven't been diagnosed ... But buying a cheap bike that needs a few new things and a few hours of work isn't such a bad thing.

[GHill762]

Originally Posted by Aodrn

Check out MCRA. There is a track day at the end of may at gateway. They do test the track, which has less gear requirement and is very cheap. If you know you want to do track, just get the gear and start in the novice class. Then start working overtime because you are going to spend your riding season very broke.

that's actually exactly what I was looking at a while back, but didn't know about TTT..

if I'm reading it right it looks like the only difference between normal track days and the TTT are the price tag (wow TTT is cheap!) and the antifreeze requirements.. not too bad though, take off the mirrors and tape all lights up, etc... I might have to run down there some time.. gotta get leather pants and proper boots and gloves (gauntlets and track boots)..

[Ninja Bob]

Originally Posted by Finesse

I got an old, beat up cheap mechanic's special and there is no better way to learn to fix your own bike than when you HAVE to or you can't ride it... Yeah it's frustrating sometimes but it's often cheaper than a moto repair class, you can do it on your own time and then you learn a lot about your bike and how it works. If you never learn how to replace parts and never dig into the bike to see how it all works, and it does break down on you, you will be lost, whereas if you'd started working on it when you got it, you will be a little ahead.

That being said, I wouldn't suggest buying a bike that doesn't run, or has problems running that haven't been diagnosed ... But buying a cheap bike that needs a few new things and a few hours of work isn't such a bad thing.

Yeah, that is a good take on it. I suppose my main problem was that I bought mine from some squid that insisted there was nothing wrong with it except cosmetics and the electric start not working. To be fair, I was an all around noob at all things motorized and didn't do my homework.

Now days I'm much more equipped to make an educated purchase, but I still need to learn my regular maintenance. What's all this noise about shimming? How do I clean the carbs? Jetting... wut? What do I do before and after winter?

I'll get there. Ninjette.org's got my back.

[Finesse]

^When I got my bike, the ahole who sold it to me told me the only problem was the rip in the seat and the crack in the fairing.

I ended up replacing the front rotor, front and rear brake pads, right handlebar, adding a rear fender, replacing the chain and both sprockets, replacing both tires, replacing the brake pedal, brake and clutch levers, adding bar ends, replacing both forks, adjusting the valves and adjusting throttle cables.

I knew nothing about bikes when I got it, so it taught me the hard way but still all of these things weren't too terribly complicated Couldn't afford a shop so I did this myself with the help of a complete stranger I met thru couchsurfing.org who has turned out to be my best friend over the 10 months I've had my bike.

[Whiskey]

Originally Posted by Ninja Bob

The thing I wish I had known going in is to save up the money for a bike with no problems instead of a old, beat up mechanic's special. It's hard to really learn on a bike that you're constantly worried about breaking down at any moment.

Put the money on good gear & a cheap starter bike, that way if/when you do drop it due to some noob mistake
1) You stand a much better chance of walking away unhurt

2) it's not a shiny new machine that you've just damaged

[Ninja Bob]

Originally Posted by Whiskey

Put the money on good gear & a cheap starter bike, that way if/when you do drop it due to some noob mistake
1) You stand a much better chance of walking away unhurt

2) it's not a shiny new machine that you've just damaged

I didn't say a shiney new bike. I said a bike that you know isn't on the verge of breaking down or falling to pieces. Especially if you're not mechanically inclined like myself.

[alex.s]

how to motorcycle:

step 1:
admire the motorcycle. you WOULD start it, but that requires getting closer than 6 feet to it. but it looks best from about 7-8 feet away. up close and you can see all those little imperfections that piss you off that nobody else notices. is that bent? it's hard to tell from this angle. better move a few feet to the side... ah yes, that looks better... hmm, i'd better look at it from the other side for awhile. is that person staring at me? i should probably go.

step 2:
put ALL of your gear on it. you already put the gear on, but now you need to take every single piece off, place it somewhere on the motorcycle, and then have a smoke, or do your thing while the motorcycle acquires your scent. once it's nice and musky with your stank, get your gear back on. make sure to put the gloves on before your helmet for extra safety.

step 3:
okay you're geared back up, all ready to go. now's the time to go back in your house and get the thing you forgot to put in your pack that you now have to take off but you can't get it off because your jacket makes it hard without unzipping first, but you have to take your gloves off to unzip the jacket without screwing it up. so once you've taken ALL of your gear off again, and you get the stupid thing you've forgotten into your pack. you get all your gear back on and head out the door.

step 4:
is that oil? proceed to tear down the motorcycle engine. inspect all bearing surfaces and clearances before reassembly with fresh gaskets and new fluids. make sure you clean up with kitty litter all that oil you spilled every time you try to do anything even after years of doing the same thing over and over. you've convinced yourself you will spill no more, but spill you do. typically with hot oil when nobody is around to hand you towels leaving you soiling an entire roll of shop towels grabbing for them frantically with a bunch of hot oil all over your scalding hands.

step 5:
okay, the bike is all back together, you're all geared up again, and you're off on your journey! unfortunately you didn't take the msf so you don't know how to steer and you crash the bike in the first corner. sorry, too bad. better luck next bike.

[Sirref]

^ sounds like a typical harley rider

[Sargent]

I went out and bought my first motorcycle without ever having ridden more than a dirt bike across a street. The salesman pushed it out of the showroom doors. I said, "Okay, show me how to ride this." He looked at me awkwardly and showed me the controls. I spent ten minutes screwing around in the parking lot then rode an hour home during rush hour through downtown Portland.

Apparently I did it wrong.

[Brian]

Originally Posted by Sargent

I said, "Okay, show me how to ride this." He looked at me awkwardly and showed me the controls. I spent ten minutes screwing around in the parking lot then rode an hour home during rush hour through downtown Portland.

Apparently I did it wrong.

That must have been pretty dangerous, I don't think there's any way you just hopped on a bike for the first time and knew what you were doing. Unless you stayed in first gear and hogged the front brake, at least for me, there's so much that goes into riding a motorcycle..

[Sargent]

Originally Posted by Brian

There is no way you just hopped on a bike for the first time and knew what you were doing. Unless you stayed in first gear and hogged the front brake, at least for me, there's so much that goes into riding a motorcycle..

When I was a teenager I rode a bicycle everywhere. I didn't start driving until I was 18. And you can map from Scappoose, OR to Vancouver, WA. There's no reasonable way to make that trip in first gear.

[Brian]

Originally Posted by Sargent

When I was a teenager I rode a bicycle everywhere. I didn't start driving until I was 18. And you can map from Scappoose, OR to Vancouver, WA. There's no reasonable way to make that trip in first gear.

You rode a bicycle or a motor bike??

[Sargent]

Bicycle. As long as you have decent situational awareness and understand how a clutch works, it's not that difficult to pick up. My wife (girlfriend at the time) sat in the parking lot waiting to make sure I was comfortable and followed me a ways to make sure I wasn't going to get myself killed.

[Brian]

Originally Posted by Sargent

Bicycle. As long as you have decent situational awareness and understand how a clutch works, it's not that difficult to pick up. My wife (girlfriend at the time) sat in the parking lot waiting to make sure I was comfortable and followed me a ways to make sure I wasn't going to get myself killed.

I totally agree with the prior experience you learned from a bicycle. I've rode bicycle's all my life but would have probably whiskey throttled my 250 if I tried to drive it home.

[allanoue]

Originally Posted by Sargent

I went out and bought my first motorcycle without ever having ridden more than a dirt bike across a street. The salesman pushed it out of the showroom doors. I said, "Okay, show me how to ride this." He looked at me awkwardly and showed me the controls. I spent ten minutes screwing around in the parking lot then rode an hour home during rush hour through downtown Portland.

Apparently I did it wrong.

Sound just like my first ride. Except I skipped the 10 minuets in the parking lot.

[Sirref]

I do agree that having road-cycle experience can help but it's still a bit sketchy to ride without even knowing the basics that are required in order to have a motorcycle license.

[Sargent]

Originally Posted by Brian

whiskey throttled

I was not familiar with that term. Thank you. I have many a new youtube video to watch.

[Sirref]

oh dear god, I've done that slightly in the past. Luckily nothing has come of it.