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Old October 1st, 2014, 07:34 PM   #1
Qomomoko
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Moto leaking gas

93' Ninja 250

Ninja 250 is leaking gas when running.
Coming form Carb area, does not seem to be the gasket area.
Not familiar with carbs.
There are some screws on the bottom area(maybe used to adjust setting, not sure if bikes has been jetted though I think so b/c she always starts right up with chocke)

Hope I do not end up missing track day this Sunday b/c of this.

Was actually about to go out and practice some cool stuff from "Sport Riding Techniques" when katabum surprise.

I figure either I do it or take it to Moto-tech Racing (closest bike shop).

Best case, is it a matter of getting carb off and tighing up up a loose screw?
or
2nd best case a matter of getting a gasket for the carb?
or
some with the jetts and then I better just take it to Walter(owner of closest shop)?
or
other-> (closest shop)

video below with like as my videos do not post up well

http://youtu.be/oB0BatBEXTI
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Old October 1st, 2014, 08:51 PM   #2
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The screws at the very bottom of the carbs are drain screws. If they aren't tight, the carbs will drip gas.
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Old October 1st, 2014, 11:05 PM   #3
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Looking at the video, it is possible it may be coming from where the airbox boots meet the carb. Pop the top off the airbox and see if it is unusually wet or smells strongly of fuel inside (or check for fuel leaking from back of airbox). If that is the case, either it was flooded during starting and the fuel ran back into the airbox after filling the ports, or you may have a leaking petcock. In the video it sounds like its just cranking and not firing. That + fuel leaking would definitely make me think flooded engine.
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Old October 2nd, 2014, 03:15 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flitecontrol View Post
The screws at the very bottom of the carbs are drain screws. If they aren't tight, the carbs will drip gas.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PHMCS View Post
Looking at the video, it is possible it may be coming from where the airbox boots meet the carb. Pop the top off the airbox and see if it is unusually wet or smells strongly of fuel inside (or check for fuel leaking from back of airbox). If that is the case, either it was flooded during starting and the fuel ran back into the airbox after filling the ports, or you may have a leaking petcock. In the video it sounds like its just cranking and not firing. That + fuel leaking would definitely make me think flooded engine.
Thanks guys. hope its an easy fix...she start up now easyily but still leaks.. ..

hopefully removing and getting to parts is easy as I not have much time and also to be able to make it to the track this sunday and not have to spend money on a moto shop ..
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Old October 2nd, 2014, 03:42 AM   #5
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getting to top of air box... tightening the drain screw

seems based on video that it is a lot of work to get to air box..

gonna see if I can manage to tighten drain screws in place... mini update before sun rises for what I hope to be a quick fix.
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Old October 2nd, 2014, 05:38 AM   #6
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update.. appears to be flooded



appears to have been flooded!!!

put white dry paper around to pic up gas for smallest of leak and nothing.

more later for input but going to get 1/4 hose clap as, believe or not, my bike had no clamps for the hose (GAS) lines , did not bother to check when bought bike from a motoshop. There have been other "small" details that I have bee noticing that are making me lean towards doing my own work OR am I being to demanding?

thanks again for input guys and cross fingers that no more leaky gas... Wont sign up for track day Sunday until I can take her for a spin and make sure she up to par.

Last futzed with by Qomomoko; October 2nd, 2014 at 10:29 AM.
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Old October 2nd, 2014, 07:41 AM   #7
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If you do the work yourself, at least you know what was, or wasn't, done. Too many surprises from a shop, in addition to the bill!
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Old October 2nd, 2014, 10:32 AM   #8
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Time to use internets to learn about carbs...

its stopped leaking, must have used up gas....

ran her (still) for a while.. on off... onf off.. 10 min intervals and she seems good.

Wonder if I flooded her up but opening up the throttle when starting her up?....

Yesterday at first try she started right up... then after ten min ( I was busy getting ready to take her out by putting on gear and checking tire pressrue) she turned off.. then .. had trouble starting.... I checked gas .checked pectcock.. nothing.. then maybe I did try her again with throttle and then maybe I saw the gas leak IF NOT. and the floater or needle valve was stuck, IS IT A DANGEROUS CONDITION FOR THE TRACK?
Thanks again
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Old October 2nd, 2014, 11:37 AM   #9
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leaking gas + track day = dangerous could be a float issue gas keeps trying to get into the carb even when the bowl is full, could be a gasket, when it comes to carb trouble it almost always leads me to have to at least pull the carb out of what ever bike it is with the issue.
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Old April 9th, 2015, 04:47 AM   #10
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the leak..

things looking good.

the float bowl gasket looks good, though its pretty obvious from my video that it is leaking from there, the last pic think near the top left screw on its right side.

the rubber screws that go on the floats and the openings where those screw go on also seem well.

the float bowls move easily..

there is some debris can be seen in last pic #10 and also 2nd to last #9.

Planning on reading the threads on carb cleaning and HOPING that does the trick but I also rather see what you guys think and avoid surprises.

I am ordering a set of JIS socket screw heads but will be putting hex/allen screws on the bowls to avoid future screw trouble as pic #2 on the bottom right shows I had to dremmel the head to get it off.

the video was taken a while back but after running the bike for a little, the leak stop.

Leak showed up again after having the bike sit still due to mods last week.

https://youtu.be/oB0BatBEXTI

#1

#2

#3

#4

#5

#6

#7

#8

#9

#10
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Old April 9th, 2015, 08:23 PM   #11
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Luis,

The problem may be in the float valves (conical black things that go into that well).
That black pointy end is made of Neoprene, which gets harder with time and exposure to air (when carbs are dry).
The solution to that is replacement of those two.
The bottom of the well against those valves close sometimes develops sediments from fuel and dirt that avoid a perfect seal.
When the engine is working, the vibrations make the harden valves leak.

Follow these links for cleaning and adjustment:
http://faq.ninja250.org/wiki/How_do_...n_the_carbs%3F
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Old April 9th, 2015, 09:31 PM   #12
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Clean and rebuild the carburetors, New float valves for sure, order rebuilding kit, set float height, set idle mixture screws. Add a fuel filter too.

Also check the engine oil, odds are there's gas in it.

Any questions please feel free to ask.

SIDENOTE: if you need parts, or carburetors service PM @ducatiman I personally vouch for him.
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Old April 10th, 2015, 05:19 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Motofool View Post
Luis,

The problem may be in the float valves (conical black things that go into that well).
That black pointy end is made of Neoprene, which gets harder with time and exposure to air (when carbs are dry).
The solution to that is replacement of those two.
The bottom of the well against those valves close sometimes develops sediments from fuel and dirt that avoid a perfect seal.
When the engine is working, the vibrations make the harden valves leak.

Follow these links for cleaning and adjustment:
http://faq.ninja250.org/wiki/How_do_...n_the_carbs%3F
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghostt View Post
Clean and rebuild the carburetors, New float valves for sure, order rebuilding kit, set float height, set idle mixture screws. Add a fuel filter too.

Also check the engine oil, odds are there's gas in it.

Any questions please feel free to ask.

SIDENOTE: if you need parts, or carburetors service PM @ducatiman I personally vouch for him.
thanks guys.. i ordered gaskets for the float but it was just one and now parts.. partly mis read description and got fooled by the pics they posted so will be looking for the carb rebuild kit,.. i'll pm ducatiman...figure gonna be between $40 and $50 or where else you guys recommend..
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Old April 10th, 2015, 02:18 PM   #14
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^ I returned your PM, will significantly beat that $40-50 pricetag.
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Old April 10th, 2015, 05:27 PM   #15
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^ I returned your PM, will significantly beat that $40-50 pricetag.
thanks.. will try and cancel and order through you..

i was in a rush.
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Old April 11th, 2015, 10:47 AM   #16
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$28 shipped, enough to do one carbset (both carbs)

2 pilot orings
2 bowl orings
2 float valves
8 stainless buttonhead screws for diaphragm covers
and 8 for float bowls
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Old April 18th, 2015, 07:05 AM   #17
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Carbs dont look 100% clean as I had hoped..

Spoke with ducatiman...offers great service but since I already bought the $46 kit from ebay.. and cleaned "stuff" with the pinesol/water mixture 3/4... then gonna butten the carb up when I get the hex screws for the float bowls; should be here today or tomorrow ish..

however.. the pinesol mixture left some soap deposits...though mostly looks like on the outside, like on the CHOKE slider... Should I now dip the carb parts in gasoline or some similar to loosen those deposits?

I have sprayed some carb cleaner to get it cleaner such...

i took copper wires and ran them through the jets/needles looking things..and there was no gunk..

the rest are also pics of the needle sliders and boots.. there where no washers in there. It feels like metal or very hard plastic but doubt its washers stuck..I'll look for stainless steel washers.. look like 3M size (my 4M did not fit)

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Old April 18th, 2015, 12:56 PM   #18
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Good deal, hopefully it works now.

BTW did you get the stainless steel hardware from @ducatiman?

SIDENOTE: be sure that part# 16017 is installed correctly, if not the bike will run like crap.

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Old April 18th, 2015, 01:08 PM   #19
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washers position...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghostt View Post
Good deal, hopefully it works now.

BTW did you get the stainless steel hardware from @ducatiman?

SIDENOTE: be sure that part# 16017 is installed correctly, if not the bike will run like crap.

naw.. by the time he replied I had ordered the carb kit from ebay…

the washers.. they would go between the boots (16126) and then the needle sliders (16009) correct?

and thanks for the warning.. sounds like some one ran their ninja with that piece installed "differently" lol
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Old April 18th, 2015, 01:21 PM   #20
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naw.. by the time he replied I had ordered the carb kit from ebay…

the washers.. they would go between the boots (16126) and then the needle sliders (16009) correct?

and thanks for the warning.. sounds like some one ran their ninja with that piece installed "differently" lol
Yes the washers goes slides over the needle, then just install them, remember small steps.

Personally I would put it back without any changes, get it running smoothly, adjust the idle mixture screws, then try just one washer at a time.

If memory serves me correctly, you can do the washers without removing the carburetors, just remove the diaphragm covers, remove just the needles add washer, install.

Tuning and dialing in carburetors is a slow process, if done correctly it's worth it in the long run, and less headaches if done in steps. This allows you to know if a change doesn't work, you know exactly what it was, as opposed to making several changes and then your lost.
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Old April 18th, 2015, 05:23 PM   #21
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Yes the washers goes slides over the needle, then just install them, remember small steps.

Personally I would put it back without any changes, get it running smoothly, adjust the idle mixture screws, then try just one washer at a time.

If memory serves me correctly, you can do the washers without removing the carburetors, just remove the diaphragm covers, remove just the needles add washer, install.

Tuning and dialing in carburetors is a slow process, if done correctly it's worth it in the long run, and less headaches if done in steps. This allows you to know if a change doesn't work, you know exactly what it was, as opposed to making several changes and then your lost.
thanks..really... going slower than i wanted but.. cant rush moto stuff..
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Old April 23rd, 2015, 04:18 PM   #22
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do 'em up red, mon (Ex500, these)
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Old April 24th, 2015, 09:30 AM   #23
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do 'em up red, mon (Ex500, these)
waoooo.. they look awsome!!!
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Old April 24th, 2015, 11:33 AM   #24
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and he's just teasing, should see his other work.
@ducatiman offers FULL SERVICES, including custom builds.
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