how to check a motorcycle engine to see if its good?

ninja_thresh_hold · May 3rd, 2013, 06:44 AM

Okay, so I'm buying a ex500r engine to swap into my 250 and need to know how to chick the engines health, it's not on the frame and it isn't known if it runs, so how can I check it out?

Motofool · May 3rd, 2013, 07:49 AM

Eric,

I would make sure that the engine has enough and good lubricant inside before testing anything.

Secondly, I would anchor the thing solidly, keeping it properly leveled.

Clean or new spark plugs.

Then, I would connect fluids, sensors and power to it, verifying that vacuum tubes are OK and hooked or capped.

A compression test will tell you how worn the piston-rings-cylinders are.

A leak-down test will tell you how well the valves isolate the cylinder.

http://www.dansmc.com/compression_test.htm

http://www.dansmc.com/leakdown.htm

If the thing is in decent shape and no noises are present when turning it by hand, I would try firing it up.

The most probably is that the carbs are dirty inside and that you will need to clean and re-try starting up.

...........or you could skip all those steps and just buy it as is...........

Jiggles · May 3rd, 2013, 07:50 AM

You smoke too much weed

ninja_thresh_hold · May 3rd, 2013, 07:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Motofool

Eric,

I would make sure that the engine has enough and good lubricant inside before testing anything.

Secondly, I would anchor the thing solidly, keeping it properly leveled.

Clean or new spark plugs.

Then, I would connect fluids, sensors and power to it, verifying that vacuum tubes are OK and hooked or capped.

A compression test will tell you how worn the piston-rings-cylinders are.

A leak-down test will tell you how well the valves isolate the cylinder.

http://www.dansmc.com/compression_test.htm

http://www.dansmc.com/leakdown.htm

If the thing is in decent shape and no noises are present when turning it by hand, I would try firing it up.

The most probably is that the carbs are dirty inside and that you will need to clean and re-try starting up.

...........or you could skip all those steps and just buy it as is...........

to the best of my knowledge it is not on a frame, so i dont think i can start it, but i think i might just low ball him saying that idk if it works, i mean hell, 100$ for an engine would be a hell of a deal whether it needs rebuilt or not lol

ninja_thresh_hold · May 3rd, 2013, 08:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jiggles

You smoke too much weed

I didn't realize there was a such thing! Lol, what makes you say that?

Jiggles · May 3rd, 2013, 08:44 AM

Your entire OP

ninja_thresh_hold · May 3rd, 2013, 08:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jiggles

Your entire OP

Lol ah ;P I edited it, I was kinda tired when I posted it lol

choneofakind · May 3rd, 2013, 08:48 AM

Not to hate here, but someone's going to say it:
Why not just buy a 500? You'll get a bike that has service history and can be test-ridden.

Now that that's out of the way,
Motofool is dead on. First thing I'd check is that nothing touches/bumps when turned over by hand. If that's good, I'd buy it on the spot for as cheap as possible.

Then starting it is the basics:
fuel
spark
air
compression

Don't forget to give the engine a thorough once-over to make sure things like rocker arms aren't broken. Open the oil filter thing to check for metal shavings on the filter etc etc. As long as it looks alright, go for it.

If you see metal shavings or bent rocker arms, run the other direction.

ninja_thresh_hold · May 3rd, 2013, 08:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by choneofakind

Not to hate here, but someone's going to say it:
Why not just buy a 500? You'll get a bike that has service history and can be test-ridden.

Now that that's out of the way,
Motofool is dead on. First thing I'd check is that nothing touches/bumps when turned over by hand. If that's good, I'd buy it on the spot for as cheap as possible.

Then starting it is the basics:
fuel
spark
air
compression

Don't forget to give the engine a thorough once-over to make sure things like rocker arms aren't broken. Open the oil filter thing to check for metal shavings on the filter etc etc. As long as it looks alright, go for it.

If you see metal shavings or bent rocker arms, run the other direction.

The reason I'm doing a swap is because I have grown to love the looks of my bike, and I have a lot of work in it, but I want more power, but not as much as a zx6r can provide, and the 500s are ugly IMO, so I'm going to swap the engine for a 500, and take the 250 engine and put it on a kx250 frame, and have a faster bike for the street, and a nicely running dirt bike.

Joshorilla · May 3rd, 2013, 09:09 AM

Get a zxr400 they're loooovely

choneofakind · May 3rd, 2013, 09:14 AM

I'm not critiquing the swap. I'm just putting it out there because SOMEONE inevitably will say it. So I got it out of the way for you.

I'd go for it. When in doubt, you can always part out the engine on Ebay.

Joshorilla · May 3rd, 2013, 09:16 AM

What chode said, also, if he can't prove it's running i'd expect that to be reflected in the price.

ninja_thresh_hold · May 3rd, 2013, 09:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by choneofakind

I'm not critiquing the swap. I'm just putting it out there because SOMEONE inevitably will say it. So I got it out of the way for you.

I'd go for it. When in doubt, you can always part out the engine on Ebay.

Yeah, and if it does work out, I'll still have a dirt bike that I can sell for a profit

ninja_thresh_hold · May 3rd, 2013, 09:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joshorilla

What chode said, also, if he can't prove it's running i'd expect that to be reflected in the price.

That's why I posted here, so I can know how to check stuff myself, and tell him I'll give him like 100$ or so for it since idk if it runs

Joshorilla · May 3rd, 2013, 09:20 AM

How much is he asking for it, if it looks to be solid, i'd say max of $200, $100 if it looks to be a bit knackered.

Make sure it includes the carbs and such, last thing you want is to source random expensive replacement parts, this is why a donor bike is often better.

ninja_thresh_hold · May 3rd, 2013, 09:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joshorilla

How much is he asking for it, if it looks to be solid, i'd say max of $200, $100 if it looks to be a bit knackered.

Make sure it includes the carbs and such, last thing you want is to source random expensive replacement parts, this is why a donor bike is often better.

He says complete engine, so it should have everything. He's parting out 2 500s and I just texted him and asked about it

Jono · May 3rd, 2013, 09:24 AM

Or you could just get one of these...

Alex · May 3rd, 2013, 09:28 AM

Some relevant threads here:

The Ex 500 Engine swap with pics

Custom 09 ninja 250 with ex 500 or 650r engine + others

ninja_thresh_hold · May 3rd, 2013, 09:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alex

Some relevant threads here:

The Ex 500 Engine swap with pics

Custom 09 ninja 250 with ex 500 or 650r engine + others

Thanks Alex, yeah I've read those before, I'm just trying not to get screwed over on an engine I can't use

ninja_thresh_hold · May 3rd, 2013, 09:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jono

Or you could just get one of these...

Is that a cbr 500?

Jono · May 3rd, 2013, 09:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ninja_thresh_hold

Is that a cbr 500?

Yes!

AFazakerley · May 3rd, 2013, 11:21 AM

See if you can turn the engine over manualy with-out spark plugs in, then turn it over with plugs in. Should be able to feel compression to certain point.

JohnnyBravo · May 3rd, 2013, 11:27 AM

I don't think I've ever seen used oil, or a filter without metal particles

Jiggles · May 3rd, 2013, 12:07 PM

I liked the old op better

choneofakind · May 3rd, 2013, 12:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnnyBravo

I don't think I've ever seen used oil, or a filter without metal particles

My filter never has metal filings in it. Neither does my oil. I put a magnet in a plastic bag, then run that through the old oil to check. The metal filings would get stuck to the outside of the bag if there were any.

Are you thinking that metal shavings are normal? Or is this just because your bike is still brand new? Sorry, Idk what you were suggesting exactly.

JohnnyBravo · May 3rd, 2013, 12:55 PM

Naw... I ran the army oil analysis program, so I saw on the machine the metal particles that were microscopic, so even if you can't see them they exist... Glad you can't find them though

choneofakind · May 3rd, 2013, 01:00 PM

Oh gotcha. Well I meant like giant shiny metal shavings that would imply that something bad was happening. Of course there's going to be a bunch of tiny particles of metal in any engine oil

Joshorilla · May 3rd, 2013, 01:18 PM

Infact they add tiny particles of metals to most oils! Zinc being a notable one.

JohnnyBravo · May 3rd, 2013, 02:17 PM

I didn't have any smarty, useful things to say besides all oil got metal stuff in em.

Chone glad you care enough for your bike to go the extra miles!!!

KawiKid860 · May 4th, 2013, 02:35 AM

Quote:

the 500s are ugly IMO

Shut up, just shut up!

Do you know how many miles are on the engine? These 500 engines are a little more fragile than a lot of other bikes due to awkward design on kawis part. A really abused 500 motor can be trash around 20k miles, but a well cared for one can go for as long as any other sport bike engine. I'd just stay away from one in unknown condition, bad things happen if you continually go over 10,500 rpms.

choneofakind · May 4th, 2013, 06:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KawiKid860

These 500 engines are a little more fragile than a lot of other bikes due to awkward design on kawis part.

Interesting. Have a little more info on this?

ChaoSS · May 4th, 2013, 06:48 AM

I think if you don't know enough about engines to know how to check one out, you don't know enough to do a proper engine swap.

Just my thought.

alex.s · May 4th, 2013, 01:35 PM

how to check if an engine is good.

has fluids, still in bike:
run the engine, get it up to temp. does it sound horrible? is it spewing fluids? does it even run? ok good so its looking good so far. do a compression test. still good? drain the oil and catch some oil with an oil test kit then send it off to the lab to be tested. when the results come back if it tests clean its probably good.

no fluids, out of bike, off ebay or something:
disassemble the engine and examine the crank and bearings, valves and seats, pistons, cams, the trans, do ohms checks on the stator and pickup coils, check the oil pump and all the seals. make sure nothing is bent (crank, rods, trans shafts or forks) if everything looks good, reassemble. otherwise replace or fix whats broken or toss it aside for spare parts in the future.

KawiKid860 · May 4th, 2013, 04:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by choneofakind

Interesting. Have a little more info on this?

I spose I could get some info from ex-500.com but I'm too lazy right now. OP may want to check it out himself.

Also just saying if you start pulling the 500 engine apart you have to lap the head before reassembling or else it'll be toast before you go 500 miles. Buying a replacement motor is usually a lot cheaper than rebuilding for the 500 unless you can do it all yourself and are pretty good at it.

Another note, make sure you get a 2nd gen engine (1994-2009) or if you get a 1st gen (1987-1993) You'll want to replace the CCT, flywheel, transmission and probably a few other bits with 2nd gen units.

ninja_thresh_hold · August 25th, 2013, 04:58 PM

ended up gettinga zx6r instead

ChickenRun · August 25th, 2013, 07:57 PM

Awww quitter

May 3rd, 2013, 06:44 AM	#1
ninja_thresh_hold ninjette.org ********* Name: Eric Location: Athens, Alabama Join Date: Jul 2011 Motorcycle(s): 2008 Kawasaki Ninja 250r (忍者 250r; sold!) 2001 zx6r Posts: 347	how to check a motorcycle engine to see if its good? Okay, so I'm buying a ex500r engine to swap into my 250 and need to know how to chick the engines health, it's not on the frame and it isn't known if it runs, so how can I check it out? __________________________________________________ Last futzed with by ninja_thresh_hold; May 3rd, 2013 at 08:47 AM.

May 3rd, 2013, 07:49 AM	#2
Motofool Daily Ninjette rider Name: Hernan Location: Florida Join Date: Mar 2011 Motorcycle(s): 2007 Ninja 250 Posts: A lot. MOTY - 2016, MOTM - Dec '12, Jan '14, Jan '15, May '16	Eric, I would make sure that the engine has enough and good lubricant inside before testing anything. Secondly, I would anchor the thing solidly, keeping it properly leveled. Clean or new spark plugs. Then, I would connect fluids, sensors and power to it, verifying that vacuum tubes are OK and hooked or capped. A compression test will tell you how worn the piston-rings-cylinders are. A leak-down test will tell you how well the valves isolate the cylinder. http://www.dansmc.com/compression_test.htm http://www.dansmc.com/leakdown.htm If the thing is in decent shape and no noises are present when turning it by hand, I would try firing it up. The most probably is that the carbs are dirty inside and that you will need to clean and re-try starting up. ...........or you could skip all those steps and just buy it as is........... __________________________________________________ *Motofool* *.................................Never ride faster than your guardian angel can fly* "Mankind is composed of two sorts of men — those who love and create, and those who hate and destroy. Love is the bond between men, the way to teach and the center of the world." - José Martí

May 3rd, 2013, 07:50 AM	#3
Jiggles Jigglin' your Jiglets Name: Sean Location: San Jose, Ca Join Date: Jun 2011 Motorcycle(s): 2009 K1300S, 2013 Ninja 300, 2011 Ninja 250R, Faster than Unregistered's ninjette Posts: Too much. Blog Entries: 1 MOTM - Apr '13	You smoke too much weed __________________________________________________ If the Ninja 250 doesn't have enough power for you, then you don't know how to ride it. AFM #676 Supersports are for n00bs
	1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.

May 3rd, 2013, 08:44 AM	#6
Jiggles Jigglin' your Jiglets Name: Sean Location: San Jose, Ca Join Date: Jun 2011 Motorcycle(s): 2009 K1300S, 2013 Ninja 300, 2011 Ninja 250R, Faster than Unregistered's ninjette Posts: Too much. Blog Entries: 1 MOTM - Apr '13	Your entire OP __________________________________________________ If the Ninja 250 doesn't have enough power for you, then you don't know how to ride it. AFM #676 Supersports are for n00bs

May 3rd, 2013, 08:48 AM	#8
choneofakind ninjette.org certified postwhore Name: . Location: . Join Date: Feb 2011 Motorcycle(s): . Posts: Too much. MOTM - Feb '13, Feb '14	Not to hate here, but someone's going to say it: Why not just buy a 500? You'll get a bike that has service history and can be test-ridden. Now that that's out of the way, Motofool is dead on. First thing I'd check is that nothing touches/bumps when turned over by hand. If that's good, I'd buy it on the spot for as cheap as possible. Then starting it is the basics: fuel spark air compression Don't forget to give the engine a thorough once-over to make sure things like rocker arms aren't broken. Open the oil filter thing to check for metal shavings on the filter etc etc. As long as it looks alright, go for it. If you see metal shavings or bent rocker arms, run the other direction.
	1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.

May 3rd, 2013, 09:09 AM	#10
Joshorilla Bass Master General Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: A lot. Blog Entries: 24	Get a zxr400 they're loooovely

May 3rd, 2013, 09:14 AM	#11
choneofakind ninjette.org certified postwhore Name: . Location: . Join Date: Feb 2011 Motorcycle(s): . Posts: Too much. MOTM - Feb '13, Feb '14	I'm not critiquing the swap. I'm just putting it out there because SOMEONE inevitably will say it. So I got it out of the way for you. I'd go for it. When in doubt, you can always part out the engine on Ebay.

May 3rd, 2013, 09:16 AM	#12
Joshorilla Bass Master General Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: A lot. Blog Entries: 24	What chode said, also, if he can't prove it's running i'd expect that to be reflected in the price.

May 3rd, 2013, 09:20 AM	#15
Joshorilla Bass Master General Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: A lot. Blog Entries: 24	How much is he asking for it, if it looks to be solid, i'd say max of $200, $100 if it looks to be a bit knackered. Make sure it includes the carbs and such, last thing you want is to source random expensive replacement parts, this is why a donor bike is often better.

May 3rd, 2013, 09:24 AM	#17
Jono ninjette.org certified postwhore Name: Jono Location: Memphis, TN Join Date: Sep 2011 Motorcycle(s): 2009 Triumph Street Triple, 2009 KLX250SF, 2003 Suzuki SV650S (Sold), 2006 Ninja 250 (Sold) Posts: A lot.	Or you could just get one of these...

May 3rd, 2013, 09:28 AM	#18
Alex ninjette.org dude Name: 1 guess :-) Location: SF Bay Area Join Date: Jun 2008 Motorcycle(s): '13 Ninja 300 (white, the fastest color!), '13 R1200RT, '14 CRF250L, '12 TT-R125LE Posts: Too much. Blog Entries: 7	Some relevant threads here: The Ex 500 Engine swap with pics Custom 09 ninja 250 with ex 500 or 650r engine + others __________________________________________________ Montgomery Street Motorcycle Club / cal24.com / crf250l.org / ninjette.org ninjette.org Terms of Service Shopping for motorcycle parts or equipment? Come here first. The friendliest Ninja 250R/300/400 forum on the internet! (especially Unregistered)
	1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.

May 3rd, 2013, 11:21 AM	#22
AFazakerley ninjette.org member Name: Alex Location: Woburnn Ma Join Date: Aug 2012 Motorcycle(s): 2000 Ninja 250 Posts: 71	See if you can turn the engine over manualy with-out spark plugs in, then turn it over with plugs in. Should be able to feel compression to certain point.

May 3rd, 2013, 11:27 AM	#23
JohnnyBravo Certifiable nontundrum Name: Harper Location: NC Milkshake stand Join Date: Mar 2013 Motorcycle(s): 2013 SE NINJA 300 Posts: Too much. MOTM - Sep '13, Sep '16	I don't think I've ever seen used oil, or a filter without metal particles

May 3rd, 2013, 12:07 PM	#24
Jiggles Jigglin' your Jiglets Name: Sean Location: San Jose, Ca Join Date: Jun 2011 Motorcycle(s): 2009 K1300S, 2013 Ninja 300, 2011 Ninja 250R, Faster than Unregistered's ninjette Posts: Too much. Blog Entries: 1 MOTM - Apr '13	I liked the old op better __________________________________________________ If the Ninja 250 doesn't have enough power for you, then you don't know how to ride it. AFM #676 Supersports are for n00bs

May 3rd, 2013, 12:55 PM	#26
JohnnyBravo Certifiable nontundrum Name: Harper Location: NC Milkshake stand Join Date: Mar 2013 Motorcycle(s): 2013 SE NINJA 300 Posts: Too much. MOTM - Sep '13, Sep '16	Naw... I ran the army oil analysis program, so I saw on the machine the metal particles that were microscopic, so even if you can't see them they exist... Glad you can't find them though

May 3rd, 2013, 01:00 PM	#27
choneofakind ninjette.org certified postwhore Name: . Location: . Join Date: Feb 2011 Motorcycle(s): . Posts: Too much. MOTM - Feb '13, Feb '14	Oh gotcha. Well I meant like giant shiny metal shavings that would imply that something bad was happening. Of course there's going to be a bunch of tiny particles of metal in any engine oil

May 3rd, 2013, 01:18 PM	#28
Joshorilla Bass Master General Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: A lot. Blog Entries: 24	Infact they add tiny particles of metals to most oils! Zinc being a notable one.

May 3rd, 2013, 02:17 PM	#29
JohnnyBravo Certifiable nontundrum Name: Harper Location: NC Milkshake stand Join Date: Mar 2013 Motorcycle(s): 2013 SE NINJA 300 Posts: Too much. MOTM - Sep '13, Sep '16	I didn't have any smarty, useful things to say besides all oil got metal stuff in em. Chone glad you care enough for your bike to go the extra miles!!!

May 4th, 2013, 06:48 AM	#32
ChaoSS ninjette.org sage Name: Tim Location: Goshen CA Join Date: Oct 2012 Motorcycle(s): 2012 red 250 ninja Posts: 740	I think if you don't know enough about engines to know how to check one out, you don't know enough to do a proper engine swap. Just my thought.
	1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.

May 4th, 2013, 01:35 PM	#33
alex.s wat Name: wat Location: tustin/long beach Join Date: Sep 2009 Motorcycle(s): wat Posts: Too much. Blog Entries: 5 MOTM - Oct '12, Feb '14	how to check if an engine is good. has fluids, still in bike: run the engine, get it up to temp. does it sound horrible? is it spewing fluids? does it even run? ok good so its looking good so far. do a compression test. still good? drain the oil and catch some oil with an oil test kit then send it off to the lab to be tested. when the results come back if it tests clean its probably good. no fluids, out of bike, off ebay or something: disassemble the engine and examine the crank and bearings, valves and seats, pistons, cams, the trans, do ohms checks on the stator and pickup coils, check the oil pump and all the seals. make sure nothing is bent (crank, rods, trans shafts or forks) if everything looks good, reassemble. otherwise replace or fix whats broken or toss it aside for spare parts in the future. __________________________________________________
	1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.

August 25th, 2013, 04:58 PM	#35
ninja_thresh_hold ninjette.org ********* Name: Eric Location: Athens, Alabama Join Date: Jul 2011 Motorcycle(s): 2008 Kawasaki Ninja 250r (忍者 250r; sold!) 2001 zx6r Posts: 347	ended up gettinga zx6r instead __________________________________________________

August 25th, 2013, 07:57 PM	#36
ChickenRun ninjette.org member Name: Brandon Location: Orlando, FL Join Date: Apr 2013 Motorcycle(s): 2010 250r SE (without stupid tribal decals) Posts: 110	Awww quitter __________________________________________________ "It sounds like a lawnmower." "Shut up no it doesn't."

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