Question regarding Oil and longevity...

[Advincula]

Hey all,

I'm not sure where to put this because the particular bike in question is a Yamaha R6, so I placed it here. Please move it if it's not meant to be here, thank you!

Context time: My girlfriend owns a 2004(?) Yamaha R6 with about 8,000 miles on it - 4,000 being hers. She bought it about June of last year. Here's the problem: She hasn't changed the oil on that thing since (EDIT: I'm not even sure if the oil was brand new when she purchased it). As of now, the same oil has been in that engine for at least 15 months. I've already lectured her heavily on the necessity of keeping such a high revving engine properly lubricated (or any engine, for that matter) and the irresponsibility of riding a mechanically compromised motorcycle (potential danger to herself, others around her).

My question is: What kind of problems should I look out for? I've read that the piston rings need proper lubrication during the break-in period of the engine to develop good seals, and that in extreme situations you can blow a piston from lack of lubrication, but that's all I really learned from research. Should I be on the lookout for advanced wear? Damage to the rings/rods/block?

I just want to be accurate in knowing exactly what issues that can arise from having such old oil in a relatively new engine like that, and so I can pass on that knowledge for the sake of safety for our hobby.

Thank you for your help!

[Bigballsofpaint]

I think you should do an oil change on it and then keep riding it....

[jkv45]

You aren't going to notice much by running bad/old oil. Frankly, it's hardly worth fretting about at this point - just change the oil!

If cost is a big factor, use Shell Rotella T6 5W-40. If not, there are a lot of good cycle-specific synthetic oil choices. With an engine of that type, good oil is important (it's important for any engine IMO).

It's up to her, but if you are a good boyfriend you will help round-up the necessary items (oil/filter) and schedule a deadline for her to do it (with your help of course).

Simple basic maintenance. Just like checking tire pressure, adjusting the chain, checking other fluids, etc...all of which may need attention at the same time.

[Advincula]

Will do! Thank you for your quick responses; I just wanted to be sure of what we were looking at. Perhaps I overestimated the potential damage.

Safe riding, everyone!

[dcj13]

The lubrication and bike maintenance recommendations in this thread are sound.

The relationship advice, however, is unwise. I recommend you avoid lecturing, deadlines, and ultimatums. Make this a bonding/teamwork experience! Best of luck.

[csmith12]

There are a few r6 riders here that are very active, me being one of them.

Change the oil/filter
optional - Save a sample to send in to analysis if you want
Do the other normal scheduled maintenance before it causes other more expensive problems

If she has any interest, have her help you do the work yourself. If not... just take care of it yourself.

[csmith12]

Also, 4k miles on a good quality synthetic oil isn't that big of a deal, unless you're riding track/racing, or they're really, really hard miles such as start and stop city traffic. $25 oil changes as needed is cheap engine insurance imho.

[SLOWn60]

Originally Posted by dcj13

The lubrication and bike maintenance recommendations in this thread are sound.

The relationship advice, however, is unwise. I recommend you avoid lecturing, deadlines, and ultimatums. Make this a bonding/teamwork experience! Best of luck.

So true! NEVER demand of your significant other an oil change or anything else! Instead; your actions, words and attitude should create an atmosphere where it becomes something they want to do regularly!

[choneofakind]

uh... just change the oil regularly from here on out? Maybe keep an eye on the odometer from time to time since she doesn't seem to know that she needs to?

while you're at it, check her car. 3,000 miles on my motorcycle is normal, I see no reason to panic about 4,000 miles. The car gets oil changes every 5,000 miles, but I've let it go to 6,500 miles before. No biggie.

here's the great thing. Any oil is better than no oil!

[xXecuterXx2]

Originally Posted by csmith12

Also, 4k miles on a good quality synthetic oil isn't that big of a deal, unless you're riding track/racing, or they're really, really hard miles such as start and stop city traffic. $25 oil changes as needed is cheap engine insurance imho.

^^^ +1 homie

[Motofool]

Originally Posted by Advincula

....... My question is: What kind of problems should I look out for? I've read that the piston rings need proper lubrication during the break-in period of the engine to develop good seals, and that in extreme situations you can blow a piston from lack of lubrication, but that's all I really learned from research. Should I be on the lookout for advanced wear? Damage to the rings/rods/block?

The wear of the engine happens during start ups, when not enough pressure of oil keeps moving metal parts separated.
Short trips at relatively low speeds and frequent start ups can kill any engine many times faster than old oil.

The lubrication system is fed by a pump; hence, as long as there is enough oil level in the crankcase for that pump to suck it up, oil will flow onto all intended parts (even if the filter is too dirty and clogged, because there is a built-in by-pass).

Besides accumulated dirt and carbon from combustion, other potential risk is decomposition of oil due to high temperatures and contamination with gasoline or coolant.

Please, read this:
http://faq.ninja250.org/wiki/Why_Synthetic_Oil%3F

These engines will assertively let you know when lubrication has been deficient, even for short periods of time: they can be either properly lubricated or blown apart.

[cadd]

making a mountain out of a molehill. If you're really concerned, order a testing kit from Blackstone Laboratories. They'll send it to you free of charge.

Collect a sample of the oil when you (make your gf) do the oil change, and send it in. It's not expensive at all. They will email you a nice report telling you all about the oil that was in the bike.

[jkv45]

Originally Posted by cadd

making a mountain out of a molehill. If you're really concerned, order a testing of the from Blackstone Laboratories. They'll send it to you free of charge.

I agree - not that big of a deal - and what are you going to do about it anyway?

I'm personally very concerned about the oil type and condition of the oil in my cycles. I don't hesitate to run them up to redline any time without concern.

I guess I don't really get the Used Oil Analysis (UOA) thing. What are you going to do if it's bad news, but the engine still runs well - pull it apart? I'd rather spend the cost of the test ($25) on top-notch oil.

[Brother Michigan]

Originally Posted by cadd

If you're really concerned, order a testing of the from Blackstone Laboratories. They'll send it to you free of charge.

Collect a sample of the oil when you (make your gf) do the oil change, and send it in. It's not expensive at all. They will email you a nice report telling you all about the oil that was in the bike.

This. I test the oil in my cars regularly just to keep up with what's going on with all those expensive bits inside.

[InvisiBill]

Originally Posted by jkv45

I guess I don't really get the Used Oil Analysis (UOA) thing. What are you going to do if it's bad news, but the engine still runs well - pull it apart? I'd rather spend the cost of the test ($25) on top-notch oil.

Yeah, right now it's pretty pointless to do the UOA, unless you're willing to rebuild the engine based on bad results. It would help point out if there's unusual wear or anything like that, but there's not really anything you can do about it. It's simply after-the-fact data. If the results are bad enough that you'd be willing to rebuild it, the problems should be evident in standard operation of the engine without paying for any special tests.

Ideally, you'd do UOAs as frequently as possible when you first get the bike, to get an idea of how quickly the oil wears and to see what's "normal" for your particular engine. Once the pattern is established, you can use that data to establish your maintenance routine and just do occasional UOA spot-checks to make sure nothing weird is going on.

Originally Posted by http://www.calsci.com/motorcycleinfo/Oils1.html

Here's the truth: modern Japanese engines are amazingly well engineered and can tolerate a surprising amount of abuse.

Your engine will not explode if you use Spiffo-Magic Superlube for 4,000 miles. Your engine will not explode if you never use synthetic oils. However, any of these choices puts additional strain on your engine.

Your engine now has a little extra wear on it. It'll probably only last 99,000 miles instead of 100,000. Like everyone else said, don't worry about it, just keep up on maintenance from now on.