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Old November 21st, 2017, 12:22 AM   #1
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el cheapo muffler from ali #2

Inspired by Michael's thread: https://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=298242
I ordered TWO of these mufflers; for my street-bike and race-bike. I found some coupons and combined with their 11.11 special, price for muffler was U$11.24/ea !!! DHL fast shipping brought total to $58, wow!!!

Packaged arrived safely with usual plastic-bag wrapper. Thin cardboard box inside was beaten, however, they taped extra foam on ends.



Contents very well packed in foam and muffler itself had additional foam condom for extra protection!



Fit and finish is exquisite! Carbon had flawlessly smooth gel-coat.



I can't find any way they can improve this product! Very impressive!!!
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Old November 21st, 2017, 12:40 AM   #2
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Now reason I wanted to replace muffler on racebike was to preserve my Laguna Seca elbow.



Tyga wouldn't sell me just the end-cap alone so I can switch out the elbow easily and I didn't want to chop it off and weld it back on each time. So I thought about getting Tyga's carbon-fiber muffler to swap. But they wouldn't tell how much it weighed, so bah! I'll just get the Ali one.

The Ali muffler weighs 1.39kg without noise-insert compare to 1.62kg for Tyga w/Laguna Seca elbow. Without the elbow, they're probably similar. The Ali muffler has thicker gauge tubing and the conical end-cap trades off lightweight functionality for some concession to aesthetics.



The noise insert weighs 0.09kg. I'll run my race-bike without it and use it on street bike.



I won't have time to install until this weekend. Need to weld on the loops for springs on street bike and weld on a stopper-ring on the race bike.
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Old November 21st, 2017, 05:36 AM   #3
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And of course we are all waiting on sound clips
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Old November 21st, 2017, 06:09 AM   #4
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You won't need your laguna seca elbow with the insert in the muffler, i have a similar one and the baffle keeps it pretty quiet.
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Old November 21st, 2017, 07:23 AM   #5
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I put the same exhaust on my bike, also with the Akrapovic decal, but something I note is that the Ninja lost some power, because with the stock exhaust, the bike could pass the 100km without any problem, and now if I want to pass the 100km I need to accelerate a little more
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Old November 21st, 2017, 10:03 AM   #6
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I put the same exhaust on my bike, also with the Akrapovic decal, but something I note is that the Ninja lost some power, because with the stock exhaust, the bike could pass the 100km without any problem, and now if I want to pass the 100km I need to accelerate a little more
I wouldnt be surprised if you need to jet it, if you already havent done so. Even if they say no need to jet you cant account that it will be true for every single bike across the board
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Old November 21st, 2017, 10:24 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darksik View Post
I put the same exhaust on my bike, also with the Akrapovic decal, but something I note is that the Ninja lost some power, because with the stock exhaust, the bike could pass the 100km without any problem, and now if I want to pass the 100km I need to accelerate a little more
What RPM-range are you using to accelerate?

Given the larger diameter tubing and shorter length, I suspect this muffler would enhance high-RPM flow, but may lose some mid-range. Similar to what happened with the Tyga when I installed it. This makes the lean low-end worse, while matching the too-rich factory top-end perfectly. I got a 5-8% power-increase with no re-jetting needed. Off-idle and mid-range had more stumbling. I added more low-end fuel by turning out pilot-screws 0.5 turns.
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Old November 21st, 2017, 10:58 AM   #8
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I wouldnt be surprised if you need to jet it, if you already havent done so. Even if they say no need to jet you cant account that it will be true for every single bike across the board
My bike don't have the jetting, i think if i put that will consume more gasoline

Quote:
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What RPM-range are you using to accelerate?


Given the larger diameter tubing and shorter length, I suspect this muffler would enhance high-RPM flow, but may lose some mid-range. Similar to what happened with the Tyga when I installed it. This makes the lean low-end worse, while matching the too-rich factory top-end perfectly. I got a 5-8% power-increase with no re-jetting needed. Off-idle and mid-range had more stumbling. I added more low-end fuel by turning out pilot-screws 0.5 turns.
I don't understand why you refer to rpm-range used to acelerate
Well i remove the db killer, because i like how it sounds, but today i will try to ride with the db killer to see if the bike feels something good
also what does that work if you turn out the pilot screws?
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Old November 21st, 2017, 11:09 AM   #9
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When you accelerate to 100kph, does engine go to 9000rpm, shift, rev from 7000 to 9000rpm, shift, 8000-> 9000rpm?
Or do you rev to 13000rpm, shift, rev 11000 to 13000rpm, shift, 11500 to 13000rpm?

The mid-range RPMs tend to be lazy with exhaust upgrade due to being lean (not enough fuel). While too-rich factory top-end high-RPM is perfect with extra air-flow. With carbs, you have to remove them from bike, disassemble and drill out the pilot-screw plugs and screw pilots all the way in and back out 3-turns. Maybe even shim the needles with a washer or two. Then re-install carbs, making sure you get all the hoses connected properly. Then if that adjustment isn't perfect, you pull the carbs again and make some more changes. Then re-assemble.

With EFI, you can fix so both mid-range and high-RPM is perfect with 5 mouse-clicks and you're done in 30-seconds.

Last futzed with by DannoXYZ; November 21st, 2017 at 12:40 PM.
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Old November 21st, 2017, 02:52 PM   #10
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You need back pressure, I was running a straight pipe, switched to a can and picked up 5 mph on the straights at Chuckwalla.
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Old November 21st, 2017, 03:35 PM   #11
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Yeah, back-pressure... old term. They're using pulse-tuning now as pressure is not constant in exhaust.
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Old November 21st, 2017, 07:48 PM   #12
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Link to original page on YouTube.

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Old November 21st, 2017, 10:34 PM   #13
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great write up jac! yes the world is finally tuning in to el cheapo! interesting fuel info. with pods and a factory pro kit i had to go clip 4 as 3 had the mid lean stumble. i have the 40 pilots in and have tried them on the rich side but found the bike liked it semi lean(slight pop on downshift)low end more responsive. i currently have the 112's in but might try the 110's again. i have researched many threads that mention max power tapers off at 10,500 to 11,000.then why tune to redline if power is not there? air/fuel gauge coming to as el cheapo system has o2 bung welded in. currently at 40 mpg. i like it with the baffle in. it's just way to loud for daily driving.
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Old November 22nd, 2017, 02:03 AM   #14
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Awesome thanks. So we get:

34,4/18,9 HP/tq factory stock
36,7/19,2 HP/tq Yosh, stock map
38,0/ HP/tq Yosh, tuned map
38,4/ HP/tq Yosh, tuned map w/noise-insert

There's been shift in tuning market where customers are making decisions without adequate background knowledge. People think that bigger pipes is better (which it's not) and aftermarket upgrade suppliers have no choice but to create non-optimized products or lose sales.

I just measured exhaust outlet of my Tyga where it goes into muffler and it's a massive 42mm!!! Plug that into various exhaust calculators and you get sufficient flow-rate for 100bhp!!! No wonder a straight pipe of that size loses power, the pulses and pressure-waves coming back along the edge of pipe of that size would be optimized for 50000 RPM with 250cc engine. Adding some restriction with muffler to slow down pulses and changes optimum scavenging RPM to more reasonable 11000 RPMs.

Ali muffler I got has 51mm inlet and is listed as being useable on a ZX14 with 192 hp!!! So yeah, it's way too big and needs to be clamped down for a 250's flow-rate.
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Old November 22nd, 2017, 02:30 AM   #15
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I had some extra time tonight and figured I'd install Ali muffler on my street bike first. Very first mod of bone-stock bike!!!



Measured factory exhaust-outlet at 35,0mm and cone-adapter ID of 37,5mm. So that leaves a 1,25mm gap all the way around... hmmm...



Installing wrap-around clamp on factory bolt.



Due to on-axis inlet of Ali muffler vs. offset & angled inlet of factory muffler, there's bend and gap at cone-adapter.



Inside clearance is close with 8mm gap, shouldn't be a problem though.



And the moment you've all been waiting for! Let's fire it up!!!

Link to original page on YouTube.

It's louder than I'd like for street-bike, even with noise-insert. There's extra noise from the leak at the muffler-inlet. I think I'll weld up a split-tube to that cone-adapter so I can clamp it down on factory outlet.

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Old November 22nd, 2017, 03:52 AM   #16
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I had some extra time tonight and figured I'd install Ali muffler on my street bike first. Very first mod of bone-stock bike!!!



Measured factory exhaust-outlet at 35,0mm and cone-adapter ID of 37,5mm. So that leaves a 1,25mm gap all the way around... hmmm...



Installing wrap-around clamp on factory bolt.



Due to on-axis inlet of Ali muffler vs. offset & angled inlet of factory muffler, there's bend and gap at cone-adapter.



Inside clearance is close with 8mm gap, shouldn't be a problem though.



And the moment you've all been waiting for! Let's fire it up!!!

Link to original page on YouTube.

It's louder than I'd like for street-bike, even with noise-insert. There's extra noise from the leak at the muffler-inlet. I think I'll weld up a split-tube to that cone-adapter so I can clamp it down on factory outlet.

Sounds very nice to me.

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Old November 22nd, 2017, 05:37 PM   #17
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great
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Old December 4th, 2017, 11:19 PM   #18
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Here’s video of cold-start. You can see almost as much steam coming out muffler-to-exhaust joint as there’s coming out the end! Hahahahha!!!!

Link to original page on YouTube.

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Old December 4th, 2017, 11:39 PM   #19
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As noted previously, mid-range lean-mixtures got worse with the extra flow. Cruising in and between commuter traffic in the 5000-8000rpm range has more stumbling and jerkiness. Acceleration was also slower in this range.

However, it leaned out the too-rich top-end and the bike just absolutely SCREAMS between 10000-13000rpms. Not as fast as my race-bike with 20% increase with full Tyga system, but certainly 8-10% more top-end.

This weekend perhaps, I'll pull the carbs and give it other 1/4-turn out on the pilots and maybe shim needles washer or two. Also remove the noise insert and see if it runs better or worse. I suspect that even with 51mm inlet, the sudden transition steps and sharp edges inside the muffler hampers flow compared to Tyga or Yosh mufflers. It might actually flow without insert similar to those systems with insert.

Last futzed with by DannoXYZ; December 6th, 2017 at 04:34 PM.
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Old December 5th, 2017, 05:50 AM   #20
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This is most cool JacRyan... I was considering the exact thing later down the road on this project I have. Right not I have a really old Yosh (90ish) canister. Figure when it's happier, I'd try one of those pipes. Thanks for posting yours!
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Old March 6th, 2018, 12:58 AM   #21
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I sold off my street-bike before Christmas, but kept muffler for race-bike with Tyga full exhaust. Here's how I fitted it. Note the cone-adapter inlet is smaller and won't slide over exhaust tubing (which is larger than factory size by 7,5mm).



I cut off about 8mm from tip of cone.



I made cut not quite enough so cone still doesn't fit over exhaust tubing. Then I reamed out inside of cone with Dremel grinding stone to make inside of tip parallel to give more surface area touching exhaust pipe to seal.



Very tight fit over exhaust. I clamped the muffler body with hanger bracket before I installed springs. Didn't want them pulling muffler on too far. When I have time, I'll weld a stopper ring onto exhaust.

Also note that the Tyga exhaust has bend in pipe just ahead of muffler. This allows the pipe to entre muffler centered and on-axis. Compared to cockeyed connection to factory exhaust which has the bend on muffler instead.
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Old June 5th, 2018, 02:01 PM   #22
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Ok, after 3-months of abuse (3 race-weekends and 17 track-days = 25 days total), wear and tear is starting to show on the Ali El Cheapo muffler! Carbon-like overlay is burning off at entrance of muffler and rubber sleeve around clamp is melting! Thanks to Maverick for the Akra sticker!



I should've packed muffler with ceramic material beforehand. Would've diffused incoming hot-exhaust and may have extended survival time. I'm going to track down other muffler on street bike and pack it to see how long it lasts. Other half of packing material goes into my Laguna Seca special. I really don't like loud exhausts!

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Old February 15th, 2019, 07:40 AM   #23
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i went 8.5 mm on my cut. dremel with stone is the key. when you start, your adapter should not fit. carefully remove inside near taper till it fits snug. you have use a hose clamp as a stop or the adapter will keep going fwd. works great!
thanx danno


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Old February 15th, 2019, 02:15 PM   #24
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Glad you got it all to fit! Any photos?

On side-note, I got meatballed for noise at Laguna Seca last June at 92db with el-cheapo muffler with noise-insert!!! Most of time, I hug left side of track after T-5 going up hill with no problems (sound booth is on right). But this one time, I went up right side to pass pack of 5 slowpokes and that threw me over noise limit.

Luckily, I had my previous Tyga muffler with elbow in spares box. Threw that on, had it inspected and signed off. Then I was back on track in just 2-minutes.
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Old February 16th, 2019, 02:01 AM   #25
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Old February 16th, 2019, 07:52 AM   #26
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Looks very nice!
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Old February 16th, 2019, 10:26 AM   #27
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Looks very nice!
many thanx friend. can’t wait to see el cheapos on pregen. actually you might be the first.
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