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Old December 2nd, 2011, 12:40 PM   #41
Socal5646
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last ditch effort....

you said it yourself...you connected your volt meters + terminal to a (+) source and the negative terminal to the neutral lead you used and it read 12V....right? Well if that neutral terminal is (+) like you say, you would have been connecting your volt meter to two (2) positive (+) terminals and got a reading of 12v???!
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Old December 2nd, 2011, 08:55 PM   #42
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They are not the same. I grounded the multimeter to the frame and tested the wire that my neutral input is spliced into. And got 11.86 volts. That being said, the signal that illuminates the neutral light, thus activating the neutral reading on the indicator is in fact, a positive signal. At least it is for the Ninja 250r. Being that this DIY was specifically written for the Ninja 250r, thats how it works.


Edit: fixed repetitive sentence. I'm tired. Worked a 12 hour shift today...
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Old December 2nd, 2011, 09:03 PM   #43
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Originally Posted by Socal5646 View Post
last ditch effort....

you said it yourself...you connected your volt meters + terminal to a (+) source and the negative terminal to the neutral lead you used and it read 12V....right? Well if that neutral terminal is (+) like you say, you would have been connecting your volt meter to two (2) positive (+) terminals and got a reading of 12v???!
I believe we've got a bit of a miscommunication here.
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Old December 3rd, 2011, 12:30 AM   #44
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lol
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Old December 3rd, 2011, 12:41 AM   #45
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For anyone else doing this mod....forget the whole positive negative thing and just connect the white wire to the ONLY neutral indicator lead in the back of your cluster and you'll be fine.

P.S. OP ...Even IF Kawasaki decided to make that lead (+) for the 250 when its (-) on every other bike they make (zx6r, 650ern, 650r, versys...etc) A POSITIVE SIGNAL WILL NOT RESET THE COUNTER!
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Old December 5th, 2011, 05:23 PM   #46
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I just about have mine dialed in... for now. I haven't caught it missing an up shift, or a down shift, with the exception of occasionally not reading 1. That's not that big a deal though if it works as consistently as it is at the moment.

There are two things I found:
1) The magnet really does need to be parallel to the switches. Although perpendicular can work, I believe I had a lot of problems with it because it wasn't covering the length of the switch with it's magnetic pull... so theoretically if the switch was most sensitive in the middle, but the end of the magnet was positioned toward the bottom of the switch, it wouldn't work as well.
2) Hot glue may be fine for getting it to work, but it doesn't like to stick well to smooth metal surfaces, especially after a cold night. In the meantime, I added extra glue on the edges to hold it down, and will figure out another solution, should the need arise. I found movements less than 1mm were enough to screw it up, so I don't want to touch it if I don't have to.
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Old April 10th, 2012, 08:17 PM   #47
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Neutral doesnt do anything.

I connected the white cable to my neutral light and nothing happened. That is, I connected it to BOTH of the cables leading to the neutral light. And in both cases the neutral input did nothing. What am i doing wrong?
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Old April 10th, 2012, 08:24 PM   #48
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I connected the white cable to my neutral light and nothing happened. That is, I connected it to BOTH of the cables leading to the neutral light. And in both cases the neutral input did nothing. What am i doing wrong?
Mine was hooked up to the positive input on the neutral light. Make sure you are getting a good, solid connection.

Those wires are tiny, so be sure that the white wire isn't broken within the wiring harness.
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Old April 10th, 2012, 08:32 PM   #49
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Neutral doesnt do anything.

Thanks for such a quick reply. I soldered mine on so from what I can see it is making a good connection. The battery on my bike has gone dead now with all the times ive been testing the neutral link.
Pisses me off. Im thinking that you are right about the wire being thin and weak. Maybe it has broken somewhere else along the cable.
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Old April 10th, 2012, 08:40 PM   #50
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Thanks for such a quick reply. I soldered mine on so from what I can see it is making a good connection. The battery on my bike has gone dead now with all the times ive been testing the neutral link.
Pisses me off. Im thinking that you are right about the wire being thin and weak. Maybe it has broken somewhere else along the cable.
I would contact the seller and see about getting a replacement unit. Sounds like you may have gotten a defective one.
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Old September 16th, 2012, 12:32 PM   #51
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ride a weestrom....

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*Sigh* It is a little better, but still can jump, although not as bad. The funny thing is it worked fine for the middle of my ride to work, but was buggy at the beginning and the end. If it were programed to stop at 6 it would help. It can get to 8, I down shift, and I'm in 7th.... frustrating. Although I like my current method of mounting the sensor/switches, I may just move it to the shift linkage bar like you have it, Josh.
I lamented the lack of a gear indicator on the weestrom when i got it, especially for the first 6 months or so. I am so used to counting up and downshifts now, i dont feel like anything's missing on the ninjette. Ymmv :-)
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Old September 16th, 2012, 12:59 PM   #52
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I find the included switch/sensors and magnets are EXTREMELY sensitive, and difficult to setup. Mine is working, but can still give me issues. It doesn't always read first, and recently has missed a couple downshifts. Yet, when moving, it can change if I bump the shift lever with my foot. I found less than 1mm makes a difference in setting the sensors, which is VERY frustrating, especially since you really can't adequately test it on a stand. I'm considering replacing the magnetic switches with mechanical ones. I'm assuming they are NC switches, but a multimeter would verify this.

I'd love to see pics of the various solutions you all have come up with.
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Old October 31st, 2012, 11:16 AM   #53
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Gear indicator

Hi, guys i need help i dont know where to connect the white wire(neutral), i cant find it, where is located? I have zx636 06?
Thx in advance.
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Old October 31st, 2012, 01:09 PM   #54
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Hi, guys i need help i dont know where to connect the white wire(neutral), i cant find it, where is located? I have zx636 06?
Thx in advance.
Connect it to the N indicator lamp.
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Old May 5th, 2013, 02:19 AM   #55
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Updated thread with some useful info

Wow - thread revival!

My friend just bought a Ninja 300 & I was envious of the GI Pro gear indicator that he installed - as simple as connecting a single plug under the seat .

It got me thinking about my little ol' Ninja 250 and previous success with GPIs as shown on this thread. I bought one of these EBay GPIs for $20 and started to look at alternative ways to wire it as I really didn't want to access the neutral light wire under the instrument panel & cut the device halfway along for this.

Thankfully I can report there IS an easier way of wiring this little device where you do NOT need to make any cuts into the wiring of the device - WIN! You do NOT need a multimeter or any real electrical knowledge for this - you just need to be able to solder well.

With the help of a workshop manual I was able to find the positive wire of the neutral switch. It's in a very accessible position just behind the idle adjustment knob on the left side of the bike. The side fairing does NOT need to be removed for this job. It is just behind the sidestand switch plug and I stripped it just a teency bit & soldered the white GPI wire here. I tapped into power from the licence plate light (using a red 3mm wire soldered to GPI red wire) & grounded the whole thing (using a 3mm black wire soldered to GPI black wire) to a lug underneath one of the fuel tank holder bolts.

With the help of my electrician Father (very useful and indeed soldering expert!!) every join was heat shrunk & then hidden away nicely. Testing the device was successful & we just have to finalize the whole setup by mounting the display, sensors & magnet (semi) permanently - something we didn't quite have time for today. The wires of the sensors were wrapped in a section of 3mm silicone hosing - cut lengthway along the section with small scissors - and then wrapped in electrical tape. It all looks factory stock.

This is a MUCH easier & elegant way of doing this mod for a number of reasons - there is minimal bodywork removal & no need to take a chance in tapping into the wiring halfway along the device.

See what you think & I'll have final pictures soon......

Hope you like it
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Old May 5th, 2013, 08:34 AM   #56
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Old May 5th, 2013, 03:16 PM   #57
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Thanks for the write-up. Well done.
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Old May 6th, 2013, 01:09 PM   #58
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I notice that some of you are having difficulty getting the switches to count up and down. The switch housing looks like they hold reed switches (small glass capsules with a switch inside). I have to wonder if you could use a multimeter with a beep function to test the switch locations vs magnet location? Another suggestion might be to move the magnet as far down the shifter as possible. Too close to the gear selector shaft, and you won't get enough travel in the magnet.

Also, in looking on ebay, many of them count to 8, but if you look hard you can find one that counts to 6.
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Old May 6th, 2013, 03:37 PM   #59
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I notice that some of you are having difficulty getting the switches to count up and down. The switch housing looks like they hold reed switches (small glass capsules with a switch inside). I have to wonder if you could use a multimeter with a beep function to test the switch locations vs magnet location? Another suggestion might be to move the magnet as far down the shifter as possible. Too close to the gear selector shaft, and you won't get enough travel in the magnet.

Also, in looking on ebay, many of them count to 8, but if you look hard you can find one that counts to 6.
I'm not sure, but it sounds like a good idea. Mine goes to 7, but if it's opporating correctly I never see it. When I get glitches, I just rest with N at a light. One of the things that makes it difficult to get spacing right is there seems to be more travel in the shifter when in use vs. on stands. I've even tried running it on stands, which isn't as easy as it sounds and didn't ultimately get it right.... a lot of trial and error. I've been considering changing the type of switch for a while.
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Old December 6th, 2013, 01:55 AM   #60
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What do you mean by GPI?

Hello i am sorry i am new to this but what do you mean by GPI's and where on ebay did you buy it?
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Old December 6th, 2013, 02:16 AM   #61
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Hello i am sorry i am new to this but what do you mean by GPI's and where on ebay did you buy it?
Gear Position Indicator?
I don't know, gotta do an ebay search.
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Old April 26th, 2014, 03:52 PM   #62
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More info

Thanks to all the people who have posted advice here about installing the ebay gear indicator (GI). I couldn’t find much detail elsewhere, so although I have a CRF it has been very helpful. I thought I would also share my experience so it may help others.

I never thought a GI would be useful until after 30 years I rode a bike with a factory version (A little 2005 Suzuki EN125). I found it very useful. It’s surprising the number of times I was wondering what gear I was in, and not having to count, or keep changing until the gears stopped, seemed much more civilized. It wasn’t any more distracting than a speedometer or tachometer.

So with my CRF230 being a six -speed, I purchased the $20 ebay version. After reading the difficulties noted in the posts here, I wanted to have as many adjustment parameters as possible to set up the magnet and sensor.

Here’s my attempt to explain my 'home brew' installation. I’ve left out some parts that are covered by other posters. It may look a bit 'Backyard' but it works.

Using a single point on the frame I screwed two thin strips of metal about 70mm by 10mm. My single point was a threaded nut that was originally intended to attach a bash plate. Now I had something that looked a bit like the hands of a clock (at about 3:05 in my case). They could be moved up and down as a pair, and moved apart or together as needed (about 15mm in my case). Tightening and loosening the single bolt allowed for adjustment.

Onto the end of each strip I screwed a sensor. I used a small bolt in just one of the holes of each so these could also have temporary movement.

Now for the magnet. I wanted adjustment in three dimensions, the x, y and z planes. I wanted vertical positioning as well as total travel across the sensors. I also wanted to be able to vary the horizontal distance from the magnet to the plane of the ‘hands of the clock’. My cunning plan was to use a simple hoseclip.

I removed the foot gear lever and placed a large hoseclip over the spline. I could vary the horizontal distance from the magnets by moving the hoseclip along the spline (about 5mm separation in my case). I screwed up the hoseclip tight and used the long ‘tail’ as an arm holder for the magnet. This is why you need a large one. By using a couple of pairs of pliers and forming the tail into an ‘L’ cross section, this created a little ledge for the magnet, which could slide along but was stuck firmly with its own magnetism. I didn’t even remove the plastic bag it came in to aid adjustment. The hoseclip can be adjusted for vertical movement and the magnet slid along to find the perfect spot.

With so much adjustment it was a breeze to find the perfect combinations, and so it works perfectly without any errors. A final tighten of the bolts, hoseclip and a few small dabs of adhesive fixed everything in place. However it could be readjusted easily if needed.

The only issue is the neutral. I can’t get it to work although it is useable without it. The white neutral wire should reset the counter to zero when it is connected to the (-) of the battery, ie the metal frame of the bike. The neutral light normally works by the switch connecting the (-) frame of the bike to the light. The other electrode of the light is permanently connected to the (+) of the battery.

However, on my CRF, when the switch makes the connection between the frame to the neutral light, there still seems a resistance of about 20k ohm, which is not enough to reset the counter. Everything else is OK, touching the white neutral wire directly to the frame resets the counter to zero which is a good check for both the wiring and the unit. Has anyone else come across this problem? Maybe there is a resistor somewhere attached to the neutral switch?

In any case, you can live without neutral indication. The time it is useful is when you have stopped. Without it, putting the bike into neutral from first at a stop, shows ‘2’. However as soon as you re-engage first, it shows ‘1’ again and you are good to go.

Hope this is helpful to someone.

Cheers

John
===================

Update:

After getting a CRF wiring diagram I found that the neutral connection passes through a diode. This is why the resistance was high. The diode was behind the headlight, almost beside the neutral light. A easy five minute transfer of wires and problem solved. This may be something to check if you can't get the neutral working on some bikes.
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Old June 23rd, 2014, 10:20 AM   #63
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THREAD REVIVAL!! Yay!

I just ordered the same Universal GPI found in this thread, so I want to thank in advance the folks that posted here with DIY intructions, pics and vids. This will certainly make the install easier when the parts come in.

For 20$, I think this is great little add-on that will make the wife happy.
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Old June 23rd, 2014, 12:28 PM   #64
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Update:

After getting a CRF wiring diagram I found that the neutral connection passes through a diode. This is why the resistance was high. The diode was behind the headlight, almost beside the neutral light. A easy five minute transfer of wires and problem solved. This may be something to check if you can't get the neutral working on some bikes.
My N actually stopped working after a year or two of working fine. I haven't bothered to mess with it yet, but would you expect first a wiring issue or problem in the GI circuit?
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Old June 24th, 2014, 03:02 PM   #65
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“My N actually stopped working after a year or two of working fine. I haven't bothered to mess with it yet, but would you expect first a wiring issue or problem in the GI circuit?”

=================
Hi Bob

If the bike’s factory neutral indicator light also isn’t working, then it would appear that the bike’s sender switch is faulty.

Otherwise, it depends if the unit just shows a blank screen on neutral, displays N when shorted out, or misses out the N completely.

A test for the unit’s correct operation would be to touch a wire from the white GI terminal to the frame body as described in my earlier post. If it displays N, then your wiring such as the connection via the neutral light may be an issue? If a blank screen then I would think a faulty unit.

If you can get it to display N when shorted out on the frame; and if the N is always missed out when riding; and there is a good connection at the neutral light/diode; given how thin those wires are, you might want to check the white one for continuity.

Note that if people find adjustment difficult and can put up with not displaying neutral, disconnecting the neutral wire completely may make the unit less susceptible to errors.

Good luck.

John
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Old June 24th, 2014, 04:28 PM   #66
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There's a time and place for the ebay GI, which I have benifited from. For my Honda I decided to pony-up for the GIPro, which has been amazingly simple to install and configure. Yes, it will not work on the carb version ninjas, and it is pricy. My only wish is that it would display your gear when at a stop or when clutch is engaged, but that's not possible given the way it figures what gear you're in. It's been fun ebay, but I'm not looking back, LOL.

I may fix the glitch before I sell the bike though.
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Old July 9th, 2014, 01:07 PM   #67
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I'm assuming you guys bought your gear indicator from ebay? I've read some bad reviews about it on amazon. I wonder if there's an actual good indicator.
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Old July 9th, 2014, 01:11 PM   #68
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I'm assuming you guys bought your gear indicator from ebay? I've read some bad reviews about it on amazon. I wonder if there's an actual good indicator.
If you have the carb'ed version and want to do it on the cheap, then no. If you're willing to spend some money, yes. There is even a way to get some of the fancy ones to work on the carb'ed version.
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Old July 9th, 2014, 01:18 PM   #69
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If you have the carb'ed version and want to do it on the cheap, then no. If you're willing to spend some money, yes. There is even a way to get some of the fancy ones to work on the carb'ed version.
How expensive is expensive? Can you send me a link with one? I haven't found one with positive reviews yet.
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Old July 9th, 2014, 01:19 PM   #70
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@SlowBoyRacing may be able to hook you up with a really nice GI (and sensor kit if needed). I'm currently using the GIPro from Healtech. They are pretty similar as far as I can tell. Either way they aren't cheap, but IMO are worth it in the long run.
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Old July 9th, 2014, 01:26 PM   #71
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How expensive is expensive? Can you send me a link with one? I haven't found one with positive reviews yet.
I'll look it up... what year and bike?
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Old July 9th, 2014, 01:26 PM   #72
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Originally Posted by headshrink View Post
@SlowBoyRacing may be able to hook you up with a really nice GI (and sensor kit if needed). I'm currently using the GIPro from Healtech. They are pretty similar as far as I can tell. Either way they aren't cheap, but IMO are worth it in the long run.
I looked yours up. It has a premade plug. I'm hoping there's no cutting and re-wiring needed?
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Old July 9th, 2014, 04:26 PM   #73
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I looked yours up. It has a premade plug. I'm hoping there's no cutting and re-wiring needed?
I'm sorry, I forgot to specify that my GIPro is on my CBR, which is of course fuel injected, not my carb'ed Ninja. I've got the Ebay one on my Ninjette.

If you're referring to the Healtech GIPro, then it is just a plug (and harness). Most of the work is getting access to the top of the crankcase to plug in the harness. Programming was wayyyy easier than I expected.

Assuming you have a carb'ed Ninjette, you'll need some additional sensors and stuff to make it work. I know you'll need a speed sensor for the wheel, but don't know if their is more or not. It WILL be more involved than on a FI bike where you can just plug it in, more specifically a bike with an electronic speed sensor instead of a cable/gear driven speedo.
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Old July 9th, 2014, 05:49 PM   #74
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Oh my god, I really want to do this! Too bad i'm too much of a pansy to try such a thing...
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Old July 10th, 2014, 05:56 AM   #75
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I'm sorry, I forgot to specify that my GIPro is on my CBR, which is of course fuel injected, not my carb'ed Ninja. I've got the Ebay one on my Ninjette.

If you're referring to the Healtech GIPro, then it is just a plug (and harness). Most of the work is getting access to the top of the crankcase to plug in the harness. Programming was wayyyy easier than I expected.

Assuming you have a carb'ed Ninjette, you'll need some additional sensors and stuff to make it work. I know you'll need a speed sensor for the wheel, but don't know if their is more or not. It WILL be more involved than on a FI bike where you can just plug it in, more specifically a bike with an electronic speed sensor instead of a cable/gear driven speedo.
Sounds too frustrating, not hard. I'll just count the gears in my head.
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Old July 14th, 2014, 04:41 PM   #76
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Installed mine today.



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Old July 14th, 2014, 06:53 PM   #77
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Installed mine today.
How did you do the sensors?
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Old July 15th, 2014, 02:44 AM   #78
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How did you do the sensors?
Like CookieMonster in this thread: https://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=181653 (post #27)
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Old July 15th, 2014, 10:52 AM   #79
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I like how he mounted his display.
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Old July 15th, 2014, 11:07 AM   #80
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I like how he mounted his display.
So do I, but I didn't want to hack away at the body work for something that I may eventually just rip out of the bike.

I wired it like YouSnooze did, only splicing into the Neutral wire and the License plate light Positive. The rest is stand-alone and can all be removed with no trace of it ever being there, but the install is also clean enough to look "factory".

I spent the better part of the day yesterday installing it and tucking everything away.
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