Looking for some advice (commuter bike)

[Alchemist]

I'm trying to decide what direction to go re: a commuter bike with some substantial luggage capacity. A lot comes down to personal preference, but I'm just trying to get some thoughts/feedback/things-to-consider from those with a bit more experience on a variety of bikes

Background: I joined this site a few years ago, had a 1999 EX250 that eventually was more expensive to repair than replace (and I didn't have time for a "project bike"). A few years later I'm looking for a commuter bike, specifically with the ability to carry and secure a backpack with laptop/books. I can't bring it in to work before heading to school in the evening, so it needs to stay locked to the bike. The most practical solution I've come to is a bike with the ability to mount a large Givi top case. Most of the riding is highway (about 30 minutes) - a little bit of stoplight-to-stoplight, but the majority of the commute is by major highways.

The wife has also expressed an interest in something she can jump on the back of - I don't know how often that will actually happen, but something I need to keep in mind (kicks a lot of sport bikes out of the running). I'd also prefer something that can be put on a track, if only for training and practice.

I'm trying to stay under $3k for the project (ideally under $2500, but realize that there will be additional expenses that will creep in).

The options I'm considering are:

1) Go back to an EX250. SW Motech makes a luggage rack , as well as an adapter for Givi cases. I like the light weight and the ergos of the pregen, but occasionally wanted just a bit more power out of it. Additionally, while the adapter isn't terribly expensive the reviews are so-so. (NB: I'd go for an EX500 in a heartbeat if there were a way to mount a luggage rack - everything I've found comes up dry in that regard).

2) Newgen 250, 300, or CBR250 - main thing keeping me from this is that the used market is really thin, particularly for the 300, and the majority of the ads are "bike runs good" with a single photo. Additionally, wife is not a huge fan of the high passenger seat a lot of sport bikes have gone to in recent years.

3) Sport touring bikes - RxxxxRT, ST1100/1300, Kawasaki Concours, Ducati ST2/3/4, Triumph Sprint. The advantage is that many already have cases and are already set up to carry them (or parts are readily available to mount a topcase), the major disadvantage I'm seeing is that the weight, and most in my price range are high mileage - I'm still trying to feel out what the maintenance costs are for a bike (particularly a BMW) after 50,000 miles. I know they tolerate the mileage well, but if it's with a heavy price tag for specific parts...

4) I've been looking at some Honda Nighthawks (650/750cc) - they have my attention, as the standard ergos look good, the power is substantial, and the price is reasonable for most of them. The only disadvantage that I see is having to rely on the relationship between Givi's universal mount mating up with the standard "Weber grill" luggage rack. The weight is also a bit higher than I'm used to (albeit not as much as a sport tourer)...

5) Last but not least - cruisers (HD Sportster, V Star 650, Honda Shadow, etc). I'm not really opposed to them, and they may be the most comfortable (riding position-wise) taking on the highway. I'm not a huge fan of feet-forward controls, but could manage. The market is full of low-mileage/low-cost options. But mounting hard top cases to them is going to be a MacGyver operation, and limited - if any - ability to train on a track with it.

Like I said at the top, I'm not looking for anyone to tell me what the "right answer" is, just to get some thoughts/opinions.

[csmith12]

Considered the sv and kawi's 650 lines?

Less aggressive ergos
Good commuters
Good midrange torque
Does very well 2up
Can be modded pretty well for hard baggage
Very good on the track
In your price range $$$$

Me and my wife rode the Shadow for years before I got the HD bug. I wouldn't track one, but hey... I have coached full dress HD's on track and baggers too. Sure... they drug hard parts, but smiled just as big at the end of the day as the jap bike riders.

My wife and I has also done a few Sun. rides on the newgen 250. 300lbs is the stated weight limit of the 250, but meh... we broke that nearly 100lbs and did just fine in a group of 600s. There was no hard acceleration, but everything was just fine. You will want steel lines in the front, upgraded front springs and at least put the rear ramp preload at the highest setting for 2up riding on a 250. ijs

[Alchemist]

Originally Posted by csmith12

Considered the sv and kawi's 650 lines?

Less aggressive ergos
Good commuters
Good midrange torque
Does very well 2up
Can be modded pretty well for hard baggage
Very good on the track
In your price range $$$$

Me and my wife rode the Shadow for years before I got the HD bug. I wouldn't track one, but hey... I have coached full dress HD's on track and baggers too. Sure... they drug hard parts, but smiled just as big at the end of the day as the jap bike riders.

My wife and I has also done a few Sun. rides on the newgen 250. 300lbs is the stated weight limit of the 250, but meh... we broke that nearly 100lbs and did just fine in a group of 600s. There was no hard acceleration, but everything was just fine. You will want steel lines in the front, upgraded front springs and at least put the rear ramp preload at the highest setting for 2up riding on a 250. ijs

Fair point: The SV650 (and GS500) and Ninja 650 should have been mentioned; they're on the radar, I just haven't seen anything listed that's attention-worthy, but they are on the list.

We did some 2up on my last 250; I won't knock if for anyone else, but my experiences doing that stands as one of the reasons I'm hesitant to go back to one (and would prefer something with a bit more balls to it).

It wasn't often that my Ninja felt anemic, but a little more power would have been nice at times.

[jkv45]

Depending on how sporty you want to be, you might want to just go right to a V-Strom (or Versys). I have a naked SV, and it does just fine on the hwy, but it isn't going to give you any wind protection to speak of. Not really a problem, but if you want a similar bike that's more set-up for hwy riding, the Strom is pretty decent.

There's an '08 V-Strom ABS in my area right now with 47K on it for $2300. If maintained halfway decent they are going to go 100K just fine.

Enough power, moderate weight, but not a monster to wrestle around.

[Kestrel]

I use my '02 EX250 as a commuter. Approximately 40 miles round trip daily, mostly highway with a little mix of city.

I also have the SW Motech Rack w/ a 36L Givi Monokey box.

For reference, I've had the rack on the bike for approximately 12k miles, and rode 8k of that this past summer on a 4 week cross country trip. Has been rock solid with no issues whatsoever. Fits two helmets, or a backpack and stuff heaped on.

Overall, it has been a great bike. Good mileage, enough get up and go for commuting, cheaper tires and chain/sprocket wear, cheap insurance etc.

You can go two up with that setup, but it's going to be a little cramped, and not the fastest thing in the world. You *could* track it, too. I am running 17" EX500 wheels on mine with radials (fork and swingarm swaps), and good track tires are available if you do that. Even if you don't, Sport Demons and BT45s aren't that bad, either.

Weather protection isn't the best. A bigger bike will certainly be better in cooler weather. As you're in Ohio (Go Tribe ), I'll assume this is a 'better' weather commuter?

The Ninja WILL work. But plenty of other bikes will work too, with various disadvantages and advantages. You'll have to judge that for yourself...

[Alchemist]

Originally Posted by Kestrel

I use my '02 EX250 as a commuter. Approximately 40 miles round trip daily, mostly highway with a little mix of city.

I also have the SW Motech Rack w/ a 36L Givi Monokey box.

For reference, I've had the rack on the bike for approximately 12k miles, and rode 8k of that this past summer on a 4 week cross country trip. Has been rock solid with no issues whatsoever. Fits two helmets, or a backpack and stuff heaped on.

Overall, it has been a great bike. Good mileage, enough get up and go for commuting, cheaper tires and chain/sprocket wear, cheap insurance etc.

You can go two up with that setup, but it's going to be a little cramped, and not the fastest thing in the world. You *could* track it, too. I am running 17" EX500 wheels on mine with radials (fork and swingarm swaps), and good track tires are available if you do that. Even if you don't, Sport Demons and BT45s aren't that bad, either.

Weather protection isn't the best. A bigger bike will certainly be better in cooler weather. As you're in Ohio (Go Tribe ), I'll assume this is a 'better' weather commuter?

The Ninja WILL work. But plenty of other bikes will work too, with various disadvantages and advantages. You'll have to judge that for yourself...

Good to know, especially the bolded (that's the exact kind of insight I was hoping to glean from thread).

I plan on using this in better-ish weather. I'm from the northeast - I'm not opposed to cold, but I also know how quickly cold can turn dangerous if you can't do anything about it (doubly so when your dexterity is required for survival). I plan to ride into the later fall, but snow/ice/subzero temps are out.
I'll probably plan some short weekend rides when the temp drops to test gear within "recovery distance" of the house, so I can test in a safer environment (commute is about 30 minutes - don't want to be stuck out there trying to figure it out). I've been commuting via car for about a year now on the same route, so I'm not stuck with the bike in January if the weather sucks.

I've looked a bit at the V-Strom/Versys/F650 bikes - I'm a bit wary of them as I'm on the shorter side (30" inseam), and the Ninja was "just about right" in the seat-height arena. Seat height can also be counted as a "pro" for the cruisers (FWIW).

Thanks!

[tfkrocks]

I have a Ninja 300. I currently commute 50 miles round trip; about double that if I have evening plans. I have a Givi rack with a 47L top case which can carry a rather large backpack in transit and then hold either my helmet or jacket with gloves and overpants at my destination (caveat: I'm extremely small so obviously my gear is smaller. Can't guarantee your jacket would fit). I also use it in combination with tail bags for extra storage, which come with me when I leave the bike.

I would like hard side cases for holding all my gear on the bike at once but there's no ready-made hard side case solution for the Ninja 300 unfortunately. I don't know how much gear you may want to leave with the bike at any time so this might not be an issue for you.

I personally prefer commuting on a lower power bike, but that's just me. I've never feel like it's lacking in power. I'm not sure what the ranges are for the bigger bikes you're considering but the bigger bikes I've commuted on (FZ-09 and Street Triple R) only had a range of ~120miles vs the +200 miles of the Ninja 300. I really hate having to get gas so frequently. I also much prefer the high mpg and cheaper consumable parts of the Ninja 300.

No opinion on carrying a passenger as I don't intend to carry a passenger and have modified my bike so that I can't.

[CaliGrrl]

I can vouch for the pillion seat on a Triumph Sprint being pretty comfortable. Husband and I did a road trip to Death Valley and have done other smaller trips 2-up. Two side-cases and a topcase on the back will hold a lot of stuff.

[Kestrel]

Originally Posted by tfkrocks

I really hate having to get gas so frequently.

Deserves additional mention. With any substantial amount of miles per day, along with a small tank size, getting gas every other day gets .... really, really annoying. I speak from experience there, having commuted before on a bike that suffered in that way. On the Ninja 250 with its rather huge tank and good mileage, I'm only filling up once per week. That's nice.

If you can get over the idea of 'taking it to the track', I'd also really look into something like a newer Versys 650, or one of the 500cc Honda variations, or NC700 etc. All of those are fantastic commuters, can have good weather protection, great luggage options, more than adequate motor, still decent gas mileage... and.... can take two people fairly easily.

Don't take a super sport and use it as a commuter; that **** gets old when you're commuting 5 days per week, for months on end.

Think about the real mission of this bike, and purchase appropriately. Compromise too far in either direction, and it'll suck at its job.

[DannoXYZ]

You've had great suggestions for bikes; I don't have anything to add. I will expand on Kestrel's "take it to track" comment. Leave that out of your decision and chose based upon what you're spending most of your time doing. Unless you're buying sporting Ducati or Aprilia, there's very few bikes you can just "take to track" without extensive preparation and modifications. However, that only affects getting ultimate limit out of bike and going for fastest lap-times possible.

Most of enjoyment I've found is just taking any bike to track figuring out and riding it to its limits. Doesn't matter if it's Virago-250 or an Aprilia RSV4 Factory, they're all fun! Challenge for me is process of wringing its neck and getting maximum performance. Only difference will be lap-times, however, process and enjoyment for me is same.

[VaFish]

I'm going to throw something out here you haven't considered yet. (and I think you have done your homework pretty well)

What about a Maxi Scooter? Something like a used Suzuki Burgman. They have a huge storage compartment built in that will hold 2 full face helmets. With a 650 cc engine they will haul two people on the highway. You might even get your wife to ride it by her self since they have an automatic transmission. That would allow you to get another bike for yourself. Use the scooter for commuting and a sport bike for weekend runabout.

A search of Cycletrader shows a bunch of ~10 year old Burgman 400's with fairly low mileage for less than $3,000 asking price.

Also want to add, I have a 1997 883 Harley Sportster with the mid mount controls, it is not the feet forward position of most cruisers. Easy to find them in the $2,500 range. However if they have any storage on them it is usually just leather soft bags which are not lockable. Hard bags are an option, but not cheap. I commute on my almost daily in the summer, but I use a backpack and bring everything into the office.

["A"]

I have been commuting with my Burgman 650 maxi-scooter between NJ and NYC metro for the last year.

The advantage include the following:
1. Underseat compartment that can hold two full-face helmets without the need of external luggage allows vehicle width to be minimal.

2. Twist-n-go, clutch-less shifting, great to save hand/grip strength when traffic flow becomes bumper-to-bumper.

3. Low-to-ground engine/transmission allows very stable handling at all speeds when under engine power.
Maneuver under human power is somewhat cumbersome due to 600+ lb. weight.

4. Great for passenger comfort, large seating area with backrest, relaxed leg position.

I purchased my 07 Burgman 650 back in JUL 2016 with 8k mi. on odometer, $2.5K.

Prior to the Burgman, I commuted mostly with my 04 Ninja 250, though still great for its lightweight, small physical size for riding between car mirrors, the clutching/shifting gets old pretty fast once traffic slows down to a crawl.

Burgman 650 has plenty of acceleration to outpace 95% of 4-wheel vehicles from standstill, triple digit speed capable on the highway and rock solid at highway speed 90+mph.... which I do twice a week while traveling between PA and NY, 120 mi. one-way trip.



Oh, and that is a car tire mounted on the rear wheel.. $65 last over 30k mi. vs $140 scooter specific tire that only last 1/5 of mileage.

[DannoXYZ]

Really? Auto tyre? What size?

["A"]

Originally Posted by JacRyann

Really? Auto tyre? What size?

165/65-14



Same size winter ice/snow tire that I put on my previous Burgman 650, rode 14k mi. before selling it, tire was not even 1/2 worn:

[AwDang]

I'd go for a 90's/00's Nighthawk 750 personally. Stupid simple, nice ergo's, decent aftermarket....and CHEAP!!!!

BUT! Let me toss the Honda PC800 or Pacific Coast into the mix

["A"]

Originally Posted by AwDang

I'd go for a 90's/00's Nighthawk 750 personally. Stupid simple, nice ergo's, decent aftermarket....and CHEAP!!!!

Had commuted on a 2000 Nighthawk 750, too:



5-speed tranny require high engine rpm to stay at highway speed.

Air/oil-cooled engine is great in the winter to keep rider warm, but gets hot slow moving traffic.

Could really use dual front disc, or at least a floating front disc.

[Alchemist]

Originally Posted by Kestrel

Think about the real mission of this bike, and purchase appropriately. Compromise too far in either direction, and it'll suck at its job.

Been thinking about this a lot; I think there's a lot of wisdom in those words, and something I haven't been focused on enough in this.

One thing I've been kind of running up against - the requirement for mounting hardware and/or luggage rack is somewhat limiting, so I'm trying to find "outside the box" options that might be viable alternatives. Has anyone used anything by this company or a competitor? http://www.pacsafe.com/

[Kestrel]

In my experience, nothing beats having a lockable waterproof trunk.

If it's for a commuter, I'd strive to make a solution like that work, rather than go for soft luggage. There's really no comparison for day in day out usage.

[DannoXYZ]

Originally Posted by "A"

165/65-14

Same size winter ice/snow tire that I put on my previous Burgman 650, rode 14k mi. before selling it, tire was not even 1/2 worn:

That's awesome! I've seen this done on big bikes like Goldwings and Harleys for mileage. Never on scooter, but if you're commuting and putting on miles, why not? Very cool!

["A"]

Originally Posted by JacRyann

That's awesome! I've seen this done on big bikes like Goldwings and Harleys for mileage. Never on scooter, but if you're commuting and putting on miles, why not? Very cool!

Burgman 650 is a heavy scooter.. near 620 lb. wet, combined with smaller sized wheel, the tires on it gets worn rather quickly.

Usually a rear tire would only last 6-8k miles, front tire usually gets 8-9k miles.
The regular replacement scooter tires are $100-160 for the rear and $70-120 for the front.

Similar sized car tire is about $65-100, last for at least 20k miles.
$98 Winter snow/ice, non-studded tire are great for the Burgman.

I've also used tires for Polaris Spyder on the rear wheel of Burgman 650, and those are about $85 a piece.

Since car tires are designed to support vehicle that are much heavier, the application to the Burgman is not likely to exceed the stress limits of the car tire. I've gotten flats on car tires while riding the Burgman, screw in tire, still rode it 12 miles flat to get off the highway and another 3-4 miles to a gas station to get the tire plugged and back on the road for another 80 miles before replacing the car tire.

[Brother Michigan]

Using a car tire on a two-wheeled vehicle is incredibly stupid for a large number of reasons. If you can't afford to replace the proper tires at the proper interval, you probably shouldn't be riding anyhow.

["A"]

Originally Posted by Brother Michigan

Using a car tire on a two-wheeled vehicle is incredibly stupid for a large number of reasons. If you can't afford to replace the proper tires at the proper interval, you probably shouldn't be riding anyhow.

Speaking from zero experience in any topic is incredibly stupid.
You should stop that if you have zero experience in the topic.
Do not assume that car tire usage is because I cannot afford replacing tires.

I have been riding 2-wheel vehicles for over 20 years, over 3/4 million miles.
Over 30k miles on 2-wheel vehicles with car tire mounted on the rear wheel.

[Brother Michigan]

Originally Posted by "A"

Speaking from zero experience in any topic is incredibly stupid.
You should stop that if you have zero experience in the topic.
Do not assume that car tire usage is because I cannot afford replacing tires.

I have been riding 2-wheel vehicles for over 20 years, over 3/4 million miles.
Over 30k miles on 2-wheel vehicles with car tire mounted on the rear wheel.

The reason I assume you're cheap/can't afford it is because nobody of reasonable intelligence would do it otherwise. Obviously experience is not the same as wisdom.

["A"]

Originally Posted by Brother Michigan

The reason I assume you're cheap/can't afford it is because nobody of reasonable intelligence would do it otherwise. Obviously experience is not the same as wisdom.

Insulting me doesn't provide any support of your claim.
Failure to debate with evidence clearly demonstrate your level of intelligence.

Plenty of car tires have been mounted and ridden on motorcycles without problems. If you want to debate on the topic, go to a proper thread.

[Brother Michigan]

In a hobby where we advocate so much for taking personal responsibility for ones safety, I find it hilarious that you would question my intelligence while suggesting riders do something so unsafe.

Since you suggest I shouldn't debate this here (while also insulting me for not debating?), I will just leave you with this link:

http://ridermagazine.com/2016/05/20/...n-motorcycles/


Aaaaaand back on the ignore list you go! I keep giving you chances and you keep showing me how wrong I am for doing so!

["A"]

Originally Posted by Brother Michigan

In a hobby where we advocate so much for taking personal responsibility for ones safety, I find it hilarious that you would question my intelligence while suggesting riders do something so unsafe.

Treat motorcycling as a hobby is just the wrong mindset.
Motorcycles are not toys to be playing with.

Originally Posted by Brother Michigan

Since you suggest I shouldn't debate this here (while also insulting me for not debating?), I will just leave you with this link:

http://ridermagazine.com/2016/05/20/...n-motorcycles/

Nice article, zero testing were done with car tire mounted on 2-wheel vehicle, how does that validate as a comparison?
Without valid evidence, of course you wouldn't debate.

Originally Posted by Brother Michigan

Aaaaaand back on the ignore list you go! I keep giving you chances and you keep showing me how wrong I am for doing so!

Ignorance starts with ignore, your failure to try and understand dynamics of car tire usage and claim that it is unsafe for all motorcycling without providing any valid evidence.
No loss for me if you are too ignorant to even bother to learn something you have no clue.

[Alex]

Aaron (@Brother Michigan) - you have been reported for violating the TOS of the site, and I agree. Please keep the discussion on topic without resorting to personal attacks. There will be no additional warnings for any posters in this thread.

[CaliGrrl]

How does it feel to turn on that flat-faced car tire? Doesn't one normally replace a (round-faced) motorcycle tire when it gets that flat spot in the middle?

[Alex]

I've asked the same question, having ridden with a good number of folks that have made this modification, but have not ridden one myself. They uniformly say that there is much less difference overall than one would expect, but there is more resistance right at the beginning of turn-in. A front tire with a a flat profile, with harder sidewalls, I would imagine would make things quite weird quite quick. A flat rear tire profile, with soft sidewalls, evidently feels less weird.

[DannoXYZ]

Here's article from Road & Track - The greatest automotive advancement in history, and its heretics.

First, I completely agree with article about lower R&D and quality-control with motorcycle tyres compared to auto tyres. Well, consequences of tyre-failure on +4000-lb vehicle carrying family of 5 can be seriously severe. Compared to a dirty-hippie on 400-lb bike? Not even close.

Personally I've had more problems with motorcycle than auto tyres, especially bad considering I've got easily 10x more mileage on autos. My track 250 originally came with Dunlop GPR300 tyres, which seems to be similar to the Q2s I had on my CBR600RR. After my first day @ track for NRS class, I noticed centre tread tearing and chunking. Dunlop tyre-booth guy said, "must be cold-tears from too much braking too soon, heat it up on warmers first." and gave me discount on set of Alpha-13s. Hmmm... OK... Some BARFers recently reported similar street-riding tyre damage similar to me. I don't think heating up street-tyres with warmers should be required procedure just to go riding.

My buddy Jason who used to race TZ250s with AMA now does trackdays with me on his Aprilia RSV4 Factory and swears by Pirelli tyres. He wrote off Dunlops after having similar QC issues with them on his TZ. Well, couple months ago, he TOO had problems with his Pirelli tyre shredding under normal conditions. Pirelli refused to acknowledge any fault. Well, when you're paying $250 per tyre that lasts just one day, it had better last that entire day darn it!!!

Most of these Darksiders have had motorcycle tyres overheat and even blow-up under normal touring-bike usage! Many of them had multiple failures before going to auto tyres. So from their experience, they've improved their safety as they've had no more failures since switching to auto tyre under similar conditions. Can't argue against that data.

Here's some videos of bikes cornering with auto tyres:

Link to original page on YouTube.

Link to original page on YouTube.

Under normal use, bike's tyre has lenticular contact shape, longitudinally oriented like leaf. An auto-tyre has oval contact-patch aimed laterally. In upright usage, bike's load is concentrated on narrow-band in centre of motorcycle-tire; that's why we get commuter stripe in middle. With auto-tyre, that load is spread out across entire width of tyre, so much less stress per unit area.

When leaning under cornering, auto-tyre's contact patch changes from wide oval into longitudinal one just like motorcycle tyre! The load-direction on casing is similar to motorcycle-tyre, not an auto-tyre. Autos push on their tyres from outside-in when cornering. This bunches up contact-patch and distorts it. That's why wider rims on autos help improve cornering by stretching tyre and leading to less contact-patch distortion when cornering. However, on motorcycle, that tyre casing is stretched under tension from middle to outside. There is no distortion of contact-patch and casing-load is distributed across tread and outer sidewall very evenly. An auto-tyre is stressed lot less on motorcycle than on a car.


All this fear-mongering is misplaced and illogical. It's armchair-rationalization, not from personal-experience, or even 2nd-hand from someone else you know who've done it. So it sounds a lot like "Don't go to edge of Earth, you'll fall off and die for sure!!!".

[jkv45]

^ I dunno - I would need to see more info than that video to convince me.

If the contact patch and traction is so good, better than a cycle tire, should we expect to see car tires on MotoGP bikes next year?

It may have a decent contact patch, but I don't think it's the exact shape of contact patch you want for any type of cornering. During cornering it's flexing the sidewall of a car tire in a manner that it's not designed to do.

If you are going in a straight line all day I'm sure it's fine, but if you like to crank it in a corner now and then, maybe not so much.

I know of a guy that rides a V-Strom year-round in all types of weather (heavy snow and ice) that loves his car tires.

I won't be trying one any time soon.

["A"]

Originally Posted by jkv45

If the contact patch and traction is so good, better than a cycle tire, should we expect to see car tires on MotoGP bikes next year?

Moto GP=spare no expense, not likely it represent anything remotely close to daily commute or even aggressive level of street riding.

Tire manufacturers have even less incentive to research car tire application on motorcycles that would likely compete with their motorcycle tire sales that require more frequent changes in less mileage.

Originally Posted by CaliGrrl

How does it feel to turn on that flat-faced car tire? Doesn't one normally replace a (round-faced) motorcycle tire when it gets that flat spot in the middle?

You learn how the car tire behaves under different conditions just like any new tires you would mount on your bike.

Initially it may be different that what you are used to, but after 4-500 miles, you eventually learn how to operate your vehicle as your riding requires.

[jkv45]

Originally Posted by "A"

Moto GP=spare no expense, not likely it represent anything remotely close to daily commute or even aggressive level of street riding.

Those days are gone. MotoGP bikes and Superbikes are reasonably close at this point.

The video says the car was better than a cycle tire in cornering. I can maybe see it on the hwy, but while cornering it isn't going to be "better" than a cycle tire.

Look at the way the tire need to deform when on its side. There's a lot of stress on the sidewall, and you are rolling on a small area that is the transition from the tread to the sidewall - something no car tire designer intended.

I'm glad a car tire is working for you, but I'd never try it for "normal" street riding that isn't almost totally "commuting". But then again, I'd never ride a maxi-scooter either.

[DannoXYZ]

Note that this is for the following conditions:

- heavily-loaded touring motorcycle
- long-life +20k-miles
- minimal cornering

If you're outside of these parameters, an auto-tyre won't improve things for you.

For improving existing stock tyres, there's still a lot of room using motorcycle-tyres. For example, if you do a lot of cornering, reversing street-trend of low-profile tyres will actually increase performance. Using a 120/70-17 and 180/60-17 tyre will create larger flatter contact patch when leaned over. Many race tyres even come in 80 aspect-ratio for more triangular profile. Hot tyre at moment for big track bikes is a 200/60-17 size.

[Brother Michigan]

Originally Posted by Alex

Aaron (@Brother Michigan) - you have been reported for violating the TOS of the site, and I agree. Please keep the discussion on topic without resorting to personal attacks. There will be no additional warnings for any posters in this thread.

Okey dokey!

["A"]

Originally Posted by jkv45

Those days are gone. MotoGP bikes and Superbikes are reasonably close at this point.

Are they?

How many laps does a pair of tires last in a Moto GP practice session or race?

Are you wearing out tires as quickly with your "commute" or "aggressive" riding?

Originally Posted by jkv45

The video says the car was better than a cycle tire in cornering. I can maybe see it on the hwy, but while cornering it isn't going to be "better" than a cycle tire.

I didn't look at the video, but I never said car tires are "better", I can only present the parameters that I use car tire on my vehicles.

Originally Posted by jkv45

Look at the way the tire need to deform when on its side. There's a lot of stress on the sidewall, and you are rolling on a small area that is the transition from the tread to the sidewall - something no car tire designer intended.

Consider the stress forces generated by a 4000 lb. car vs 600 lb. motorcycle.
I doubt a motorcycle can exceed the stress forces required to test the limits of a car tire under normal "commute" or even "aggressive" street riding.

Originally Posted by jkv45

I'm glad a car tire is working for you, but I'd never try it for "normal" street riding that isn't almost totally "commuting". But then again, I'd never ride a maxi-scooter either.

That's your preference, you'd never know what you're missing.

Never judge anything that you are not willing to try, for you'd have no parameters to draw comparison.

[Alchemist]

So I swung by a Harley dealer on the way home yesterday, and I'm pretty well convinced that's the route I'm going to go (albeit, probably not from dealer pricing). Getting up close to them and sitting on a few to check out the ergonomics changed some of my opinions (or more accurately, misconceptions).

Leaning hard toward Harley (Sportster or a high-ish mileage Softail), mostly because of consolidated aftermarket support (in this case, a luggage rack) - kind of curious if I'm missing anything in the metric cruiser (V-Star, Shadow, Vulcan, et al) aftermarket parts market. I've never been one to follow trends (heck, I usually try to avoid them), but the availability of parts, accessories, etc spanning is pretty hard to beat.

[DannoXYZ]

Originally Posted by "A"

Consider the stress forces generated by a 4000 lb. car vs 600 lb. motorcycle.
I doubt a motorcycle can exceed the stress forces required to test the limits of a car tire under normal "commute" or even "aggressive" street riding.

Yeah, thing that lots of naysayers forget since they haven't tried it themselves, is these people already have had tyres overheat and explode on them!!! They're not testing any waters or risking anything, they've had outright dangerous failure of motorcycle tyres; it can't get any worse because they've already experienced worse case scenario!!! By going to higher load-handling auto tyres, they're actually improving their set-up, reducing problems and lowering risk.

[VaFish]

Originally Posted by JacRyann

Yeah, thing that lots of naysayers forget since they haven't tried it themselves, is these people already have had tyres overheat and explode on them!!! They're not testing any waters or risking anything, they've had outright dangerous failure of motorcycle tyres; it can't get any worse because they've already experienced worse case scenario!!! By going to higher load-handling auto tyres, they're actually improving their set-up, reducing problems and lowering risk.

I gotta think that Harley and Honda engineers have tried lots of tire options and there is a reason they install the tires they do on their big touring bikes (and it's not because some tire company is paying them off). If the car tires really worked better they could easily make a rim with the proper bead edge on it to use car tires.

[snot]

My hubby loves his Sprint ST.
I like the Ninja 650, for my next bike.