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Old February 17th, 2012, 10:32 AM   #1
675Raisinator
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415 chain conversion question

What is the best rear sprocket size? Kit comes with 57 but im hearing 59 would be better. Anyone have experience with this mod?
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Old February 17th, 2012, 02:07 PM   #2
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I've got the 57 and am happy with it, but I may go down a tooth or two, but thats just because my bike is track only and I'm topping out against the rev limiter at the end of straights.

For daily riding, who cares hahah
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Old February 17th, 2012, 02:58 PM   #3
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yea man this is track only ... and i ride smaller technical tracks that dont have super long straightaways ... i get to 95mph and im already engine braking into corner ... so drive out of turn is more important. ... my friend is telling me 59 would be better than 57 for that ... not sure tho
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Old February 17th, 2012, 03:12 PM   #4
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yeah for a smaller track a larger rear sprocket will give you shorter gearing, but you will be shifting more often. Best way to judge gearing is to have the engine top out right at the end of the fastest straight in the lowest useable gear.

So for example at chuckwalla I'm bouncing off the rev limiter in 5th about 10 yards from the braking zone, so if I go up teeth i'm pretty much guaranteeing that i'll have to shift and waste time. If I go down a tooth I may just touch the limiter at the braking zone which is ideal, minimizing shifts.
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Old February 17th, 2012, 03:57 PM   #5
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I found website that had an excel spreadsheet that calculated the speed/rpm, up & downshift speeds, gear ratio each gearing, etc. for whatever sprocket you desire; and when I compared the 3 sprocket a few weeks ago I noticed very slight differences. It even graphed the differences.

Unfortunately I don't have the link to the site anymore or am just too lazy to go look for it. LOL
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Old February 17th, 2012, 04:42 PM   #6
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Old February 18th, 2012, 02:10 AM   #7
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Quote:
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What is the best rear sprocket size? Kit comes with 57 but im hearing 59 would be better. Anyone have experience with this mod?
The stock gearing works well for our local track (the track is very small)

We've been doing some research and if I get the 415 kit, I'll get the 59 rear to try to match the stock gearing. According to gearingcommander . com that's the closes to stock.

Stock with the 130 tire:


Custom with the 140 tire:
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Old February 18th, 2012, 11:19 PM   #8
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For what it's worth, I ran this setup last season and used an 18/57. It was nice for technical tracks and still topped out at 102-104, but my rev limiter is at 14,500. I've only run Pacific near Seattle, Portland, and Streets of Willow with this gearing, but it has been good for all those tracks.

The 18/57 is a gnat's ass taller than stock, but not much, (although my bike had a 14/45 stock, I think some came with a 47 on the back).

When I moved from the 140/70 rear tire to the 120/70, I rode for one session and came in and put on my 55 in the rear. This puts my gearing back to whre it was with the 57 and the larger tire. I would be pretty hesitant to run much larger than the 57 on the back, but I guess it would depend on the track and whether there were any corners that made for really awkward shift points.

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Old February 23rd, 2012, 09:53 AM   #9
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Help please

Did anyone have front sprocket trouble? I got the 415 kit and when I put the front sprocket on the nut tightens all the way up but the sprocket is still loose on the shaft kind of like I need to use a couple washers or something.
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Old February 23rd, 2012, 09:58 AM   #10
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There is a washer that is supposed to be in there... also make sure that your sprocket is on correctly, its not symmetric so make sure thats correct as well.

ALSO both Nemesis and I had our front sprocket nuts unwind themselves and come off on the track (after torquing to 65 lb-ft!) so be sure to have some kind of physical lock, safety wire or silicone to ensure the nut doesn't come loose.
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Old February 23rd, 2012, 10:03 AM   #11
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Thanks, I didn't see a washer in my kit so guess I'll have to come up with something. I'm guessing it goes on the transmission side of the sprocket
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Old February 23rd, 2012, 01:42 PM   #12
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Thanks, I didn't see a washer in my kit so guess I'll have to come up with something. I'm guessing it goes on the transmission side of the sprocket
Its a keyed washer that sits right behind the nut, you had to pull it off when you took off the stock sprocket. Re-use that one
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Old February 23rd, 2012, 03:42 PM   #13
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O yea I know about that one, I am saying with all that there is still free play with the sprocket like its just a touch too narrow
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Old February 23rd, 2012, 03:44 PM   #14
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huh. get in touch with the dude selling them. The machinist might have messed up, a friend of mine just called me with the exact same problem. Sounds like a batch of sprockets got machined wrong.
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Old February 23rd, 2012, 04:57 PM   #15
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A little slop is no problem.

FYI on choosing sprockets. Buy several and ride w/ them. That is the only way to choose the correct one for the day. When the wind changes the sprox will need to change if you want the best laptimes.
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Old February 23rd, 2012, 05:21 PM   #16
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Yea I ordered a couple different rear sprockets assuming i would have to make some changes.. On the 520 setup 15/45 seemed to be a good base for most tracks.. I know some dirt bikes have a little slop in the front sprocket it just worried me a tad on this thing
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Old February 23rd, 2012, 10:14 PM   #17
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huh. get in touch with the dude selling them. The machinist might have messed up, a friend of mine just called me with the exact same problem. Sounds like a batch of sprockets got machined wrong.
So i measured the stock sprocket and its 0.258" thick, and cheeks measured his (has slop) and its the same! It must have something to do with how the splines were cut on the sprocket, or maybe certain bikes have different spline lengths??! Definitely strange...
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Old February 24th, 2012, 06:35 AM   #18
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I would be willing to bet your right about the different spline lengths.. The cut to go on the splines seems dead on . Definitely appreciate the help I'm gonna try it with an without some homemade spacers on some side roads here before I use it at the next race round and I will post up what I figure out
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Old February 27th, 2012, 04:08 PM   #19
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There is a washer that is supposed to be in there... also make sure that your sprocket is on correctly, its not symmetric so make sure thats correct as well.

ALSO both Nemesis and I had our front sprocket nuts unwind themselves and come off on the track (after torquing to 65 lb-ft!) so be sure to have some kind of physical lock, safety wire or silicone to ensure the nut doesn't come loose.
Tourqe spec is 94 ft/lbs not 65.
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Old February 27th, 2012, 04:09 PM   #20
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Tourqe spec is 94 ft/lbs not 64.
god DAMMIT jon
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Old March 3rd, 2012, 09:37 AM   #21
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Ok so just an update, I put a spacer on the transmission side of the sprocket about 3 or 4mm thick and took it down the road near the house. So far so good, I'll put it thru the paces at Roebling Road in 2 weeks and we will see how she holds up
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Old March 3rd, 2012, 10:25 AM   #22
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yeah Cheeks did the same thing, seems to be workin out for him. Not sure what happened there....
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Old March 8th, 2012, 08:19 AM   #23
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god DAMMIT jon
What? I never said it was 64 lbs. I said the front axle nut is around 65. I believe it was Dino who gave us the torque spec. Dammit, Dean!

I need to re-torque my shiet but bike's all loaded up. Dammit!
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Old March 10th, 2012, 10:46 AM   #24
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I'm in favor of no slop. behind the spacer that is behind the sprocket is an o-ring. no pressure on the o-ring you can get a leak of oil very slight through the spacer and output shaft gap. needs to be tight. I took a 2mm body washer, dremeled out the inside until it fit and then that was it. torqued, red loctite.

We also run the Dunlop and I really see the need for a 53 at TWS with the 1mile straight. Will need to get one made.
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Old March 13th, 2012, 06:55 AM   #25
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I believe it was Dino who gave us the torque spec. Dammit, Dean!
Wait! Wait! Wait!, I only got involved after your nuts fell off!

Sheesh! Now I know how Cowboy feels!
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Old March 14th, 2012, 11:19 AM   #26
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here it is ... put it on last weekend with some help from a friend ... wasnt too bad at all ... front sprocket bolt was a bitch
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Old March 14th, 2012, 01:48 PM   #27
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What's the advantage of converting it?
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Old March 14th, 2012, 02:24 PM   #28
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What's the advantage of converting it?
Lighter weight and less chain resistance.
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Old March 15th, 2012, 06:27 AM   #29
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What's the advantage of converting it?
girls are ridiculously attracted to the shiney moving parts and are more likely to sleep with you ... i also fitted some bells and random blinking lights for this purpose
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Old March 17th, 2012, 04:27 PM   #30
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girls are ridiculously attracted to the shiney moving parts and are more likely to sleep with you ... i also fitted some bells and random blinking lights for this purpose
hmmmm........











Ordering now
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Old March 17th, 2012, 07:32 PM   #31
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Ok so just did a full trackday with my new 415... thing def improves acceleration response as soon as you hit the throttle but I cant really tell the difference much after that ... still feels a lot more responsive at corner exit which is where the 250s need it,,,, especially after all the mistakes i make... I did lose some track time bc I was working on tightening/losening the chain throughout the day but its pretty well settled in and this is expected ... I would def buy this product again and its right up there with clip ons and rear sets on my list of best track day mods
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Old March 17th, 2012, 07:40 PM   #32
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Damn, was hoping to be the only ninjette in CMRA with the 415 setup...what track? what gearing? I'm thinking the 16/55 still too low for TWS with the dunlop rear. need a 53 i think.
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Old March 17th, 2012, 07:45 PM   #33
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Damn, was hoping to be the only ninjette in CMRA with the 415 setup...what track? what gearing? I'm thinking the 16/55 still too low for TWS with the dunlop rear. need a 53 i think.
im not in cmra ... yet ... i was running at Grandsport speedway 16/57... havent been to tws yet .. not really looking forward to the wear and tear on the poor ninja... why kind of dunlops are you running?
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Old March 17th, 2012, 07:51 PM   #34
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sportmax gp 120/70/17 front 160/50/17 rear. they work really good.
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Old March 18th, 2012, 05:42 AM   #35
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sportmax gp 120/70/17 front 160/50/17 rear. they work really good.
thats a lot of rear tire
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Old March 18th, 2012, 09:20 AM   #36
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thats a lot of rear tire
well, I reversed some numbers. got confused with the SV. 150/60/17
about 8mm shorter than the stock 140/70. substantially lighter than stock. VERY sticky.
We ran them in the rain race that we won at MSRH. I let my son put a lot of laps on the sockers and he did well but crashed twice. My two boys had a MX ride with Dunlop so we called and asked and were able to convert that over to Road Racing. Allan Campbell from Whoopies Racing has been very helpful as he is the South Central Dunlop distributor.
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Old March 19th, 2012, 07:01 AM   #37
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Made it thru my first race weekend with the 415 setup, worked excellent and didn't even need to adjust it. Can't say I can really tell much of a difference in performance but it sure can't hurt shedding 2lbs off the bike. As far as tires, it seems like if I use a good soft 120 front I can pretty much use whatever on the rear and the bike sticks but I always run 150's on the rear
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Old March 25th, 2012, 09:40 AM   #38
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I took a 2mm body washer, dremeled out the inside until it fit and then that was it. torqued, red loctite.
I got a 7/8" washer from the local hardware store. It fits so well, as if it were made for this purpose. I eyeballed it to be about 2mm thick.

How is everyone mounting the rear sprocket? Flat side in or out? On my rear sprocket, "57" is stamped on the raised side, which I faced in to push the teeth away from the wheel. I guess I was trying to mimic the stock alignment (since my 7/8" spacer puts the front sprocket in about the stock position).
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Old March 25th, 2012, 11:20 AM   #39
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I put the numbers on the outside as well. Made sense to read that way and it seems to work!
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Old March 25th, 2012, 12:17 PM   #40
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I got a 7/8" washer from the local hardware store. It fits so well, as if it were made for this purpose. I eyeballed it to be about 2mm thick.

How is everyone mounting the rear sprocket? Flat side in or out? On my rear sprocket, "57" is stamped on the raised side, which I faced in to push the teeth away from the wheel. I guess I was trying to mimic the stock alignment (since my 7/8" spacer puts the front sprocket in about the stock position).
do you need to run a washer with the front sprocket ?
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