Parking lot practice sessions, and possible over engine heating

[ichibunkid.206]

So, I got my bike and I need to break the engine in, but I also need to practice the following skills....

1) Smooth starts from a standing stop
2) Smooth starts from a standing stop, on an incline

Since the bike has no water temp gauge.... how worried do I need to be about possible over heating the motor while I'm practicing these skills at the parking lot?

I'm not doing just these two things...when I get bored I'll go pick up some speed and work on my quick stops, followed by my starts from a standing stops for a bit and go back to the incline starts.

Do I need to be worried about over heating the engine?, or anything else I maybe missing?

Thanks for the help guy's

[Boom King]

I wouldn't be too concerned given that it is a liquid cooled engine. If it was only air cooled and you were doing this on a super hot and humid day with no air movement then maybe? If you have to practice, just go ahead and practice. The engine should be fine. If the fan comes on, just let the bike cool down for a few. I've ran the bike up to red line pretty hard and had the fan on but the temp light has never come on so I think it takes a lot to over heat this engine.

[wtfh4xx]

Word, lots of beating on to get it to overheat.
And for incline smooth starts, just rest lightly on your rear brake and pull through it and then once rolling uphill you can let off.

[ichibunkid.206]

Thanks for the help, and info guy's

[TXJ]

My wife put on 20+ miles of parking lot practice in one day before on a rebel (air cooled) and never over heated. I doubt you will have issues.

If you need hi vis cones or something, try buying tennis balls and cutting them in half. They're generally cheap and much easier to carry around then cones. One or two tubes fit a lot of halved balls. Or cheapo colored party cups with water in the base. Visual obstacles are a great aid when you're practicing. If you're doing quick stops make sure to look up the measured distance (if you're not using a MSF pre painted parking lot) diagram to make it easier and eliminate the guess work.

[ichibunkid.206]

Thanks for the tip Jack...

[almost40]

Ive ran the hell out of mine on the track at 93 degrees and my installed temp gauge never hit 200. I think it is imposible to overheat the lil 250 if everything is in proper working order.

[money]

Originally Posted by TXJ

If you need hi vis cones or something, try buying tennis balls and cutting them in half. They're generally cheap and much easier to carry around then cones. One or two tubes fit a lot of halved balls.

We used tennis-ball halves in my MSF BRC - it worked great.

[GeorgiaHooligan]

You can hold the bike on an incline by keeping the clutch in the sweet spot (friction zone).This is what I prefer personally.

[ichibunkid.206]

Originally Posted by GeorgiaHooligan

You can hold the bike on an incline by keeping the clutch in the sweet spot (friction zone).This is what I prefer personally.

This is the method of holding the MC on an incline I'm trying for... need to practice a lot more to find that friction zone sweet spot on my bike.....

[coondog]

Originally Posted by ichibunkid.206

So, I got my bike and I need to break the engine in, but I also need to practice the following skills....

1) Smooth starts from a standing stop
2) Smooth starts from a standing stop, on an incline

Since the bike has no water temp gauge.... how worried do I need to be about possible over heating the motor while I'm practicing these skills at the parking lot?

I'm not doing just these two things...when I get bored I'll go pick up some speed and work on my quick stops, followed by my starts from a standing stops for a bit and go back to the incline starts.

Do I need to be worried about over heating the engine?, or anything else I maybe missing?

Thanks for the help guy's

you need to worry about screwing up your engine, read break-in proceedures and find unpopulated areas with high speed limits.

[LazinCajun]

Phil, I've practiced in the FL summer for upwards of 2 hours with no issues. There's a fan that you can hear blowing when your engine gets hot -- if it stays on for a long time, take a break (hell, *you're* probably overheating at this point ) I don't think you should be worried per se, just be attentive and be aware that it is possible.

[coondog]

First thing an engine needs is a proper break-in. Not chugging around in first and second gears. There are plenty of roads outside Seattle that would be perfect for 500 quick miles and the proper handling where he doesn't have to worry about traffic, speed, going up and down the rpm, braking etc. and letting it cool off as soon as it's hot (feel). No Fan, bad sign right there for new bike in lot. Just my HO.

[ichibunkid.206]

Originally Posted by coondog

First thing an engine needs is a proper break-in. Not chugging around in first and second gears. There are plenty of roads outside Seattle that would be perfect for 500 quick miles and the proper handling where he doesn't have to worry about traffic, speed, going up and down the rpm, braking etc. and letting it cool off as soon as it's hot (feel). No Fan, bad sign right there for new bike in lot. Just my HO.

Coondog,

I would agree with you that outside of Seattle there are some great places to ride.... BUT as a noobie on a motorcycle for the first time, with limited experience, and no trailer to get the cycle to these places.... how would I get the bike there?

Would you suggest a noobie with very little experience on a motorcycle get on the Freeway and ride there? The first and foremost thing on my mind in practicing is not to be a hazard to either myself, or to anyone else on the road...

I agree proper engine break-in is important... hence my question, but from what I read, unless I purposely try to screw up the engine during break-in (running at the same RPM for a long period, bogging the engine down)... I won't say it's impossible, but hard to do.. again this is only from what I've read on the board here.

Not trying to be an A-hole, but I need to balance improving my skills in a safe manor, with properly breaking-in the motor.

If I am totally off base then please let me know.... I'm always willing to learn, and hear other ideas to improve my skills and to be a more safe rider.

[kkim]

practice in a parking lot for awhile, then take a nice relaxing cruise on some relatively quiet and uncongested side roads. is that possible to vary the heat load on the cooling system/engine? If not, keep an eye on your coolant level to make sure you have enough in there and it's not all being blown out the coolant overflow tube.

while I don't believe prolonged practice will "normally" screw up the engine, you're not doing it much good pouring a large amount of heat into a relatively tight/new engine. Most will survive the parking lot sessions, but all you need is one out of spec/tight piece of internal machinery to possibly fail due to too much heat.

my advice on break in is too usually "ride it like it needs to be ridden", but in this case, prolonged stop and go, low speed maneuvering may be a bit hard on the engine. Stop and go driving is considered "severe use" with cars when determining service intervals and usually recommends changing oil and other items at a rate twice that of normal intervals.

here's some info on the cooling system on our bikes...
http://faq.ninja250.org/wiki/Cooling_system

[ichibunkid.206]

My parking lot practice has been limited to early Sunday mornings before the mall opens... it's about a 2 mile ride from the house, so it not like I head down the block and there I am....

I've been taking more evening rides around town after rush hour, kinda expanding my riding radius a little bit further with every ride... What is taking me the most to get use to at this point is being out in the open, with no car sheet metal between me and the guy next to me, or behind me (I feel so nekked)... but most of that goes away after I'm off and riding.

Haven't gotten up enough nerves to hit the freeway yet.... I figure there's enough surface streets off of the freeway that can get me from point 'A' to point 'B' for the time being where I can rev the engine up and down that it'll do me just fine for the time being...

Thanks all

PS. Kelly... I may need to add a water temp gauge to my bike like you did on your's

[kkim]

in the meantime, just keep an eye on the coolant level in the reservoir. when the bike overheats, it will spill the contents out the overflow tube from the coolant reservoir. if it's low or empty, fill back to the full line when the bike is cooled down. also, check you radiator to make sure it's topped off.

[ichibunkid.206]

Originally Posted by kkim

in the meantime, just keep an eye on the coolant level in the reservoir. when the bike overheats, it will spill the contents out the overflow tube from the coolant reservoir. if it's low or empty, fill back to the full line when the bike is cooled down. also, check you radiator to make sure it's topped off.

Gotcha.... Thanks

[TXJ]

Originally Posted by kkim

in the meantime, just keep an eye on the coolant level in the reservoir. when the bike overheats, it will spill the contents out the overflow tube from the coolant reservoir. if it's low or empty, fill back to the full line when the bike is cooled down. also, check you radiator to make sure it's topped off.

This reminds me: Fill up YOUR coolant level. Dehydration and resulting fatigue will make your practice counter productive and possibly dangerous. As a new rider, make friends with and invest in a camel pak / fluid delivery system if you're planning on heading out for a couple hours. You can get one at walmart or a sporting store pretty cheap. 2+ liters of ice & water is a lifesaver in the summer.

That is, if you don't have one already. It beats packing water bottles.

Sorry. Ending safety dad speech now.

[ichibunkid.206]

Thanks for the reminder TXJ... temperatures here in Seattle haven't gotten very high yet, but I do have a Camelbak system for when I go mountain bike riding, so I'll probably use that when temps start getting up in the 70's or 80ish range

[beqwarrior]

Originally Posted by ichibunkid.206

Thanks for the reminder TXJ... temperatures here in Seattle haven't gotten very high yet, but I do have a Camelbak system for when I go mountain bike riding, so I'll probably use that when temps start getting up in the 70's or 80ish range

I miss seattle so much..... Transplanted here in South Carolina

[Firehorse]

Great info guys and keep up the safe practices, ichibunkid

My first practice session in a lot got the fan kicking on pretty regular intervals. Didn't know then if it was good or bad so this info helps me too.
Most of the practice consisted of going up and down the gears and break work but limited to under 4000rpms. Spent way too much time in first.

Good advice re the self hydration! My second practice session was a little hairy and I'm sure I dropped a dress size. A* gloves can sure hold a lot of sweaty palm issues...

My advice for new riders since I'm too new to comment on actual skills is to relax your arms and don't forget to breathe.

Going out to check my levels now, thanks.

[kkim]

Originally Posted by Firehorse

Going out to check my levels now, thanks.

make sure the engine has cooled down/is cold before you do.

[Firehorse]

Thanks kkim but I'm not riding at the moment so he's as cold as stone
Still at the "look it up in the manual" stages so no problems with when to check what. Yet. Will be asking for help when the time comes to look at things that aren't specified in the manual.

I may be older but I've never had a vehicle of any kind to call my own so I'll be poking and prodding with extreme caution.

You should have seen me putting the lube on the chain the first time - quite ridiculous - called the dealership just to make sure I wasn't putting it where it shouldn't be. But, hey, I guess it's okay to learn with caution.

[kkim]

any time.

speaking of chain lube... are you using this one?
http://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=67464

[Firehorse]

Hmm, good reading there too. Will have to track some down. Shouldn't be too hard, apparently we have several small shops that I haven't been to yet.

I bought the lube at the dealership with the bike since I knew my first practice would take place in a gravelly, dusty area. It's Bel-ray, super-clear, 'o' ring safe blah, blah. I guess it's what they use at the dealership for the Zukis and Kawis.

Thanks again

[ichibunkid.206]

Originally Posted by Firehorse

Great info guys and keep up the safe practices, ichibunkid

My first practice session in a lot got the fan kicking on pretty regular intervals. Didn't know then if it was good or bad so this info helps me too.
Most of the practice consisted of going up and down the gears and break work but limited to under 4000rpms. Spent way too much time in first.

Good advice re the self hydration! My second practice session was a little hairy and I'm sure I dropped a dress size. A* gloves can sure hold a lot of sweaty palm issues...

My advice for new riders since I'm too new to comment on actual skills is to relax your arms and don't forget to breathe.

Going out to check my levels now, thanks.

Thanks, and you keep up the safe practices also...

When I first started learning to get the feel of the new bike in the parking lot.. I did sort of the same thing at first.. staying in first gear.... but as I got more comfortable on and with the bike, I could start to shift up to 2nd and get all my hands and feet coordinated to quick stop and shift down. I still need to work on it some more... I'm throwing in low speed maneuvers now.... and riding around town, have fun on your Ninja

[almost40]

Originally Posted by ichibunkid.206

Thanks for the reminder TXJ... temperatures here in Seattle haven't gotten very high yet, but I do have a Camelbak system for when I go mountain bike riding, so I'll probably use that when temps start getting up in the 70's or 80ish range

Camelbak's rule.

[LazinCajun]

Slightly off topic, but how exactly do you guys use a camelbak with a fullface helmet>

[kkim]

you route the drink tube up from the bottom into the helmet.

[LazinCajun]

Ah ok, pretty obvious. I didn't think it would fit under there from the pictures for some reason.

[coondog]

If you ride your bike to the lot you can ride it to the country without the highway being included. You may be right though, there was no MSF, people stopped at signs and crosswalks, there was no I-95 OR Turnpike where/when I first rode. Plus bottom line is you're worth more than anything else in the equation. Ride on!

[ichibunkid.206]

Originally Posted by coondog

If you ride your bike to the lot you can ride it to the country without the highway being included. You may be right though, there was no MSF, people stopped at signs and crosswalks, there was no I-95 OR Turnpike where/when I first rode. Plus bottom line is you're worth more than anything else in the equation. Ride on!

I'm sure I'm like most new riders... If it were only "Me, Myself, and I" on the road I'd pretty much wouldn't have a problem, but when you get them dang cagers on the road also... well that's a different story, but it's all good

[YORCHI]

I wish I had found this thread earlier...

I just got my bike last Wednesday and I've been a total of about 5-6 hours in a parking lot directly in front of me going around in straights and turns. I rode around in mostly 1st and 2nd gear on the first day, then I moved up to third gears on the second day and rode out into the street for a few minutes. On Friday I practiced nothing but slow u-turns in mostly 2nd gear and then I drove around on the street even more getting it all the way up to 5th and 6th gear. The farthest I've gone has been about 2-3 miles in a loop around my area where I was able to get through all the gears.

I feel like that should be safe for the bike, I'm keeping the rpm's between 3k-7k and I haven't even thought about the freeway yet lol

[ratlab]

do you guys,jorge and phil have friends with dirt bikes? if you do ,hit them up for some seat time-i spent a lot of time off road before i was street riding and i think that's the way to progress-i know the ninja's a 250, but it's got a lot of plastic,iffy fueling and suspension-i think it would be a tough bike to learn on,i glad i don't have to-i have been riding for about 35 years and i am finding it a difficult bike to go full tilt on-so good idea to get comfortable until you can get out there and push it-near sac. you can get up to the sierra foothills and or lake berryessa area and have a lot of open road to yourself

[ichibunkid.206]

Originally Posted by ratlab

do you guys,jorge and phil have friends with dirt bikes?

Ha!! I wish... all of my friends are married with kid's.... the biggest thrill they get now a day's is chasing a little white golf ball around

I'm getting out on the street more now a day's.... taking longer rides, I only wish the weather were better. This week-end here is suppose to be pretty nice 70ish.. so I'm taking a nice long ride this Saturday

[YORCHI]

Originally Posted by ichibunkid.206

Ha!! I wish... all of my friends are married with kid's.... the biggest thrill they get now a day's is chasing a little white golf ball around

I'm getting out on the street more now a day's.... taking longer rides, I only wish the weather were better. This week-end here is suppose to be pretty nice 70ish.. so I'm taking a nice long ride this Saturday

damnit I need a fellow noob as a riding buddy lol

the only person I know here that has a bike has a 750 and he's had it for years. I asked him for help but he hasn't gotten back to me, maybe he feels I'm gonna go slow like a turtle and he doesn't wanna hold my hand as we go lol