Just for those who have been riding more than 20 years

Motofool · July 30th, 2012, 07:55 AM

In street riding, the comfort zone is a wonderful place to be, but one does not learn from being there, one can only learn from being removed from it.

http://www.ridemyown.com/articles/sa...stricks3.shtml

"By Jerry Palladino (MOTORMAN):

A couple of weeks ago, I was at a bike gathering at a local Harley Dealer when I struck up a conversation with a guy who was taking delivery of a new Anniversary Edition Ultra. The guy was into his mid to late 40's and he tells me he's been riding for 20 years and this was his 4th new Harley. He said he had an 02 Ultra, but some clown turned left in front of him and he had to "lay her down". The bike was totaled and he had a broken leg which he said was now in good enough shape that he could start riding again. I then asked him if he had ever taken any rider training courses. He looked at me like I was crazy and said, "I've been riding 20 years, that's enough training for me". I then watched him as he duck-walked his bike around a U-Turn a Greyhound bus could have easily made, and then saw him drag his feet about 100 yards through the parking lot and out onto the highway.

It made me think of something an MSF Instructor recently told me. He said he teaches the MSF Experienced Rider course and that he see's a lot of people who think they are good riders because they've been riding 20 or 30 years. The instructor said what they really have is one years experience 20 or 30 times.

That made a lot of sense. In other words, a rider gets to a certain level and then, never improves any further, but instead, keeps repeating the same mistakes over and over again. Now, if you're driving a car, you can get away with a lot of mistakes for a lot of years before it catches up with you. But, on a bike, there's usually no such thing as a little fender bender. In almost every crash on a motorcycle, you're going to get hurt or even killed and your bike is going to be a mess, if not a total wreck. The point is, don't fool yourself into thinking you know what you're doing just because you've been riding for a lot of years. Look at it this way. If experience was all you need to be a good driver, then that 80 year old guy blocking the left lane of the highway with 60 years of driving under his belt, should be able to easily win the Daytona 500 should he choose to since he has far more experience than most of those young whipper-snappers in NASCAR, right? Of course not!

Those young experienced NASCAR drivers have received the best training available and constantly practice and improve their skills. Now, the old guy with all the experience, like you, the experienced rider, can cruise on down the road just fine, until something unexpected happens. Then, all he and you can do is jam on the brakes and hope for the best. The highly trained driver or rider can rely on his skills and training and probably can avoid the crash altogether instead of "laying her down", (in other words, to avoid the crash). Now, it's true, you can't avoid every crash, but it sure would be nice to avoid most of them."

Racer x · July 30th, 2012, 08:19 AM

I have been a mechanic for therty years. When I started working on cars I thought I new it all. As I get older and learn more I find I don't know anything. Racing has tought me that as you learn you open yourself up to new possibilitys. And you have to learn MORE than you all ready know.
The same thing goes for motorcycle riding. Plus riding a motorcycle is not a natural thing to do . You MUST BE TOUGHT. Or you will rise to the level of your Harley rider and never progress. I want to laugh at the old fool. But I feel sorry for him. He will never know what riding is about.

Bermuda · July 30th, 2012, 11:53 AM

I discovered this gem very recently, and I've only been riding for a few months.

It's like with anything; you become too comfortable and let your actions become reflex. When it comes time to properly react to something out of the ordinary, or out of that comfort zone (which seems to shrink the more complacent you get), then the bad habit reflex kicks in and things go poorly.

CC Cowboy · July 30th, 2012, 12:51 PM

This is exactly why I like to squid out and get out of control once or twice during every ride. It makes you think, react, and remind yourself, you can die quickly and easily. Besides, it's fun!

alex.s · July 30th, 2012, 01:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CC Cowboy

This is exactly why I like to squid out and get out of control once or twice during every ride. It makes you think, react, and remind yourself, you can die quickly and easily. Besides, it's fun!

R1Chronicles · July 30th, 2012, 03:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Motofool

he's been riding for 20 years and this was his 4th new Harley

A lot of Harley riders are bad riders, not saying all, just a lot. I ride with large groups of them often and am amazed at the stupid things I see from long time riders, the foot drag/walk is the most common. Too many have the additude, I don't have to worry they can hear me coming. A long haul on a Harley equals, 9/10 th's by trailer, 1/10 th actual riding, always divide there experience by a factor of 10.

If riding with large groups of them the safest place to be is in the back of the pack, serious on this one. They tend to hit ditches too often on corners, nothing to do with the bikes ability to corner.

An old goldwing rider clued me into why Harley rider's hardly wave, "have you ever pushed a wheel barrow and tried to let go with one hand?" ....

Quote:

Originally Posted by Motofool

a rider gets to a certain level and then, never improves any further, but instead, keeps repeating the same mistakes over and over again

On a serious note, I find the above statement applies to a lot of riders even ones that have gone through driving courses. It's easy to fall into a groove and never challenge yourself (improve). Imo all bikes should come pre-scratched with a big ugly dent so people aren't so damned worried about there perfect bike and scared to do anything with it.

lgk · July 30th, 2012, 04:12 PM

i meet a lot of know it all people daily, spreading erroneous info.

worst part is when you prove them wrong they still try to argue with you.

Alex · July 30th, 2012, 06:20 PM

It's like groundhog day. Sometimes 20 years experience is more like 1 year of experience, repeated 20 times. It's a shame, as if someone is spending so much time and energy on just about anything, why not even attempt to be skilled at it. Typically that means it gets more fun along the way as well.

BlackNinja8 · July 30th, 2012, 06:32 PM

After only 6k miles of experience I find myself falling into this trap. Riding to work daily on auto pilot. I often conciously remind myself to be alert for the unexpected like a small animal suddenly darting out in my path. I will often pretend that I'm riding with another rider who is behind me observing my body position. This reminds me to practice proper technique...yes I have an imaginary friend.

July 30th, 2012, 07:55 AM	#1
Motofool Daily Ninjette rider Name: Hernan Location: Florida Join Date: Mar 2011 Motorcycle(s): 2007 Ninja 250 Posts: A lot. MOTY - 2016, MOTM - Dec '12, Jan '14, Jan '15, May '16	Just for those who have been riding more than 20 years In street riding, the comfort zone is a wonderful place to be, but one does not learn from being there, one can only learn from being removed from it. http://www.ridemyown.com/articles/sa...stricks3.shtml "By Jerry Palladino (MOTORMAN): A couple of weeks ago, I was at a bike gathering at a local Harley Dealer when I struck up a conversation with a guy who was taking delivery of a new Anniversary Edition Ultra. The guy was into his mid to late 40's and he tells me he's been riding for 20 years and this was his 4th new Harley. He said he had an 02 Ultra, but some clown turned left in front of him and he had to "lay her down". The bike was totaled and he had a broken leg which he said was now in good enough shape that he could start riding again. I then asked him if he had ever taken any rider training courses. He looked at me like I was crazy and said, "I've been riding 20 years, that's enough training for me". I then watched him as he duck-walked his bike around a U-Turn a Greyhound bus could have easily made, and then saw him drag his feet about 100 yards through the parking lot and out onto the highway. It made me think of something an MSF Instructor recently told me. He said he teaches the MSF Experienced Rider course and that he see's a lot of people who think they are good riders because they've been riding 20 or 30 years. The instructor said what they really have is one years experience 20 or 30 times. That made a lot of sense. In other words, a rider gets to a certain level and then, never improves any further, but instead, keeps repeating the same mistakes over and over again. Now, if you're driving a car, you can get away with a lot of mistakes for a lot of years before it catches up with you. But, on a bike, there's usually no such thing as a little fender bender. In almost every crash on a motorcycle, you're going to get hurt or even killed and your bike is going to be a mess, if not a total wreck. The point is, don't fool yourself into thinking you know what you're doing just because you've been riding for a lot of years. Look at it this way. If experience was all you need to be a good driver, then that 80 year old guy blocking the left lane of the highway with 60 years of driving under his belt, should be able to easily win the Daytona 500 should he choose to since he has far more experience than most of those young whipper-snappers in NASCAR, right? Of course not! Those young experienced NASCAR drivers have received the best training available and constantly practice and improve their skills. Now, the old guy with all the experience, like you, the experienced rider, can cruise on down the road just fine, until something unexpected happens. Then, all he and you can do is jam on the brakes and hope for the best. The highly trained driver or rider can rely on his skills and training and probably can avoid the crash altogether instead of "laying her down", (in other words, to avoid the crash). Now, it's true, you can't avoid every crash, but it sure would be nice to avoid most of them." __________________________________________________ *Motofool* *.................................Never ride faster than your guardian angel can fly* "Mankind is composed of two sorts of men — those who love and create, and those who hate and destroy. Love is the bond between men, the way to teach and the center of the world." - José Martí

July 30th, 2012, 12:51 PM	#4
CC Cowboy ninjette.org certified postwhore Name: Whodat Location: Ware Is.,MA Join Date: Jan 2009 Motorcycle(s): I pass the wind! Posts: A lot. MOTM - Mar '13, Jun '14	This is exactly why I like to squid out and get out of control once or twice during every ride. It makes you think, react, and remind yourself, you can die quickly and easily. Besides, it's fun! __________________________________________________ If everything seems under control; you're just not going fast enough!

July 30th, 2012, 06:20 PM	#8
Alex ninjette.org dude Name: 1 guess :-) Location: SF Bay Area Join Date: Jun 2008 Motorcycle(s): '13 Ninja 300 (white, the fastest color!), '13 R1200RT, '14 CRF250L, '12 TT-R125LE Posts: Too much. Blog Entries: 7	It's like groundhog day. Sometimes 20 years experience is more like 1 year of experience, repeated 20 times. It's a shame, as if someone is spending so much time and energy on just about anything, why not even attempt to be skilled at it. Typically that means it gets more fun along the way as well. __________________________________________________ Montgomery Street Motorcycle Club / cal24.com / crf250l.org / ninjette.org ninjette.org Terms of Service Shopping for motorcycle parts or equipment? Come here first. The friendliest Ninja 250R/300/400 forum on the internet! (especially Unregistered)

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
[RoadRUNNER] - Touring Tip: Riding Into Your Golden Years	Ninjette Newsbot	Motorcycling News	0	June 16th, 2014 10:50 AM
[topix.net] - Riding at 188mph may get motorcyclist two years	Ninjette Newsbot	Motorcycling News	0	February 4th, 2012 11:30 AM
[topix.net] - Linden resident still riding easy after 56 years on Triumph bikes	Ninjette Newsbot	Motorcycling News	0	June 4th, 2011 05:20 PM
[motorcyclistonline] - 25 Years of GSX-Rs \| Riding the Legend	Ninjette Newsbot	Motorcycling News	0	May 31st, 2011 01:40 PM
My first crash after riding for 9 years. Oil slicked road.	matteblack	!%@*#$%!)@#&!%@ I crashed!	38	October 9th, 2009 03:01 PM

July 30th, 2012, 08:19 AM	#2
Racer x ninjette.org certified postwhore Name: Eric Location: Iowa City Join Date: May 2009 Motorcycle(s): 2008 Kawmeracchi 350 2010 Project X Posts: A lot. Blog Entries: 54 MOTM - Sep '18, Feb '16	I have been a mechanic for therty years. When I started working on cars I thought I new it all. As I get older and learn more I find I don't know anything. Racing has tought me that as you learn you open yourself up to new possibilitys. And you have to learn MORE than you all ready know. The same thing goes for motorcycle riding. Plus riding a motorcycle is not a natural thing to do . You MUST BE TOUGHT. Or you will rise to the level of your Harley rider and never progress. I want to laugh at the old fool. But I feel sorry for him. He will never know what riding is about.

July 30th, 2012, 11:53 AM	#3
Bermuda ninjette.org member Name: Andrew Location: Oakville Join Date: Feb 2012 Motorcycle(s): 08 Ninja 250R Posts: 18	I discovered this gem very recently, and I've only been riding for a few months. It's like with anything; you become too comfortable and let your actions become reflex. When it comes time to properly react to something out of the ordinary, or out of that comfort zone (which seems to shrink the more complacent you get), then the bad habit reflex kicks in and things go poorly.

July 30th, 2012, 04:12 PM	#7
lgk ninjette.org certified postwhore Name: Jason Location: Norfolk, VA Join Date: Dec 2011 Motorcycle(s): 2012 EX250, 2014 EX300 Posts: A lot.	i meet a lot of know it all people daily, spreading erroneous info. worst part is when you prove them wrong they still try to argue with you.

July 30th, 2012, 06:32 PM	#9
BlackNinja8 ninjette.org guru Name: NJ Location: Westchester, NY Join Date: Feb 2012 Motorcycle(s): 2011 250R (Sold); 2012 Vulcan 900; 2009 Harley Iron 883; 2004 SV650s; and a bunch of others over the years... Posts: 470	After only 6k miles of experience I find myself falling into this trap. Riding to work daily on auto pilot. I often conciously remind myself to be alert for the unexpected like a small animal suddenly darting out in my path. I will often pretend that I'm riding with another rider who is behind me observing my body position. This reminds me to practice proper technique...yes I have an imaginary friend.